Barry Bonds: "I Didn't Know"

Purple Reign · Dec 3, 2004

This is my take on this whole BALCO/Steroids thing, particularly when it comes to Barry Bonds. It is all about one's personal preference. If you were not a Barry Bonds fan before he admitted using the drugs, more than likely you are going to dismiss everything he has done and taint his very life from the day he was born. For crying out loud, he is probably guilty of shooting Lincoln, JFK and MLK. If you were a Barry Bonds fan before this "great, soul cleansing, holy salvation revelation", you probably do not care, as long as he hits 900 bombs by the All Star Break.

My take is that Barry Bonds may be alot of things, but stupid is not one of them. And I feel that if he was on the stuff in 2003, he sure as heck would not be on it in 2004, right? And last time I checked, in 2004 he still was the best player in baseball.

I have come to the realization in life that we live in an age where the celebrities that we look up and pay money to see, and invest time in enjoying are not perfect. Not William Jefferson Clinton, not Rush Limbaugh, not Ricky Williams, not Marion Jones, not Chris Webber, not Jason Giambi, not Barry Bonds. Short of committing a feloneous act that puts other folk in harms way, we should continue to enjoy your entertainment IF YOU CHOOSE TO. Does this excuse their actions. Absolutely not. But "we all have sinned, and fallen short of the glory of God". And for the media, the talk show host to show the level of indignation that they do when these things come to light to me is so hypocritical.

It is "clear" (no pun intended), that in 2004 every thing is larger than life, including the discretions of our celebritites. I will continue to watch San Francisco Giants baseball and root for #25 and hope that he has learned from his mistakes, and live my life and raise my own children.

Bibby_Is_Clutch · Dec 3, 2004

You couldnt have said it better. And many people already dont like him as a person... and who set that in your mind? the media...?

People who say "Bonds is a Jerk to Fans and the Media" dont know anything. Ive known him for a long time and one of his BEST qualities is being friendly to the fans.

Sure he may be a little snippy sometimes at the media but do you know what happen previously in the day? no. are you a professional athelete and sit at a table getting asked the same question every day after telling them to NOT ask that question? no.

Same thing with the steroids... why would the man lie? He admitted to using steroids but said he wasnt aware.

Ask yourself this question... You have arthritis (like barry) and you longtime best friend who happens to be an expert with phyiscal workouts and lifestyles tells you that this "arthritis cream" he tried or bought works and that he should try it and see if it helps at all.
Are you going to say "Wait..." and have it tested or questioned for steroids? No. Especially when you got it from a regular personal trainer... Greg had never been involved with any steroids publicly or anything... he only used them years ago when he was a full time body builder... so why would you question it... wouldnt you have enough trust and faith in your best friend that he wouldnt give you something illegal unknowingly?

Whether he knew it or not he took them. Big deal... sure its wrong and not right but:
1. He didnt know (How can you blame him?)
2. It didnt help him (Improves muscle mass and decreses fat only... no eye-hand cord.)
3. Who knows how much he accually did it. (Couldve been only a few months)

So who ever has not sinned can throw the first negative comment out about Barry and this issue...

I accually feel sorry for him... his career is now tainted with this steroid thing all because his "best friend" basically ripped him off.

bdouble013 · Dec 3, 2004

I'm sorry, but Barry is a professional athlete. If my WIFE gives me something I make sure I know what I am taking. How am I supposed to believe that professional athlete when told the creme he was using was flaxseed oil replied with, "Whatever."

Riiiight.

rhuber · Dec 3, 2004

I’ve been a HUGE fan of Bonds, particularly for the past 10 years or so… and that hasn’t changed. When all the suspicions started flying through the media some time ago, I didn’t want to believe it. Not Bonds… please… not him. I was sure they were wrong. Well… wish as I might that it wasn’t true… it was. I’m upset at the media’s handling of the whole thing, and as much as I hate to say it… I’m upset with Barry Bonds.

Firstly: I don’t believe that he didn’t know. I have no proof, and I’m certainly not an authority on the matter, I can only speak my mind… but my mind tells me that an athlete who has as much respect for his body and his physical performance as Bonds does, and excels in the manner he does (particularly for a man of his age in this business), is a man that pays impeccable attention to what goes into his body. He’s not the kind of man to stick a needle under his skin unless he knows exactly what’s in the syringe, and I don’t believe he’s inclined to take ANYBODY’S word for it.

