Prospect watch 2011

[bajaden]

Baja, could you speak a bit more on Terrance Jones? Just from reading scouting reports on the different draft sites, he seems like he could be an ideal fit for us if we wind up in the 3-6 range and he's available. He's typically described as a good defender who can also shoot the NBA 3 and create a bit. Though his dribbling skills seem to be more straight line than a true shot creator. On our team though with Cousins and Reke, that sounds like a pretty favorable description for our needs.

What are your thoughts from watching him? Is that an accurate assessment? Could he play 2 or 3?

I like T. Jones a lot, and I like him better than P. Jones. Now having said that, I'm basing my opinion on what I"ve seen with my own eyes. Both players are very skilled. The main difference is in their attitude and approach to the game. T. Jones plays with an attitude similar to Casspi, and P. Jones plays with and attitude similar to Greene. I'm only talking about attitude on the court here, not talent. But you asked me about Terrence.

T. Jones is a 6'9" SF with an NBA body, terrific athleticism and long arms. He's an explosive leaper, and is a natural shotblocker, a rare commodity from a SF. At the college level he shows tremendous potential as a defender. He has quick feet and great basketball IQ. Both on defense and offense. He handles the ball very well for a 6'9" player, and has a little shake and bake to his game, which sometimes gets him into trouble. He see's the floor well and is a very good passer, san's his previous PG experience. Although, he'll be a SF at the next level, at times he plays down on the block for Kentucky, and has a decent post game. I could see him posting up some of the SF's in the NBA in the future. He's very strong, and is a good rebounder. He has a decent to good mid-range game. Which includes a nice little turn around jumper from the top of the key. He's a very physcial player, and loves to use his physical attributes on his opponets. Works well in college, won't work as well in the NBA.

His weakness is his jumpshot. He brings the ball up directly in front of his face and has a shooting motion that has his wrist following his arm, instead of his wrist leading the shot. Which makes it look like a shot put type of shot, or that he's almost pushing the ball toward the basket instead of shooting the ball. Despite that, he's a lot more accurate than one would think, and was actually shooting around 38% from beyond the arc for a good portion of the year. He's also very emotional on the court. Aka DeMarcus Cousins. He plays with such intensity, that it sometimes gets the better of him. So he's had a few run in's with the ref's and with Calapari. But there's no denying his talent. If he had a solid jumpshot, I think he would be the number one pick in the draft. At worse, number 2. And he may well be number 2 when the smoke clears anyway.

He's not without flaws. But there isn't a player in any draft that doesn't have flaws. When Michael Jordan was drafted he couldn't shoot a lick from outside and I think he turned out just fine. Jordan's first couple of years in the NBA his 3pt percentage was under 20%. Its rare to find a player with Jones size, that can handle the ball and pass the ball like he can, and plays with such intensity and confidence. And busts his butt at both ends of the floor. As you can see, I like him a lot. My top three players right now are Irving, T. Jones, and D. Williams. Doesn't mean I don't like others as well. But I think any of these three would be a very good fit on the Kings.

 

[hrdboild]

Hmmm! Douby > Walker! A bit of a stretch me thinks.. Douby, who was picked around # 22 or so, and was a SG at Rutgers, does not compare to Walker who will probably be picked in the top ten and is a player with PG skills and instincts, even if he chooses not to use them from time to time. There is only one catagory that Douby excelled over Walker. He was 2 inches taller.

Walker's proven himself against much better competition so I don't think it's a very good comparison either, but it was a funny comment. I hated that pick at the time and I hate it even more now. And Walker does scare me a little bit because he's had some games where he takes 20+ shots to score 20 points. I don't think he's a chucker -- his team needs him to be an aggressive scorer this year. But he's a lottery pick primarily based on his scoring and that's maybe not the best backcourt player to team up with Tyreke. I like Walker a lot and I wouldn't hesitate to draft him with a mid first round pick -- but in the high lottery I'm afraid that pick might not work out all that well for us. In any case, there's at least 6 or 7 guys I would pick over him if given the chance.

 

[bajaden]

Watched the Texas/Texas A&M game last night. Huge rivalry game. Texas had already beaten A&M on Texas homecourt. As a matter of fact Texas trounced them. So needless to say A&M was loaded for bear, plus Texas hadn't beaten A&M on their homecourt in a long time. So the stage was set for a classic matchup. Unfortunately for Texas A&M it was a flashback to both teams earlier game this year..

Texas came out and jumped all over A&M. The game was over at halftime with Texas having a plus 20 pt lead. Final score, Texas 69, Texas A&M 49. And it wasn't that close. Very impressive win for Texas and on the road to boot. And against a very good Texas A&M team. I have both Ohio St. and Texas in my final 4 right now. Both teams play tough defense, and both have very well balanced offenses. They can hurt you both inside and outside.

Josh Hamilton, a 6'7" SG/SF, had a very nice game on both ends of the floor for Texas. His defensive assignment was Kris Middleton, another 6'7" SG/Sf. Middleton, who is one of A&M's leading scorers was held to 0 pts and was 0 for 9 from the floor. His defensive assignment was Josh Hamilton, who almost fouled Middleton out of the game with 4 fouls, and who scored 20 pts on 7 of 14 shooting, to go along with 6 rebounds, 3 assists, and 2 blocked shots. Hamilton won the battle of SF's on this night.

Tristan Thompson, a 6'8" freshman PF did what he was suspossed to do. He partroled the paint for 3 blocked shots and added 10 pts to go with 5 boards. Thompson is an interesting prospect. They list him at 6'8", but I swear he has to be taller than that. He seems to tower above everyone else. He certainly plays taller than 6'8". He has very long arms and has great timing on his blocked shots. He's very rough around the edges, but he has a lot of potential.

