Alvin Gentry next to coach Kings

#31
If he goes back to the big lineup that never went anywhere then he's not paying attention and this won't go anywhere either. The only thing that could come from that is you showcase Bagley, he plays well, builds a market, and you either overpay or watch him leave on a high while he used your minutes to do it.
I don't think the big lineup was exactly the problem. More on how they where used. When we have that linup we shouldn't have Barnes be are number 1 option. We need to play thru Hali and fox. Then with Bagley it will help out on rebounds and keep us playing. Fast.
 
#32
I agree with the Interim label. Save the full-time for next season, and put Bobby and Doug in the mix then.
oh no. I don't understand the fascination around Bobby Jackson being HC. He has no proven track record.

Bobby Jackson's resume:
  • 2010-2012: Kings player developmental coach and regional scout
  • 2013: T-Wolves player developmental coach
  • 2015-2018: Kings college scout
  • 2018-2020: Kings assistant coach
  • 2021: Stockton head coach
We need to look outside of the organization for help. Vlade and Peja were failures for the team.
 
#34
I don't think the big lineup was exactly the problem. More on how they where used. When we have that linup we shouldn't have Barnes be are number 1 option. We need to play thru Hali and fox. Then with Bagley it will help out on rebounds and keep us playing. Fast.
It was a problem, just a different problem. And it wasn't utterly terrible because Luke was determined to play that way. The spacing issues are real and honestly, Metu as a spacer has been an upgrade over Bagley. Barnes at PF in every advanced metric for a few years now is the key piece to them having legit net ratings in their 5 man units. They start there, they end there. Where it takes you is where it takes you.
 
#35
Should have been the play last year. I'm going to watch 5 games and then maybe take a break because I think we just threw the towel in on the season. At least maybe we can get a good pick. Maybe he can showcase Bags effectively for a better trade.
 
#36
You think we can win with 3 guards and 2 undersized forwards? I can see 3 guards and 2 big forwards but everyone can't be 6'2
I think Monte built this G roster and supposedly had an idea of how it can work. Lets see it. As far as winning? We'll know within about 2 weeks whether tagging Gentry as Lukes leftovers kills the season dead from then on regardless. This is a gunky roster where all of it's key primary assets sit at PG/SG. Losing and using them right will at least sustain some value there. Benching in favor of FA to be role players is the kind of thought process that got them in this mess in the first place.
 
#37
Should have been the play last year. I'm going to watch 5 games and then maybe take a break because I think we just threw the towel in on the season. At least maybe we can get a good pick. Maybe he can showcase Bags effectively for a better trade.
Yeah, there is a very short time to turn this around now, and truthfully this isn't totally fair to Gentry. Last year he could have had a McMillan turnaround. Now he's up against it. There is no amount of showcasing possible with Bagley. Teams are 100 percent sure the Kings won't match a deal on him this summer. They'll wait. Or they should at least.
 
#38
Like I said, I know nothing about Bobby Jackson as a coach...but I like what I see at the Summer League. If that is his fingerprints or someone else...I would like to see that person giving a chance. The team at the Summer League is playing a Warriors-like defense switching hustling and team help and I like that a LOT. Also, got to give King a chance to play I thought he's a gem. Why is he not on the roster?
 
#40
They hired Vlade as GM solely because he was a Kings legend and that was good PR, who then got Peja and all these brought into the mix. The franchise has been running on cronyism for some time now.

The top comment I saw from a Jazz fan was that he expected Kings fans to be breathing a sigh of relief that it wasn't Christie. There's no way he could fathom that Kings fans would not only be disappointed, but were leading the charge to have Christie as coach.
its common practice to bring guys in that you are familiar with. Happens all the time. Both the Wolves and Kings wanted Finch allegedly and that is due to established relationships. Candidates should be hired because they are the right fit for the team, not because they are a former player. However, I don’t think being a former player or assistant coach automatically eliminates you from consideration either.

It’s not cut and dry who will be a good and successful coach anyway. Lot of factors.
 
#41
I wanted Bobby J but I don't think hiring Gentry as interim instead is that horrible of a move anymore.

