Sactown ExPat
Starter
Which superstar are we packaging Bagley and Buddy for this summer? This has to be the most obvious incoming trade since JWill for Bibby. I’m going to go a little off the board here and say....Dame.
Bagley + Buddy for Superstar X
- Thread starter Sactown ExPat
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SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
And what does that mean for Fox? Might be tilting the other way right now honestly. I'm not sure what superstars are out there anyhow. This last summer would've been the time to strike probably. Too many teams created a 2 superstar combo so they'd likely have to wait it out and trade up in the draft. If the Kings are in that 6-7 range then they might be able to package Bagley to move up or get another top pick along with their own. That could help stretch out the time before the Kings cap starts to harden with Fox, Buddy, Bagley, and Barnes taking up a good chunk of the cap otherwise. This draft isn't the greatest though and there's a lot of PG's so just sitting and taking BPA might not work this time.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
If Walton keeps trying to turn him into Beal he might as well just skip on to the real thing. In theory Buddy is a much better fit but it looks like Walton is expecting something else out of him as it is.
Sactown ExPat
Starter
Oh, for sure, picks would be included. Just curious which superstar folks think we are getting this summer.
I said Devin Booker in the other thread
Sactown ExPat
Starter
Yes! That was the other guy that came to mind for me. I agree, whomever we get will be a big-time scorer and a guy who can close games. And, for Booker, we may not have to include any picks, which would be a bonus.
Sactown ExPat
Starter
Obviously, we’re talking about second tier guys and not MVP candidates. But, to the question, teams stuck in neutral, and/or with a discontent star, who need to press the reset button.
Sactown ExPat
Starter
Thanks for the STR level analysis.
twslam07
All-Star
That makes more sense but the fact that you think “superstars” are the same as 2nd tier guys is what is likely throwing everyone off.
Albatros
Starter
What possible analysis can one provide?
No one is going to trade a star of any description for them 2, unless of course it's a star who's just been arrested or something.
twslam07
All-Star
You'd likely have to make it Bagley, Hield, & our 2020 1st to make it attractive/competitive enough. Beal seems like the only potential guy at the moment considering he would be a good fit next to Fox, is still somewhat young, is locked up for a few more years, and is not happy with his current situation.
Having said that, I feel like any of these deals are going to be difficult to pull off because of Hield. If the Wizards are trading Beal (26), why would they want Hield (27)? For that matter, why would any team want to trade a star for a 27 year old player when (more often than not) a trade like that indicates a rebuild? Hield would have to go to another team with young assets being redirected to WAS, and in the case of trying to send Hield to a 3rd team, why wouldn't that 3rd team cut the Kings out and try to acquire the better & younger Beal for themselves?
They obviously would need the assets to acquire someone like Beal but you'd think that if a team is in the market for a SG, they would likely try to acquire Beal first.
Even if we did acquire Beal for a package like that, we still aren't good enough to becomes a championship contender...
Fox/Joseph
Beal/James
Barnes/Bogdan
Bjelica
Holmes/Dedmon
That's not good enough to be a top team, and we wouldn't really have any cap space in the 2020 offseason to add talent. Your only chance really is to trade Bogdan for a future pick and then let Bjelica, Holmes, Dedmon, & Joseph walk in the 2021 offseason. You'd have ~$30 mil in cap space to add around Fox, Beal, Barnes, James, & 2021 1st. I don't believe $30 mil is enough for a max player so this type of idea seems shortsighted to say the least.
Having said that, I feel like any of these deals are going to be difficult to pull off because of Hield. If the Wizards are trading Beal (26), why would they want Hield (27)? For that matter, why would any team want to trade a star for a 27 year old player when (more often than not) a trade like that indicates a rebuild? Hield would have to go to another team with young assets being redirected to WAS, and in the case of trying to send Hield to a 3rd team, why wouldn't that 3rd team cut the Kings out and try to acquire the better & younger Beal for themselves?
They obviously would need the assets to acquire someone like Beal but you'd think that if a team is in the market for a SG, they would likely try to acquire Beal first.
Even if we did acquire Beal for a package like that, we still aren't good enough to becomes a championship contender...