Secondly: Bonds is a H-U-G-E role model to kids. That’s not something that accidentally happened… that’s part of the job. What do you think the reaction of teenage athletes is when they find out that the greatest athletes they can think of are pumping this stuff into their systems? Do you think they’re writing their idols off as idiots, or do you think they’re wondering how they can get their hands on some of this stuff? I’m honestly afraid to know the answer to that… because I fear that it’s all too often the latter.

As much as I hate the way the media hounds these guys… this stuff really does matter. I’ll always be a fan of Barry Bonds… that much won’t change. I think I can hate something he’s done without sacrificing my appreciation for him. I feel sorry for Bonds, and everyone who turns to drugs to help them perform in a world that absolutely demands it of them, but that feeling is outweighed by the widespread effect it has on young athletes.

EDIT: As I side note... I try hard not to throw heavy opinions around on discussion boards because it just stirs up more trouble than I care to play with, but I thought someone should play devils advocate (I’ll probably regret that).

Bricklayer · Dec 3, 2004

You're not playing devil's advocate, you're playing rational human being.

LPKingsFan · Dec 4, 2004

The question remains that: were the substances he used banned at the time? I don't know for sure, but the impression I'm getting is no.

To me, it's not all that different from McGwire and the andro thing, and everyone is still on his jock.

Regardless, Barry didn't even use the stuff last year and he still blew everyone away.

And of course, is anyone clamoring about the fact that NONE OF THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN LEAKED from a SEALED grand jury testimony?

Bricklayer · Dec 4, 2004

LPKingsFan said:

Who knows what he used last year. In particular with that wonderful testing non-system baseball has. I'm also thinking once you have the extra mass, it takes a while to lose it. In any case, since there WAS no baseball steroid policy until this scandal started to break, then basically NONE of the players involved broke any rules and are "clean".

But of course that's not true -- they still cheated to gain an advantage over their fellow players and certainly shouldn't be celebrated for it even if the Players Union were able to keep the substances from being banned forever.

P.S. Regarding the leaked testimony: the government does that more than you might think with grand jury testimony. I DETEST grand juries, and I am a laywer! (would of course feel different if I joined the US Attorney's Office) But the grand jury process essentially releases the prosecution from all the rules and is not infrequently used as a hammer to punish individuals outside the law whom they don't think they can actually convict.

Bibby_Is_Clutch · Dec 4, 2004

When you discontinue using steroids especially hGh you lose the muscle mass and all the benefits very quickly. Its like not giving your muscles and whatever else the human growth hormone benefits food... they cant continue without the substance and therefore dissapear...

Those are the words from my physician.

Bricklayer · Dec 4, 2004

Bibby_Is_Clutch said:

He apparently, at least recently, was not using HgH, but rather a supposedly undetectable substance called Clear and some sort of Cream. And that's just the BALCO stuff.

I have no idea what he was or was not using last year, but I'd be willing to bet a significant chunk of change that he had all sorts of stuff in his system that you wouldn't normally find there in you or I (whether legal or illegal)

Of course at this point I'm not sure it particualrly matters what he uses or doesn't use anyway since the travesty has already been perpetrated on baseball and everyone is too scared to pitch to him anyway. He could stride on up there with man-boobs, still get 200 walks and never have to even consider the possibiltiy somebody would throw him a fastball.

Bibby_Is_Clutch · Dec 4, 2004

Its not like he used them for years... it was during the year of 2003 which could not have even been the whole year... and it was one of his weaker years of late. Steroids dont make you better at a sport... they give you muscle and less fat.

Bonds doesnt hit homeruns with muscle... he does it with his eye-hand/speed cordination.

If you can have that clean and perfect of a swing and that fast and just weigh as much as him (muscle or fat) you would probably hit a lot of hrs too.

Purple Reign · Dec 4, 2004

LPKingsFan said:

If Barry is truthfully testifying, the above point is absolutely correct. What he was using at the time was not illegal. That is why Bond's attorney on yesterday kept hammering the fact that "Barry did not take anything illegal". I kind of compare this to the Barrett Robbins, Dana Stubblefield and Bill Romanowski cases. All took THG before it was banned by the NFL. They all got four games suspensions and move on. But because this is "a straight up full blown witch hunt" conducted by the Feds, Barry is now being crucified in the court of public opinion.

