Miles and Miles
G-League
In the 7 games after the All Star break they play 4 teams with losing records and the other three are the Lakers, Wizards, and Pacers. In the 5 game winning streak they played 3 losers and 2 winners.
"It takes 50 games to know your team."
- Thread starter fnordius
- Start date
In the 7 games after the All Star break they play 4 teams with losing records and the other three are the Lakers, Wizards, and Pacers. In the 5 game winning streak they played 3 losers and 2 winners.
You say four teams with losing records, I say two sets of back-to-back on the road. And Charlotte is a better team, record notwithstanding.
We may finish that string 2-5. If we lost to Boston (which, with Paul Pierce, is not inconceivabale), we might well lose them all.
Others have argued the point with you, so I won't bother. But I wasn't playing the what if game. I was playing the "god I wish we would just tank. We're not going anywhere."
2 steps back, 10 steps forward. You may not understand it, but I am willing to lose now in order to win for years and years in the future. Or you can stay around a .400 team for the next decade. Why on earth would you choose the latter?
The problem with these hypotheticals is that they have no realities to go with them.
If we were one game out of 6th, that would mean 29 wins so far, which could mean anything from a so-so position in the playoffs to 4th pick in the lottery (assuming a highly improbable 0-31 end to the season).
But how would we have gotten to 29 wins? Obviously not with this team and schedule. If we got to 29 wins by playing all 41 of our home games, + road games against the 10 weakest opponents in the NBA, we'd have a lousy team and should totally forget about the playoffs. If we'd played 41 road games, + 10 home games against the best teams in the NBA, and just had a KG/LBJ/Wade level of player return to our roster after being out injured for 4 months, then we might have a shot at going all the way.
Unfortunately, we are much closer to the first scenario than the second. By our 49th game, we had played 27 at home and only 22 on the road. With two road losses since then, we still have 17 road games and 14 home games to play. We've been winning 55% of home games and 29% of road games, so if we keep on doing as we have been, we're looking at going 12-19 from here on out, ending up with a 34-48 record (41.4%), 12th place in the West and the 9th draft pick.
Even if we did the unthinkable, and won every single game, going 31-0 in what's left of the season, we'd have a 64% record, which would put us behind 5th-place Houston. So 6th would be the best outcome even in an impossible scenario.
On the other hand, if we went 7-24 from here, we'd end up with a 29-53 record and the #4 lottery position. I'm not enough of an optimist to expect that, but at least it's within the realm of possibility, and missing the target by a bit might still be quite helpful to the franchise. Any trading decisions that are going to be made will happen based on the season so far, the time to showcase our players is over. So there's really no reason at all to win any more (non-Lakers) games.
Come on, Muss, you can do it! Nobody makes Kool Aid like you do, and no player can ever be as much of a locker room cancer as a coach can. Go 7-24 now, and you will have made a cool $7M for only a year's work -- more than twice as much as the average American with a doctorate makes in their entire lifetime -- and with next year's lottery looking quite good, you might even get another contract from a team that wants to be the Boston of '07-'08, but which needs a little help. I know you can do it, please don't let us down!
If we were one game out of 6th, that would mean 29 wins so far, which could mean anything from a so-so position in the playoffs to 4th pick in the lottery (assuming a highly improbable 0-31 end to the season).
But how would we have gotten to 29 wins? Obviously not with this team and schedule. If we got to 29 wins by playing all 41 of our home games, + road games against the 10 weakest opponents in the NBA, we'd have a lousy team and should totally forget about the playoffs. If we'd played 41 road games, + 10 home games against the best teams in the NBA, and just had a KG/LBJ/Wade level of player return to our roster after being out injured for 4 months, then we might have a shot at going all the way.
Unfortunately, we are much closer to the first scenario than the second. By our 49th game, we had played 27 at home and only 22 on the road. With two road losses since then, we still have 17 road games and 14 home games to play. We've been winning 55% of home games and 29% of road games, so if we keep on doing as we have been, we're looking at going 12-19 from here on out, ending up with a 34-48 record (41.4%), 12th place in the West and the 9th draft pick.
Even if we did the unthinkable, and won every single game, going 31-0 in what's left of the season, we'd have a 64% record, which would put us behind 5th-place Houston. So 6th would be the best outcome even in an impossible scenario.
On the other hand, if we went 7-24 from here, we'd end up with a 29-53 record and the #4 lottery position. I'm not enough of an optimist to expect that, but at least it's within the realm of possibility, and missing the target by a bit might still be quite helpful to the franchise. Any trading decisions that are going to be made will happen based on the season so far, the time to showcase our players is over. So there's really no reason at all to win any more (non-Lakers) games.
Come on, Muss, you can do it! Nobody makes Kool Aid like you do, and no player can ever be as much of a locker room cancer as a coach can. Go 7-24 now, and you will have made a cool $7M for only a year's work -- more than twice as much as the average American with a doctorate makes in their entire lifetime -- and with next year's lottery looking quite good, you might even get another contract from a team that wants to be the Boston of '07-'08, but which needs a little help. I know you can do it, please don't let us down!
gunks
Hall of Famer
Ah yes, the Petrie vision
Bricklayer
Don't Make Me Use The Bat
If the Lakers do no more than play .500 ball from here on out, we'd have to go 22-9 down the stretch to catch them.
