Grades v. Sonics 02/10

Status
Not open for further replies.

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#1
REBOUNDING!!!!

Peja ( A ) -- nice to see -- for the first time in weeks it seems, Peja came out and had a game where he mattered. Was strong on both sides of the floor -- did a nice job on both Lewis and Radmanovic on defense, and was moving with confidence and assertiveness on offense. And what do you know -- Peja moved well, and he got the ball. Remarkable coincidence. Had a decent game on the glass for him, but as usual there were a few times when he just didn't even flinch toward the ball. Teamed with Mobley to give us outside shooting throughout the game, and unlike Cat, remained steady in the 4th. Lewis busted free late in the game on us, but it wasn't Peja's fault (scramble plays, over Mobley/Barnes etc.) -- in fact when we switched him back onto Rashard, he went back to making it tough.
Webber ( A- ) -- damn near racked up his third straight triple double, which would have been a wonderful way to respond to the All Star snub. Racked up nine more beautiful assists, and actually would have had more if our shooters had hit a few more of the open threes he set them up for. Unfortunately his rebounding trrailed off as the game went along. Think he had five in the first quarter, and only four therafter. Started letting guys get inside of him. Think the constant pounding on his back by the Evans/Fortson duo may have taken its toll, but he was also stuck playing center for long stretches and every single time he went to help on a driving Sonic, his man went right to the front of the rim for the board. Not quick enough to recover anymore. Through most of the game was unusually quiet with his own shot, and instead was swinging the ball around the court willingly and at times brilliantly, but he got fired up in the last quarter. Finally got superthug Danny Fortson kicked out of the game in the 4th -- turned the tables on him and got under HIS skin rather than the other way around. Nicely done. And Webb responded BEATUIFULLY to the boos raining down on him. Drained shot after shot in a colossal **** you to the Seattle fans. THAT'S the way its done, and actually bumped his grade up a bit for me. Made a bad turnover down the stretch, but also made a nice pass ouo of a double to set up Darius for a layup (and note Darius used the glass to protect the ball from being blocked). Was actually doubled almost the whole way down the stretch, but our shooters couldn't hit their shots and down we went.
Ostertag ( B ) -- got the start tonight to set up up a Tag/James matchup, with us then going small when they brought in Vlad Radmanovic. Did a nice job, but not a spectacular one. Battled as expected, and gave us a nice safety blanket around the hoop that no other King is capable of providing. Watch the difference when he's in there -- guys drive to the hoop and either just drive right on past and out the other side of the paint or have to alter their shot to get it around the big guy. Was not as effective in the third, and may even have been tiring as he's not used to these minutes. Went to the bench in the mid-third, and Rick never went back to him. May have been a real mistake -- even though Tag's energy was seeming to tail off, we got absolutely destroyed on the glass after he left the game for the last time. Slaughtered even.
Mobley ( B+ ) -- lot of points, but not as good a game as the numbers would indicate. In the first three quarters actually played a very simple game. Just stood out on the perimeter and waited for Webb or one of the other Kings to find him for an open three. But quit scoring after three, and made some bad bad plays down the stretch -- made a terrible turnover on a late pass to Webb in the final three minutes just seconds after I said "be careful!", and it ignited the Sonics' final rush. Then 45 seconds later passed up a jumper, forced the drive, ignored a wide open Peja on the perimeter and challenged three Sonics at the rim. Not surprisingly, that did not work. Also missed a wide open three at the 30 second mark which would have brought us back to within one. Through three quarters, was a very effective weapon as a standstill sharpshooter to punish the Sonics' zone/doubles, but just went away late. Also was more than countered by Ray Allen, who to be fair was lighting up everybody who tried to guard him.
Bibby ( C+ ) -- very very quiet for most of the game. Stepped it up somewhat in the fourth, but only somewhat. Down the stretch was unable to make the plays we needed. Shooting was interesting -- almost all of his misses came off of forced one on one plays where he was tightly contested. His hits came when he was working within the offense. Just didn't seem like Mike could hit a jumper off of his own dribble tonight. Did not notice his defense for most of the game, which is actually a good thing when you're talking about Mike. But down the stretch we could not get ANY stops when we needed them, and Mike was a significant part of that. Just did not seem terribly involved -- kind of off in his own world while the rest of the team was in yet another war.
Songaila ( B- ) -- even with Tag starting, got the lion's share of the minutes tonight. Played a strong first half, with his only demerit his inability to cover Radmanovic. But was shooting and passing well, and held his own in there against Forston. Got the bulk of the minutes in the second half, but therein lay the problem. We got HAMMERED on the glass down the stretch, and a major part of that was Darius contributing ZERO rebounds in the final 24 minutes (of which he probably played 15 or so). Webb's rebounding tailed off as the game went along too, but he was basically playing one on two on the glass when teamed with Darius. With rebounding losing the game for us, knocked his grade down a peg despite otherwise solid play.
House ( B- ) -- only had a first half stint, and while he didn't do much other than hit a three, he didn't play poorly either. Not really sure why he didn't get a second half stint.
Barnes ( C ) -- what looked like a nice coaching move by Rick to insert Barnes as a small PF to keep up with Radmanovic went awry in Matt's second half stint -- all he was really doing was fouling. Did a pretty good job on Radmanovic, which was why he was in there, but when we tried him on Lewis, he was ineffective. Did not give his normal boost on the glass either on a night when we really needed it.
Evans ( INC ) -- short first half stint. Played inexplicably poor defense on Allen -- Mo is a better defender than that -- and that was the last we saw of him.

