Kings after OG

T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#61
#61
Kingz19 said:
id be very angry if Keegan is included for a potential rental.

The best active Kings player I would part with is Davion and some draft compensation. Id consider Huerter too but it’s still risky.

OG is fine player but he hasn’t established himself to the point where teams are going to make a big risk to bring him in. The longer they wait the less he is worth on the market.

Plus, going into a free agency where you’ll have to retain both Domas and OG seems pretty daunting even if we acquire OG for a fair package
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I think the real key is you have to make sure Domas is locked in here for his next contract. I'd place it at like 90%+, especially after this last season. And literally everything he's done in a Kings uni has been to show love to the city and the franchise. I geniunely think he likes it here, likes playing with Brown and Fox. Doesn't hurt he had a career season too in this system that keeps him as the focal point of the offense.

But still, you have to plan for that ~10% chance he doesn't re-up. If Monte gets sloppy this off-season and things blow up next year, the Kings are just flat out done and back to being a bottom-feeder.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#62
#62
pdxKingsFan said:
WRT age timelines, I'm more concerned that Beal's best days are past him and yet his prime pay days are the next four years. I've heard people say he has the Wiz over a barrel right now because of his contract and no-trade being so unique, so guess who owns that barrel if we do bring him on and he can only go 40 games next season?

I have no doubt that a prime Beal can work, I am just not sold that's who we are getting.

Also you mentioned earlier you don't think the new CBA outlook is as bleak as almost everyone else who has analyzed it does. But there's a lot of rules in it that eliminate the MLE for teams past a certain level, or allow buy out deals and even minimum signings. We also presumably will be paying Keegan over 20 million on his next deal. I just don't see how this isn't crippling if it doesn't work.

Also Domas hasn't re-signed yet, let's say Beal completely altered every piece of chemistry and damages that?
Like if Ant's second contract was up next year, could you see him re-signing with Minnesota instead of picking a team that isn't crippled after they blew it on the Gobert deal?
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Injuries are a concern for sure, but the thing about Beal is he's not going to be expected to be a number 1 option anymore either. That might take some of the pressure off him as well. If Bradley Beal can only play a certain amount of games next season but is there for most of the playoffs I'll take it.

What I'm saying about the new CBA is that there would likely be an out for teams. I mean, that's why the stretch and waive was really good for a few years. The owners aren't going to cripple themselves, bet on that, lol. Back in those days it was the same doom and gloom too. The players ain't signing any deals that limit the ability for them to find teams on a decent deal. And what is that level? The Kings will likely be able to be under any major tax penalty thresholds for the time being. The Kings will be paying most of that money the next few seasons to someone so whether it's better for that to be Barnes, Huerter, and Holmes or Beal is the question to ask.

Chemistry is a what if. I mean, it can be said for any incoming player in terms of damaging the chemistry, including OG. What if Brown pushes Keegan to the bench in favor of OG/Sasha or even Barnes? What if OG is simply trying to showcase for a big deal? Ah, so what. If it happens it happens. In the playoffs the only damaging thing I saw was the desperate attempts for Brown to find someone on his roster besides Fox to turn the tide and on most nights he was struggling to do so. Even going so far as to play TD in the most crucial of moments. If Brown was to say no. Then so be it. If he's on board with a deal like this? All day, every day. He deserves it. If he turns down the talent upgrade then he has a good reason for it.
 
J

Joshoua

All-Star
#63
#63
SacTownKid said:
I make it a rule to never judge a player in total while at their peak and while the picture is only half painted when compared to the complete picture of anyone else that has decline factored in. This is how people get those "Harden is better than Jordan!" kinds of stuff, haha. Jokic has got a chance though but that's to be decided once we see what his downside is like.
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agree but harden was a known choker where Jokic takes it to the next level
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#64
#64
Kingz19 said:
id be very angry if Keegan is included for a potential rental.

The best active Kings player I would part with is Davion and some draft compensation. Id consider Huerter too but it’s still risky.

OG is fine player but he hasn’t established himself to the point where teams are going to make a big risk to bring him in. The longer they wait the less he is worth on the market.

Plus, going into a free agency where you’ll have to retain both Domas and OG seems pretty daunting even if we acquire OG for a fair package
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Again, I don't think it's the right way to look at things if you are actually trying to win. I think the question to ask is, will you ever have the space to acquire a player like OG in the first place? Without moving the likely pieces in these deals for nothing the answer is likely a clear no. Shoot for the moon if you need it. Don't worry about losing your footing on the middle rung. If the Kings come in with another star without touching Fox, Domas, and Murray? DO IT!
 
