Kenny Thomas for Juwan Howard?

[Cecil]

KT for J. Howard? This whole thread should be deleted.

 

[SacTownKid]

I heard Musselman doing an interview on the summer league broadcast for the Kings game against the Mavs and it seems like he likes the Kenny/Reef PF rotation. Kenny would be able to pressure the ball like he wants to do.

From the way it sounded I wouldn't be too sure that Petrie is shopping Kenny at all. I just hope we don't go into next season with a -1 Bonzi Wells, no Justin Williams, and nothing else that actually helps this team become better.

 

[Kings113]

I thought that at first as well, but I think he was being diplomatic and playing it safe.

Regardless, we cannot have the same front-court we have now, and don't expect us to sit around for 2 plus months and roll out on opening night with KT/Brad/SAR/Potapenko and 1 or 2 third big men.

 

[SacTownKid]

You're probably right.

 

[Bricklayer]

I heard Musselman doing an interview on the summer league broadcast for the Kings game against the Mavs and it seems like he likes the Kenny/Reef PF rotation.

Oh lord.

Well at least now we are beginning to get a feel for how he could have been fired after only 2 years in Oakland.

 

[HndsmCelt]

Of course it could also mean the Muss has learend a little about "being political." No advantage in crticizing your current line up. If your stuck with them you have to show trust. If you wnat to trade them you can't undemine potential trade value.

 

[Kings113]

Really, I think it's just being safe and "as it stands now". Aside from the thing with Bonzi, and getting 1 or 2 undrafted rookies, I can't see us just doing that and keeping our front-court we have now.

I'd be surprised, but don't think that's how it goes.

 

[mcsluggo]

Of course it could also mean the Muss has learend a little about "being political." No advantage in crticizing your current line up. If your stuck with them you have to show trust. If you wnat to trade them you can't undemine potential trade value.

Amen. I HOPE he has learned that lesson.

 

[Cecil]

I wouldn't be shocked if Kenny T. was traded, but people need to think about what kind a player he is. Although he is undersized, he makes up for it with his mobility and quickness. Something that everyone wants - athletic players. He is aggressive on the boards, can nail the occasional jumper, and gets points from offensive rebounds. He definately is underpaid for a starting PF. People need to relax and give THIS Artest led team a chance this year. I think people feel like these players are their friends or something, and if one doesn't smile all the time like Vlade did, they overlook their playing abilities and want them traded.

 

[Kings113]

Thing is, KT needs a big defensive center next to him or his short-comings are clear - 6'7", not a shotblocker, usually not much of a post-defender, not a presence in the paint. Brad isn't any of those either unfortunately, and neither is anyone else on our team, except for post-defense from SAR. But that and KT's rebounding/hustle aren't what you anchor and rely on for you interior defense. Which, is all that we have on the defensive-end in the front-court right now, which is unfortunate. It needs to be improved.

I sure hope KT gets his jumpshot back, where-ever he is, as it was just occasional last season indeed, instead of automatic like before.

Underpaid? I'd say he's overpaid.

 

[Cecil]

Yes, underpaid. A starting PF making 6 1/2 million this year. The next best bargain not with a rookie contract is Shareef. Would you rather still have Webber at 20 million on the books this year?

 

[Kings113]

His whole contract.

 

[Bricklayer]

I wouldn't be shocked if Kenny T. was traded, but people need to think about what kind a player he is. Although he is undersized, he makes up for it with his mobility and quickness. Something that everyone wants - athletic players. He is aggressive on the boards, can nail the occasional jumper, and gets points from offensive rebounds. He definately is underpaid for a starting PF. People need to relax and give THIS Artest led team a chance this year. I think people feel like these players are their friends or something, and if one doesn't smile all the time like Vlade did, they overlook their playing abilities and want them traded.

Yes, I know what sort of player Kenny is -- an undersized non-defending ego-centric platoon type player with an attitude problem his entire career. A low minute starter for lottery teams. Should be a bencher for a good team, but would prefer to pout and grump, and so is nearly useless in the role for which he was born. If he is "underpaid" for a starting PF, its because he is one of the very worst "starting PFs". Its like DeShawn Stevensen complaining he was underpaid for a starting OG. Orlando's solution was simple -- just replace him as a starter.