Adelman ( B ) -- Rebounding once again. Something has to change. We can play with anybody, but this team is going nowhere in the playoffs as the 5th worst rebounding team in the league. Rick made the smart, if predictable move to start Tag -- match him with James and then go small off the bench to counter the Radmanovic threat. After briefly trying Darius on Vlad with poor results, Rick also made another good coaching move (or so it seemed) to try to bring in Barnes as a mini-PF to chase him around. Worked pretty well in the first half, and Vlad never did get going. But in the second half it was a struggle. Decision to remove Tag in the third was solid, but we never brought him back and got killed on the glass after he left. Darius gave us 3 boards in 30 minutes, and all three were in the first half. Barnes also was not nearly as effective in the second half, and just put us into the penalty by hacking hacking hacking. While not really Rick's fault, Cat also never recovered after taking his late third quarter rest. Don't think he had any points after that, and was shaky down the stretch. Mo and House were forgotten about in the second half, although Mo at least was squeezed by Peja's big night + leaving Peja on the floor was the right move. Down the stretch something new happened -- whether it be Webb's clutch play this year, or his inspired run after the Fortson confrontation, the Sonics decided not to let him beat them an dkeyed the whole defense on him. And abruptly we looked out of synch -- we had shots, but nobody stepped up and hit them. And we could simply get no stops at all. So another game against an elite opponent. Another close loss. Clearly we can play with these teams, but just as clearly we aren't doing the little things to turn these losses into victories. Rebounding and defense win championships they say. We do neither very well.
 
Last edited:
#2
Barns (D): Looks like every time he touch the floor he will foul someone. The reason why we are over the limit 8 1/2 mins in the 4th. Somebody tell that kid stop making dumb fouls!
 
#3
I have only one word to say, and we all know what it is, so I shall not write it down. Of course, it starts with "R". No more need be said.
 
#7
I think Adelman only deserves a c. As you said we were killed on the boards in the fourth quarter and he didn't make any changes. A "rookie" pale looking guy ate our lunch in the fourth quarter..sheesh.
 
#9
Perfect analysis Brick. I not only agree with your grades but everything you wrote. If anyone wants to know what happened in this game read every word.
 

HndsmCelt

Hall of Famer
#11
My only major complaint is the B for Tag. I would add a pluss beceause of the fact taht once he went out the Kings got Killed on the glass. While he was in the Sonics had NO lay ups, not one.

