[Grades] Grades v. Magic 12/21/2013

Where to from here for Marcus Thornton?

  • Reemerges as starter

    Votes: 1 1.5%
  • Reemerges as bench guy in place of Outlaw

    Votes: 21 30.9%
  • Remains spot player

    Votes: 7 10.3%
  • Remains completely out of rotation

    Votes: 1 1.5%
  • Traded by deadline

    Votes: 31 45.6%
  • Still on team in 2045 when the lease is up

    Votes: 7 10.3%

  • Total voters
    68
  • Poll closed .

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
KF_GradingConsortium201314600x378_zps660e18ea.jpg


Ok, well a fugly game fully worthy of its 4 games in 5 nights stature, but we eventually wobbled aright enough to wander out with a victory. After half there may have even been some defense played, although the Magic are a remarkably easy team to play defense against. Notable tonight was DeMarcus just obviously being gassed after the big road trip, and how useful it was to have the extra weapon in Gay to pick up the slack (after a slow start himself). Also notable was the return of Marcus Thornton, who really does need to be traded down to one of these Florida teams since everytime he hits the sunshine state he seems to catch a second wind. Anyway, fugly slow paced game, like two mediocre heavyweight boxers leaning on each other in the 9th round and mostly just hoping the other one passes out from lack of oxygen first. We survived, and avoided the bagel on the road trip. Yay and all that. At least there was some fight.

Your Consoritum Graders tonight:
Bricklayer
Bajaden
Rainmaker
MassachusettsKingsFan


Boxscore

Stats: 39min 23pts (8-20, 3-6, 4-4) 6reb 2ast 0stl 1blk 2TO
Gay ( B ) -- Gay started off the game really, really cold. He didn’t seem particularly engaged on either end. His defense was lazy (late closeouts, weak fouls, etc.), and his offense just wasn’t there at all. This lasted until about halfway through the 2nd quarter when Gay helped spark the Kings mini-run with a quick 8 points (two 3’s and two FT’s) that erased Orlando’s double digit lead right before halftime. He was much more aggressive after the half, and was mostly effective. We definitely saw more than a couple forced shots and drives to the basket (some of which went in), but aggressive Rudy Gay is better then invisible Rudy Gay. He had a very short spurt of hero basketball late in the fourth that could have cost the Kings the game had Orlando not completely collapsed in the last minute or so. His defense never really picked up, but he did contribute on the glass with 6 rebounds. I didn’t love a lot of Rudy’s game tonight, but I thought his impact was more positive than negative. Despite his 20 shot attempts he didn’t handle the ball as much as that number would suggest. And with Cousins struggling to find his own offense, the Kings needed all the points Gay could give them. When he was handling the ball his decision-making was a little questionable, but you could see his superior talent level again tonight. He had one fantastic pass to Cousins over the top of the defense for an easy two points that might have been the best play of the entire game. This was a solid, but not great overall game from Gay on a night where his volume shooting didn’t necessarily take anything away from the rest of his teammates. --Mass

Stats: 37min 11pts (5-7, 0-0, 1-2) 7reb 0ast 2stl 0blk 2TO
Thompson ( B- ) -- a more solid effort than the night before in Miami. Played well down around the hoop, was occasionally victimized early and late by the perimeter shooting Magic semi-bigs. Had more rebounds by the end of the first quarter than he had all game in Miami, but faded back away again as Jason this year is basically rebounding at the same rate he did last year, which was a career low effort. Had an important stint in the early 4th holding down the center spot for a gassed Demarcus. Started it off with a good challenge inside on Oladipo to force a miss, and did a fully credible job at center against Vucevic until Boogie could get back. Quit producing numbers as the game went along, but until the jumpshooting ways of his opposite numbers finally chased Malone into bringing back Outlaw for the final 2 minutes, JT stayed out on the floor tp play long minutes by just being solid as his career. --Brick

