Fire Walton
- Thread starter Tetsujin
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I have to agree. Walton is doing a pretty good job of increasing our lottery odds and while I'm indifferent on the need for tanking vs. winning culture debate at this point, the writing is already on the wall as far as this season is concerned. If we scored infinity points we'd give up infinity +1. The Knicks have been a lost cause for about as long as we have (arguably, longer even) and the minute they hire a decent coach they're suddenly a competitive team again. We need to stop scraping the bottom of the barrel looking for discounts, hiring people's buddies, and just generally acting like an NBA head coach doesn't matter. We have players who are hungry and talented enough to win with some actual leadership. Once this season is over the front office needs to leave no stone unturned in finding the best coach available.
My hope is Monte already has 2-3 in mind and has sold Vivek on his plan. Vivek probably doesn't want to get stuck in some kind of contract carousel anymore than Monte wants coaching instability so he'll probably also be ok to ride out the year as long as Coach Bagley isn't making everything go sideways. It does seem like as long as Bagley gets reasonable minutes the seas stay calm and we can live with Walton. The extended break is exactly the scary time when he could get replaced and we go on a run that screws everything up so my fingers are crossed we don't make that move. Maybe if we close with a few wins it wouldn't be the worst thing.
yeah but remember that same “decent coach” was run out of town in Minnesota. The same Minnesota who fired their next coach just a bit ago.
We generally have players with low BBIQ that are average to horrible defenders. Before any coach can get this team to play better defense the roster is going to have to turn over.
We generally have players with low BBIQ that are average to horrible defenders. Before any coach can get this team to play better defense the roster is going to have to turn over.
When a franchise struggles for a couple of years, they are rebuilding, starting over, acquiring talent. Finding the right coach.
When a franchise struggles for 20 years the problems are usually related to the owners, the management and front office. The Kings' issues run much deeper than Walton, Jaeger and Malone.
Mike Malone is the case in point, fired from the Kings and building a playoff caliber team in Denver.
When a franchise struggles for 20 years the problems are usually related to the owners, the management and front office. The Kings' issues run much deeper than Walton, Jaeger and Malone.
Mike Malone is the case in point, fired from the Kings and building a playoff caliber team in Denver.
I think Thibodeau getting run out of Minnesota had more to do with his role as GM than his role as coach. And in any case he did snap their 13 year playoff drought before internal divisions broke up the team and his bosses sided with their young "franchise player" over established All-Star Jimmy Butler and a Coach of the Year winner. And look where that has gotten them. They had the first overall pick last year and are still far and away the worst team in the league. And despite his short tenure, Thibs now holds the second best win % of any TWolves coach (not counting McHale's 31 games) and the only guy better than him had a Hall of Famer on the roster for his entire tenure.
I'd agree with all of that. And yet, Sacramento was as much of a nothing franchise in the mid 90s as it is now. Geoff Petrie came in and drafted a couple building blocks, traded for a few more, then brought in Rick Adelman and they were a fixture in the playoffs for the next 8 years. I don't think finding the right coach is a panacea, but I think it's quite clear that if you have a poor coach than nothing else you're doing right is going to matter. It's a complete team effort of front office, coaching staff, and players that drives franchises to sustained success and if any of those pieces aren't pulling their weight the whole thing falls apart.
I'd agree with all of that. And yet, Sacramento was as much of a nothing franchise in the mid 90s as it is now. Geoff Petrie came in and drafted a couple building blocks, traded for a few more, then brought in Rick Adelman and they were a fixture in the playoffs for the next 8 years. I don't think finding the right coach is a panacea, but I think it's quite clear that if you have a poor coach than nothing else you're doing right is going to matter. It's a complete team effort of front office, coaching staff, and players that drives franchises to sustained success and if any of those pieces aren't pulling their weight the whole thing falls apart.
I think changing coaches during a global pandemic is a terrible idea. If Walton loses the locker room - can him. But as long as they are competing and the young guys are getting run - keep him. Change it up this off-season when it’s safer. There will be some good coaches out there and depending on what Monte does - the job could be a lot more attractive.
Part of it's called timing. They are either too quick on the trigger or let it sit and wither away. At some point you have to know when to strike and how. Also a reluctance to let others mistakes, including your own fairly recent ones, guide you. The Walton issue is fighting history including their own recent history with the eventual nasty fallout with a transition coach. They are choosing to sit on that one in particular and just let it keep adding fuel to the dumpster fire. Will it fix things entirely? Probably not, and they missed their window for a clean sweep, but you have to start somewhere.
Gentry has had his chances and has never proven to be anything more than average as a head coach. He's been a head coach for all or part of 17 seasons and led those teams to winning records just twice. His teams typically lead the league in pace or close to it and are near the bottom in most defensive metrics. That just sounds like more of the same to me.
I realize I'm a broken record on this and have been for 10 years now but what the heck, I'll say it again just in case someone hasn't heard it yet. Nate McMillan is the coach we need. He's led his teams to winning records in 10 out of 16 chances. He's coached 3 different teams and all of them have made the playoffs. All of them developed into above average defensive squads at their peak. His success in the playoffs has been mixed which led to his surprising departure from Indiana but injury issues had a lot to do with that. More importantly his coaching philosophy is the exact opposite of the high flying pace-and-space ball which has ossified this team into everyone's favorite squad to rack up points against.