Texas has another player that I really like and thats J'Covan Brown, a 6'1" sophmore that comes off the bench as the backup PG. He has a sort of smaller version of Bonzi Wells in appearence. Different game of course. What I mean is that when you just judge him by appearence, you wouldn't think he was quick, but you'd be wrong. He'll be coasting along and then suddenly turn on the after burners and drive to the basket.

I really like this kid. I think he's very talented. He has a little too much razzle dazzle to his game, and it gets him in trouble at times. But this is a kid that can eventually play in the NBA.. He tried a behind the back pass last night on a fase break that turned into a turnover. Coach immediately benched him and let him cool for a while. Brown was visibly upset at being pulled from the game. But it was a lesson he needed to learn. 5 minutes later, he was back on the floor.

 

[bajaden]

Those interested in seeing Terrence Jones play, Kentucky is on ESPNU at 4 PM today. I believe that Baylor and Perry Jones is on ESPN 2 at the same time.. Enjoy!!

 

[hrdboild]

Also Harrison Barnes and North Carolina play at 6pm today on ESPN3 so you can watch it online, or at least the first hour before the Kings game starts anyway.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

I like T. Jones a lot, and I like him better than P. Jones. Now having said that, I'm basing my opinion on what I"ve seen with my own eyes. Both players are very skilled. The main difference is in their attitude and approach to the game. T. Jones plays with an attitude similar to Casspi, and P. Jones plays with and attitude similar to Greene. I'm only talking about attitude on the court here, not talent. But you asked me about Terrence.

T. Jones is a 6'9" SF with an NBA body, terrific athleticism and long arms. He's an explosive leaper, and is a natural shotblocker, a rare commodity from a SF. At the college level he shows tremendous potential as a defender. He has quick feet and great basketball IQ. Both on defense and offense. He handles the ball very well for a 6'9" player, and has a little shake and bake to his game, which sometimes gets him into trouble. He see's the floor well and is a very good passer, san's his previous PG experience. Although, he'll be a SF at the next level, at times he plays down on the block for Kentucky, and has a decent post game. I could see him posting up some of the SF's in the NBA in the future. He's very strong, and is a good rebounder. He has a decent to good mid-range game. Which includes a nice little turn around jumper from the top of the key. He's a very physcial player, and loves to use his physical attributes on his opponets. Works well in college, won't work as well in the NBA.

His weakness is his jumpshot. He brings the ball up directly in front of his face and has a shooting motion that has his wrist following his arm, instead of his wrist leading the shot. Which makes it look like a shot put type of shot, or that he's almost pushing the ball toward the basket instead of shooting the ball. Despite that, he's a lot more accurate than one would think, and was actually shooting around 38% from beyond the arc for a good portion of the year. He's also very emotional on the court. Aka DeMarcus Cousins. He plays with such intensity, that it sometimes gets the better of him. So he's had a few run in's with the ref's and with Calapari. But there's no denying his talent. If he had a solid jumpshot, I think he would be the number one pick in the draft. At worse, number 2. And he may well be number 2 when the smoke clears anyway.

He's not without flaws. But there isn't a player in any draft that doesn't have flaws. When Michael Jordan was drafted he couldn't shoot a lick from outside and I think he turned out just fine. Jordan's first couple of years in the NBA his 3pt percentage was under 20%. Its rare to find a player with Jones size, that can handle the ball and pass the ball like he can, and plays with such intensity and confidence. And busts his butt at both ends of the floor. As you can see, I like him a lot. My top three players right now are Irving, T. Jones, and D. Williams. Doesn't mean I don't like others as well. But I think any of these three would be a very good fit on the Kings.

Thanks for the write up. Really sounds good for us. It's still really early, but as of now, he's my #2 behind Irving as well.

 

[Kingster]

I like T. Jones a lot, and I like him better than P. Jones. Now having said that, I'm basing my opinion on what I"ve seen with my own eyes. Both players are very skilled. The main difference is in their attitude and approach to the game. T. Jones plays with an attitude similar to Casspi, and P. Jones plays with and attitude similar to Greene. I'm only talking about attitude on the court here, not talent. But you asked me about Terrence.

T. Jones is a 6'9" SF with an NBA body, terrific athleticism and long arms. He's an explosive leaper, and is a natural shotblocker, a rare commodity from a SF. At the college level he shows tremendous potential as a defender. He has quick feet and great basketball IQ. Both on defense and offense. He handles the ball very well for a 6'9" player, and has a little shake and bake to his game, which sometimes gets him into trouble. He see's the floor well and is a very good passer, san's his previous PG experience. Although, he'll be a SF at the next level, at times he plays down on the block for Kentucky, and has a decent post game. I could see him posting up some of the SF's in the NBA in the future. He's very strong, and is a good rebounder. He has a decent to good mid-range game. Which includes a nice little turn around jumper from the top of the key. He's a very physcial player, and loves to use his physical attributes on his opponets. Works well in college, won't work as well in the NBA.

His weakness is his jumpshot. He brings the ball up directly in front of his face and has a shooting motion that has his wrist following his arm, instead of his wrist leading the shot. Which makes it look like a shot put type of shot, or that he's almost pushing the ball toward the basket instead of shooting the ball. Despite that, he's a lot more accurate than one would think, and was actually shooting around 38% from beyond the arc for a good portion of the year. He's also very emotional on the court. Aka DeMarcus Cousins. He plays with such intensity, that it sometimes gets the better of him. So he's had a few run in's with the ref's and with Calapari. But there's no denying his talent. If he had a solid jumpshot, I think he would be the number one pick in the draft. At worse, number 2. And he may well be number 2 when the smoke clears anyway.