There is one concern, and only one concern, in trading a Kenny Thomas: The only thing he does do well at a starter's level is rebound (although I will say I think he is better at grabbing the spectacular rebound in space then the tough one inside amongst the big trees). And with the collection of skirts populating the rest of our frontline, and with us potentially losing our only other reboudner with cahones if Bonzi goes too, we absolutely positively MUST bring in a big board masher or two if we are going to lose those guys.

 

[Cecil]

we absolutely positively MUST bring in a big board masher or two if we are going to lose those guys.

This whole point to this is who in the hell is going to give up a 'big board masher'? It's nearly impossible to trade for a big who will improve your situation. You can go for the question mark big, like Jerome James and Dampier, who are well overpaid and take nights off, in free agency. But no team is going to let them go or trade. Sh*t, Nene has been hurt a lot of his career and still got the big bucks while Denver hasn't moved him. You know teams have called about him for four seasons.

If this is 'rebuilding' for the Kings, you have to be happy with the current line-up. Shareef and Artest are huge pieces when dumping contracts/players. You have a better chance missing yourself while pissing in the wind than the Kings do at upgrading at PF/C.

 

[Jerryaki]

milwaukee might. villanueva, gadzuric, magloire, and bogut. they've got big men to spare.

 

[Cecil]

Why would they want to bring in KT if they have that many big anyways. I seriously doubt they send over Villanueva or Bogut. Magloire would be nice, but then who is their other center? Why not keep him for the year and then sign and trade him in the offseason. Gadzuric is a downgrade.

 

[Jerryaki]

my fault, i got my threads crossed, forgot this was the KT thread not the bonzi thread.

but then again, a sign and trade with bonzi for one of their bigs and that's an upgrade in our frontcourt. so it's not like we're absolutely stuck with KT at that position.

 

[Rome]

I will be very mad if we lose Bonzi and keep the same starting front court from last season.

 

[Kings113]

That shouldn't happen, as we'd have more options for bigs most likely with free-agents. If so, what the hell is going on?

Since I guess we won't use the MLE/LLE if we have Bonzi back, and would only be able to trade.

 

[Oscar]

Who gives a **** if they played for the Fab Five? Webber didn't bring back any rings? Guess what, neither has anybody else playing for the Kings, either. What difference does being part of the Fab Five make? What college a player went to and what their college team's nickname was when discussing trade prospects is roughly as relevant as what their jersey number is.

The questions that people should be asking themselves regarding Thomas for Howard are: 1) would Howard be an upgrade over Thomas as a reserve PF (presuming that neither would start), 2) would such a move be financially viable, and 3) would it be in the Kings' best interests to make that move.

Being part of the Fab Five has pee-all to do with it.

Absolutely it makes a big difference that they were a part of the Fab 5. It has to do with the selfish mindset of this Michigan team and how it has carried over into the pros. No other team was hyped as much as they were. And they ate it up and ran with it.

You want a rent-a-player in Howard, by all means go get him. Just be well aware of what you're getting. A decent offensive player who has bounced around a lot, doesn't help get his team to the next level, and is not that young anymore. And you can keep your asterisks to yourself.

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Webber and Juwan Howard playing for Michigan has zero bearing on whether or not they won championships in the pros.

And, if this board didn't have profanity filters, asterisks would be the least of your complaints.

 

[hearns]

There aren't too many options for trade Kenny, but I wouldn't trade him for Juwan Howard. Maybe a Kenny for McInnis+Nachbar.

 

[Oscar]

Webber and Juwan Howard playing for Michigan has zero bearing on whether or not they won championships in the pros.

And, if this board didn't have profanity filters, asterisks would be the least of your complaints.

Again, it has EVERY bearing on whether or not they won championships in the pros. Maybe if they thought about the team they were on in the pros first, they might have made an extra pass, hustled and played defense a little harder; that might have made the difference in an important playoff game to get them to the big dance.

Frankly, I expected more from Jalen Rose than the rest of them. He had all the makings of another Magic Johnson, but it only turned out to be selfish magic.

P.S. Look at the namesake of my screen name. Oscar Robertson had stats with the best of them - he AVERAGED a triple-double one season. But he even realized that, if you don't help to elevate the rest of the team's play, you don't get a ring.

