Kevin Martin and playing time

Gregorius

Gregorius

G-League
I have a question about Kevin Martin getting time. Is game time absolutely necessary for his developement? I would imagine playing would help ease nervousness and tension, but I would think that majority of the development would come with practice time with the team and by himself.

Does actual playing time factor into a young players developement more than I've imagined? If it does it makes me feel bad for young players on good teams... that would be cool if we could rent Special K out to the Hawks or the Bobcats or something for a year or two so they could develop more and then come back...
 
(I split this off from the game discussion thread.)

How much does playing time factor into development, especially in the first year?

I think it's an interesting question and I'd really like to hear some opinions, so I did the magic moderator thing and made it a new thread.
 
It's very important because the average career of a player is 3 years in the NBA which is a pretty short time. Odds are most 2nd round picks will never make it. Kevin is a good prospect and like most Kings picks have worked out for us or elsewhere. Renting out a player I don't think is a forseeable option but wouldn't hurt development. Minutes are definitely sacred on playoff level teams and although we are going in a different direction without CWebb we aren't rebuilding and thus we can't just let a rookie play unless he is a top level talent which Martin has not proved to be so far.
 
Give me an example of a player who become great by sitting on the bench.

Every second spent on the floor is very important because no practice can ever replace a real game situation
 
Some players do get "rented" out to Euro teams to help in their development. As far as actual playing time, I would think it could do nothing but help. The actual games are a lot different than practice from what I have heard through player interviews.
 
bigbadred00 said:
It's very important because the average career of a player is 3 years in the NBA which is a pretty short time. .
Click to expand...

I'm curious. Where did you find that statistic?
 
Well, I believe that stat because there may be a lot of players who have really short contracts who offset those with long term ones. I mean, I've been following NBA for a long time and I don't know the names of half of the people on some teams...
 
But figure this, most 2nd rounders never make it past the 2nd year. And most first rounders might make it 6 or 7 if they are very lucky. Those who make it or 7 feet are going to play longer of course but average Joe is not going to make it.
 
bigbadred00 said:
Hmm..maybe that was football, but the average NBA draftee doesn't make it past his first contract.
Click to expand...

Still curious. Where did you get THIS statistic?
 
No offense, bigbadred, but you're making a lot of presumptive statements that may sound right, but I'd be very interested in seeing some substantiating data.
 
It's an observation:

Look at last years draft for instance.

Lampe-Doing nothing on Hornets Bench
Kapono-Bobcats (starter)
Walton-Bench of Lakres
Jerome Beasley-Out of NBA
Sokoflis-Not in the NBA Yet
Szymon Szewczky-Not in NBA
Mario Austin-Never heard of him
Travis Hansen-Not in the NBA
Steve Blake-3rd guy behind Arenas
Slavko Vranes-Not in NBA
Derrick Zimmerman-Nothing
Willie Green-Good role player behind AI
Zaur Pauchila

I can go on and on.

Of the 2nd round guys only Kapono, Walton, Willie Green, Blake, and Korver play more than probally 7 minutes a game.

The year before. Dan Gadzuric, Boozer, Ronald Murray, Rasual Butler and Barnes are the only players of note, the list goes on and on. In the first round that year Ely is a castoff, Woods is a castoff, Curtis Borchardt nothing, Nachbar, nothing....there is alot of wasted talent....that's where you get 3 or 4 years of the average NBA career.
 
I really dont think so, i think Kevin Martin has abilities but i think its better for him to watch and learn and make the best of every chance he gets...
 
VF- we let go of our 2nd round pick this year, the year before Corsley Edwards, he's not in the league. Maurice Jeffers? Ever heard of him, don't think so. So ...yeah you get the picture, probally more than half of nba draft picks never make it past the 2nd year and some not past the first cut.
 
Who is he going to play for? If Mobley is the primary 2 guard and Evans is the primary 2 backup. I just don't see many minutes for Martin.

There was a time when you could count on the Kings for one or two blowouts a month giving the "deep" bench players some time. Maybe if he bulks up a little he could log some time at the 3 next year.
 
To make things worse for Martin much of a rookie's development and impression he creates with the coaching staff comes from practice/scrimmage. But in our case, we haven't had enough healthy bodies to even practice lately with the new guys, let alone do a full five on five scrimmage. This can only retard his development. But, as stated above, it's a league wide phenomena that, in all fairness, should be addressed by the league by allowing teams to send guys "down" to the NBADL without losing them to someone else.
 
VF-Average experience in the NBA in 2002 was 4.821 years. You have to figure 95% of them are first round picks. Of 2nd round picks you might get at most 5 role players in a draft and about 10 of the first round picks are busts, I can do the calculation but of players in the nba the average is 4.82 years. and it keeps dropping. this figure does not account for players out of the league and players dropped, so you can figure the number should be lower, I could be wrong though.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/survey_htwt0102.html
 
There is no Practice that can compare to the speed of a game.

The proof is in the pudding, when you play a certain person so much you get to know their tendacies and can play defense on them easier, because you know what they want to do. In a game situation playing different players every night going at full speed, you have to learn on your feet.