Conventional wisdom says Fox needs a fast paced offense to thrive but maybe conventional wisdom is wrong. Wouldn't be the first time. We've seen Fox develop this season into a scorer who can get his shots in a half court offense not just barreling down the court on the break. Haliburton is a heady, opportunistic playmaker who moves the defense with his eyes then finds the open man. I think these guys could win at a snail's place if asked to and I know McMillan is a coach who will teach discipline and demand execution on the end of the floor where we need the most help. The poetic symmetry of hiring the very same coach who eliminated us from the playoffs way back in 2005 to kick off this run of futility so we can finally make it back under his watch is just a fun bonus.**
**Nobody fact check me on this please cause apparently my memory is a little spotty.
I realize I'm a broken record on this and have been for 10 years now but what the heck, I'll say it again just in case someone hasn't heard it yet. Nate McMillan is the coach we need. He's led his teams to winning records in 10 out of 16 chances. He's coached 3 different teams and all of them have made the playoffs. All of them developed into above average defensive squads at their peak. His success in the playoffs has been mixed which led to his surprising departure from Indiana but injury issues had a lot to do with that. More importantly his coaching philosophy is the exact opposite of the high flying pace-and-space ball which has ossified this team into everyone's favorite squad to rack up points against.
Conventional wisdom says Fox needs a fast paced offense to thrive but maybe conventional wisdom is wrong. Wouldn't be the first time. We've seen Fox develop this season into a scorer who can get his shots in a half court offense not just barreling down the court on the break. Haliburton is a heady, opportunistic playmaker who moves the defense with his eyes then finds the open man. I think these guys could win at a snail's place if asked to and I know McMillan is a coach who will teach discipline and demand execution on the end of the floor where we need the most help. The poetic symmetry of hiring the very same coach who eliminated us from the playoffs way back in 2005 to kick off this run of futility so we can finally make it back under his watch is just a fun bonus.**
**Nobody fact check me on this please cause apparently my memory is a little spotty.
Gentry has had his chances and has never proven to be anything more than average as a head coach. He's been a head coach for all or part of 17 seasons and led those teams to winning records just twice. His teams typically lead the league in pace or close to it and are near the bottom in most defensive metrics. That just sounds like more of the same to me.
I realize I'm a broken record on this and have been for 10 years now but what the heck, I'll say it again just in case someone hasn't heard it yet. Nate McMillan is the coach we need. He's led his teams to winning records in 10 out of 16 chances. He's coached 3 different teams and all of them have made the playoffs. All of them developed into above average defensive squads at their peak. His success in the playoffs has been mixed which led to his surprising departure from Indiana but injury issues had a lot to do with that. More importantly his coaching philosophy is the exact opposite of the high flying pace-and-space ball which has ossified this team into everyone's favorite squad to rack up points against.
Conventional wisdom says Fox needs a fast paced offense to thrive but maybe conventional wisdom is wrong. Wouldn't be the first time. We've seen Fox develop this season into a scorer who can get his shots in a half court offense not just barreling down the court on the break. Haliburton is a heady, opportunistic playmaker who moves the defense with his eyes then finds the open man. I think these guys could win at a snail's place if asked to and I know McMillan is a coach who will teach discipline and demand execution on the end of the floor where we need the most help. The poetic symmetry of hiring the very same coach who eliminated us from the playoffs way back in 2005 to kick off this run of futility so we can finally make it back under his watch is just a fun bonus.**
**Nobody fact check me on this please cause apparently my memory is a little spotty.
I realize I'm a broken record on this and have been for 10 years now but what the heck, I'll say it again just in case someone hasn't heard it yet. Nate McMillan is the coach we need. He's led his teams to winning records in 10 out of 16 chances. He's coached 3 different teams and all of them have made the playoffs. All of them developed into above average defensive squads at their peak. His success in the playoffs has been mixed which led to his surprising departure from Indiana but injury issues had a lot to do with that. More importantly his coaching philosophy is the exact opposite of the high flying pace-and-space ball which has ossified this team into everyone's favorite squad to rack up points against.
Conventional wisdom says Fox needs a fast paced offense to thrive but maybe conventional wisdom is wrong. Wouldn't be the first time. We've seen Fox develop this season into a scorer who can get his shots in a half court offense not just barreling down the court on the break. Haliburton is a heady, opportunistic playmaker who moves the defense with his eyes then finds the open man. I think these guys could win at a snail's place if asked to and I know McMillan is a coach who will teach discipline and demand execution on the end of the floor where we need the most help. The poetic symmetry of hiring the very same coach who eliminated us from the playoffs way back in 2005 to kick off this run of futility so we can finally make it back under his watch is just a fun bonus.**
**Nobody fact check me on this please cause apparently my memory is a little spotty.
Still, I like Nate and our best coach ever also spent time in Portland. Also we almost share the same last name in common. Not that that counts for anything.
In the news link section of this board, there is a link to the Bee with the excerpt being that Luke feels safe. I don’t have a subscription so I don't know the context of the question. But if it is a straight question towards if he feels his current job is safe going forward, what the Hell? It's either that he's tone deaf, he flat out lied playing reverse psychology with optics of his firing or something is seriously wrong in management. More than one could be and probably is true.
Luke’s job being safe “for now” is good management from McNair.
He’s an awesome tank commander, and the benefits of firing him before the end of the year are pretty nil. We aren’t making the playoffs either way.
Good coaches always hit the market after playoffs, and the summer is also a better time to nab an assistant off another team’s staff.
Sign me up for McMillan though. I think he’d be great here.
He’s an awesome tank commander, and the benefits of firing him before the end of the year are pretty nil. We aren’t making the playoffs either way.
Good coaches always hit the market after playoffs, and the summer is also a better time to nab an assistant off another team’s staff.
Sign me up for McMillan though. I think he’d be great here.
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