Despite his great opening night performance, Vasquez’s stats could have been much better. I had a quick check at the game, and Vasquez actually pass the ball for clear open shots 23 times, with only 4 of them ending in a basket. This is a 17% shooting average that is rather abysmal. Had the team shot 43% (not that great given the fact we are talking about nice looks), he would have had 10 assists. Would the team had shot 50% (more like a reasonable average), Vasquez would have had 14 assists. So basically Vasquez did a pretty good job at distributing the ball, but his team mates let him down. Now, in general this is not a big deal as we won the game, but it does play a big role in players’ minds. For a good PG to keep up his passing, he has to feel that his team mates will make the shots, otherwise, inevitably Vasquez will start taking more shots himself. (Not ideal inn my opinion, as we already have IT doing that). Anyway let’s hope we can improve this area for the game for Friday.
GV’s 4 assists
- Thread starter morsatun
- Start date
The Hammer
All-Star
I don't think GV will stop distributing even if the team goes on an extended shooting slump. We have a coach that is implementing a system that is based on trust, so GV is being coached to continue to trust his targets, and let them shoot through slumps.
In the previous regime, yes, we had to worry about that because there was no leadership... the style was at the whims of the players... to "gel"...
It's that very trust which is helpful for getting through shooting slumps and boosting players confidence. See Mark Jackson.
In the previous regime, yes, we had to worry about that because there was no leadership... the style was at the whims of the players... to "gel"...
It's that very trust which is helpful for getting through shooting slumps and boosting players confidence. See Mark Jackson.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
Wait, how is 50% of 23 = 14?
My mistake I meant to write 60%
PurpleHaze
All-Star
Greivis is quintessential pass first PG from his earliest days, mastering getting ball to the "franchise" player as his primary duty. I wonder how many Kings fans know that during GV high school basketball days in Rockville, Maryland he had this team mate named Kevin Durant. The Kevin Durant - who even taught him how to speak English as they became very close friends.
http://larrybrownsports.com/basketb...gh-school-buddies-at-montrose-christian/67502
(also please read my quote below - all Kings fans will like it!)
http://larrybrownsports.com/basketb...gh-school-buddies-at-montrose-christian/67502
(also please read my quote below - all Kings fans will like it!)
I know he is a great passer, but he is also very use to take over the offense and try to do everything when things are not working. Last year he took 14 shots per game, and he was famous within the fans (not in a good way) for his hero ball attitude at the end of games. Again don't get me wrong, I think he will be great for us, but we need to make things happen for him as well.
Glenn
Hall of Famer
Here's Vasquez" comment:
Vasquez on Cousins: "That's my guy, his skills, his footwork. He's got every tool. To be honest? I played with Marc Gasol, but this guy has every tool to be an All-Star, and that's why I'm here. I want to be DeMarcus' little brother. I want to protect him, make sure I get blamed, not him. This is going to be good. You'll see."
Maybe part of the new culture will be that you need to have an attitude similar to this. That's maybe an overstatement on my part but it makes some sense.
Glenn
Hall of Famer
I'll defend GV before I see how things work out.
I cannot see him as going into a full bore IT hero ball mode with a team built around Cousins and especially with the quote above. On the other hand, I want players who aren't afraid to have the ball at the end of games. I knew essentially nothing about GV and was surprised at his offensive aggression.
Yes, his stats could have been better BUT IT'S NOT ABOUT STATS. It's about results. And in his first game as a King, a game you describe as a "great opening night performance," GV was part of the reason we won. That's what matters, along with the obvious chemistry building between GV and his teammates ... I think you're trying way too hard to get into his head.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
That's actually a very encouraging quote. It's true leadership, rather than the usual cliches. Also great to see him trying to get the guys going verbally both on the court and during timeouts. Noteable that Malone went directly to him when he felt the guys were dropping their heads and GV took action immediately.
Kingsfan23
All-Star
Came into this season slightly skeptical but I definitely like GV so far and he looks like a part of the franchise heading forward, and I love everything he says off the floor. Of course we are very early in the season
I absolutely agree with you, and I would go one step further, to say that in my opinion, after last year, Vasquez's stats where great but his value as a player was not in line with his stats, because the people in his own team did not perceived him as a key part of the philosophy of the team. In other words, GV was more valuable to someone that look a his stats than to someone that look at his team's games. In contrast, I think at the end of this season, his value will be higher than what his stats would suggests. He will become more valuable to the kings (if not key for the system) than for anyone else that comes and look at his stats
I tend to judge players by how they play for the Kings, not what they did before they came here. What I saw last night, and I spent quite a bit of time watching GV even when the camera wasn't on him, went a long way towards convincing me he is exactly the kind of player we need at the point.