He's not without flaws. But there isn't a player in any draft that doesn't have flaws. When Michael Jordan was drafted he couldn't shoot a lick from outside and I think he turned out just fine. Jordan's first couple of years in the NBA his 3pt percentage was under 20%. Its rare to find a player with Jones size, that can handle the ball and pass the ball like he can, and plays with such intensity and confidence. And busts his butt at both ends of the floor. As you can see, I like him a lot. My top three players right now are Irving, T. Jones, and D. Williams. Doesn't mean I don't like others as well. But I think any of these three would be a very good fit on the Kings.

I've seen enough of T. Jones to say that he's an overated athelte, and I wouldn't want him in the top 5. He's not fluid, and he plays below the rim with his offensive game. In that aspect, he reminds me somewhat of Greene, who was also hyped as a great athlete, but gets his shot blocked on drives because he doesn't elevate on the drive. T. Jones coordination is not off the charts either. He is a pretty good rebounder and pretty good defensively, but he's going to have issues getting his own shot in the NBA.

 

[TTown Kings]

I've seen enough of T. Jones to say that he's an overated athelte, and I wouldn't want him in the top 5. He's not fluid, and he plays below the rim with his offensive game. In that aspect, he reminds me somewhat of Greene, who was also hyped as a great athlete, but gets his shot blocked on drives because he doesn't elevate on the drive. T. Jones coordination is not off the charts either. He is a pretty good rebounder and pretty good defensively, but he's going to have issues getting his own shot in the NBA.

I tend to agree with this assessment. I've watched him a few times now and really want to like him as he is one of the players being talked about as high lottery that has actually had good production in college (unlike P Jones, Barnes, etc.). I kind of seem him as a 4 in a NBA 3's body if that makes sense. He doesn't seem to have the quickness and athleticism of NBA 3s and he's too small to be a 4. Pretty much a tweener in every sense of the word.

With all that being said, he reminds me a little of Michael Beasley who is doing just fine these days.

 

[bajaden]

I tend to agree with this assessment. I've watched him a few times now and really want to like him as he is one of the players being talked about as high lottery that has actually had good production in college (unlike P Jones, Barnes, etc.). I kind of seem him as a 4 in a NBA 3's body if that makes sense. He doesn't seem to have the quickness and athleticism of NBA 3s and he's too small to be a 4. Pretty much a tweener in every sense of the word.

With all that being said, he reminds me a little of Michael Beasley who is doing just fine these days.

If either one of you don't think that Jones isn't athletic, or can't jump, then I just don't know what to say. I had people tell me these exact same things about Blake Griffin in his freshman year. Now if you ask me if he's prefect, then no. He has some rough edges, and one of them is that he grew 6 inches in a very short period of time, and he's still trying to play like he's 6'3". Could he be another Donte Greene? Sure! But I don't think so. And the reason I don't think so is because of his attitude. I've watched him play 9 times now. And he's had some very bad games, and he's had some very good games.

He's not my top choice, so I'm not going to spend a lot of time defending him. If you asked me who has the most talent between T. Jones and P. Jones, I'd say P. Jones. My problem with P. Jones is that he doesn't show up every night and play hard. There's a long way to go before the draft, and who I like now and who I'll like then might be two entirely different things.

 

[bajaden]

By the way, in last nights game I didn't think Jones had one of his better games. But I think you also have to look at results. He got off to a rough start, but in the end he had 22 points on 7 of 15 shooting to go along with 12 rebounds and 4 blocked shots. In the end, its about results. P. Jones might look fluid and pretty, but too often he doesn't get the results he should.

Kingster, I know your a big fan of K. Walker. And as a matter of fact, so am I. But if one had tuned into tonights game and had never seen him play before, he would have come away wondering what the hell we liked about him. He had 8 pt's on 3 of 14 shooting and was 1 for 6 from behind the arc. Now because I've seen him play 8 or 9 times already, I know the dude is a better player than he showed tonight.

Were talking about potential here. And thats how you have to judge these guys, along with any and all tangibles you can find. I mean come on Kingster, last year you basicly told me that Cousins sucked at this time of the year.

 

[Big Cuz 15]

i haven't seen t. jones play but i fear he's gonna end up like terrence williams, earl clark ball park. a talented forward just doesn't translate to nba

 

[kingsboi]

Can somebody fill me in on what makes Derrick Williams such an interesting prospect? I've been hearing his name here and there, just haven't seen him play. What are his strengths? Weaknesses? NBA position? Any information would be greatly appreciated!

 

[hrdboild]

Can somebody fill me in on what makes Derrick Williams such an interesting prospect? I've been hearing his name here and there, just haven't seen him play. What are his strengths? Weaknesses? NBA position? Any information would be greatly appreciated!

I've only seen him play a few times, but my take on Derrick Williams is that he's an incredibly talented scorer who seems to posses an uncanny feel for the game. What I mean by that is that I can't recall ever seeing him make a mistake on the court. He's one of those guys that just seems to always be in the right spot at the right time. He's also a very explosive leaper and he takes defenders off the dribble with surprising ease considering he played center for Arizona last year and was still considered mostly a post player before this season. He actually reminds me a bit of Russell Westbrook in college the way he's just on another level athletically than everyone else out there.

He's currently shooting a ridiculous 70% on three pointers (with 1.5 attempts per game) and the way he shoots them -- quickly and in rhyhtm -- suggests to me that he could be a very good three point shooter from NBA range in a couple years as well. Oh and he leads the NCAA in free throw attempts per game right now. That's a pretty impressive scoring resume he's putting together this year and when you see him play it's not hard to picture him being a star in the NBA.