Stats: 37min 14pts (5-14, 0-0, 4-9) 11reb 2ast 1stl 2blk 4TO
Cousins ( D+ ) -- Nope, just did not have anything left in the tank after carrying the team through the first three nights of a 4 In 5 stretch. Cuz has done a better job fighting through fatigue this year, but in this case the legs were just shot. Was getting pushed around by Vucevic (although not dominated -- even on a bad night Boogie won the matchup) and O'Quinn, who are about as beefy as any center duo in the league, never looked comfortable on offense, pushed off his spots, no explosion. And throughout his career one of the first places you can see fatigue with Boogie is on the glass. By the end of the third was clearly just gassed, was not changing ends fast, and the feet stopped moving. Came back on for the final 5 min or so, and while no less gassed than before, sort of wildly scrapped around inside to some minor effect (and half his rebounds came in sort of wild late action), including coming up with a huge sequence at the 2:40 mark that may have sealed the game for us. Came up with the offensive rebound, the finish +1, missed the FT, grabbed the offensive board off his own miss, went back in got fouled again, and split the pair for the whole-lotta-effort three point play to get us back up 7. Probably added the + here. In fact really, given circumstances I was even pondering C-. But justifiable or not this was clearly one of Boogie's worst games, so sown into the Ds we venture. --Brick

Stats: 17min 9pts (3-3, 2-2, 1-2) 0reb 2ast 1stl 0blk 0TO
McLemore ( B- ) -- Both the ups and downs of rookie life were on display tonight for Ben. Wasn't seeing much, if any of the ball for long stretches but the few touches he did get he capitalized on. Made a nice pass to JT on an early JT dive to the basket. Hit both 3's he attempted and I was impressed by the speed and balance with which he got off and made his second 3. Turned, balanced himself, elevated and fired extremely quickly, which is tough to do given the angle and speed with which he ran to the wing. Later received the ball in transition and did a good job getting into the paint and converting softly off the glass considering his ball handling concerns. Didn't see much of the ball and was a spectator much of the night on offense so it's tough to hold not doing more offensively against him. Finished 3-3 on FG's. What did knock his grade down were his fouls. His fouls sent him to the bench early in both halves. This is also part of his growing pains and something he should improve on as he adjusts to the speed of the game at this level. Afflalo had a great night, scoring 26 on 9-17 from the floor, however a number of those points came when Ben was on the bench. Ben did a decent job tracking and sticking with Afflalo, foul trouble aside and his defense is slowly trending up. Has to limit fouls going forward but is something most rookies have to go through during their first go-around.--Rain

Stats: 43min 23pts (8-15, 3-7, 4-4) 5reb 9ast 3stl 0blk 4TO
Thomas ( A ) -- Thomas played a pretty complete game tonight. Most of his scoring came in the flow of the game, and he did have the occasional, I think its my time to score moments. But they were far and few between. A couple of them ended up being turnovers, and two of them came at a significant point of the game when the Magic were attempting to come back. But as they say, no harm no foul. He did have a total brain dead moment with less than two minutes left in the game, he unbelievably left the ball roll down the floor without touching it to start the clock, as though we were behind in the game, and trying to save clock. I can only assume that he's been in that exact situation so many times, that it was an automatic reflex. However he followed that moment by pulling up and hitting a 16 footer giving us a 6 pt lead with 36.8 seconds left in the game. In fact, that was the game. I thought IT benefited by not having to guard one of the quicker and taller PG's tonight. In fact, he was up against someone almost his own size, at least height wise. Nelson isn't a spring chicken anymore either, plus, he's more of a pass first PG. So defensively, IT got a little break. Not that he didn't have a couple of breakdowns. Nelson got by IT in the first quarter, and was fouled. Later in toward the end of the 2nd quarter, IT turned his head for moment and Nelson blew by him for a layup. Probably his worse moment came at the beginning of the 3rd quarter, when Nelson put the ball on the floor and drove past IT for a layup with 2 ticks left on the shotclock. But I'm nitpicking now. IT played a very good game. It was a nice mix of assists and scoring that I thought was very well balanced. He ended the night with 9 assists, and with a little luck, he could have had few more. He was certainly a big part of the win. --Baja
 
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Bench

Stats: 10min 0pts (0-1, 0-0, 0-0) 3reb 1ast 0stl 0blk 0TO
Outlaw ( ) -- --Rain

Stats: 12min 1pts (0-1, 0-0, 1-2) 3reb 0ast 0stl 0blk 0TO
Williams ( D ) -- Williams only saw 12 minutes tonight (about 10 minutes less than any of his other games as a King) and he wasn’t very effective in those limited minutes. I didn’t notice an obvious reason why Williams’s minutes were cut so short tonight, other than Malone electing to ride Rudy Gay for 39 minutes at small forward (Kind of strange considering this is the Kings 4th game in 5 nights). His only play of note was a nice baseline cut where Cousins gave him a bounce pass that led to FT’s. He was a -10 in 12 minutes without any real contributions statistically, so… not great.--Mass