I guess it could give Bobby J time to season himself a full season as head coach without any distraction and if he does well there, it should give him a boost in the summer when an actual search is presumably done.

It would have been a 0-100 situation for Bobby, and Doug as well, so maybe this is the safest route.

My question here now is, is the season dead or is something going to change ?

I'm very curious what Gentry is going to do. Is he going to continue Waltons schemes or change things up completely?

If it's the former, put this season in the bag
 
#42
It was a problem, just a different problem. And it wasn't utterly terrible because Luke was determined to play that way. The spacing issues are real and honestly, Metu as a spacer has been an upgrade over Bagley. Barnes at PF in every advanced metric for a few years now is the key piece to them having legit net ratings in their 5 man units. They start there, they end there. Where it takes you is where it takes you.
Metu a better spacer than Bagley? I mean his shot looks better, but as far as going in? It's pretty close and I'd say maybe even a downgrade.

It All depends on where you think our cap is. If we're going to miss the playoffs again, at least let's get somethin for our players. Bagley the only one who can build his trading value on this team. Everyone else is who we think they are
 
#43
Great. Nothing personally against Gentry, but yet another recycled, mediocre, hasn't done anything particularly well, hamster on the wheel coach for the Kings. Nothing's going to change. What a waste of a potential opportunity to better themselves. A "change" for the sake of the same old absolutely nothing. SMDH
 
#44
I think Monte built this G roster and supposedly had an idea of how it can work. Lets see it. As far as winning? We'll know within about 2 weeks whether tagging Gentry as Lukes leftovers kills the season dead from then on regardless. This is a gunky roster where all of it's key primary assets sit at PG/SG. Losing and using them right will at least sustain some value there. Benching in favor of FA to be role players is the kind of thought process that got them in this mess in the first place.
I don’t understand why I keep seeing this take over and over again. We all know it is embalanced and has its weaknesses but there is legitimate talent on this roster:

-one of the fastest PGs in the league and best at getting to the bucket
-one of the best volume 3 point shooters in the league
-one of the most efficient bigs in the league
-Barnes is an excellent well-rounded player, the type of starter you don’t question or have serious concerns about
-Davion has the potential to be one of the best guard defenders in the league
-Tyrese, like Barnes, is a solid contributor and, current struggles aside, is great at facilitating and should be used as an x-factor to help glue together some mismatched talent

You build around the first three components / players. You have ingredients with the next three players that help fill the gaps and can compliment the strongest pieces of the roster. This isn’t ever going to be a contending team but it’s nowhere near G-league, the fact it’s looked that way is on Walton being totally unable to make anything out of the top 6 dudes work

As for Gentry, his background with the Suns and Warriors is the top-line in terms of coaching fit. For this roster to work you need tons of movement and speed. You look for open 3s for Buddy and Halliburton, open lanes for Davion and Fox, and action moving towards the basket with Holmes. We know that works but it’s never been a team philosophy to make those the first and last pieces the offense is based around. I expect Gentry to move us in that direction

MOST IMPORTANT I think we are gonna see a big change in culture. For a long time it’s been widely known that the Kings haven’t had a functional professional culture. From the Cousins years and Karl with constant backstabbing and preferential treatment for stars, something that continued thru Vlade’s tenure with organizational mismanagement and firing Joerger to replace him with a go-along get-along coach who’s selling point was that he’s easy going and players like him. Gentry is professional and well-respected (as a coach rather than a sycophant). He’s been an interim head coach many times (Hollinger called him the GOAT interim head coach which is both funny and weirdly necessary). He will put in a professional culture and do his job, I don’t think there’s gonna be any drama with him and I assume he knows why he’s here. Woj tweet that contractually he’s got the job this year and can compete for next says he knew the deal coming in, and I have no doubt he’s gonna be happy to do his job and part ways in the offseason if that’s how things go. Of course everyone will be ecstatic if he really gets things firing on all cylinders and we have a barn burner year and he stays around too

For an off-ramp from Vlade/Luke this is as good as we can have hoped for. If Vivek was being mercurial about firing Walton over the offseason, then the front office “managed up” in the best possible way. Brought in a GSW tied pro assistant, sat pat and waited for Vivek to pull the trigger himself, slid in Gentry with zero drama. We have professionals in charge at every level without going thru an insane leakfest to get here.
 