That's 22-9 with 14 home games and 17 road games. And that's if the Lakers suddenly go .500. And that's just to tie. If they keep on playing at their current pace it would be us going something closer to 25-6 or 26-5 or some such ridiculousness.
That's also with us facing a brutal March and April filled with long road trips and game after game against West playoff teams/playoff contenders. After a 5 game swing through solid East teams, the Kings final 15 games of the year are all against the West, including Dallas, Spurs, Rockets, Suns twice, Utah, Lakers twice etc. It ain't happening.
And while the stupidity of going for #7 or #8 might "only" require us to go 20-11 or some such down the stretch against those opponents, that's a huge stretch on its own. The final two playoff teams are, barring injuries, likely going to be the Nuggets and the Hornets. The Nuggets oince they get their pairing up and running should be good for 45 or so at least. The Hornets are rushing now that they have their guys back, and Peja may even join the party. But who knows, before we could even catch those teams we'd have to leapfrog the Warriors -- who's fate depends on Baron's health, the Clippers (making a move?), the Wolves etc, all of whom are more legit threats than we are. And then we could get to be the team to get embarrassed on national TV by the Mavs instead of them.
That's 22-9 with 14 home games and 17 road games. And that's if the Lakers suddenly go .500. And that's just to tie. If they keep on playing at their current pace it would be us going something closer to 25-6 or 26-5 or some such ridiculousness.
That's also with us facing a brutal March and April filled with long road trips and game after game against West playoff teams/playoff contenders. After a 5 game swing through solid East teams, the Kings final 15 games of the year are all against the West, including Dallas, Spurs, Rockets, Suns twice, Utah, Lakers twice etc. It ain't happening.
And while the stupidity of going for #7 or #8 might "only" require us to go 20-11 or some such down the stretch against those opponents, that's a huge stretch on its own. The final two playoff teams are, barring injuries, likely going to be the Nuggets and the Hornets. The Nuggets oince they get their pairing up and running should be good for 45 or so at least. The Hornets are rushing now that they have their guys back, and Peja may even join the party. But who knows, before we could even catch those teams we'd have to leapfrog the Warriors -- who's fate depends on Baron's health, the Clippers (making a move?), the Wolves etc, all of whom are more legit threats than we are. And then we could get to be the team to get embarrassed on national TV by the Mavs instead of them.
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Kingster
Hall of Famer
DITTO!!!!
CruzDude
Senior Member sharing a brew with bajaden
Somehow the reality of the original thread has been lost many times. "Where are we after 50 games", was the question. Seems everyong is hung up on the dum idea that an NBA team can play for a lottery position. Who cares at this point? It depends more on what other teams do. Heck the Lakers are on a 4 or 5 game losing streak now with no immediate solution.
Kings won 5 in a row than got trashed by an angry Sonics team that played up to their potential (then went on to beat better teams their next 2 games!!). The next two Kings games were lost by my boy Ron Ron in the last 2 minutes of each game.
Where are the Kings after 50 games? Well, not nearly where we all thought they'd be. My contention for 2 months or so has been the lack of on-court chemistry: not personalities but playing styles. That and a total lack of athleticism. All inhereted by Muss. No matter how good a coach is, if he is handed a poor set of parts, the whole can never win a bunch of games. Lenny Wilkens found that out as is Isiah and even Phil Jackson.
I think Muss has done everything he could with the hand dealt him. I don't think KT, SAR, Hart and Price have stepped up like they could or should. Kevin has become better than we thought and he and Bibby don't get the touches they need to lead the team offense. So lets take a look at the pieces of this car that is (has?) becoming a clunker.
KT is grossly inconsistent and cannot be counted on as hoped. Has 1 good game every 3 or 4. Better in a running game but sadly undersized.
SAR is inconsistent, improving a little bit but neither can match up with many of the athletic PF. A journeyman at best.
Brad is getting better in the offense but is a major defensive liability in the middle who doesn't rebound well, doesn't block shots and therefore allows way too many "points-in-the-paint". Has been out with injuries missing 15 games in the first half which really affects his play in 20+ games.
Bibby had a horrible first half shooting wise due mainly to the hand and wrist injury/recovery. Seems to give body language of pouting when Ron Ron hogs the ball and dribbles too much, too much of the time. Has lost, rather had taken away, his crunch time benefit from the past 5 years by Ron Ron. Is the only King to play in all 51 games so far.
Ron Ron.......... boy he is a toughie to rate after 50 games. Scoring 39 is useless if Kings loose. He needs to concentrate more on defense and transition skills and less on trying to be a "go-to" guy and forcing the issue as he did in the last two losses. I'd rather seem him get 10+ rebs every night and 3-4 steals than get 39 and Kings loose.
Bench.
Cisco is coming around and showing signs of being really good. Next year, if he is still here, he will be the key 6th man. Great hustler, sometimes too much but that's better than not enough.