As for weaknesses -- he hasn't been a big force on defense this year, solid but not impressive in any way, and his rebounding numbers have fallen off the past couple games. He's been hit and miss in that department which I guess isn't that uncommon for guys who average a lot of offensive boards. And the numbers say that as good as he is at creating his own shot, he's almost just as bad at setting up his teammates (his assist to turnover ratio is really ugly). I can't speak much to that because like I said, I don't recall seeing him make mistakes out there. Maybe someone else can elaborate on the turnover problems.

So there's some questions about him as a prospect just like everyone else -- but if you're looking for a finisher, he's got elite talent. Probably at the SF position I think but he's got the skills (if not the ideal size) to handle PF too.

 

[bajaden]

I've only seen him play a few times, but my take on Derrick Williams is that he's an incredibly talented scorer who seems to posses an uncanny feel for the game. What I mean by that is that I can't recall ever seeing him make a mistake on the court. He's one of those guys that just seems to always be in the right spot at the right time. He's also a very explosive leaper and he takes defenders off the dribble with surprising ease considering he played center for Arizona last year and was still considered mostly a post player before this season. He actually reminds me a bit of Russell Westbrook in college the way he's just on another level athletically than everyone else out there.

He's currently shooting a ridiculous 70% on three pointers (with 1.5 attempts per game) and the way he shoots them -- quickly and in rhyhtm -- suggests to me that he could be a very good three point shooter from NBA range in a couple years as well. Oh and he leads the NCAA in free throw attempts per game right now. That's a pretty impressive scoring resume he's putting together this year and when you see him play it's not hard to picture him being a star in the NBA.

As for weaknesses -- he hasn't been a big force on defense this year, solid but not impressive in any way, and his rebounding numbers have fallen off the past couple games. He's been hit and miss in that department which I guess isn't that uncommon for guys who average a lot of offensive boards. And the numbers say that as good as he is at creating his own shot, he's almost just as bad at setting up his teammates (his assist to turnover ratio is really ugly). I can't speak much to that because like I said, I don't recall seeing him make mistakes out there. Maybe someone else can elaborate on the turnover problems.

So there's some questions about him as a prospect just like everyone else -- but if you're looking for a finisher, he's got elite talent. Probably at the SF position I think but he's got the skills (if not the ideal size) to handle PF too.

To be honest with you, I don't think he has a turnover problem. He attracts a lot of attention from the other team and operates near the basket more than away from it. As a result he has a lot of hands reaching in and batting at the ball. Thus the turnovers. I like Williams a lot, and think he may be one of the best all around players in the draft. I'd like to add that if you get frustrated by the refing in the NBA, then you'll love the ref's in college. Defensively teams are allowed to get away with things in college on a regular basis that will be called a foul in the NBA. Part of the reason players coming out of college get into foul trouble in the NBA. Also remember that players get to live in the paint in college. Not so in the NBA. As a result, some players are better almost immediately in the NBA than they were in college, because of more open lanes with which to operate in. And some players suffer defensively, because they're not allowed to just stand under the basket and goaltend. Think Thabeet.

As far as Williams defense is concerned. I think the only thing you can really judge a player in college on is what his capabilities are. If he's a good athlete and has quick feet, and has a good work ethic, then you have to assume that he can be a good defender at the next level. Personally I put lateral quickness above foot speed, and the two shouldn't be confused. For instance, Chris Webber was a terrific athlete, but he had lousy lateral quickness, and as a result his defense suffered when confronted with a very quick PF. But Webb made up for it with smarts.

I'll say it over and over again. Its rare for players coming out of college to be good defensive players, and when they are, they're usually one trick pony's. Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Issiah Thomas, Kobe Bryant, etc., wern't drafted for their defense. They all became good defenders. I think its fine to look at the long range potential of a player as a defender, but if your going to base your drafting him on that one thing, your not going to have many players on your draft list.

 

[bajaden]

i haven't seen t. jones play but i fear he's gonna end up like terrence williams, earl clark ball park. a talented forward just doesn't translate to nba

No offense intended, but if you haven't seen him play, what are you basing your fears on? I'm missing the logic there. By the way, Earl Clark was, is, a very talented player, with a pee poor attitude, and bad work ethic. If someong ever lights a fire under him, he'll be a good player. I see no resemblence in that fashion with T. Jones. If anything, Jones gets himself into trouble by thinking he can just impose his will athleticly instead just using his skills. Thats my main frustration with him. If your 6'8"/6'9", I don't care how athletic your are. You don't drive into a double team waiting for you under the basket and expect to just dunk the ball. To his credit, he never stops attacking, and never seems to lose his confidence. Is he a sure thing? No! But neither most of the 18 and 19 years olds.

 

[hrdboild]

I'll say it over and over again. Its rare for players coming out of college to be good defensive players, and when they are, they're usually one trick pony's. Michael Jordan, Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, Issiah Thomas, Kobe Bryant, etc., wern't drafted for their defense. They all became good defenders. I think its fine to look at the long range potential of a player as a defender, but if your going to base your drafting him on that one thing, your not going to have many players on your draft list.

Yeah, that's true. And anyway, of the top 10 or so prospects this year I'd put Williams in the top half of them defensively. He's about on par with most other college players as a defender right now and his athleticism and basketball IQ give him an advantage going forward.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

i haven't seen t. jones play but i fear he's gonna end up like terrence williams, earl clark ball park. a talented forward just doesn't translate to nba

I think Baja touched on this, but both guys on the list are immensely talented players with very bad attitudes. It's their off the court characteristics holding them back. It's alsio why both of them weren't being touted as highly as Jones. Williams is more skilled and Clark is more athletic, but they really aren't comparable to Jones.