Tetsujin

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#65
#65
https://twitter.com/statuses/1669497280368607232

Sabonis
Keegan
OG
Huerter
Fox
---
Monk
Sasha
Lyles

Twenty million dollars of cap space puts us in the range of acquiring one of the top guys in this free agent class but it'd probably be hard to convince them to sign up to be a backup. Jerami Grant is another Klutch client but he's looking for a big payday and probably wouldn't want to be playing 4th/5th fiddle or potentially serving as our third or fourth best forward, let alone be stuck coming off the bench. He would be good OG insurance in the off chance he walked post-trade. Nikola Vucevic and Brook Lopez would immediately solve our backup center woes but I doubt either is quite at the point in their careers that they would enjoy taking a smaller bench role (though Vuc is probably closer to that point than he'd probably publicly acknowledge). Kyle Kuzma is probably getting a contract in the 20 mil a season range but he's also in that same boat as Jerami Grant. Jordan Clarkson is a Klutch guy like Fox/OG/Trey but in the case that Huerter and Monk are still on the team I'm not sure he's particularly necessary for the Kings. Austin Reaves would be a fun signing just because it would screw with the Lakers but I'm not sure he's a great fit for our system and he's oddly like Tyrese Haliburton in that he'd probably take touches from Fox for some reason. Gary Trent is a Klutch guy and would be a great floor spacer for us. He's also going to be expensive and not really bringing anything we don't already have. HB is in that same situation as Jerami and Kuzma. If he'd be willing to play a smaller role for us, I'd enjoy having him back as our third forward.

There is also a world where we decide to **** with the Nuggets and throw a huge unmatchable contract at Bruce Brown. Would Josh Hart be willing to come off the bench if it meant a bigger payday?


Yeah, I think it's fair to say I'm much more pro-OG move than Beal move at this point. But I think the real opportunities for Monte are going to come once a Beal deal actually happens and sets the market for star players for the summer (Beal for Herro/Duncan/Jovic/picks?)

Also wonder if there's a way to expand an OG deal a bit to have the Raptors include Otto Porter Jr in the package.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#66
#66
The_Jamal said:
Yeah, this is where the Kings really have to be careful. Unless behind close doors, Domas has 100% said "I'm here as long as I get the max", then you do have to operate some level of caution until he signs on the dotted line.

Imagine you go all in for Beal or OG and then Domas doesn't resign. Uh-oh, all of a sudden you just set the franchise back 5+ years and are basically forced to trade Fox in order to get any sort of rebuild assets back.
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If that happens you probably already blew it anyway. I'm more concerned with this team taking a step back next year and questioning whether to re-sign even someone like Monk. I don't expect it, but if that happens I think that would be more damaging if this were a concern in the first place. Then the issue is once you enter the season your flexibility to make this type of move is already gone. If Monte were concerned about these types of things happening he doesn't start what he did in the first place. Now he needs to finish it while he's got the chance. Rule of thumb is usually is if you can add All star talent without touching your core you do it. And in a league where yes, it's a weapons race in terms of G/F play I'm doing it with the names we're hearing. Even LaVine if Murray isn't involved.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#67
#67
Tetsujin said:
https://twitter.com/statuses/1669497280368607232

Sabonis
Keegan
OG
Huerter
Fox
---
Monk
Sasha
Lyles

Twenty million dollars of cap space puts us in the range of acquiring one of the top guys in this free agent class but it'd probably be hard to convince them to sign up to be a backup. Jerami Grant is another Klutch client but he's looking for a big payday and probably wouldn't want to be playing 4th/5th fiddle or potentially serving as our third or fourth best forward, let alone be stuck coming off the bench. He would be good OG insurance in the off chance he walked post-trade. Nikola Vucevic and Brook Lopez would immediately solve our backup center woes but I doubt either is quite at the point in their careers that they would enjoy taking a smaller bench role (though Vuc is probably closer to that point than he'd probably publicly acknowledge). Kyle Kuzma is probably getting a contract in the 20 mil a season range but he's also in that same boat as Jerami Grant. Jordan Clarkson is a Klutch guy like Fox/OG/Trey but in the case that Huerter and Monk are still on the team I'm not sure he's particularly necessary for the Kings. Austin Reaves would be a fun signing just because it would screw with the Lakers but I'm not sure he's a great fit for our system and he's oddly like Tyrese Haliburton in that he'd probably take touches from Fox for some reason. Gary Trent is a Klutch guy and would be a great floor spacer for us. He's also going to be expensive and not really bringing anything we don't already have. HB is in that same situation as Jerami and Kuzma. If he'd be willing to play a smaller role for us, I'd enjoy having him back as our third forward.

There is also a world where we decide to **** with the Nuggets and throw a huge unmatchable contract at Bruce Brown. Would Josh Hart be willing to come off the bench if it meant a bigger payday?


