Maloofs Remain Stubborn

T

The Hammer

All-Star
#61
#61
Wow. This thread got... interesting.

Interesting story... random people in bars in Seattle now believe the Kings are staying. Was just out and had a drink and was chatting with a guy and started talking basketball, fantasy, playoffs. To test him I said so you know about the Kings and how they are moving right? (myself already of the belief that they will stay)... and he goes... oh but I thought they were staying? (!!!) I go when did you hear that? He goes today, on tv. Must have been espn or something, but the point is that the fact that average joe sports fan in a bar in seattle (bellevue) already believes the Kings are staying is pretty much a clear sign that they are. Stern's comments directly have created this. Stern knows the power of his words in the media.
 
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Gary

Gary

All-Star
#63
#63
Glenn said:
That's from 2006. Not sure how that applies now. Now the area, and not the Maloofs, have to come up with a plan to build an arena by March 2012. I am interested mostly in how this is going to happen and not that cluster **** that occurred back then. Everyone was behaving badly back then.
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We were discussing what had happened in the past when the Maloofs, and the city tried to cooperate on building an arena.. Both sides were pretty retarded, but the Maloofs were as much to blame with their outrageous demands that they own the arena that would have been built mostly by taxpayer money.
 
fansinceday1

fansinceday1

Starter
#66
#66
Gary said:
We were discussing what had happened in the past when the Maloofs, and the city tried to cooperate on building an arena.. Both sides were pretty retarded, but the Maloofs were as much to blame with their outrageous demands that they own the arena that would have been built mostly by taxpayer money.
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Exactly. I remember the maloofs coming in out of the blue and demanding a huge monstrosity of a parking garage right next tO the new arena. The maloofs did not want to give up the money they earned at the current arco but the design did not call for a lot of parking to be built in the railyards.

The whole point of the new arena was to encourage mass transit and walking to and from the game. People milling around meant the surrounding restaurants and bars would be full. Didnt the maloofs also demand that there be a certain area around the arena that could not have resaurants cause it would eat i to their concessions?
 
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Gary

Gary

All-Star
#67
#67
fansinceday1 said:
Exactly. I remember the maloofs coming in out of the blue and demanding a huge monstrosity of a parking garage right next tO the new arena. The maloofs did not want to give up the money they earned at the current arco but the design did not call for a lot of parking to be built in the railyards.

The whole point of the new arena was to encourage mass transit and walking to and from the game. People milling around meant the surrounding restaurants and bars would be full. Didnt the maloofs also demand that there be a certain area around the arena that could not have resaurants cause it would eat i to their concessions?
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Yah I would have to go back and research a little, but I remember some pretty outrageous demands that were just stupid on the Maloofs part.
 
Jim Les

Jim Les

G-League
#68
#68
fansinceday1 said:
Exactly. I remember the maloofs coming in out of the blue and demanding a huge monstrosity of a parking garage right next tO the new arena. The maloofs did not want to give up the money they earned at the current arco but the design did not call for a lot of parking to be built in the railyards.

The whole point of the new arena was to encourage mass transit and walking to and from the game. People milling around meant the surrounding restaurants and bars would be full. Didnt the maloofs also demand that there be a certain area around the arena that could not have resaurants cause it would eat i to their concessions?
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And this is exactly why beggars can't be choosers. If the Maloofs wanted a huge parking garage and isolation, then they need to buy the requisite land and pay for the damn thing themselves. If, however, the public is expected to foot 75% of the bill, then the public needs to design a building that is in the best interest of the city, which is one that would actually increase urban density and promote walk-ability and public transportation. They don't get to have it both ways, and if they don't sell the team, I can see this same argument being rehashed for another (possibly short) NBA season. Hopefully KJ will just get an arena done on his own terms without any input by the Maloofs, and then offer the Maloofs to be tenants instead of letting them own the arena outright. Even if they refuse, it will be awfully hard for them to leave town with the approval of other owners if there is a brand-spanking-new arena ready for use.

Sac may have gotten another year, (which is great) but that's just more time for this thing to get really nasty.
 
Section 101

Section 101

All-Star
#69
#69
Jim Les said:
And this is exactly why beggars can't be choosers. If the Maloofs wanted a huge parking garage and isolation, then they need to buy the requisite land and pay for the damn thing themselves. If, however, the public is expected to foot 75% of the bill, then the public needs to design a building that is in the best interest of the city, which is one that would actually increase urban density and promote walk-ability and public transportation. They don't get to have it both ways, and if they don't sell the team, I can see this same argument being rehashed for another (possibly short) NBA season. Hopefully KJ will just get an arena done on his own terms without any input by the Maloofs, and then offer the Maloofs to be tenants instead of letting them own the arena outright. Even if they refuse, it will be awfully hard for them to leave town with the approval of other owners if there is a brand-spanking-new arena ready for use.

Sac may have gotten another year, (which is great) but that's just more time for this thing to get really nasty.
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The maloofs will not own the arena. They would be the management group running the arena.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#70
#70
Jim Les said:
And this is exactly why beggars can't be choosers. If the Maloofs wanted a huge parking garage and isolation, then they need to buy the requisite land and pay for the damn thing themselves. If, however, the public is expected to foot 75% of the bill, then the public needs to design a building that is in the best interest of the city, which is one that would actually increase urban density and promote walk-ability and public transportation. They don't get to have it both ways, and if they don't sell the team, I can see this same argument being rehashed for another (possibly short) NBA season. Hopefully KJ will just get an arena done on his own terms without any input by the Maloofs, and then offer the Maloofs to be tenants instead of letting them own the arena outright. Even if they refuse, it will be awfully hard for them to leave town with the approval of other owners if there is a brand-spanking-new arena ready for use.