Purple Reign · Dec 4, 2004

Just an aside article that I found in the SF Chronicle.

Some people cannot fathom the indifference. The revelations about Jason Giambi and Barry Bonds brought a rousing "so what?" from the general public, causing waves of journalistic outrage around the country.

Here's what they're missing: Baseball is a haven for wrongdoing. Scandals are at the core of its history. Whatever your age, the first one hits pretty hard: the 1919 White Sox throwing the World Series, clubhouses infested with amphetamine-like substances and cocaine, the obliteration of the 1994 World Series, Pete Rose gambling on the game, and now the strange and nebulous Steroid Era. After that first shattering of innocence, you are properly jaded to withstand years of torment.

Perhaps it seems weak-minded and inappropriate to throw out a tired cliche like "baseball will recover," but that's exactly what will happen.

Just one year after Shoeless Joe and the Black Sox scandal, Babe Ruth hit 54 home runs. The National League leader had 15. A legend was born.

At the top of The Chronicle's sports page on Sept. 13, 1985, it was revealed that Willie Mays' name had come up in the Pittsburgh drug trial. Former teammate John Milner testified that Mays had a substance called "red juice" in his locker during his final (1973) season with the Mets. "I tried it once," Milner said. "I don't know what kind of speed it was, but it kept your eyes open."

Over the years, respected baseball sources have told me that Henry Aaron liked a little "juice," as well. In the '60s and '70s, you were an oddball if you didn't use it. Guys just looking for an "edge," right? The rascals. Reputations survived intact. (Tim Raines once said he slid into bases a certain way so he wouldn't crack the little vial of cocaine in his back pocket; years later, that story had virtually disappeared from his resume.)

This past season, tainted by steroid accusations, was an absolute triumph in spirit, attendance figures and postseason drama. And so it will be next summer, no matter how outrageous the BALCO developments become.

What strikes me, more than the nuts and bolts of grand jury testimony, is the stupidity. One feels a measure of compassion for athletes in track or swimming, because the "edge" is set precisely by the clock. Steroids might be a risky and illegal venture, but if you're falling short of a juiced-up athlete, and the evidence is right there on paper, you might try like hell to catch up.

When it comes to Giambi, Bonds and Jose Canseco, one feels no pity. For crying out loud, they were god-like figures within a year or two of their arrival. They already had the edge. I ran across another story, this one from the 1993 All-Star Game, in which Bonds, sitting in the dugout, astounded his National League teammates by picking up the rotation of pitches during the game. "Slider," he'd say before the ball got to home plate, or "fastball," with the ball barely out of the pitcher's hands. Someone asked Bonds how the pitcher was "tipping" his deliveries, and Bonds said, "No, it's not that. Can't you see it?" The man has been 100 percent baseball genius from the moment he stepped onto a big-league diamond.

Now we're supposed to believe that Bonds didn't know what he was putting into his body. Right. This guy has the most driven, conscientious workout program this side of Jerry Rice, but he ingests substances indiscriminately. Now we're the stupid ones.

Ban the asterisk

Baseball wants this scandal to go away, just as it refuses to acknowledge Mark McGwire's admitted use of "andro" (since banned by the sport) during his 70-homer season. The only good thing about that: There will be no "asterisk" for Bonds or anyone else. As it should be. Bonds' personal habits reflected the climate of his day, when steroid use was rampant. Forget the asterisk. That would be like going back to 1903, when Jimmy Sheckard led the NL in homers with nine, and noting, "This guy was actually pretty strong. Remember that the balls were dead. He couldn't help it" ... Now we have to fend off the rancid stench of the players' union, blindly combating Bud Selig's efforts to get an authentic drug-testing program in place ... The most disturbing thing about the Bonds-Giambi stories wasn't the testimony, which had already been accepted as fact by the general public. It's that the "confidentiality" of grand jury testimony doesn't mean a thing. Your so-called "private" remarks can be leaked by someone with an agenda. What a disgrace for the federal government ... How do you explain the steroid thing to your 7-year-old kid? Easy. "The guy took a bunch of stuff that made his muscles bigger. You're not allowed to do that, and it's really bad for your health. Now, let me tell you why baseball isn't about strength or muscles at all." In the end, Bonds aside, steroid users won't be remembered as cheaters, just losers. Giambi is a physical wreck. Sammy Sosa (who has admitted nothing to date) is an emotional wreck. Canseco became a parody of himself. Ken Caminiti didn't live to tell about it. That's your message: sheer destruction .

