Ailene Voisin: Bottom line: With Webber, Kings mattered more

[Padrino]

It's nothing to smirk at, and he may deservedly make the All-Star team, but you have a very liberal definition of Superstar if you'd put Webber in that category, particularly given how much of a liability he is defensively and how much he struggles to create his own shot.

steve nash is a defensive liability. is the reigning mvp of the nba not a superstar?

 

[nbrans]

steve nash is a defensive liability. is the reigning mvp of the nba not a superstar?

When the Sixers win 60 games, let's talk.

 

[Padrino]

Here are Pau Gasol's numbers: 19.6 pts, 9.4 rebs, 4.2 asts, .6 stls, 2.3 blks. He ranks 13th in efficiency. Plus he's better on defense and the Grizzlies have a better record than the Sixers. Is he a Superstar too?

You also might add "All-NBA Defense" to Garnett's statline and look again to see how he and Webber compare.

i'd say yes, gasol has the potential to be a superstar. his career numbers aren't nearly as good as webb's, but this season he's starting to step up, offensively and defensively.

my point in the garnett comparison is that they are both aging, and webb's had a major injury and major surgery, but he manages to only be a step behind garnett, still. i just don't think it's fair to write off webb when he's still performing at a very very high level--the level of a superstar--amidst a controversial trade and a new system.

 

[Padrino]

When the Sixers win 60 games, let's talk.

phoenix proved that their number of regular season wins was irrelevant when they got tore up by san antonio in the western conference finals.

 

[nbrans]

i'd say yes, gasol has the potential to be a superstar. his career numbers aren't nearly as good as webb's, but this season he's starting to step up, offensively and defensively.

my point in the garnett comparison is that they are both aging, and webb's had a major injury and major surgery, but he manages to only be a step behind garnett, still. i just don't think it's fair to write off webb when he's still performing at a very very high level--the level of a superstar--amidst a controversial trade and a new system.

Well, if Pau Gasol is a Superstar then you just have a loose definition of Superstar that encompasses about 25-30 people in the league. Which is fine, but if the term can encompass that many players it doesn't mean all that much.

And I'm sorry, the Garnett comparison is outlandish. Garnett happens to be one of the best defensive players in the league, matches up against his opponent's best front court player no matter the position and still does everything Webber does on offense. I really don't think you're helping your cause with that comparison.

 

[Padrino]

Well, if Pau Gasol is a Superstar then you just have a loose definition of Superstar that encompasses about 25-30 people in the league. Which is fine, but if the term can encompass that many players it doesn't mean all that much.

And I'm sorry, the Garnett comparison is outlandish. Garnett happens to be one of the best defensive players in the league, matches up against his opponent's best front court player no matter the position and still does everything Webber does on offense. I really don't think you're helping your cause with that comparison.

i didn't say gasol was a superstar. i said he had the potential to be a superstar. webber's been a superstar for a lotta years in the nba, and i don't think the injury has set him back so much that people can write him off as one of the best in the league at his position. the garnett comparison is not that outlandish, either. if webber's lost a coupla steps because of the injury, garnett has lost one simply with age, wear, and tear. he's not dominating either side of the ball like he did in his mvp seasons, but no one is saying he's not a superstar anymore. i don't think you can judge this as simply as you are. players age, and this includes superstars. players get injured, and this includes superstars. but it doesn't always affect the impact that they have on the game. that impact is what separates them from people putting up the same numbers. nobody's ever gonna call shareef a superstar, cuz he has no impact on the game. imo, as long as webb stays healthy, he's a superstar. i'm gonna leave it at that, knowing that we have resolved nothing in the last half hour, cuz it's my lunchbreak. peace.

 

[KP]

Well, if Pau Gasol is a Superstar then you just have a loose definition of Superstar that encompasses about 25-30 people in the league. Which is fine, but if the term can encompass that many players it doesn't mean all that much.

And I'm sorry, the Garnett comparison is outlandish. Garnett happens to be one of the best defensive players in the league, matches up against his opponent's best front court player no matter the position and still does everything Webber does on offense. I really don't think you're helping your cause with that comparison.

Webber just Destroyed Garnett(both Defensively and Offensively) what... like a few weeks ago? Again, you simply don't watch Philly enough, and you have absolutely no idea what is going on with that team. Pay more attention to the NBA night in and night out and especially Webber if you are going to set yourself up as such an expert on his game(or lack thereof) and you might help your own causes a little bit.

 

[nbrans]

Webber just Destroyed Garnett(both Defensively and Offensively) what... like a few weeks ago? Again, you simply don't watch Philly enough, and you have absolutely no idea what is going on with that team. Pay more attention to the NBA night in and night out and especially Webber if you are going to set yourself up as such an expert on his game(or lack thereof) and you might help your own causes a little bit.

So... Shareef got the best of Garnett, does that mean he's a superstar too?

Webb had a great game against Garnett. That doesn't mean he's the same class of player as Garnett night in and night out.

You would help your cause if you weren't blinded by your deep-seated love of Webber.

 

[KP]

So... Shareef got the best of Garnett, does that mean he's a superstar too?

Webb had a great game against Garnett. That doesn't mean he's the same class of player as Garnett night in and night out.

You would help your cause if you weren't blinded by your deep-seated love of Webber.