Sac may have gotten another year, (which is great) but that's just more time for this thing to get really nasty.
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The Maloofs put all their cards on the table with the move to Anaheim. It was a dumb move on their part because now they have no negotiating power to go after a bunch of concessions that they didn't need in Anaheim. If Sacramento builds the arena with ICON and Burkle and whatever other private money they can raise they will pretty much be dictating terms at this point.
 
Bricklayer

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#71
#71
pdxKingsFan said:
The Maloofs put all their cards on the table with the move to Anaheim. It was a dumb move on their part because now they have no negotiating power to go after a bunch of concessions that they didn't need in Anaheim. If Sacramento builds the arena with ICON and Burkle and whatever other private money they can raise they will pretty much be dictating terms at this point.
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Partially -- but the NBA still has the axe poised over Sacto's neck. The new arena has to come timely and be up to NBA standards, or its still adios. And many of the Maloofs demands were pretty much NBA standard, or would be necessary for any NBA owner owning a team in Sac.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#72
#72
Bricklayer said:
Partially -- but the NBA still has the axe poised over Sacto's neck. The new arena has to come timely and be up to NBA standards, or its still adios. And many of the Maloofs demands were pretty much NBA standard, or would be necessary for any NBA owner owning a team in Sac.
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Yeah but they gave up parking, a big chunk of luxury box/suite revenue, operational revenue plus other standard concessions in the Anaheim deal. I think they will get most of that back, but they lost that chip which would make getting a cut of local business revenue inside a new entertainment district or other controversial demands most certainly off the table and they'll probably forfeit a higher percentage of the cut for non-NBA events than they would have if they had gone in as willing partners.

The onus is still on Sac to produce an NBA ready arena but you have to figure if we get that far the city could throw the exact terms from the Anaheim deal in their face and the NBA would compel them to sign it.
 
Glenn

Glenn

Hall of Famer
#73
#73
Is there any evidence that the negotiating that began in 2006 is simply going to be continued in 2011-12? It sounds like that is the assumption. Anti-trust laws will prohibit the NBA from compelling the Maloofs to sign any agreement. It has even been mentioned by the mayor's office and someone else just in passing yesterday that a strict interpretation of the law would allow the team to move and the NBA couldn't stop them just as what happened with the Clippers when they moved from San Diego to LA without the authorization of the league.

This isn't to say that the league has no power as it could vote to contract or punish the Maloofs in order for them to stay in the organization. At least that's what happened to the Clippers or something similar. I don't think it will go that far but businesses in this country have a right to go wherever they wish.
 
Section 101

Section 101

All-Star
#74
#74
Glenn said:
Is there any evidence that the negotiating that began in 2006 is simply going to be continued in 2011-12? It sounds like that is the assumption. Anti-trust laws will prohibit the NBA from compelling the Maloofs to sign any agreement. It has even been mentioned by the mayor's office and someone else just in passing yesterday that a strict interpretation of the law would allow the team to move and the NBA couldn't stop them just as what happened with the Clippers when they moved from San Diego to LA without the authorization of the league.

This isn't to say that the league has no power as it could vote to contract or punish the Maloofs in order for them to stay in the organization. At least that's what happened to the Clippers or something similar. I don't think it will go that far but businesses in this country have a right to go wherever they wish.
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And this is where the local state politicians can jump in and make things miserable for Anaheim if goes that direction. Start taking away some state funds and see how they react.
 
T

The Hammer

All-Star
#75
#75
Glenn said:

This isn't to say that the league has no power as it could vote to contract or punish the Maloofs in order for them to stay in the organization. At least that's what happened to the Clippers or something similar. I don't think it will go that far but businesses in this country have a right to go wherever they wish.
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And this is where I think the League can leverage power. Just assess an astronomical relo fee.

I also know how frachise agreements usually work... if the NBA is anything like other franchise operations. There is undoubtedly a franshise agreement in place in which all this stuff is clearly written out... hence I don't think "anti-trust" laws would apply. They are ALWAYS written in favor of the parent organization in every way possible.

If I want to move my GNC to a better market... there are all kinds of rules that apply. Now perhaps in the case of the Clippers there were other factors that led to the NBA not enacting any power they may have had to prevent the move... who knows really. I can't imagine that all these details aren't extremely clearly spelled out in the franchise agreement between League and Team. How much of those have made it into public knowledge... we don't know. It's all still a private business and no obligations to reveal the details of the franchise agreement exist, as far as I know.

I do know GNC owners who basically break the franshise agreement rules (not really in regards to relocation), but GNC looks the other way because they are so successful...
 
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rainmaker

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#76
#76
Glenn said:
Is there any evidence that the negotiating that began in 2006 is simply going to be continued in 2011-12? It sounds like that is the assumption. Anti-trust laws will prohibit the NBA from compelling the Maloofs to sign any agreement. It has even been mentioned by the mayor's office and someone else just in passing yesterday that a strict interpretation of the law would allow the team to move and the NBA couldn't stop them just as what happened with the Clippers when they moved from San Diego to LA without the authorization of the league.

This isn't to say that the league has no power as it could vote to contract or punish the Maloofs in order for them to stay in the organization. At least that's what happened to the Clippers or something similar. I don't think it will go that far but businesses in this country have a right to go wherever they wish.
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As Hammer said, one thing they do control is the relocation fee, which can make it financially impossible to move. Stern has a reputation of being a nightmare to work with if you cross him.
 
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