LPKingsFan · Dec 4, 2004

I would agree. The players union stinks, and Bonds shouldn't be singled out like this.

VF21 · Dec 4, 2004

rhuber said:

I’ve been a HUGE fan of Bonds, particularly for the past 10 years or so… and that hasn’t changed. When all the suspicions started flying through the media some time ago, I didn’t want to believe it. Not Bonds… please… not him. I was sure they were wrong. Well… wish as I might that it wasn’t true… it was. I’m upset at the media’s handling of the whole thing, and as much as I hate to say it… I’m upset with Barry Bonds.

Firstly: I don’t believe that he didn’t know. I have no proof, and I’m certainly not an authority on the matter, I can only speak my mind… but my mind tells me that an athlete who has as much respect for his body and his physical performance as Bonds does, and excels in the manner he does (particularly for a man of his age in this business), is a man that pays impeccable attention to what goes into his body. He’s not the kind of man to stick a needle under his skin unless he knows exactly what’s in the syringe, and I don’t believe he’s inclined to take ANYBODY’S word for it.

Secondly: Bonds is a H-U-G-E role model to kids. That’s not something that accidentally happened… that’s part of the job. What do you think the reaction of teenage athletes is when they find out that the greatest athletes they can think of are pumping this stuff into their systems? Do you think they’re writing their idols off as idiots, or do you think they’re wondering how they can get their hands on some of this stuff? I’m honestly afraid to know the answer to that… because I fear that it’s all too often the latter.

As much as I hate the way the media hounds these guys… this stuff really does matter. I’ll always be a fan of Barry Bonds… that much won’t change. I think I can hate something he’s done without sacrificing my appreciation for him. I feel sorry for Bonds, and everyone who turns to drugs to help them perform in a world that absolutely demands it of them, but that feeling is outweighed by the widespread effect it has on young athletes.

EDIT: As I side note... I try hard not to throw heavy opinions around on discussion boards because it just stirs up more trouble than I care to play with, but I thought someone should play devils advocate (I’ll probably regret that).

Very nice post, rhuber...

I have not been a fan of baseball for a long time.

My take, for what it's worth, is that after repeatedly swearing he NEVER used steroids, Bonds has apparently testified to using them (without knowing it was steroids?!). If he set records while using those drugs against players who DIDN'T use them, then his records should be stripped. Fair is fair.

But, like I said, I"m no longer a baseball fan. The "sport" became all about money, drugs, and everything but the game itself a long time ago - and that's when I quit watching it.

Evenstar · Dec 4, 2004

bonds is such a great hitter becuase of his hand/eye coordination, and his bat speed.
and look at giambi, he's been hurt, has that tumor on his pituitary gland. when was the last time bonds got hurt?????

purple reign stole my thunder on the dot 3 lounge article (

) but it brings up some GREAT points.

baseball players have always been cheating. and why does everyone make a big stink when bonds is hitting home runs, but NO ONE would DARE question ruth even when he was hitting 54, and the next highest guy was hitting 15. does that not seem a little odd to anyone??? now i have NO idea how great ruth was, but guess what, today's media also has no idea. there aren't many people alive today who got to see ruth play. i don't doubt ruth's greatness, but it does make me wonder, damn, i know he's good, but to out homer entire teams???? how is that possible??? and why is it that he is the god, but bonds is thebig cheater??? ( theres still no viable proof that he'd been juicing up this whole time outside of 03. wheres the positive blood tests???? )

and all this talk about these stupid writers saying they won't vote bonds into the hall of fame, well i can't say what i want to say to them, but that is the biggest CROCK i have EVER heard of. so bonds might have been taking a substance that wasn't on the banned list, so he can't be in the hall, but guys like gaylord perry who threw spitballs ( illegal) are allowed to be in the hall????? um ok how is that fair??????

i hate what's going on. i hate seeing the best player i have ever and probably will ever see get talked about like this. i'll never stop supporting bonds, he dons the orange and black. i'll never stop cheering for bonds.

zip95843 · Dec 4, 2004

Evenstar, amen.