HereWeBoogie
Hall of Famer
anyone listen to GV's interview on Grant Napear show today? this guy is awesome, everything he had to say was just perfect
PurpleHaze
All-Star
Glenn said: "I knew essentially nothing about GV and was surprised at his offensive aggression."
Take a look at his stellar career at Univ of Maryland. Especially his amazing All American senior year where I saw him play a lot on TV into NCAA tourney. He led Terps in virtually every offensive category but always main facilitator for others on his highly ranked team. I would never say he was overly aggressive or a gunner at all - because he rarely forces anything. I just love how he glides effortlessly on the court with superior court vision at 6'6". To me GV is exactly what this Kings team needs in the backcourt and has needed for years - a true floor leader and a true unselfish PG.
Take a look at his stellar career at Univ of Maryland. Especially his amazing All American senior year where I saw him play a lot on TV into NCAA tourney. He led Terps in virtually every offensive category but always main facilitator for others on his highly ranked team. I would never say he was overly aggressive or a gunner at all - because he rarely forces anything. I just love how he glides effortlessly on the court with superior court vision at 6'6". To me GV is exactly what this Kings team needs in the backcourt and has needed for years - a true floor leader and a true unselfish PG.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
Enough with the IT gunner/chucker crap. By the same token as guys missing on the Vasquez "potential assists", they were also missing on potential IT assists. IT had more assists than Vasquez on few minutes and guys were missing with him also. Start watching the games rather than reading the narratives written two years ago.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
But he is a gunner. That's not to say he never passes, but quite often he goes into hero mode. Sometimes it works, and great, it's very nice to have someone who is capable of putting up points in a hurry off the bench and adding energy. He is fearless, I'll give him that. But one perfect example of when it gets to his head happened when he got the ball and Ben was clearly ahead of him up the court for what probably would have been an easy dunk. Instead IT kept the ball and went straight to the basket, missing wildly over two defenders (IIRC). He's still a clear positive off the bench, but he does tend to get tunnel vision, especially after he's made a couple baskets. I don't know how you're not seeing it, to be honest.
Kingster
Hall of Famer
"Gunner" is just a lazy-man pejorative. Yes, I saw the same play with McLemore. He should have seen him. It was a bang-bang play. He didn't. He made an error. Does that make him a gunner? Really? Or does that make you tunnel vision because you're focused on the exception/mistake rather than the rule? Did you know that CP3 had 6 TO's in the last game? He FAILED six times. He screwed up six times. He sucked six times. It certainly doesn't make him a bad pg, but it that's all you focused on it certainly would.
Dime Dropper
All-Star
Your post might make sense if it was a one-off. He regularly takes shots when passing would clearly be the better option, it wasn't exactly a one-off. It has happened many times before and will happen again. Sometimes he's successful, so it's forgotten about. I really don't know how you're failing to see this. I like IT, and I value him quite a lot off the bench. I'm not out to belittle him or anything like that. I think you've become so infatuated with defending him that you really can't give an honest view of his game, or else willingly ignore what he does out there. I'm kind of lost for words, he's a scorer that can pass. That's his mentality, and probably what's asked of him. Not necessarily a problem if that's your role. Just a bit weird, quite frankly, to suggest he's as good a playmaker as GV (which, though you didn't say it outright, seems to be the point you were alluding to by saying players were missing on both of their passes yet IT had more assists in less minutes).
Glenn
Hall of Famer
Debating the definition of words doesn't further the discussion unless the use of the term distorts the conversation. It's a misdirection of the point being made. If you don't think that IT is usually looking for his own shot, that's simply your perception but to pawn off your perception as fact is ridiculous.
Padrino
All-Star
indeed. i'm not so sure why there's even an argument over this. isaiah thomas is very clearly of a mind with the current generation of nba-caliber PG's, who are scorers as much as they are passers. there are so few "traditional" pass-first PG's in the contemporary nba, and i don't believe such a PG is terribly valuable anymore. vasquez may be an exceptional floor general, but even he has a scorer's streak that extends beyond the duties of the "traditional" PG. but while vasquez is clearly inclined towards playmaking, isaiah thomas is not a natural playmaker, though he's a capable one when called to be. that said, his current sixth man capacity is the best role for him, and it's a role in which the kings surely want him to score as much as pass. however, it's on IT to tamp down his desire to look for his own shot when it benefits the team for him to swing the ball...
IT and Vasquez are very valuable players for us. They are different in the ways you describe. Right now it looks like they are complimentary to each other, making each other better. IT and Cuz are both gunners. The crowds want Cuz to shoot and they want IT to hold off a bit. We need them both. Let's keep watching and see how it turns out.