Yeah, I think it's fair to say I'm much more pro-OG move than Beal move at this point. But I think the real opportunities for Monte are going to come once a Beal deal actually happens and sets the market for star players for the summer (Beal for Herro/Duncan/Jovic/picks?)

Also wonder if there's a way to expand an OG deal a bit to have the Raptors include Otto Porter Jr in the package.
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A Wiz/Heat deal like that just seems like a total why bother type of move. The Heat gets slightly better, the Wiz get slightly worse while still eating that money on their cap. I guess it's up to Beal and then the Wizards to say yes.
 
2

206Fan

All-Star
#71
#71
I think I would do Huerter, Davion, and a future 1st. I'd really like to hang onto #24 to draft a Huerter replacement.

I'm eyeing Podz, Whitehead, or Sheppard who are all good 3pt shooters. I don't think they last until #38.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#73
#73
Insomniacal Fan said:
On a 31 win team, everyone is tradable.
On a 48 win team... Not so much
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The second part is possibly true, but Fox apparently wasn't as it pertains to the first and from what Vivek said, it sounded like he never was. Monte stacked draft assets to build around De'Aaron and waited. I'd bet everyone on this team IS tradable, with the exception of Fox and Domas. As it should be.
 
N

NiNetNiNe

Bench
#74
#74
I love Huerter and Davion, but if them and a future first gets us OG then I do that all day everyday. A Fox, Monk, OG, Keegan, and Sabonis is pretty damn good. That would still leave us with our picks this draft to maybe get someone nice in a deep draft, and with all of our money to still play around with.
 
funkykingston

funkykingston

Super Moderator
Staff member
#75
#75
SacTownKid said:
The second part is possibly true, but Fox apparently wasn't as it pertains to the first and from what Vivek said, it sounded like he never was. Monte stacked draft assets to build around De'Aaron and waited. I'd bet everyone on this team IS tradable, with the exception of Fox and Domas. As it should be.
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I don't ever trust what Vivek says about prior moves. He's a fan of revisionist history when it makes him look better.

At one point he claimed that he wanted to draft Elfrid Payton but his "basketball people" told him Stauskas was the right pick. A dumb thing to lie about when every Kings fan has seen that infamous video from the war room.

He has done that sort of thing a lot.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#76
#76
funkykingston said:
I don't ever trust what Vivek says about prior moves. He's a fan of revisionist history when it makes him look better.

At one point he claimed that he wanted to draft Elfrid Payton but his "basketball people" told him Stauskas was the right pick. A dumb thing to lie about when every Kings fan has seen that infamous video from the war room.

He has done that sort of thing a lot.
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I don't think it's revisionist after the fact. Even at the time, I mentioned in one of the threads that it sure didn't look like they were sitting Fox to move him but rather, it looked like they were showcasing Davion and Haliburton. Well, here we sit. It then makes Montes PG stacking look a lot less confusing and after that, almost everything he's done has made complete sense if Fox was their guy.
 
funkykingston

funkykingston

Super Moderator
Staff member
#77
#77
SacTownKid said:
I don't think it's revisionist after the fact. Even at the time, I mentioned in one of the threads that it sure didn't look like they were sitting Fox to move him but rather, it looked like they were showcasing Davion and Haliburton. Well, here we sit. It then makes Montes PG stacking look a lot less confusing and after that, almost everything he's done has made complete sense if Fox was their guy.
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Maybe in that case it is the truth. I'm just saying I don't ever trust what Vivek says because he's clearly lied or twisted the truth and thrown other people under the bus to cover for it.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#79
#79
206Fan said:
...complete revisionist history by Vivek when it was being reported 2 years ago that Fox had low trade value and the Pacers wouldn't do the trade if it wasn't Haliburton.
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Was that true though? I mean, I can't see a pivot that large going down with the way it played out. So, you won't take Fox, alright, we'll completely destroy our plan then, here you go. LOL. I remember the blurb about Fox and then it being mostly shot down almost immediately.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles...d-in-domantas-sabonis-trade-talks-at-deadline

https://kings-beat.beehiiv.com/p/sources-kings-hope-build-around-deaaron-fox-tyrese-haliburton

When you factor in the way it played out, evidence points to yes, they were showcasing Haliburton. We have to give Monte that much credit. Otherwise his PG stacking was Vlade level and we now know that's not him.
 
Ozymandias

Ozymandias

All-Star
#80
#80
I would certainly think OG would be the starting PF here..


Surprised to see a depth chart with Keegan at PF and OG at SF... Have you, by any chance, taken a look at these 2 players legs? KM has a solid set of legs on him no doubt but OG legit has tree trunks for legs for a basketball player.