#45
Metu a better spacer than Bagley? I mean his shot looks better, but as far as going in? It's pretty close and I'd say maybe even a downgrade.

It All depends on where you think our cap is. If we're going to miss the playoffs again, at least let's get somethin for our players. Bagley the only one who can build his trading value on this team. Everyone else is who we think they are
Yeah, so far in terms of efficiency they are both not great but he's a better spacer in the sense that he knows his role. He's always hovering outside and in the right spot. Bagley mainly got used at the corner, Metu would space everywhere around the horn which outside of his refusal to shoot open jumpers and/or miss easy ones, he is better at attempting to create the most space possible.
 
#46
I see George Karl is calling the Gentry move a good one while simultaneously calling for Vivek to sell the team.

On a team so incompetent and completely horrible for years, I still think taking a risk is in order and would MUCH prefer giving Christie or BJax a shot at coach, both I think would do better than Gentry. Gentry is pretty mediocre at best IMHO, however mediocre is far better coaching than the Kings have had in years. We'll see...
 
#47
I don’t understand why I keep seeing this take over and over again. We all know it is embalanced and has its weaknesses but there is legitimate talent on this roster:

-one of the fastest PGs in the league and best at getting to the bucket
-one of the best volume 3 point shooters in the league
-one of the most efficient bigs in the league
-Barnes is an excellent well-rounded player, the type of starter you don’t question or have serious concerns about
-Davion has the potential to be one of the best guard defenders in the league
-Tyrese, like Barnes, is a solid contributor and, current struggles aside, is great at facilitating and should be used as an x-factor to help glue together some mismatched talent

You build around the first three components / players. You have ingredients with the next three players that help fill the gaps and can compliment the strongest pieces of the roster. This isn’t ever going to be a contending team but it’s nowhere near G-league, the fact it’s looked that way is on Walton being totally unable to make anything out of the top 6 dudes work


As for Gentry, his background with the Suns and Warriors is the top-line in terms of coaching fit. For this roster to work you need tons of movement and speed. You look for open 3s for Buddy and Halliburton, open lanes for Davion and Fox, and action moving towards the basket with Holmes. We know that works but it’s never been a team philosophy to make those the first and last pieces the offense is based around. I expect Gentry to move us in that direction

MOST IMPORTANT I think we are gonna see a big change in culture. For a long time it’s been widely known that the Kings haven’t had a functional professional culture. From the Cousins years and Karl with constant backstabbing and preferential treatment for stars, something that continued thru Vlade’s tenure with organizational mismanagement and firing Joerger to replace him with a go-along get-along coach who’s selling point was that he’s easy going and players like him. Gentry is professional and well-respected (as a coach rather than a sycophant). He’s been an interim head coach many times (Hollinger called him the GOAT interim head coach which is both funny and weirdly necessary). He will put in a professional culture and do his job, I don’t think there’s gonna be any drama with him and I assume he knows why he’s here. Woj tweet that contractually he’s got the job this year and can compete for next says he knew the deal coming in, and I have no doubt he’s gonna be happy to do his job and part ways in the offseason if that’s how things go. Of course everyone will be ecstatic if he really gets things firing on all cylinders and we have a barn burner year and he stays around too

For an off-ramp from Vlade/Luke this is as good as we can have hoped for. If Vivek was being mercurial about firing Walton over the offseason, then the front office “managed up” in the best possible way. Brought in a GSW tied pro assistant, sat pat and waited for Vivek to pull the trigger himself, slid in Gentry with zero drama. We have professionals in charge at every level without going thru an insane leakfest to get here.
I agree, and as I've said many times, gimmicks can work. Will they get you rings? Probably not, well, outside of the Pistons defensive gimmick team in '04, clearly not, but they'll get you a spin at the wheel if good enough. And with where the Kings are at, beggars can't be choosers. The question now is if Gentry, being a Luke pick, is just another step in this franchises inability to create a clean slate. Everything Bobby Jackson did in summer league fits the main rosters needs to a T. If Gentry goes with pressure man to man on defense, and as you said, keeping the middle open and attacking, then this team can get back on track if they aren't totally out mentally at this point. Gentry being the pick is good in one sense, we'll know if this season is toast pretty quick, and I'd put mediocre .500 basketball at toast level. Serious toast considering that means another pick in that 10-12 range. Not good enough to trade for anything, and hoping someone drops again that doesn't play PG. lol.
 