There is no experience like game time experience. Practice is good for learning sets and the ebbs and flows of your teammates.

My personal opionion on why they are not playing martin is his tendancy not to shoot when he is open. I know the coaching staff want him to shoot the ball when he is in there and there are sometimes when he does not look confident in his shot.

Martin will be a good pro and because he is a 6'-7" 2 guard this will really help him in the future.

I would love to see martin getting 8-10 mins a game for the remainder of the season. but we all know adlemans knack for not wanting to play rookies.

Think about this, the Cuttino & Mo Evans situation (Free Agency) could leave open the 2 guard spot and Martin could be starting for the kings in 2 years.
 
piksi said:
Give me an example of a player who become great by sitting on the bench.

Every second spent on the floor is very important because no practice can ever replace a real game situation
Click to expand...

Ok, I know this example might seem a little weird because this player is rarely on the bench, but LeBron James played his rookie season averaging 20.4 points on 40.5% shooting and 5.7 rebound and 5.8 assists. After the all-star break (reflecting the experience he had gained starting and playing all those minutes) his stats were not that much better 21.8 points on 43.8% shooting, 5.1 rebound, and 6.1 assists).

However when James came back this season after not much actual playing (but a whole lot of bench time on the Olypic teams bench) and a whole lot of intense practice and training on his own, he's come back averaging 25.5 points on 4.85% shooting and 7 rebound and 7.6 assists.

Thats a significant increase for those numbers and those numbers increased not as he played minutes during his rookie season, but after a lot of practice in the offseason.
 
Reminds Me of Tht Classic Line .....

Diehard Jim said:
There is no Practice that can compare to the speed of a game.

The proof is in the pudding, when you play a certain person so much you get to know their tendacies and can play defense on them easier, because you know what they want to do. In a game situation playing different players every night going at full speed, you have to learn on your feet.

There is no experience like game time experience. Practice is good for learning sets and the ebbs and flows of your teammates.

My personal opionion on why they are not playing martin is his tendancy not to shoot when he is open. I know the coaching staff want him to shoot the ball when he is in there and there are sometimes when he does not look confident in his shot.

Martin will be a good pro and because he is a 6'-7" 2 guard this will really help him in the future.

I would love to see martin getting 8-10 mins a game for the remainder of the season. but we all know adlemans knack for not wanting to play rookies.

Think about this, the Cuttino & Mo Evans situation (Free Agency) could leave open the 2 guard spot and Martin could be starting for the kings in 2 years.
Click to expand...

In order to get credit .... you gotta have credit .... HUH ????

Boils down to what some others have been saying .... gotta make the most out of the minutes you get when you do get 'em.

You gotta come READY TO PLAY and PUMPED !!!! Like Mo is and like Matt did !!!
 
Last edited:
bigbadred00 said:
VF-Average experience in the NBA in 2002 was 4.821 years. You have to figure 95% of them are first round picks. Of 2nd round picks you might get at most 5 role players in a draft and about 10 of the first round picks are busts, I can do the calculation but of players in the nba the average is 4.82 years. and it keeps dropping. this figure does not account for players out of the league and players dropped, so you can figure the number should be lower, I could be wrong though.

http://www.nba.com/analysis/survey_htwt0102.html
Click to expand...

I'll accept the figure of 4.82 years, which is significantly higher than your presumption of 3 years.

I don't buy your presumption that those figures keep dropping.

Sorry, but numbers are a thing with me. All too often people tend to quote statistics that do not actually exist. The real ones are out there. I just like to see people actually find and use them.

;)
 
opening day 85-86 experience 3.85 years
opening day 04-05 experience 4.82 years

from nba.com link already given in post earlier.

The average time in the league is going up not down.

The reason for this is simple. there are more teams now then there were before. since 85-86 there have been the additions of Charlotte, New Orleans, Miami, Orlando, Memphis, Toronto. 6 teams x 12 players will raise the average tenure in the NBA.
 
Diehard Jim said:
opening day 85-86 experience 3.85 years
opening day 04-05 experience 4.82 years

from nba.com link already given in post earlier.

The average time in the league is going up not down.

The reason for this is simple. there are more teams now then there were before. since 85-86 there have been the additions of Charlotte, New Orleans, Miami, Orlando, Memphis, Toronto. 6 teams x 12 players will raise the average tenure in the NBA.
Click to expand...

Well also jsut that athletes are taking better care of themselves, and medicine has improved dramatically. Once upon a time you hit 32 you were just about done, and certainly any sort of msjor kne injury was the end of your career. rememebr a time in the late 80's when ti was still considered amazing when a guy came back at all from an ACL tear.
 
swisshh said:
Playing time is very important if you ask me. Practice and real games are two different beasts to tackle.
Click to expand...

Well its chicken and egg though -- you have to earn PT in practice to get on the court. No coach of a playoff type team (where every game matters) is going to throw a player that looks shaky in practice onto the court to either develop or not on the court and potentially lose his team games. You can do that if you't in the lottery + it doesn't matter, not if 1 loss is the difference between homecourt or not in the playoffs.
 
Now we're getting to Adleman playing/developing young players and you know how I feel about that. I don't think you can earn playing time through practice with Adleman.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top