Ya know he plays SF for Toronto because he's displaced by Siakam and now Scottie Barnes, thats why Toronto isnt a suitable longterm location for him...
 
Ozymandias

Ozymandias

All-Star
#81
#81
was always a big fan of OG at IU.. Never understood how he fell in that draft, i know there was an injury involved but for his evaluations to not come back as lottery grade across the board --- thats one of those things that would never happen in the year 2023, teams aware of the direction the game was headed in or hes an easy lotto pick.

I like how I settled on rooting for the Kings because they went after players that I liked to watch and they've done pretty much nothing but gone after players I like to watch since..

Beal and OG both sound like good options to me.. Both have their merits.. We can adjust to either scenario I think.
 
K

kingsfan101

Starter
#82
#82
ShastaKingsFan said:
That's what many said about Haliburton. Nobody is untradeable, if a deal puts your team in a better position
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True, but in Hali's case, he and Fox were clearly getting in each other's way.

Keegan gave us wing depth which we had been missing since Rudy. In fact, given that Rudy wasn't happy here, even that is probably not a good comparison. Honestly, I can't remember any time before Keegan when we had solid wing play since Artest played here.
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#83
#83
wasn't it reported in February that Toronto was seeking something along the lines of 3 first rounders for OG? Now things may change because they will want to get something in return if he were to walk, it's the bluff and negotiate game now.
 
ShastaKingsFan

ShastaKingsFan

All-Star
#84
#84
SacTownKid said:
I don't think it's revisionist after the fact. Even at the time, I mentioned in one of the threads that it sure didn't look like they were sitting Fox to move him but rather, it looked like they were showcasing Davion and Haliburton. Well, here we sit. It then makes Montes PG stacking look a lot less confusing and after that, almost everything he's done has made complete sense if Fox was their guy.
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Some still think that he coincidentally had an ankle injury going into that trade dead line. With it magically going away as soon as Sabonis put on a Kings uniform
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

Hall of Famer
#85
#85
206Fan said:
I think I would do Huerter, Davion, and a future 1st. I'd really like to hang onto #24 to draft a Huerter replacement.

I'm eyeing Podz, Whitehead, or Sheppard who are all good 3pt shooters. I don't think they last until #38.
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I think the Kings would have to get extremely, unrealistically lucky to replace Huerter with the 24th pick. I mean, I know the guy had a rough playoff series but he’s not an easily replaceable talent. Especially with a first year player
 
ockingsfan

ockingsfan

Starter
#86
#86
Kingz19 said:
I think the Kings would have to get extremely, unrealistically lucky to replace Huerter with the 24th pick. I mean, I know the guy had a rough playoff series but he’s not an easily replaceable talent. Especially with a first year player
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I think if we move Huerter in a trade, it would be Monk that steps into the starting lineup, not a rookie draft pick
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

Hall of Famer
#87
#87
ockingsfan said:
I think if we move Huerter in a trade, it would be Monk that steps into the starting lineup, not a rookie draft pick
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Of course, I figured as much…but then you need to replace Monk’s production off the bench. If not replace it, find a competent SG/combo guard to come off the bench. Because in this scenario we’re also trading the backup PG with no proven next man up to replace him. Bring back TD? Is Ellis ready?

I know we’re probably banking on Sasha being a scorer off the bench…I am…. but Huerter is more suited for DHO action with Domas. Monk is great as a a 6th man.

the bench was pretty shaky offensively last season. Kings had one of the best starting lineups last season. Their lack of flexibility and offensive consistency off the bench was a major weakness. This plan seems to make the Kings starting lineup even better, but the bench possibly even worse.

Either way, no matter who starts you’re talking about replacing either Huerter or Monk’s bench production with a #24 rookie. I would rather part with #24 than Huerter. Even if it ruins any excitement for draft night.

I mentioned earlier I’m not opposed to trading Huerter to Toronto in an OG deal, but the plan can’t be a low first round rookie covering for valuable production from the most shored up position from last season. They can be good right away, but they can also never be good at all. Chances are the Kings won’t draft an immediate rotation player at 24.
 
SacTownKid

SacTownKid

Hall of Famer
#90
#90
Tetsujin said:
https://twitter.com/statuses/1669752440332382209
The Pacers prematurely ending their rebuild because Rick Carlisle doesn’t like coaching young players would certainly be something. It would also be 100% dependent on Tyrese turning into James Harden or Luka.
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Yeah, and they should be going after Ayton if they're cutting things short. Hali and Ayton in pick and roll is probably tops in the league from day 1. I'm sure the Suns are like, we don't need the 7th pick. Good, make it a 3 team deal. Sure would suck to see OG with the Suns though.
 
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