VF21 · Dec 4, 2004

This is sad...all the way around. Two wrongs, or 20, or even 100 - don't make a right. Bonds should be allowed to get away with something because other players MIGHT have done something, too? Comparing Gaylord Perry throwing spitballs to condoning Bonds and the others using steroids (which can kill, BTW) is just wrong.

Nobody wins in this case, especially not the youngsters who are getting the message it's okay to use steroids if your name is Barry Bonds because, after all, he has good hand-eye coordination and would have set those hitting records anyway...

Bibby_Is_Clutch · Dec 4, 2004

VF21 said:

Bonds didnt set any records while on steroids that I know of and no he shouldnt be stripped of them if any. If you are taken advantage of, which he was by his BEST FRIEND then he is not to blame. Someone like Mark who took andro in the looker room infront of media and teamates should. I dont care if its illegal or legal it is a performance enhancing drug. Bonds didnt go "hey can i get some steroids"... he was tricked, lied to, taken advantage of.

Bibby_Is_Clutch · Dec 4, 2004

Evenstar said:

bonds is such a great hitter becuase of his hand/eye coordination, and his bat speed.
and look at giambi, he's been hurt, has that tumor on his pituitary gland. when was the last time bonds got hurt?????

purple reign stole my thunder on the dot 3 lounge article (

) but it brings up some GREAT points.

baseball players have always been cheating. and why does everyone make a big stink when bonds is hitting home runs, but NO ONE would DARE question ruth even when he was hitting 54, and the next highest guy was hitting 15. does that not seem a little odd to anyone??? now i have NO idea how great ruth was, but guess what, today's media also has no idea. there aren't many people alive today who got to see ruth play. i don't doubt ruth's greatness, but it does make me wonder, damn, i know he's good, but to out homer entire teams???? how is that possible??? and why is it that he is the god, but bonds is thebig cheater??? ( theres still no viable proof that he'd been juicing up this whole time outside of 03. wheres the positive blood tests???? )

and all this talk about these stupid writers saying they won't vote bonds into the hall of fame, well i can't say what i want to say to them, but that is the biggest CROCK i have EVER heard of. so bonds might have been taking a substance that wasn't on the banned list, so he can't be in the hall, but guys like gaylord perry who threw spitballs ( illegal) are allowed to be in the hall????? um ok how is that fair??????

i hate what's going on. i hate seeing the best player i have ever and probably will ever see get talked about like this. i'll never stop supporting bonds, he dons the orange and black. i'll never stop cheering for bonds.

Bonds will be in the hall of fame no matter what as it stands now. If it comes out or he admits to knowning about the steroids then it may be different, but even so he will probably still be in there.

Take away the year he took steroids (2003) and he still has the numbers to be in the HOF.

VF21 · Dec 4, 2004

Bibby_Is_Clutch said:

Whatever.

Why Barry Bonds should be different than any other athlete who has ingested steroids is beyond my ability to comprehend. HE LIED about it...and then said, "Yeah, I took them but I didn't know I was taking them."

Make all the excuses for him that you like. I'm sorry I even posted in this thread...

Bartking · Dec 4, 2004

There was a guy in the Tour de France this year...or maybe the Olympics. He had a drug test come out positive...and you know what he said? He said Yup, you got me. Only time I know of that it happened like that.

Barry had a magic cream and he didn't know about it.......RIIIIGHT.

rhuber · Dec 4, 2004

I'm honestly not convinced one way or another what should happen, I don't know enough details to really form much of an opinion in that respect. I was simply expressing my own disappointment in the matter... and I think that much is pretty valid.

sloter · Dec 4, 2004

Q: Why aren't these substances not only banned from baseball, but illegal ?

Purple Reign · Dec 4, 2004

VF21 said:

No don't be sorry, this is great conversation. My whole feeling is that though Barry Bonds is wrong for participating in performance enhancing drugs, baseball turned a blinded eye throughout all of this. Bonds only did what MLB allowed him to do. Just like they did with Sosa, McGwire and every other batter AND PITCHER that has been involved in this whole mess. It all goes back to my original point. It is about personal choice. If you were not a Barry Bonds fan before he admitted using the drugs, more than likely you are going to dismiss everything he has done. If you were a Barry Bonds fan before this " you are probably going to cut him some slack.