You are blinded by your deap seated hatred. Reef got the best of Garnett?? When? On Dec 13 Reef posted 19 and a measely 2 rebs, Garnett was off offensively but still got got a double double 11-10, that one could be called a draw at best.. but what really impressed me was Reefs 6 pts and 4 rebs in over 30 min dec 5... that must be the game you are talking about right? Hmmm...There must have been some other time Reef dropped 27 and 21 on him and stopped him defensively at least 3 times at key game winning moments right? Do you even think before you write this stuff? Get your facts straight. Not only does Webb have the career numbers and accomplishments, he has those night in and night out numbers you are craving (this year), plus he has the head to head too. You obviously didn't watch that game either.

 

[nbrans]

You are blinded by your deap seated hatred. Reef got the best of Garnett?? When? On Dec 13 Reef posted 19 and a measely 2 rebs, Garnett was off offensively but still got got a double double 11-10, that one could be called a draw at best.. but what really impressed me was Reefs 6 pts and 4 rebs in over 30 min dec 5... that must be the game you are talking about right? Hmmm...There must have been some other time Reef dropped 27 and 21 on him and stopped him defensively at least 3 times at key game winning moments right? Do you even think before you write this stuff? Get your facts straight. Not only does Webb have the career numbers and accomplishments, he has those night in and night out numbers you are craving (this year), plus he has the head to head too. You obviously didn't watch that game either.

I don't hate Webber, I really like Webber and I was sorry to see him go even if I felt it was necessary. I'm just one of the few people around here who makes a distinction between pre-injury and post-injury Webber. You act like he's the same guy, and I'm sorry, he's not. He's a shell. That was a great game Webber put out there and great for him, but the fact is that Webber is one of the worst defensive power forwards in the league, is not getting his team beyond .500, and is shooting a measly 43% to get his 19 points. Shoot, even Allen Iverson is shooting a higher percentage than Webber. Webber's an All-Star, I'm happy that he's getting points and rebounds, but if you think he's in the same class as Garnett or Brand or Nowitzki you're deluding yourself.

 

[KP]

I don't hate Webber, I really like Webber and I was sorry to see him go even if I felt it was necessary. I'm just one of the few people around here who makes a distinction between pre-injury and post-injury Webber. You act like he's the same guy, and I'm sorry, he's not. He's a shell. That was a great game Webber put out there and great for him, but the fact is that Webber is one of the worst defensive power forwards in the league, is not getting his team beyond .500, and is shooting a measly 43% to get his 19 points. Shoot, even Allen Iverson is shooting a higher percentage than Webber. Webber's an All-Star, I'm happy that he's getting points and rebounds, but if you think he's in the same class as Garnett or Brand or Nowitzki you're deluding yourself.

He's not the same guy and I have said that many times. But he isn't even close to being a shell, thats why people dispute you here because you can't seem to back off those kind of statements no matter how well C-Webb plays this year. And he's still better than any player on our team... yes, even Reef . Back to the previous post...Not even one comment on Reefs numbers from those games when your point was completely disproven? Just change the subject huh? That's a shocker... . It was so nice after that Sixers/Kings game the other night.. not a peep for a while... but I knew it couldn't last. You're back with a vengence. Entertaining though.

 

[nbrans]

He's not the same guy and I have said that many times. But he isn't even close to being a shell, thats why people dispute you here because you can't seem to back off those kind of statements no matter how well C-Webb plays this year. And he's still better than any player on our team... yes, even Reef . Back to the previous post...Not even one comment on Reefs numbers from those games when your point was completely disproven? Just change the subject huh? That's a shocker... . It was so nice after that Sixers/Kings game the other night.. not a peep for a while... but I knew it couldn't last. You're back with a vengence. Entertaining though.

Reef got the best of Garnett in one game. Webber got the best of Garnett in one game. That doesn't mean that either player is better than Garnett or in the same class as Garnett. I thought that was clear enough, but apparently you need things repeated.

 

[KP]

Reef got the best of Garnett in one game. Webber got the best of Garnett in one game. That doesn't mean that either player is better than Garnett or in the same class as Garnett. I thought that was clear enough, but apparently you need things repeated.

2 rebs. What a performance! Webber single handidly won that game and Dominated Garnett. if you watched it, you would know that. Reef has to grab more than 2 rebs in a game before he can claim that he got the best of any PF that got 10 in the same.

 

[love_them_kings]

I don't hate Webber, I really like Webber and I was sorry to see him go even if I felt it was necessary. I'm just one of the few people around here who makes a distinction between pre-injury and post-injury Webber. You act like he's the same guy, and I'm sorry, he's not. He's a shell. That was a great game Webber put out there and great for him, but the fact is that Webber is one of the worst defensive power forwards in the league, is not getting his team beyond .500, and is shooting a measly 43% to get his 19 points. Shoot, even Allen Iverson is shooting a higher percentage than Webber. Webber's an All-Star, I'm happy that he's getting points and rebounds, but if you think he's in the same class as Garnett or Brand or Nowitzki you're deluding yourself.

yeah, Webb isn't what he was. And never will be preinjury Webb. But, a shell???? Okay, a shell. A shell that is performing better than any of our current players. A "shell" that is contributing 20-10 night in, night out. That has great basketball smarts, great hands, and passion for the game. Hmm... that's the kind of "shell" the Kings could use just about now.

 

[love_them_kings]

Judging from Philly's win/loss record this year compared to last, doesn't look like it did them much good either.

Honestly, I could care less how the Sixers are doing, and it makes me laugh that people try to justify this trade by saying that the Sixers aren't any better than last year. Who cares about the sixers?! The trade hurt the KINGS. We are no where near the team this year that we were last year. We lack identity, purpose,and oh yeah, a winning record. So, even if you want to say that the Sixers broke even in the trade, then we still lost.