 

[Kingster]

I've only seen him play a few times, but my take on Derrick Williams is that he's an incredibly talented scorer who seems to posses an uncanny feel for the game. What I mean by that is that I can't recall ever seeing him make a mistake on the court. He's one of those guys that just seems to always be in the right spot at the right time. He's also a very explosive leaper and he takes defenders off the dribble with surprising ease considering he played center for Arizona last year and was still considered mostly a post player before this season. He actually reminds me a bit of Russell Westbrook in college the way he's just on another level athletically than everyone else out there.

He's currently shooting a ridiculous 70% on three pointers (with 1.5 attempts per game) and the way he shoots them -- quickly and in rhyhtm -- suggests to me that he could be a very good three point shooter from NBA range in a couple years as well. Oh and he leads the NCAA in free throw attempts per game right now. That's a pretty impressive scoring resume he's putting together this year and when you see him play it's not hard to picture him being a star in the NBA.

As for weaknesses -- he hasn't been a big force on defense this year, solid but not impressive in any way, and his rebounding numbers have fallen off the past couple games. He's been hit and miss in that department which I guess isn't that uncommon for guys who average a lot of offensive boards. And the numbers say that as good as he is at creating his own shot, he's almost just as bad at setting up his teammates (his assist to turnover ratio is really ugly). I can't speak much to that because like I said, I don't recall seeing him make mistakes out there. Maybe someone else can elaborate on the turnover problems.

So there's some questions about him as a prospect just like everyone else -- but if you're looking for a finisher, he's got elite talent. Probably at the SF position I think but he's got the skills (if not the ideal size) to handle PF too.

And let me add a few things. The guy is a foul magnet. I think he goes to the foul line an average of 11 times a game or thereabouts. He's very strong, deceptively so because he's not built like a Cousins or Shaq or someone like that. His strength and excellent balance allow him to finish extremely well under the basket. He's athletic enough to do a reverse pivot on the move; you don't see that everyday from a guy his size. He's diversified: he can play outside or inside, depending on the matchup. He handles the ball pretty darned well from what I've seen. He's not really the silky smooth forward type like Pearce was in his early years or maybe DeRozan; he's more of a power guy. Character-wise he's supposed to be AAA. Looks to be a hard worker. Makes an obvious impact in every game he plays, even when his teamates don't throw the ball to him enough. There's no reason he can't be a good defensive player down the line. I really don't think it matters what position he plays. He's going to make his presence felt regardless.

 

[kingsboi]

So pretty much based on the little I read so far, is he more of a NATURAL scorer and will give you 20+ a game or is he a rhythm scorer and just takes what the defense gives him and give you a quiet 20 point game? Plus his no defensive ability frightens me a bit, we lack a defender from the SF position so having a defender there would be ideal.

 

[tevans13]

i haven't seen t. jones play but i fear he's gonna end up like terrence williams, earl clark ball park. a talented forward just doesn't translate to nba

Earl Clark wasn't nearly as productive as Terrance Jones is in college.

 

[hrdboild]

So pretty much based on the little I read so far, is he more of a NATURAL scorer and will give you 20+ a game or is he a rhythm scorer and just takes what the defense gives him and give you a quiet 20 point game? Plus his no defensive ability frightens me a bit, we lack a defender from the SF position so having a defender there would be ideal.

I'm not quite sure I understand the difference. 20 points is 20 points is it not? He can score in so many ways that he can quite easily take over a game (and has done so regularly this season) simply by taking what the defense will give him. I also didn't mean to characterize him as having "no defense" if that's what you got from my writeup. He's not an exceptional shot-blocker but he's a solid team defender with good awareness of where his teammates are and where he needs to be. I don't think he's stood out for his defense particularly, but as bajaden pointed out -- few top players do at the college level. And he is leading his team to wins.

 

[kingsboi]

I'm not quite sure I understand the difference. 20 points is 20 points is it not? He can score in so many ways that he can quite easily take over a game (and has done so regularly this season) simply by taking what the defense will give him. I also didn't mean to characterize him as having "no defense" if that's what you got from my writeup. He's not an exceptional shot-blocker but he's a solid team defender with good awareness of where his teammates are and where he needs to be. I don't think he's stood out for his defense particularly, but as bajaden pointed out -- few top players do at the college level. And he is leading his team to wins.

20 points is 20 points but there is a quiet 20 points where he gets it in the flow of the offense and theres 20 points where he just jacks up shots. All in all, I like that he leads his team to wins, that means he is a competitor and has a great desire to lead his team to victory. I probably won't watch him play until the tournament or maybe one of these days if I have time to catch a Arizona game I might tune in and check him out.

 

[bajaden]

20 points is 20 points but there is a quiet 20 points where he gets it in the flow of the offense and theres 20 points where he just jacks up shots. All in all, I like that he leads his team to wins, that means he is a competitor and has a great desire to lead his team to victory. I probably won't watch him play until the tournament or maybe one of these days if I have time to catch a Arizona game I might tune in and check him out.

Considering that Williams is shooting 63.4% overall from the floor, and 68.6% from beyond the arc, I'd hardly say he just jacking up shots. If he were, he'd be averaging over 40 pt's a game. He's a very smart player that seldoms forces things and has very high basketball IQ. To be honest, you'd be hard pressed to find another player in the draft thats a better all around player, that also has as much potential as Williams. I'm more impressed everytime I see him play. Last night he had 21 pt's on 8 of 14 shooting. He also grabbed 8 boards.