#48
Yeah, so far in terms of efficiency they are both not great but he's a better spacer in the sense that he knows his role. He's always hovering outside and in the right spot. Bagley mainly got used at the corner, Metu would space everywhere around the horn which outside of his refusal to shoot open jumpers and/or miss easy ones, he is better at attempting to create the most space possible.
Ok I just think Bagley is better than metu, call me crazy
 
#49
I think we will see the difference between a average coach and a bad one in the next 20 games.. then hopefully we will see the difference between a average coach and a good coach in the offseason
 
#50
Ok I just think Bagley is better than metu, call me crazy
Overall for sure. I 100% agree, but they squashed the potential out of Bagley years ago at this point. The moment they ran all the pick and roll for Holmes and stuck their number 2 pick in the corner, LITERALLY, haha, it was done. Metu is a role player. He went through the Spurs system. He's going to be better as a role player.
 
#51
I think we are thinking too hard on it. Play your best players. The roles will make themselves. We keep forcing roles and trying to create stars instead of playing basketball. That's why we never get any surprise talents like other teams. And stop getting cute. If we have such talent at guard, then our bench should kill there's correct? Why force them into the starting line up. Let them kill the 2nd string.
 
#52
Great. Nothing personally against Gentry, but yet another recycled, mediocre, hasn't done anything particularly well, hamster on the wheel coach for the Kings. Nothing's going to change. What a waste of a potential opportunity to better themselves. A "change" for the sake of the same old absolutely nothing. SMDH
This is silliness. Fans have every right to be frustrated with the Kings organization, and for a variety of reasons, but naming Alvin Gentry the interim head coach after firing Luke Walton mid-season should not be among them.

Be angry instead at McNair and Vivek for not firing Walton at the end of last season so they could conduct a full-scale head coaching search during the off-season. Such a search would prove pointless right now, as any head coach thrust into this kind of situation is not being put in a position to succeed (including the unproven ex-Kings that many seem to want piloting this sinking ship during what would be their rookie season as head coach o_O).

Gentry will be just fine as the interim guy, then McNair can start up a proper search for a head coach in the off-season. Better late than never, and all that.
 
#53
I think we are thinking too hard on it. Play your best players. The roles will make themselves. We keep forcing roles and trying to create stars instead of playing basketball. That's why we never get any surprise talents like other teams. And stop getting cute. If we have such talent at guard, then our bench should kill there's correct? Why force them into the starting line up. Let them kill the 2nd string.
We aren't though, to Lukes credit he tried every configuration possible. So in his own demise has come a conclusion to most possible hypotheses in the way of rotation configuration. The team is flawed and the league is flawed. If you can't shoot, switch on defense, or rely on versatility period good luck. Now, if they are OK with sacrificing need for building talent value, then maybe they can get something positive out of it regardless. If wins come in the process then great. Trying to find balance with an imbalanced roster, in an imbalanced league where a lot of SF's find time at C, is a worthless waste of time if you are attempting to actually be competitive in the interim.
 
#54
I agree, and as I've said many times, gimmicks can work. Will they get you rings? Probably not, well, outside of the Pistons defensive gimmick team in '04, clearly not, but they'll get you a spin at the wheel if good enough. And with where the Kings are at, beggars can't be choosers. The question now is if Gentry, being a Luke pick, is just another step in this franchises inability to create a clean slate. Everything Bobby Jackson did in summer league fits the main rosters needs to a T. If Gentry goes with pressure man to man on defense, and as you said, keeping the middle open and attacking, then this team can get back on track if they aren't totally out mentally at this point. Gentry being the pick is good in one sense, we'll know if this season is toast pretty quick, and I'd put mediocre .500 basketball at toast level. Serious toast considering that means another pick in that 10-12 range. Not good enough to trade for anything, and hoping someone drops again that doesn't play PG. lol.
I wouldn’t call it “gimmicks.” It’s good fundamentals and game plans that need to be developed. Building habits and discipline in terms of how the offense runs specifically. The fact that there’s limited depth on the team, and that certain players have exploitable weaknesses (Fox’s shooting and defense, Buddy’s playmaking and also defense, Davion’s shooting etc) doesn’t mean that building a system to maximize the certain elite strengths this roster have is a gimmick. It just means there’s not enough pieces *yet,* but that doesn’t mean you blow things up, it means you build a system that makes our current pieces work, and keep an eye out for how to fill the gaps - whether that comes from the draft, organic improvement, or free agency. And free agency *would* come into play if it was clear that our team was playing well but needed one big piece to get over the top