Fox/Joseph
Beal/James
Barnes/Bogdan
Bjelica
Holmes/Dedmon
That's not good enough to be a top team, and we wouldn't really have any cap space in the 2020 offseason to add talent. Your only chance really is to trade Bogdan for a future pick and then let Bjelica, Holmes, Dedmon, & Joseph walk in the 2021 offseason. You'd have ~$30 mil in cap space to add around Fox, Beal, Barnes, James, & 2021 1st. I don't believe $30 mil is enough for a max player so this type of idea seems shortsighted to say the least.
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I wouldn't package a 1st round pick around Beal. He's dead last in defense in DRPM and DPIPM. Behind even Trae Young and IT. He's proven he can defend better than that in the past but he's obviously gotten tired of losing and isn't putting in the effort this year. If he comes here, he's more than likely going to lose and now we're going to have an extremely talented but no effort player that we're eventually going to grow tired of.
I'd roll the dice and package Hield and Bagley for him and hope something works but I wouldn't throw in lottery picks because it's too risky with the way he's played.
twslam07
All-Star
That’s not enough value for Beal though and Hield won’t be attractive to them either.
You can reference his defensive numbers in WAS, sure but the fact is he hasn’t been close to this bad in prior years. And it likely comes with him not caring since he’s on a trash team and the fact that he carries the offensive workload.
If we’re trading for Beal, it’s to win now and a team of Fox, Beal, Bogdan, Barnes, Bjelica, & Holmes is certainly better than what he has now. So if you’re making the argument that Beals defense will remain bad because we’ll still be bad, then why the hell are we making a trade for a star?
I already called out the shortsighted nature of this premise so we’re probably in agreement to some degree, but a Fox, Beal, Bogdan, Barnes, Bjelica, & Holmes team probably tops out as a 5-8th seed. The only hope to become a true contender would be signing a 3rd star to pair with Fox & Beal and I find that highly unlikely.
I do disagree with the premise that Beals defense wouldn’t pick up if we were to trade for him. Our team would be about on par with those WAS teams of old Wall/Beal/Porter/Gortat vs. Fox/Beal/Barnes/Holmes. The years where Beal was actually putting effort in defensively.
Again, this idea is DOA for me as I don’t see this as a path to being a true contender.
I'm not saying it's enough value to land Beal. I'm just saying I wouldn't give up what would probably be required to get him because I don't see it being a path to contention either.
You're right, that team is better than what we have now but defensively I don't think they would be good enough to get into the playoffs. Even if Beal returns to the same kind of defender he was a couple years ago, he's still a below average defender at his position. I could be wrong.
The way it would more than likely go down is we would give up the players plus the pick for Beal and play .500 ball to finish the season. Then we'll go into the next season with high hopes, only to have the team win 32 games. Then we'll watch Washington pick a solid player with our pick and we'll all be mad that we're in the exact same spot we were in before but with a bunch of vets instead of promising young players. Then they properly rebuild a year or two behind schedule and even more time is wasted. Kangz tradition basically.
Kings_of_California
Starter
The only team I could see trading a star straight up for Bagley and Hield is Phoenix. They've made some really strange decisions before so I wouldn't put it past them to do it again. Booker is playing out of his mind this year but they need a PF badly.
That said Ayton is starting to play up to his potential and they've been competitive so maybe they're not inclined to trade Booker.
Also, I've not totally given up on Bagley like a lot of people here. He's not been good but I hardly think putting him on the floor is us tanking. That's a bit out there for me. I also don't think Vlade (if he's still here) trades him. He picked him over Luka and I think he's going to die on that hill trying to prove it wasn't a unanimously atrocious pick.
That said Ayton is starting to play up to his potential and they've been competitive so maybe they're not inclined to trade Booker.
Also, I've not totally given up on Bagley like a lot of people here. He's not been good but I hardly think putting him on the floor is us tanking. That's a bit out there for me. I also don't think Vlade (if he's still here) trades him. He picked him over Luka and I think he's going to die on that hill trying to prove it wasn't a unanimously atrocious pick.