The more I watch him, I'm starting to believe he can play SF full time, as oppossed to being a stretch 4 like Jeff Green. He's a very good athlete, and he fools you because he has the body of someone that can play PF. He does spend the bulk of his time closer to the basket than away from it, but if you watch him enough, and note his reactions, he has very good reflex action, and can move very quickly when he has to. Someone commented on his turnovers possibly being a problem. He's only averaging slightly over 2 turnovers a game. And he averaging slightly over 2 fouls a game. So at least at the college level, neither are a problem. I really like him and now have him at number 2 on my list. Unfortunately, I think the NBA scouts are moving him up their lists as well.

 

[Kingster]

Considering that Williams is shooting 63.4% overall from the floor, and 68.6% from beyond the arc, I'd hardly say he just jacking up shots. If he were, he'd be averaging over 40 pt's a game. He's a very smart player that seldoms forces things and has very high basketball IQ. To be honest, you'd be hard pressed to find another player in the draft thats a better all around player, that also has as much potential as Williams. I'm more impressed everytime I see him play. Last night he had 21 pt's on 8 of 14 shooting. He also grabbed 8 boards.

The more I watch him, I'm starting to believe he can play SF full time, as oppossed to being a stretch 4 like Jeff Green. He's a very good athlete, and he fools you because he has the body of someone that can play PF. He does spend the bulk of his time closer to the basket than away from it, but if you watch him enough, and note his reactions, he has very good reflex action, and can move very quickly when he has to. Someone commented on his turnovers possibly being a problem. He's only averaging slightly over 2 turnovers a game. And he averaging slightly over 2 fouls a game. So at least at the college level, neither are a problem. I really like him and now have him at number 2 on my list. Unfortunately, I think the NBA scouts are moving him up their lists as well.

I have him #1 on my list. I just hope the Jones's stay above him with the scouts. He's not getting the pub like the midwest and east coast guys. Fine by me. I highly doubt Petrie would pass on this guy.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

The more I watch him, I'm starting to believe he can play SF full time, as oppossed to being a stretch 4 like Jeff Green. He's a very good athlete, and he fools you because he has the body of someone that can play PF. He does spend the bulk of his time closer to the basket than away from it, but if you watch him enough, and note his reactions, he has very good reflex action, and can move very quickly when he has to.

I think you don't need to look any farther than Carmelo Anthony to find a 6'8" 240 guy who is effective as a wing player. I don't know whether there's a great similarity there in style of play or not, as I haven't seen Williams much, but he can shoot it, he can really climb the ladder, and he seems to be quick and to know where to be on the floor. I'm beginning to like him a lot.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

I like Derrick Williams, should be a top 3 pick, and should be in the mix for #2 with Jared Sullinger. I still like Kyrie Irving as the #1 overall, even though he's barely played, but I think he can really be special because he was that good in the 8 games or so he's played. Hopefully shades of Chris Paul, even looks like him.

Perry Jones is starting to slip in my rankings--he just hasn't brought it that often....he's physically intriguing, but he has the hope he doesn't go through a Chris Taft-like slide in the draft if he keeps this up. He probably won't, since he doesn't have many conditioning/attitude problems, but with his tendency to waver it's hard to put a definite number on his draft spot.

I'm pretty high on guys like DJ Kennedy, who I've talked about earlier this thread, and Damian Saunders--a 6'8" physical freak, senior out of Duquesne. His defense is extremely superior and I can see him as some sort of stopper who can garner steals, blocks and even rebounds out of the small forward position. More athletic Mbah a Moute hopefully. Have him as the first pick out of the 2nd round, and I know he's very low on people's radar right now. Milan Macvan, Chandler Parsons and Charles Jenkins out of Hofstra IMO are good mid-2nd round pickups. Shelvin Mack and Aaric Murray I'm also quite high on here--Murray isn't an aesthetically pleasing player in terms of fluidity and athleticism, but he gets it down and really has some natural shooting touch. Mack seems ordinary at first glance but I like his composure, if he finds the right team that can use composed scoring he can produce late 1st round type results.

I'd suggest that these freshmen could use another year of school at this point, unless they explode from this point onwards: Brandon Knight, Harrison Barnes, Cory Joseph. I'm not sure if Travis Leslie and Donatas Motiejunas can find respective niches in the NBA, for all their potential and talent. I'm higher on Markieff Morris than his brother Marcus--in fact, if this draft is loaded with guys who want to enter before the new CBA kicks in, I think Marcus might really drop to even a mid-2nd round pick actually. He just seems so ordinary, and frankly, similar to Drew Gooden, and Gooden's the quintessential journeyman. Markieff at least brings some defensive punch to the table and has improved his offensive game drastically. Rodney Williams and Maalik Wayns are two sophomores who can use another year, as can Mason Plumlee--a big disappointment IMO, and if drafted in the first round might have real bust potential. Kenneth Faried has numbers that boggle the mind, but at the end of the day he doesn't have much range and plays against weak competition, and it might be Balkman 2.0 with him.

 

[bajaden]

I like Derrick Williams, should be a top 3 pick, and should be in the mix for #2 with Jared Sullinger. I still like Kyrie Irving as the #1 overall, even though he's barely played, but I think he can really be special because he was that good in the 8 games or so he's played. Hopefully shades of Chris Paul, even looks like him.

Perry Jones is starting to slip in my rankings--he just hasn't brought it that often....he's physically intriguing, but he has the hope he doesn't go through a Chris Taft-like slide in the draft if he keeps this up. He probably won't, since he doesn't have many conditioning/attitude problems, but with his tendency to waver it's hard to put a definite number on his draft spot.