I get why so many fans are wary of ending up on the “treadmill” but the days of tanking and stocking up on elite talent are long gone. Lotto reform makes that an inherently unreliable path, to the point where giving up talent to get a high pick is almost always a losing bet. Houston last year had a 48% chance of landing the number 5 pick. They had a *60%* chance of landing outside the top 3. Just look at the chart from last year. No matter how much you tank you’re still looking at a coin flip at best just to get a top 3 pick. Tanking as a legit rebuilding strategy is dead, and it’s time fans stop talking like it still is
 

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#55
I wouldn’t call it “gimmicks.” It’s good fundamentals and game plans that need to be developed. Building habits and discipline in terms of how the offense runs specifically. The fact that there’s limited depth on the team, and that certain players have exploitable weaknesses (Fox’s shooting and defense, Buddy’s playmaking and also defense, Davion’s shooting etc) doesn’t mean that building a system to maximize the certain elite strengths this roster have is a gimmick. It just means there’s not enough pieces *yet,* but that doesn’t mean you blow things up, it means you build a system that makes our current pieces work, and keep an eye out for how to fill the gaps - whether that comes from the draft, organic improvement, or free agency. And free agency *would* come into play if it was clear that our team was playing well but needed one big piece to get over the top

I get why so many fans are wary of ending up on the “treadmill” but the days of tanking and stocking up on elite talent are long gone. Lotto reform makes that an inherently unreliable path, to the point where giving up talent to get a high pick is almost always a losing bet. Houston last year had a 48% chance of landing the number 5 pick. They had a *60%* chance of landing outside the top 3. Just look at the chart from last year. No matter how much you tank you’re still looking at a coin flip at best just to get a top 3 pick. Tanking as a legit rebuilding strategy is dead, and it’s time fans stop talking like it still is
Being a 4 guard team is a gimmick, it just is, but I agree with the concepts you're talking about. I mean sweet jeebuz, Monte answered the questions of drafting Davion with something along the lines of he can guard some PF's. Good, lets see it. I mean, Vlade got roasted for saying Bagley can play SF, but this is OK? lol. A 4 guard unit team is not as bad as when Don Nelson did it, but heck, he got the record for being the first 8th seed team to beat number 1 seed IIRC doing it.

And that's true about tanking but the higher the pick you have, the more trade options you have as well. Teams are pretty consistent right now in terms of what they want for stars. A high pick to start, and a plethora of options down the road.
 
#56
I would suggest the first thing he do is go back to rotation that was at least sort of working at the start of the year. Then hopefully he is an improvement on Luke’s in game coaching and adjustments, although something tells me he was probably contributing to some of the issues. We shall see and I’ll give him a fair chance.
 
#57
I would suggest the first thing he do is go back to rotation that was at least sort of working at the start of the year. Then hopefully he is an improvement on Luke’s in game coaching and adjustments, although something tells me he was probably contributing to some of the issues. We shall see and I’ll give him a fair chance.
Yeah, I mean is the assumption that Luke took no advice from his staff here? Really? That's why I think going BoJax was a good call considering in summer league he ran Lukes system. Lost games. Ditched it. Won a summer league title. After literally reinstating it in the championship game in the 1st quarter, which they ended up losing BTW. I mean, are these FO people paying ANY attention here? They make millions and are this incompetent? Wow.

Fair shake? Yes. Short leash? Yep. And unfortunately they've given themselves no leeway with a move like this because if winning doesn't commence the only other change is short sales on their core pieces.