Stats: 13min 2pts (1-1, 0-0, 0-0) 4reb 1ast 0stl 0blk 0TO
Acy ( ) -- --Brick

Stats: 5min 5pts (2-4, 1-1, 0-0) 1reb 0ast 0stl 0blk 0TO
Fredette( INC ) -- Jimmer only played 5 minutes in the game, and although he did score 5 pts on 2 of 4 shooting, it was a mixed bag of good and bad moments. Its very hard to come to any kind of conclusion in such a short time. --Baja

Stats: 5min 2pts (1-3, 0-1, 0-0) 1reb 0ast 0stl 1blk 1TO
Gray ( INC ) -- only had the first half stint. Was a ragged point of the game, but the big guy looked better than the numbers would indicate. Had several good challenges on the perimeter, got a nice smush right at the rim to save a hoop, scored on a little push shot/hook thingie. Really he did fine. Just anybody thinking Malone has any thought whatsoever about tanking/losing these things needs to check out our minutes distribution on the final game of a 4 nights in 5. --Brick

Stats: 24min 15pts (6-10, 3-6, 0-0) 3reb 0ast 1stl 0blk 2TO
Thornton ( A- ) -- After having been missing in action the entire season, seemingly out of the abyss the Bayou Bomber reappeared at an opportune time to help push us through to victory. Came in late in the 2nd after Ben went to the bench in foul trouble and finished inside off a nice pass from Cuz. A couple minutes later made a terrible shovel pass to Cuz on a pick & pop where Nelson stepped in and took it down for an easy layup. It was a quiet first stint for Marcus. Second stint he had much more of an impact as the shooting touch which had apparently evaporated earlier this year and left Marcus a shell of his former self suddenly came back into existence. Came off a pin-down screen on the wing and dropped in a 20 footer. Two minutes later hit a pullup 3 from the top of the key in transition. One minute later came through a double screen and hit another 3 up top. Following possession drained a transition 3 on a setup from Isaiah. Three 3's in 90 seconds and 11 points in just over three minutes. Went from a 78-77 lead to a 93-81 lead during that stretch. I'm not sure we win this without MT's burst as it provided enough of a cushion to carry us the rest of the way. Such a short productive stretch might not result in an A- for a few others but in comparison to the version of MT we've seen thus far this year, this was an A- performance and those few minutes not only helped push us to win but were arguably is best minutes of the season. Would be great if this were a sign of things to come from Marcus, either to have a spark off the bench and provide depth behind Ben, or for increased trade value. Both would be beneficial. --Rain

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Traded by the deadline leading the poll so far. It is going to take more than an occasional night like this to get his value up to neutral but given our financial outlook I can see the popularity of the choice
 
#Give Thornton, Jimmer mins
#Cousins was terrible 2night lucky the opposition big man was even worse
#JT if he could catch could have had a 15+ point game
#IT and Gay carried us great performances with some awful shots and turnovers but good none the less
#Loved Acy energy/ man to man D
#Williams regulated to the same position he was in Minny......
#B Mac got torched by Afflalo but did ok on offence

Basically we played a team more awful that us that's all it was 2night
 
its just weird ever since his 31pt game he has not been given many minutes or even gotten the ball much

that game was on december 9th, the very same night that the kings agreed to a trade for rudy gay, who complicates the distribution of minutes in malone's frontcourt rotation considerably. seems pretty simple to me.
 
that game was on december 9th, the very same night that the kings agreed to a trade for rudy gay, who complicates the distribution of minutes in malone's frontcourt rotation considerably. seems pretty simple to me.

i totally understand and i knew he would probably go to the bench but he has been a lot less involved than he could be. even with Gay being the new starting SF
 
Now that IT is the starting PG, Malone should somehow assign Derrick Williams as the new sixth-man. There should be a new clear leader for the 2nd unit.
 
I was thinking if all Jimmer does when he's on the floor playing PG is jack shots and dribble aimlessly maybe just let Thornton be the back up PG and get the ball in his hands all the time with the 2nd unit and he can do the same thing while being a better athlete.

Jimmer is doing zero playmaking and taking bad shots all of which MT does better, could be an idea since we aleady got a SG playin back up PG. Xavir Henry is doing a decent job as a make shift PG for the Lakers so maybe MT can do the same thing and having the ball more might make him play harder.
 
