Blake Griffin - A Bust Waiting to Happen

Kingster

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#1
#1
He'll play in the NBA. He looks to be a very good defensive rebounder. But his limitations in other areas is going to prevent him from having a high ceiling - the lack of a quick first step on a dribble drive, his rather short stature for a power forward, his lack of fluidity, his lack of impact on defense. I actually hope for his sake he's not the #1 pick because he won't be able to live up to it. Other than the obvious financial reasons, he'd be better off picked #10 just so he doesn't have to live up the hype.

And to define, bust, I mean that he will be a pretty good player in the NBA, but not of the caliber one would usually think THE #1 draft pick in the NBA draft would be. He will not be a star.
 
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Nighthawk1

Starter
#3
#3
Kingster said:
He'll play in the NBA. He looks to be a very good defensive rebounder. But his limitations in other areas is going to prevent him from having a high ceiling - the lack of a quick first step on a dribble drive, his rather short stature for a power forward, his lack of fluidity, his lack of impact on defense. I actually hope for his sake he's not the #1 pick because he won't be able to live up to it. Other than the obvious financial reasons, he'd be better off picked #10 just so he doesn't have to live up the hype.
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All reports of people who watch the kid say he's pretty explosive which would indicate he's got a quick first step would it not? I think I'll wait until I hear his height when he's measured to comment on that but there are "SHORT" PF's that play better then the 6'10" PF's. He's probably just as good on the defensive end as most PF's are...
 
Rockmeister

Rockmeister

All-Star
#4
#4
Kingster said:
He'll play in the NBA. He looks to be a very good defensive rebounder. But his limitations in other areas is going to prevent him from having a high ceiling - the lack of a quick first step on a dribble drive, his rather short stature for a power forward, his lack of fluidity, his lack of impact on defense. I actually hope for his sake he's not the #1 pick because he won't be able to live up to it. Other than the obvious financial reasons, he'd be better off picked #10 just so he doesn't have to live up the hype.
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You entitled to your own opinion, however, I think he'll be pretty good. If the Kings get the first pick in the draft, I'm hoping they pick him.
 
Gary

Gary

All-Star
#6
#6
Griffin has the best chances of succeeding in this draft, and is going to do fine in the NBA.

Players like Teague who are undersized SGs with limited PG skills are guys that have the best chances of busting, and who I wouldn't touch with a 10ft pole. Why want a combo guard running the point? Doesn't make sense to me.

Thabeet is another one who I believe has limited skills for what position he plays.

Jordan Hill scares me...

The only other players listed in the top 10 that don't scare the hell out of me are Jennings, and Rubio.
 
HighTopKicks

HighTopKicks

Bench
#7
#7
Nighthawk1 said:
All reports of people who watch the kid say he's pretty explosive which would indicate he's got a quick first step would it not? I think I'll wait until I hear his height when he's measured to comment on that but there are "SHORT" PF's that play better then the 6'10" PF's. He's probably just as good on the defensive end as most PF's are...
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I don't know how high Griffin measures out to be, but in the game tonight he looked to be just as tall at Pittman & Atchley from Texas, and they are both listed as 6'10". Even more impressive was the highlights of Griffin that ESPN showed before the game. Griffin's dunks showed his elbow above the rim, and in one dunk the top of his head looked level with the rim, and in another he had to duck to keep his head from hitting the bottom of the backboard. So, if he less than 6'10" who cares the kid has hops.
 
O

Oprostaj

Bench
#9
#9
Gary said:
Griffin has the best chances of succeeding in this draft, and is going to do fine in the NBA.

Players like Teague who are undersized SGs with limited PG skills are guys that have the best chances of busting, and who I wouldn't touch with a 10ft pole. Why want a combo guard running the point? Doesn't make sense to me.

Thabeet is another one who I believe has limited skills for what position he plays.

Jordan Hill scares me...

The only other players listed in the top 10 that don't scare the hell out of me are Jennings, and Rubio.
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The undersized 2 guard is a tricky prospect. Ben Gordon for example. Terrific scorer. Weird to say, but can be unstoppable when he wants to. Has a very nice old school shot (correct form) and can get it off whenever and against whoever. Is quick as all hell, not afraid to take it vs C, PF, whoever. Kind of like Bobby Jackson. However, he has no future in the NBA as the kind of player he wants to be - ball in his hands to decide the outcome. This is why I want college ball to be like the pros; same rules so people can be truly evaluated. In college, where everybody handles the ball their deficiencies are hid more expertly, than in the NBA where the PG is responsible for facilitating the offense in most cases.