Corliss has been great especially the past 10-15 games. But he is undersized to play PF and too slow to play SF. A real "tweener" and a valuable piece off the bench.
Salmons is a good not great, journeyman and can play the 1-2-3 and has nearly a 2:1 ast/TO ratio, tops on the team behind Brad and Bibby (Ron Ron is at 1.6:1 Ast/TO and Corliss is nealy 2.5 TO's for every assist!).
Douby is getting a few minutes here and there and shows tid-bits of what he might do to contribute next year. Agressive on defense but inexperienced. Rest of the bench is no help.
So all in all Kings are about where you could expect them to be, a lottery team. And there is nothing Muss can do about it............. given the players he was dealt.
Kings won 5 in a row than got trashed by an angry Sonics team that played up to their potential (then went on to beat better teams their next 2 games!!). The next two Kings games were lost by my boy Ron Ron in the last 2 minutes of each game.
Where are the Kings after 50 games? Well, not nearly where we all thought they'd be. My contention for 2 months or so has been the lack of on-court chemistry: not personalities but playing styles. That and a total lack of athleticism. All inhereted by Muss. No matter how good a coach is, if he is handed a poor set of parts, the whole can never win a bunch of games. Lenny Wilkens found that out as is Isiah and even Phil Jackson.
I think Muss has done everything he could with the hand dealt him. I don't think KT, SAR, Hart and Price have stepped up like they could or should. Kevin has become better than we thought and he and Bibby don't get the touches they need to lead the team offense. So lets take a look at the pieces of this car that is (has?) becoming a clunker.
KT is grossly inconsistent and cannot be counted on as hoped. Has 1 good game every 3 or 4. Better in a running game but sadly undersized.
SAR is inconsistent, improving a little bit but neither can match up with many of the athletic PF. A journeyman at best.
Brad is getting better in the offense but is a major defensive liability in the middle who doesn't rebound well, doesn't block shots and therefore allows way too many "points-in-the-paint". Has been out with injuries missing 15 games in the first half which really affects his play in 20+ games.
Bibby had a horrible first half shooting wise due mainly to the hand and wrist injury/recovery. Seems to give body language of pouting when Ron Ron hogs the ball and dribbles too much, too much of the time. Has lost, rather had taken away, his crunch time benefit from the past 5 years by Ron Ron. Is the only King to play in all 51 games so far.
Ron Ron.......... boy he is a toughie to rate after 50 games. Scoring 39 is useless if Kings loose. He needs to concentrate more on defense and transition skills and less on trying to be a "go-to" guy and forcing the issue as he did in the last two losses. I'd rather seem him get 10+ rebs every night and 3-4 steals than get 39 and Kings loose.
Bench.
Cisco is coming around and showing signs of being really good. Next year, if he is still here, he will be the key 6th man. Great hustler, sometimes too much but that's better than not enough.
Corliss has been great especially the past 10-15 games. But he is undersized to play PF and too slow to play SF. A real "tweener" and a valuable piece off the bench.
Salmons is a good not great, journeyman and can play the 1-2-3 and has nearly a 2:1 ast/TO ratio, tops on the team behind Brad and Bibby (Ron Ron is at 1.6:1 Ast/TO and Corliss is nealy 2.5 TO's for every assist!).
Douby is getting a few minutes here and there and shows tid-bits of what he might do to contribute next year. Agressive on defense but inexperienced. Rest of the bench is no help.
So all in all Kings are about where you could expect them to be, a lottery team. And there is nothing Muss can do about it............. given the players he was dealt.
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Who is this "we all" that you speak of? Did you not read my first post in this thread? They're exactly where I thought they'd be.
I have to agree with Slim. You're acting as though everyone was convinced this would be a contending or at least middle of the road team. Not true at all. And the idea that Muss is blameless because he was handed a poor set of parts ignores the obvious - Muss doesn't know what to do with the parts so it wouldn't matter anyway.
You go to a lot of trouble to point out all the player shortcomings BUT you haven't said anything about the lack of consistent direction from Musselman that could actually pull this team together.
You haven't addressed the lack of anything resembling a real plan of action. You haven't addressed the questionable (at best) substitution patterns that have put the hottest hands on the bench for extended periods. You also haven't touched on the total lack of allowing cohesive units to develop a playing rhythm together.
Scoring 39 kept us in the game. Had there been any kind of assertive leadership from the coaching staff we might actually have won. Instead, Ron tried to fill too many gaps because there was an ominous silence from the bench where the head coach was sitting...until it was too late.
That's just not true. There is a LOT he could be doing but it would mean admitting his players are real people and not just pictures in a power point presentation. He has apparently alienated most of the team with his "style" and "philosophy" of coaching.
It's an old adage: Players win, coaches lose. Well, this coach is losing ... a lot. And I'm losing what little confidence in him I had left.
This year is shot. The only thing I have to look forward to is at least one trade or two that will probably make me sad and a good draft pick. And then, hopefully, a NEW coach to make the metamorphosis complete.
Kingzrool
Starter
Genius! That is the answer for the Kings for sure. Muss should have brought his towell.
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