 

[Warhawk]

Maybe if they thought about the team they were on in the pros first, they might have made an extra pass, hustled and played defense a little harder; that might have made the difference in an important playoff game to get them to the big dance.

Considering Webber was considered to be one of the best passing big men in the league while he was here and the Kings were among the best teams in defence and offense and always hustled, why do you consider Webber a "failure" while he was here? Besides not getting a ring, he was one of the best plauyers in the league while in Sacramento before his injury.

 

[Oscar]

Considering Webber was considered to be one of the best passing big men in the league while he was here and the Kings were among the best teams in defence and offense and always hustled, why do you consider Webber a "failure" while he was here? Besides not getting a ring, he was one of the best plauyers in the league while in Sacramento before his injury.

Where in any of my quotes did I use the word "failure?" From the start I've only pointed out one thing: zero rings. And it looks like zero rings in their future, too.

P.S. When have the Kings ever played "defence?"

 

[VF21]

Where in any of my quotes did I use the word "failure?" From the start I've only pointed out one thing: zero rings. And it looks like zero rings in their future, too.

P.S. When have the Kings ever played "defence?"

There are 30 teams in the NBA. Only one team, with a maximum of 14 players, can win the ring each year.

If your only measurement of success is the ring, I think you're watching the wrong sport.

 

[Warhawk]

My interpretation of your earlier posts is that you consider them to be failures because they haven't won rings. If that wasn't the point you were trying to make, sorry.

I am not the greatest typist in the world (actually only started "touch-typing" in the last year or so) and make lots of mistakes. I catch most, not all of them. Sorry if the imperfect spelling offended your sensibilities.

Please refer to:

http://www.kingsfans.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12978

In addition, it is not up to any member to correct or criticize the grammar or spelling of other members. We have a worldwide community here, and a lot of our members are posting in English as their second, third or even fourth language. It's not about how something is spelled, anyway. It's about the comments.

Thanks.

 

[Oscar]

There are 30 teams in the NBA. Only one team, with a maximum of 14 players, can win the ring each year.

If your only measurement of success is the ring, I think you're watching the wrong sport.

Is that your way of rationalizing that the Kings don't have a ring and the franchise last got one on '51? No, it's not my only measurement of success - it's my ULTIMATE measurement of success.

 

[VF21]

I'm not rationalizing a thing. I don't have to. YOU are the one acting as though the ring is the only thing that matters. If it is, in fact, that's fine - for you. But please do not expect me to enjoy MY team any less because of your standards.

 

[hammystyle]

Again, it has EVERY bearing on whether or not they won championships in the pros. Maybe if they thought about the team they were on in the pros first, they might have made an extra pass, hustled and played defense a little harder; that might have made the difference in an important playoff game to get them to the big dance.

Frankly, I expected more from Jalen Rose than the rest of them. He had all the makings of another Magic Johnson, but it only turned out to be selfish magic.

P.S. Look at the namesake of my screen name. Oscar Robertson had stats with the best of them - he AVERAGED a triple-double one season. But he even realized that, if you don't help to elevate the rest of the team's play, you don't get a ring.

This whole arguement is just so out there. First off Jalen never had the makings of another Magic Johnson...seriously, that's preposterous. Jalen is 6' 8" lefty with good ball-handling skills that allowed him to be pretty effective scorer. No one, and I mean no one, has ever confused him with Magic Johnson.

To the main point of your arguement...I really don't understand your logic: Fab 5 is very hyped up = Not being team players that could win a championship in the NBA. Um..what?

Webber was a star, Jalen has been pretty good overall and was really good for a few years there, and Juwan has had a pretty good career, but has been pilloried a bit because some team decided to egregiously overpay him. At one point Webber was the best player on a team that was a legit championship contender, and Jalen was the 2nd best player on a team that went to the finals. So was it there fault that those teams lost, because when they were 18 and 19 they got a lot of attention for doing something that no college team has ever done?

My conclusion is that I think you didn't like the Fab-5 because of the baggy shorts and the kind of younger, urban style they represented. You probly didn't like them then, and feel some sort of weird validation that none have gone on to win an NBA championship.