A loss would have been great tonight. Jazz beat the Bobcats, a loss would have given the Magic a win. Just a pointless win honestly.

I am going to be very excited when we are no longer all about tanking and the draft. The draft hasnt really worked out for us lately. I'd rather we get a W and a little boost in morale.

Dont get me wrong, I get where you are coming from and am definitely hoping we end up picking in the top 6 when it is all said and done, I just cant really hate on the W's when they are so few and far between anyways.


...Poll question: I voted spot minutes. Now that MT had his good game he is due to play like crap until 2014. He's a streaky player. One good game, then a streak of doo doo.
 
I was thinking if all Jimmer does when he's on the floor playing PG is jack shots and dribble aimlessly maybe just let Thornton be the back up PG and get the ball in his hands all the time with the 2nd unit and he can do the same thing while being a better athlete.

Jimmer is doing zero playmaking and taking bad shots all of which MT does better, could be an idea since we aleady got a SG playin back up PG. Xavir Henry is doing a decent job as a make shift PG for the Lakers so maybe MT can do the same thing and having the ball more might make him play harder.

I think the whole point was that MT was shooting crap. Look up his shooting % this season compared to Jimmer's, and Thornton "achieved" it playing regular minutes. He had ample time to break out of his slump. If you just want a guy to come in and jack up shots you choose Jimmer based on this season. The problem really is that we're calling Jimmer a PG and he's going out there trying to run pick and roll with Aaron Gray. Call him a SG and tell him to just go shoot the numbers would suggest he'd do better than Thornton has.
 
Before yesterday's game Malone said he's going to play guys that play defense. I wondered if that had anything to do with Derrick Williams' lack of minutes. When he came in I said... Oh yeah we have Derrick Williams. This Rudy acquisition may not be what he needed. Poor guy.
 
Some people have been hoping for losses for 5-6 years wanting this high draft pick. They should really sit back and think about switching teams. I mean what fan wishes for their team to lose for 6 years?
 
What is up with Derrick Williams lack of minutes lately?

I've been wondering the same thing and am bothered by it. We take a chance on Williams by trading away our best defender in Moute. Derrick comes in and makes an immediate impact on both ends of the floor and changes the feel of our team, including the career game against Dallas.

His flow for the game and his confidence was rising quicker than it had at any point in his career, in just a few games with us,...then we go and back away from him and change the feel o_O

I don't know how many times we've had to say this, but it seems the only reasonable explanation is another case of "showcasing" for a trade must be going on
 
I was thinking if all Jimmer does when he's on the floor playing PG is jack shots and dribble aimlessly maybe just let Thornton be the back up PG and get the ball in his hands all the time with the 2nd unit and he can do the same thing while being a better athlete.

Jimmer is doing zero playmaking and taking bad shots all of which MT does better, could be an idea since we aleady got a SG playin back up PG. Xavir Henry is doing a decent job as a make shift PG for the Lakers so maybe MT can do the same thing and having the ball more might make him play harder.
Those are two places not to go. Hopefully other teams will see the value that comes with MT and Jimmer and bid for their services. In the meantime, hold your breath.
 
The second half of this game felt like a throwback to the Keith Smart era for me. We always had nights, every couple weeks or so, when the shots were dropping. But even bad shots go in 30% of the time and we had an inordinate amount of those tonight. I can't get on board with Rudy Gay driving into the defense and firing pullup jumpers three possessions in a row followed by IT doing the same. Thornton got on a crazy hot streak and nailed three back-to-back-to-back longballs. That's the only reason we won this game. If I hadn't been watching I'd be excited we finally won a game on the road against a beatable team, but having seen it I'm a little upset with Mike Malone that he seemingly abandoned the offensive gameplan in the fourth quarter in favor of letting three perimeter guys do whatever they wanted for 10 minutes. Thornton hit three big shots but he needed to come out after that. Ben McLemore was 3 for 3 and he didn't get off the bench in the fourth quarter. Gay needed to stop looking for his own shot and IT needed to get Cousins the ball. If Cousins doesn't touch the ball 4 or 5 times in the fourth quarter, we're not going to win very often. Yes his shot was a little off tonight (particularly from the free throw line) but good teams don't abandon what they do best in the fourth quarter.
 
Some people have been hoping for losses for 5-6 years wanting this high draft pick. They should really sit back and think about switching teams. I mean what fan wishes for their team to lose for 6 years?
Thank you. But it's no mystery what type of fan wants their team to lose over a sustained period. Those are the fans that think you have to blow something up before it can get better.
 