I'm pretty high on guys like DJ Kennedy, who I've talked about earlier this thread, and Damian Saunders--a 6'8" physical freak, senior out of Duquesne. His defense is extremely superior and I can see him as some sort of stopper who can garner steals, blocks and even rebounds out of the small forward position. More athletic Mbah a Moute hopefully. Have him as the first pick out of the 2nd round, and I know he's very low on people's radar right now. Milan Macvan, Chandler Parsons and Charles Jenkins out of Hofstra IMO are good mid-2nd round pickups. Shelvin Mack and Aaric Murray I'm also quite high on here--Murray isn't an aesthetically pleasing player in terms of fluidity and athleticism, but he gets it down and really has some natural shooting touch. Mack seems ordinary at first glance but I like his composure, if he finds the right team that can use composed scoring he can produce late 1st round type results.

I'd suggest that these freshmen could use another year of school at this point, unless they explode from this point onwards: Brandon Knight, Harrison Barnes, Cory Joseph. I'm not sure if Travis Leslie and Donatas Motiejunas can find respective niches in the NBA, for all their potential and talent. I'm higher on Markieff Morris than his brother Marcus--in fact, if this draft is loaded with guys who want to enter before the new CBA kicks in, I think Marcus might really drop to even a mid-2nd round pick actually. He just seems so ordinary, and frankly, similar to Drew Gooden, and Gooden's the quintessential journeyman. Markieff at least brings some defensive punch to the table and has improved his offensive game drastically. Rodney Williams and Maalik Wayns are two sophomores who can use another year, as can Mason Plumlee--a big disappointment IMO, and if drafted in the first round might have real bust potential. Kenneth Faried has numbers that boggle the mind, but at the end of the day he doesn't have much range and plays against weak competition, and it might be Balkman 2.0 with him.

The only comparison between Balkman and Faried are their ponytails. Faried is taller, quicker, tougher, and better looking than Balkman. I'm with you on Perry Jones. On paper he has the most upside of any player in the draft, and, he scares me more than any player in the draft. He's an athletic freak, and is 6'11". He handles the ball like a guard and is a very good passer. He has good form on his jumpshot, and runs the floor like a deer. If you just heard that description, visions of Kevin Garnett would start springing to mind. He plays like a guy 6'7", doesn't rebound very well and fails to impact most games that he's in. But, I'm sure someone will pick him in the top five spots on potential alone.

I very interested in watching Barnes next game. He was very aggressive in the last game I saw against North Carolina St. If he starts bringing every game like he did in that game, he'll start moving up the charts again. You can see the talent he has. This may sound strange, but its almost as if he's so fundamentally sound, that he doesn't allow himself any freedom to create outside of the rigid framework of those fundamentals. Corey Joseph needs to stay in school, but I think both Barnes and Knight, although they could use another year of school, will be fine in the NBA. I think Joesph would spend a lot of time in the D-League.

I also am not a big fan of Marcus Morris. Very fundamentally sound guy, but undersized and I see him as a slightly better version of Sheldon Williams. I think Gooden is high praise. I also like his brother Markieff. Better defender, and much better rebounder. And taller. Strange how one twin can be taller than the other. Travis Leslie is a disappointment to me so far. His 3 pt shot has really fallen off a cliff this year. This was a year one expected him to break out, and instead he seems to taken a step backwards.

 

[Uncia03]

A lot of good games going on today, but I've been watching a number of older games, and will be posting my observations from them.

Colorado vs. Baylor (1/29/2011)

Baylor - Perry Jones III

Jones is going to be one of those ultimate risk/reward type of players. He's extremely long and fluid with the basketball and shows hints of what could be a major game someday in the future.
Today he was guarded by Marcus Relphorde, and in my notes I was going to mention that he was being guarded by an extremely small player who he had an obvious mis-match against. The thing is that Relphorde is a 6'7 220 lbs player, and for a SF/PF that isn't exactly puny, but with Jones being 6'10/6'11, he just makes other players look shorter and stubbier than they really are.

Jones' biggest weakness was on display in this game against Colorado. He got killed on the glass by Roberson, who is a 6'7 player. After watching a few games it's pretty clear why Jones, who only ended up with 6 rebounds, is such a bad rebounder.
Whenever a ball goes up, he always tries to block out his man. The problem is, if he doesn't have a man who is in the immediate area, he'll either move himself out of position for the rebound to find a man to block out, or waste a precious second looking around rather than going strong for the board. This prevents him from getting rebounds which he should be able to easily get with his size and athleticism, while also allowing opposing players to get in and grab rebounds via angles not being blocked out by Jones.

Also, when he tries to block out, he really bends over at the waist to create to hedge out his man, but it makes him a whole lot shorter and decreases his ability to get the rebound.

So when he doesn't try to block out, and just goes for the ball, he's far more effective at getting to balls on the defensive glass. He ended up with 6 rebounds, 3 offensive, and 3 defensive, and it's not surprising that he has as many offensive rebounds as he does defensive, because on the offensive end he uses his length and athleticism to just go for the ball.

So I think that his rebounding issues should gradually get corrected, as he isn't a good defensive rebounder, and he should be considering his athletic talents.

Another issue that Jones has is his intensity. You watch a player like Fredette and you know that guy bleeds competitive spirit. Jones really seems to lack that fire, and it tends to make him less aggressive than he should be. I don't know if it's because he's always dominated his competition and it's always been too easy, or what the issue is, but he needs to be more intense, more aggressive in almost all aspects of his game.