Combo guards are similar. They NEED the ball, otherwise their rhythm is shot to ****, and their shot will not fall. I am scared of players that need the ball in order to be effective. Rubio I wouldn't mind since he's a prototypical PG. Jennings on the other hand... not so much. Thinks his **** don't stink and has a McCants mindset. He needs to get his mind right really quickly. Focus on the PG aspect of the game, use the talents that few people have and have a great career. Or, try to become the next Kobe / MJ / Tmac (great scorer with an uncanny ability to become a PG / SG / SF whenever you want to) and permanently relegate yourself to "bust" status.

I like B Griffin. Not as a #1 but he should be solid in the NBA. And for the record, Beasely would tear up the NBA offensively if he could stay on the court longer than 20 mins. He seems to have no interest in the D side of the ball. Riley will either destroy his career, or fix him into a terrific all star caliber player for years to come. I want him in NY so that he could open some eyes.
 
vikinginferno

vikinginferno

Starter
#10
#10
Thabeet is more likely to be a bust in the NBA. If you watch him, almost all of his scoring is just because he is much taller than everyone else. On defense he only is able to defend well because he is much taller than everyone else. This won't happen in the NBA. There will be guys almost as tall, as tall, or taller every game. They will likely also be stronger.
 
rainmaker

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#12
#12
Griffin won't be a bust. If we get the #1 pick and draft Griffin what do we do with JT. Griffin is too talented to come off the bench, and JT has shown to much promise to go back the the bench.

Griffin will be a good player but our problem would be that our best young prospect plays the same position as griffin, and I don't see how he and JT can play together.
 
A

artest93fan

G-League
#13
#13
rainmaker said:
Griffin won't be a bust. If we get the #1 pick and draft Griffin what do we do with JT. Griffin is too talented to come off the bench, and JT has shown to much promise to go back the the bench.

Griffin will be a good player but our problem would be that our best young prospect plays the same position as griffin, and I don't see how he and JT can play together.
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i agree ive thought about this too and i say that if we got the first pick that we trade down and pick up a nice young player like maybe trade the pick to OKC for their pick and jeff green cause im sure that they would like to have griffin at the 4 for them
 
Sarunas

Sarunas

G-League
#14
#14
vikinginferno said:
Thabeet is more likely to be a bust in the NBA. If you watch him, almost all of his scoring is just because he is much taller than everyone else. On defense he only is able to defend well because he is much taller than everyone else. This won't happen in the NBA. There will be guys almost as tall, as tall, or taller every game. They will likely also be stronger.
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I agree with you that most of his scoring and d is a result of him being taller than everyone, but i disagree when you say there will be guys as tall or taller every game in the nba. Thabeet is 7'3''...I think yao might be the only guy as tall or taller than him, but correct me if i'm wrong. A guy that is 7'3'' with coordination and some athleticism is always going to be useful in someway or another in this league. Hard to say he will be a complete bust...there will always be a use for him.

I think it also depends on what people qualify a "bust" as. I think Griffin can definitely become a very very good all star level PF in this league, but I can also see him being a david lee type (which isnt bad, but questionable at #1 overall). Everyone has a best and worst case scenario, but I dont think griffin will be a complete bust and out of the league, I think he has the tools to be a good solid player for a long time, even if its just as a great rebounder.
 
Sarunas

Sarunas

G-League
#15
#15
Nighthawk1 said:
All reports of people who watch the kid say he's pretty explosive which would indicate he's got a quick first step would it not? I think I'll wait until I hear his height when he's measured to comment on that but there are "SHORT" PF's that play better then the 6'10" PF's. He's probably just as good on the defensive end as most PF's are...
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Explosiveness and quickness in regards to a first step are completely different things. Jason Maxiell and Nate Robinson (Kryptonate) are both extremely explosive players, but they dont have the same kind of quickness on the first step like parker or monta ellis. At the same time its hard to tell if Griffin has a quick first step or not yet because he doesnt quite have the offensive arsenal that allows him to step outside and take people off the dribble and use quickness to go around them. If he develops those skills, then we will really know what kind of a first step he has.
 
Vlade4GM

Vlade4GM

All-Star
#16
#16
Sarunas said:
I agree with you that most of his scoring and d is a result of him being taller than everyone, but i disagree when you say there will be guys as tall or taller every game in the nba. Thabeet is 7'3''...I think yao might be the only guy as tall or taller than him, but correct me if i'm wrong. A guy that is 7'3'' with coordination and some athleticism is always going to be useful in someway or another in this league. Hard to say he will be a complete bust...there will always be a use for him.