The second half of this game felt like a throwback to the Keith Smart era for me. We always had nights, every couple weeks or so, when the shots were dropping. But even bad shots go in 30% of the time and we had an inordinate amount of those tonight. I can't get on board with Rudy Gay driving into the defense and firing pullup jumpers three possessions in a row followed by IT doing the same. Thornton got on a crazy hot streak and nailed three back-to-back-to-back longballs. That's the only reason we won this game. If I hadn't been watching I'd be excited we finally won a game on the road against a beatable team, but having seen it I'm a little upset with Mike Malone that he seemingly abandoned the offensive gameplan in the fourth quarter in favor of letting three perimeter guys do whatever they wanted for 10 minutes. Thornton hit three big shots but he needed to come out after that. Ben McLemore was 3 for 3 and he didn't get off the bench in the fourth quarter. Gay needed to stop looking for his own shot and IT needed to get Cousins the ball. If Cousins doesn't touch the ball 4 or 5 times in the fourth quarter, we're not going to win very often. Yes his shot was a little off tonight (particularly from the free throw line) but good teams don't abandon what they do best in the fourth quarter.
Three players carried the scoring load in the fourth Q? Sounds like teamwork to me. Extra passes mean extra turnovers. Any way, Cousins wasn't shooting very well.
 
The second half of this game felt like a throwback to the Keith Smart era for me. We always had nights, every couple weeks or so, when the shots were dropping. But even bad shots go in 30% of the time and we had an inordinate amount of those tonight. I can't get on board with Rudy Gay driving into the defense and firing pullup jumpers three possessions in a row followed by IT doing the same. Thornton got on a crazy hot streak and nailed three back-to-back-to-back longballs. That's the only reason we won this game. If I hadn't been watching I'd be excited we finally won a game on the road against a beatable team, but having seen it I'm a little upset with Mike Malone that he seemingly abandoned the offensive gameplan in the fourth quarter in favor of letting three perimeter guys do whatever they wanted for 10 minutes. Thornton hit three big shots but he needed to come out after that. Ben McLemore was 3 for 3 and he didn't get off the bench in the fourth quarter. Gay needed to stop looking for his own shot and IT needed to get Cousins the ball. If Cousins doesn't touch the ball 4 or 5 times in the fourth quarter, we're not going to win very often. Yes his shot was a little off tonight (particularly from the free throw line) but good teams don't abandon what they do best in the fourth quarter.
Yes actually you do go with the hot hand. If ray Allen is on a hot streak you don't not give him the ball in order to force it to Lebron. That's why you pay these guys, that's why you have five on the floor, that's why you have several options. If #2 or #3 is hot you don't force it to #1

Thornton was 4-6 in the 4th. Gay was 4-8 they played the whole 4th. Cousins played the whole third ans was on bench to start 4th so he was sitting during 8 of those combined 14 shots. Meaning between gay and Thornton only six shots were taken while cousins was in the game. Don't make this into to something it's not. Cousins came in and immediately missed a shot and got a tech. Thornton took 1 shot while cousins was in the game in the 4th. Isaiah took 3 and gay took 5 while cousins took 4.

4th quarter shot after cousins entered the game

Isaiah 3
Thornton 1
Gay 5
Cousins 4

2 of gays 5 shots came on one sequence when he shot missed and followed it up with a rebound and missed tip. Without that one sequence it would be 3 shots.
 
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Three players carried the scoring load in the fourth Q? Sounds like teamwork to me. Extra passes mean extra turnovers. Any way, Cousins wasn't shooting very well.

:D Thank you, I'm going to frame this and put it on my wall. Right next to my portrait of Keith Smart.
 
Wow an A and A- already and the grades aren't even done. This game might have had a different outcome if the magic made some free throws. I'm glad we got the win but no way IT and MT deserve those grades unless we're comparing it to how they played in the past. Personally I believe those grades are for flawless or near flawless games. IT played well but not A worthy. MT went on a scoring streak but there are two sides to a game and his defense still leaves a lot to be desired. He left his man open alot and I actually saw him rush down the court instead of trying to even contest a shot. If you are grading based off mt's past performances then I kinda agree. This effort looks like an A- compared to the crap he's been playing like but rarely to I see 15pts/3rb/0asst/1stl/2to grades that high.
 
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