NOTE to RA: You wna to adress the rebounding dificulties give Tag more min. It really is that simple.
 

piksi

Hall of Famer
#12
ImaKingsFan said:
I think Adelman only deserves a c. As you said we were killed on the boards in the fourth quarter and he didn't make any changes. A "rookie" pale looking guy ate our lunch in the fourth quarter..sheesh.

He should have unretired and rebounded himself.

I am not Ra fan but for different reasons. He did what he could tonight.
 
#13
tag gets a B+ from me. i wish he has played more minutes!!!! he was doing greta out there. even madea free throw, gotta love that.

webber should get an A just fot getting pippi ejected, and how he responded to all that. that was bleeping awesome. i LOVED how he responded to all the boo's. just shut em up :D
 
#14
HndsmCelt said:
My only major complaint is the B for Tag. I would add a pluss beceause of the fact taht once he went out the Kings got Killed on the glass. While he was in the Sonics had NO lay ups, not one.

NOTE to RA: You wna to adress the rebounding dificulties give Tag more min. It really is that simple.
I agree.^ I gave VF all kinds of grief about Tag before tonights game, but he made me looka lika fool... he has to be in there more. Especially with Webb, I liked that combination.
 
#16
You guys must have watched a different TAG then I saw.

He had 6 Rebounds in 21 Min... In Contrast Evans had 12 in 20 mins. Sure different positions but just a contrast of someone really KILLING the boards.
 
#17
piksi said:
He should have unretired and rebounded himself.

I am not Ra fan but for different reasons. He did what he could tonight.
Don't forget the coaches role in this. They have been rebounding like this for years and with different players I might add. It just doesn't seem to be a big priority with RA. If Pop were coach he would bench some of our players for their poor effort on the boards, or at the very least get in their grill. Of course the players are the ones who are mostly responsible, but IMHO the coach also has a share of the blame when this same weakness continues year after year. Most of the time only a couple of players are even going after the board, if it's not the coaches responsibility to correct this, then who?
 
#18
BigWaxer said:
You guys must have watched a different TAG then I saw.

He had 6 Rebounds in 21 Min... In Contrast Evans had 12 in 20 mins. Sure different positions but just a contrast of someone really KILLING the boards.
Please don't add salt to my wound please... I don't want to know... :(
 

HndsmCelt

Hall of Famer
#19
BigWaxer said:
You guys must have watched a different TAG then I saw.

He had 6 Rebounds in 21 Min... In Contrast Evans had 12 in 20 mins. Sure different positions but just a contrast of someone really KILLING the boards.
Sorry comparing a Forward who is moving to get the ball with a Center who is boxing out is not exactly the sme thing, regardless Tag was the second best rebounder the KINGS had avaliable, and in adition to his 6 boards he had 1 block, one steal and 3 assists. Not bad for guy most experts call a one diminisonal player.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#20
ImaKingsFan said:
Don't forget the coaches role in this. They have been rebounding like this for years and with different players I might add. It just doesn't seem to be a big priority with RA. If Pop were coach he would bench some of our players for their poor effort on the boards, or at the very least get in their grill. Of course the players are the ones who are mostly responsible, but IMHO the coach also has a share of the blame when this same weakness continues year after year. Most of the time only a couple of players are even going after the board, if it's not the coaches responsibility to correct this, then who?
don't forget our starting center, who averages over 9 boards per game, wasn't even in the building.

If Pop was coach? Well, he's not. And you cannot begin to assume how he'd coach this current crop of players. Further, you cannot assume that his style would even begin to work with the players we have.

It was a loss. It was a GOOD game that was lost because of a few errors at critical times.

Team grade: B-.
 
#21
VF21 said:
don't forget our starting center, who averages over 9 boards per game, wasn't even in the building.

If Pop was coach? Well, he's not. And you cannot begin to assume how he'd coach this current crop of players. Further, you cannot assume that his style would even begin to work with the players we have.

It was a loss. It was a GOOD game that was lost because of a few errors at critical times.