I think it also depends on what people qualify a "bust" as. I think Griffin can definitely become a very very good all star level PF in this league, but I can also see him being a david lee type (which isnt bad, but questionable at #1 overall). Everyone has a best and worst case scenario, but I dont think griffin will be a complete bust and out of the league, I think he has the tools to be a good solid player for a long time, even if its just as a great rebounder.
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Actually he doesn't have good coordination.
 
Capt. Factorial

Capt. Factorial

trifolium contra tempestatem subrigere certum est
Staff member
#17
#17
rainmaker said:
Griffin won't be a bust. If we get the #1 pick and draft Griffin what do we do with JT. Griffin is too talented to come off the bench, and JT has shown to much promise to go back the the bench.

Griffin will be a good player but our problem would be that our best young prospect plays the same position as griffin, and I don't see how he and JT can play together.
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If we draft Griffin, we suddenly have a pretty solid 3-man rotation at the PF/C. 16 min. Griffin/Hawes, 16 min. Griffin/Thompson, 16 min. Thompson/Hawes. More or less. Sure, Griffin probably starts over Thompson, but you can give each of the three starters' minutes.
 
vikinginferno

vikinginferno

Starter
#18
#18
Sarunas said:
I agree with you that most of his scoring and d is a result of him being taller than everyone, but i disagree when you say there will be guys as tall or taller every game in the nba. Thabeet is 7'3''...I think yao might be the only guy as tall or taller than him, but correct me if i'm wrong. A guy that is 7'3'' with coordination and some athleticism is always going to be useful in someway or another in this league. Hard to say he will be a complete bust...there will always be a use for him.
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I said almost as tall, as tall, or taller. Also I am sure there are guys as tall as him besides Yao Ming. Zydrunas Ilgauskas is 7'3". There are many 7'1 or 7'0 footers also in the NBA which he will only be slightly taller and he won't be able to just go right over them.
 
Gary

Gary

All-Star
#19
#19
vikinginferno said:
I said almost as tall, as tall, or taller. Also I am sure there are guys as tall as him besides Yao Ming. Zydrunas Ilgauskas is 7'3". There are many 7'1 or 7'0 footers also in the NBA which he will only be slightly taller and he won't be able to just go right over them.
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And if it's any indication to the 7'ers he's playing against in college Thebeet will get pushed around even more int he NBA...

So basically the little centers that have a jumpshot will own thabeet, and the big guys that can push Thabeet around will own him too. Thabeet will do fine against guards when playing goalie though.

I actually wouldn't mind having a guy like Thabeet in Sacramento believe it or not.. But not with a top 1-5 pick.
 
vikinginferno

vikinginferno

Starter
#20
#20
Gary said:
And if it's any indication to the 7'ers he's playing against in college Thebeet will get pushed around even more int he NBA...

So basically the little centers that have a jumpshot will own thabeet, and the big guys that can push Thabeet around will own him too. Thabeet will do fine against guards when playing goalie though.

I actually wouldn't mind having a guy like Thabeet in Sacramento believe it or not.. But not with a top 1-5 pick.
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Yeah I totally agree with this. He will in no way ever be close to being a franchise player. I think he will at his best be a pretty good role player.
 
Sarunas

Sarunas

G-League
#21
#21
vikinginferno said:
Yeah I totally agree with this. He will in no way ever be close to being a franchise player. I think he will at his best be a pretty good role player.
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I agree with you and Gary as I dont think he will be a franchise player, but I dont think he will be a total bust, where hes of no use to us. Just in all honestly I dont think there are any players in this draft who jump out and scream superstar. That is a big reason why I'm on the Thabeet wagon if we cant get griffin. I don't know if we can really expect franchise stardom from anyone in this draft, so I'm content with settling for a 7'3'' guy who could be a useful piece in our team. I think this year of suckatude has made me more pessimistic than i should be and has lowered my expectations...:cool:
 
K

KCKingsCountry

G-League
#22
#22
rainmaker said:
Griffin won't be a bust. If we get the #1 pick and draft Griffin what do we do with JT. Griffin is too talented to come off the bench, and JT has shown to much promise to go back the the bench.

Griffin will be a good player but our problem would be that our best young prospect plays the same position as griffin, and I don't see how he and JT can play together.
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One of the two will be trade bait.
 