It would not at all surprise me to see Jones be the best player in this draft 5 years from now. He's got a fairly smooth looking stroke, adequate passing, and all the athletic gifts that you'd ever want from a basketball player. He needs to gain a lot of strength, but he's young and I'm sure will get stronger as he matures. His game seems to be perfect for the SF position, and at 6'10/6'11 could be a walking mis-match game in and game out. But he has to become more consistent with his outside shot, develop better defensive rebounding habits, and get more intensity, otherwise he won't ever maximize his potential.
For this game, other than the rebounding it was a good game by Jones. 14 points on 6/12 shooting, had some good post moves and a couple of nice passes.

I'll watch the Baylor vs. Texas A&M game later, and see how he's progressing.

 

[Uncia03]

Georgia vs. Kentucky (1/29/2011)

Kentucky - Terrance Jones

Depending on what you were looking for in Jones, this was either a terrible game, or a decent one.. It didn't help that he picked up his 2nd foul with 10 minutes left in the 1st half and sat till the 2nd half. So he started off really slow, and had only 2 points in the 1st half.

He played for most of the 2nd half, but only picked up 5 more points for a total of 7 on the night.

Now here is what's interesting. He had the job of guarding Trey Thompkins, a legitimate forward at 6'9, 245. He did a very good job of denying Thompkins the ball, moving him from his spots, and over-all making things difficult for Thompkins. Thompkins is a very physical player who Georgia really relies on, but he ended the game with only 9 points, and a lot of that had to do with Jones' defense. Now Jones did get in early foul trouble, and that 2nd foul in the 1st half came when he allowed Thompkins to get deep post position, and then fouled him on the shot. But by and large, Jones did a good job on the defensive end, while defending a larger player.
Though Jones didn't finish with many points, he did get two buckets by taking Thompkins off the dribble and scoring at the hoop.
So from an offensive standpoint, it was really a bad game for Jones. From a defensive perspective, it was a pretty good game. Now, Jones ended the game with 7 rebounds, all on the defensive end, but 2 of them came in the last 20 seconds or so of the game, so he lost both the rebounding and scoring games against Thompkins.
Unfortunately for me, this did not do anything to settle my questions about Jones. I want to believe that he can play the SF spot, because I don't think he's quite big enough to play the PF spot. He's a really big, incredibly strong SF, but would probably be overmatched in a lot of contests if starting at PF.
So whenever I watch him, I try to see him playing the SF spot on our team, and whether or not he can convince me that he has the skills will determine how high I’m going to have him personally ranked.
He had three nice dribble takes to the basket (2 baskets & 1 foul), but he didn't display an outside shot, which was available if he'd wanted it against Thompkins.
So I'll just have to continue to watch games to see if he can convince me that he could come in next year and be a starter for our Kings team. I think he's got a ton of talent and fantastic athleticism (especially strength for a SF), I just don't know what position will be his best, and whether it would help a need for our team.

Kentucky - Brandon Knight

Knight plays a lot of minutes for this Kentucky team and in this game he played the full 40. He had a decent game, but nothing truly spectacular. He played good defense against Roberson who is a quick guard, keeping Robinson from penetrating a good portion of the time.
He wasn’t very efficient from the 3pt line shooting 2 of 7, and two of those misses were on rushed shots that he shouldn’t have taken. He does a good job of getting the ball moving up in transition and will make the open pass when a team.
He had a very nice take into the lane, using a low-quick dribble to split the double for a hoop, but for the most part he was content to keep the ball moving, and shooting when he had the shot.

 

[Uncia03]

Missouri at Texas (1/29/2011)

Texas – Jordan Hamilton

Hamilton had a very good game in this one. As much as I like watching him have a good game, it’s all through the eyes of seeing if he can play the SG position for our team, and that usually means playing defense against SGs.

In this game he was matched up against Kim English a 6’6 guard who is one of Georgia’s better players. Hamilton did get beat off the dribble two or three times during the game, allowing English an easy lane to the hoop, but he also played some solid defense, keeping in front of English, or forcing tough shots.

Hamilton did very well on the boards, and it has been one of his most impressive traits this year. He isn’t a freak athlete or incredibly strong, but he is constantly around the basket when a shot goes up. He doesn’t leak out, but rather moves into position for the defensive board, and he tries to take good angles to the basket on the offensive end. He ended up with 13 rebounds for the game.

His most impressive trait has been his shooting. He didn’t do very well from the 3pt line, hitting only 2 of 7, but he ended his day shooting 7 of 15 for 16 points.

He is really good moving with-out the ball. He flashes into the lane looking for the pass and has a nice pull-up jumper which goes in more times than not. He uses screens really well, and he doesn’t try to force a shot if there isn’t one available.

He showed good passing in this one, making nice entry passes to post players, and finding the one man while using his dribble to find passing lanes. He ended the day with 5assists, and most of those were from him making the smart pass to a player with good positioning.

It was one of the better games I’ve seen from Hamilton, and I felt better about seeing him at the SG position after this one then before having watched the game. There really are not a lot of SG prospects in this year’s draft, but Hamilton is beginning to show that he might be one of the best ones out there.


Texas at Texas A&M (1/31/2011)

Texas – Jordan Hamilton

I'm bummed but I can't find my notes on this game.
But Jordan Hamilton was very, very good in this one. He ended up with 20 points on 7/14 shooting and 6 rebounds. He was asked to guard Khris Middleton, and Middleton ended up going 0-9 with 0 points in the game. Hamilton played really good defense at times, but the rotations by Texas were superb, and really helped when Middleton was able to get past Hamilton.

Hamilton was just really smooth out there, moving with-out the ball, getting open shots from the baseline and middle of the screen with a nice pull-up.

His rebounding was down, but his performance in this one keeps him in the running as one of my top SG candidates for this draft.