Team grade: B-.
I was not assuming his style would work, but I was trying to illustrate that years go by with different players on the team and our rebounding is still sub par...so IMHO RA's style doesn't appear to be working either. For the record, before anyone accuses me of being a "hater"..I have waited "years" before making this criticism of RA. I am not saying he is the worst coach in the league, but I am frustrated that the rebounding situation has gone on for years now.
 
Last edited:

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#22
BigWaxer said:
You guys must have watched a different TAG then I saw.

He had 6 Rebounds in 21 Min... In Contrast Evans had 12 in 20 mins. Sure different positions but just a contrast of someone really KILLING the boards.
Tag was not dominant on the glass. But he was pretty good, and he was a big ole impediment in there intimidating cutters and getting in the way of the Sonics inside thugs.
 
#23
I think our guys inability to rebound falls somewhat on the shoulders of the style they play but more so on the players themselves. Its nearly impossible to get offensive rebounds when all your bigs are on the perimeter, but on the defensive end they just get out jumped b/c they don't box out. And on the long rebounds they are not quick enough to run after the balls. Notice when someone like Mo Evans is in we get some of those rebounds. Mobley picks a few up as well.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#24
I would like to have seen Bradley get a little time. He can get boards and he's able to pass the ball fairly well.

This year's team is still a work in progress. And they are making progress IMHO. I'm not about to start panicking quite yet.
 
#25
It seems like the guys sometimes take certain things for granted and get into trouble. Like that Bibby-to-Peja inbounds, what the heck was that? First Peja, running away from the ball in a route that would make any cornerback drool, and nobody else back to help out. Where did they have to be, it's not like the ball was anywhere near the frontcourt! :rolleyes:

And while other teams often have one guy pressuring the ball handler, Bibby ticks me off by waiting inside the three point line every single time. Doug and Bobby were our guys who apply pressure, but it doesn't seem to have worn off on our current guards. I wouldn't have such a problem if Bibby at least made it look like he was trying to not let the opponent get whatever they want. That 6-point play tonight, first Daniels blows by Bibby for a layup, then Bibby tries to throw the ball through a defender... Graaaaahhhr... Hulk Mad... Hulk Smash!
~~
 
#27
I hate to see "A" grades after a loss such as last night's, though players themselves deserve the good grades the team just HAS to find a way to FINISH.

There is nothing entertaining about a crappy loss (one we were in position to win), and they are all crappy lately. Nothing 'positive' will be flowing from my fingertips for at least 18 more hours, even dancing men with pom pom's could not rescue me from this sullen state. :(
 
#28
I don't know, our team played like crap for 3.5 quarters twice last week and had great finishes, while it's the opposite this week and were losing. I don't know what is better, I think the 2nd is b/c they won but they got lucky in those games. We need both sides of the coin, the last 5 minutes and the rest of the game.

Anyone else find it frustrating that we can't hold leads right now. We come out on fire to start the 3rd quarter, everything seems perfect and bam Sonics are back in the game.
 
#29
bigbadred00 said:
I don't know, our team played like crap for 3.5 quarters twice last week and had great finishes, while it's the opposite this week and were losing. I don't know what is better, I think the 2nd is b/c they won but they got lucky in those games. We need both sides of the coin, the last 5 minutes and the rest of the game.

Anyone else find it frustrating that we can't hold leads right now. We come out on fire to start the 3rd quarter, everything seems perfect and bam Sonics are back in the game.
Thats because we were playing the Suns and the Sonics when we lost. They are not #2&3 in the league for nothing. This was a frustrating loss. Brads rebounding was really needed. Hope he controls his temper better in the future.
 
#30
Sadly nobody beats them right now (top 3 in the West), Dallas is just as bad as us versus these teams. I think Memphis has had a little better luck but they got Phoenix without Nash and then last week thugged them with Nash and beat the Spurs once. Houston has also beaten the Spurs twice, but haven't beaten the Suns or Sonics yet. Hopefully they don't do as well in the Playoffs versus the other teams ^^. Brad struggles versus the sonics though, I thought Ostertag was doing a good job in the game, don't know why he wasn't put back in maybe he was tired. Atleast he could stop people going in and could give us some fouls.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.