I consider myself in the fan catagory. And for every circumstantial piece of evidence that the critics have for supporting him being a user. i have a piece of circumstantial evidence that shows that it does not matter. When I look at all of the high profile folks that are involved in this:

Marion Jones
Jason and Jeremy Giambi
Jose and Ozzie Canseco
Dana Stubblefield
Barrett Robbins
Mark McGwire
Sammy Sosa
Tim Montgomery
Kelli White
Alvin and Calvin Harrison, WHAT DO ALL OF THESE PEOPLE HAVE IN COMMON.........Their careers are either over because of steroids or they are so unproductive that their careers are close to being over.

Why has Bonds WHO IS OLDER THAN DIRT, risen above the fray when the others all fairly young have died in their steroid grave? Because Bonds has more talent than all of those people combined twice over. Plus he works hard and is a genetic freak.

Bricklayer · Dec 4, 2004

Bonds flat out cheated. And he knew EXACTLY what he was doing. I don't care whether he's on your team or not, that is just inexcusable.

Top flight MLB hitters do NOT suddenly get explosively better after their 35th birthday. I defy you to find one other example.

And it didn't start in 2003. That's kind of a sad smokescreen. It started when an aging power hitter who had never hit more than 46 homers in his life (and that was done 1 time years ago in his prime) suddenly magically got twice as potent at the age of 35 circa 2000 or so. He then goes on and starts setting personal, and record, bests in Slugging% (as pitchers quickly figured out you could no longer fairly pitch to him) year after year after year. A year or two after the great McGwire/Sosa HR derby, plenty of time to decide to get in on some of the action yourself.

You don't win when you cheat. Nor do your records count cmpared to the records of non-enhanced humans. You are not playing the same game as anyone else. Not playing by the same rules. So you can't beat them.

There have been some suggestions Bonds should not make the HOF for this -- he has cheated and stained the integrity of the game. I believe he still should. But the Bonds who should make it is the Bonds circa 1999 or so who was ALREADY a HOF player, already one of the better outfielders ever to play the game. Not the juiced up superhero parody that has made a travesty of the recordbook.

P.S. as an aside, Ruth revolutionalized the game, which is why he is sucha legend. He more or less invented the home run as the game's defining event (and thus ironically probably set up the current generation of cheat-at-all-costs power hitters). However one look at his physique will tell you all you need to know about him cheating -- nto that the tchnology was there anyway. Difference with him is that he was the first guy to use a home run swing and actually try to hit the ball high in the air and out of the park.

rhuber · Dec 4, 2004

Purple Reign said:

When I see this list, I see a million young athletes, who are convinced the only thing keeping them from excelling in their sport to the degree of those listed above.... is the use of drugs -- and I suspect a very large number will at least contemplate following suit. I don't care much when and where it all started... but I care very much when and where it ends.

LPKingsFan · Dec 4, 2004

No one has still said whether what he used was banned by baseball at the time, and how that's any different than McGwire?

Ryle · Dec 4, 2004

I just find it very odd that he goes from average about 45-48 home runs per year the previous few years and then he hits 73???? Anyone remember when Brady Anderson his like 50 home runs one year and I don't think he's hit more than 20 in any other year???

Steroids are rampant in MLB and something needs to be done about it.

Bricklayer · Dec 4, 2004

LPKingsFan said:

Its different than McGwire only in that what McGwire used was a relatively widely distributed weight training supplement (at the time) that floated around on the borders of being a steroid. No labs, secret formulas designed to be undetectable etc. It was out there and in common use, and he used it. did he use it with the intention of gaining an advantage? No doubt. Makes gaining muscle mass much easier. Did McGwire use it with knowledge that what he was doing was cheating? Much less likely. And that is the difference.

Bricklayer · Dec 4, 2004

Ryle said:

Wasn't even averaging 45-48. Had hit more than 42 ONCE in his entire career, back in 1993. He was not considered an elite power hitter on the levels of the Sosas and McGwires (who as it turned out were likely supplelmented as well). Then everything changed in 1999-2000.

If I had to speculate I could even go this far -- in 1999 Bonds was beginning to slip a bit with age, and sufferered through an injury plagued season. The next year he emerged as a new sort of creature. It could very well have been during that injury plagued year, while trying to rehab and watching Sosa and McGwire drink in all the glory, that this whole thing got started for Barry.

Barry Bonds: "I Didn't Know"

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