Amory

Amory

Bench
#24
#24
Nighthawk1 said:
Agree 100%, if we get the #1 pick I don't see us not trading one away...
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How about trade JT or Hawes for Jennings or another PG then?

I would like to pick Griffin if we get the 1st draft pick and see what happens wtih JT and Hawes. I have no problem with trading JT or Hawes if the price was right and Griffin were to be the better of the 3.
 
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upinsmoke

upinsmoke

All-Star
#25
#25
There is nothing wrong with having 3 young bigs I would not trade anyone of them.

Depth and flexablity are keys to getting the team back on the right track imo.
 
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Nighthawk1

Starter
#26
#26
Amory said:
How about trade JT or Hawes for Jennings or another PG then?

I would like to pick Griffin if we get the 1st draft pick and see what happens wtih JT and Hawes. I have no problem with trading JT or Hawes if the price was right and Griffin were to be the better of the 3.
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Which PG is up to debate, it's hard to trade Hawes just due to his age and the improvements he's shown already... Plus his outside game would work pretty well with Griffin's inside game... Keeping all 3 is an option of course as well...

Smills doesn't seem to be very popular on here or Realgm, but he brings up an interesting trade scenario with Washington and trying to steal their lotto pick away which I'd be in agreement with at least trying to do.

Another way might be trading JT for example for another lotto draft pick (in the 10-14 ish range) and combining it with our Houston pick for maybe a #5-6 which could accomplish us getting a PG we want out of the draft... It's a pretty steep price to pay though but it could be worth it to finish the assembly of our young core
 
Kingster

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#27
#27
Nighthawk1 said:
All reports of people who watch the kid say he's pretty explosive which would indicate he's got a quick first step would it not? I think I'll wait until I hear his height when he's measured to comment on that but there are "SHORT" PF's that play better then the 6'10" PF's. He's probably just as good on the defensive end as most PF's are...
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I don't go by "reports". I go by what I see. And I've seen him being guarded by bigger guys who can't go around. That's a red flag.
 
vikinginferno

vikinginferno

Starter
#28
#28
Nighthawk1 said:
.
Another way might be trading JT for example for another lotto draft pick (in the 10-14 ish range) and combining it with our Houston pick for maybe a #5-6 which could accomplish us getting a PG we want out of the draft... It's a pretty steep price to pay though but it could be worth it to finish the assembly of our young core
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JT is worth much more than a 10-14 pick, especially in this draft.
 
Kingster

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#29
#29
Sarunas said:
Explosiveness and quickness in regards to a first step are completely different things. Jason Maxiell and Nate Robinson (Kryptonate) are both extremely explosive players, but they dont have the same kind of quickness on the first step like parker or monta ellis. At the same time its hard to tell if Griffin has a quick first step or not yet because he doesnt quite have the offensive arsenal that allows him to step outside and take people off the dribble and use quickness to go around them. If he develops those skills, then we will really know what kind of a first step he has.
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Please explain what you're talking about. I've seen guys bigger and taller than Griffin guard him, yet Griffin can't dribble past them. He obviously can dribble the ball; that's not a problem. But he doesn't have the quick step to get by his man. If he's so explosive and/or quick then why can't he take a center outside, go to the hole, and slam it? All this talk is just that unless you actually see it on the court, and I haven't seen it. I saw Utah guard him with a center. Griffin had no impact, couldn't get past him. I saw Texas guard him by a big guy. Same effect.
 
Sarunas

Sarunas

G-League
#30
#30
Kingster said:
Please explain what you're talking about. I've seen guys bigger and taller than Griffin guard him, yet Griffin can't dribble past them. He obviously can dribble the ball; that's not a problem. But he doesn't have the quick step to get by his man. If he's so explosive and/or quick then why can't he take a center outside, go to the hole, and slam it? All this talk is just that unless you actually see it on the court, and I haven't seen it. I saw Utah guard him with a center. Griffin had no impact, couldn't get past him. I saw Texas guard him by a big guy. Same effect.
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I'm completely agreeing with you in my previous statement. I was explaining that just because a guy is explosive (as griffin is, or maxiell) doesnt mean he has a quick first step and can go around guys (like parker, ellis, etc.). They are two different abilites. I also dont think he has the offensive skills to do so, so we havent seen if he actually has quickness in his first step consistently, but either way I am definitely in agreement with you, and that was the point i was trying to convey.
 
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