Blazers talking to Kings?

[whozit]

Sac out:
B. Miller
K Thomas
J Salmons
Q Douby

Sac In:
R LaFrentz
S Marion
Portland 1st

Miami out:
S Marion
M Banks

Miami In
B Miller
K Thomas

Portland Out
R Lafrentz
Future 1st

Portland In
J Salmons
Q Douby
M Banks

Similiar to yours:

Sacramento Out:

Brad Miller
Kenny Thomas
Sheldon Williams
Mikki Moore
John Salmons

Sacramento In:

R Lafrenz
Channing Frye
Shawn Marion
Portland 1st

Miami Out:

Marcus Banks
Shawn Marion

Miami In:

Brad Miller
Kenny Thomas
Marcus Banks

Portland Out:

R Lafrenz
Channing Frye
Ist round pick

Portland In:

Marcus Banks
Mikki Moore
John Salmons

Trade ID #4953327

 

[Showtime]

http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=11350

The Kings May Have A Deal: The Sacramento Kings may be closing in a trade, but it does not look like it's the long-rumored Brad Miller deal that's going to get done first. The Kings are rumored to have had some conversations that would send John Salmons to Portland in a deal that will likely return Raef LaFrentz and a future draft pick, according to sources close to the discussions. It's possible the Kings could send Mikki Moore in the deal, although the Kings would surely want to include Kenny Thomas. The additional players needed for the deal to work under the cap could not be confirmed by either side. The Blazers have been shopping out the ending $12 million contract of Raef LaFrentz that is now covered by insurance, making Raef an absolutely free player that clears a ton of cap space in July. The Kings are still evaluating their options, and the LaFrentz deal is said to be one of several that they are looking at before the deadline. King's GM Geoff Petrie told reporters that he was looking at a lot of options and was trying to keep an open mind, hinting that nothing has been decided yet.
"You have to be open to just about anything at this point," King's GM Geoff Petrie said to Sam Amick of the Sacramento Bee. "What form that might take, I don't know yet, but certainly I think you have to have a very, very open mind about what type of things you might consider and what immediate impact it might have – at least in some facet of what you're trying to do."

"The magnitude of our decline is troubling on a lot of fronts," Petrie said. "And for nobody more than me. We didn't show much in exhibition. We didn't see much in the first 25 games, and I think a big part of the rest of the year is going to be, 'Do (the players) want to persevere and try and play together so the whole team plays better?'

"You have to look for some motivation to play, obviously, other than a playoff spot. So that has to be some individual improvement that fits into a team concept."

The Kings' goal is to get some significant breathing room under the NBA salary cap this summer, and go after a couple of upper tier free agents. The Kings have been shopping Brad Miller and John Salmons fairly aggressively. They have also put Kenny Thomas and Mikki Moore on the table as well. The Kings are looking for the right combination of ending contracts and future assets, preferably young players still on their rookie deals.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

Well I'd say Salmons is an upgrade over Outlaw, throw in the rights to Koponen or a pick and salaray matchers and I'd be down. Thats pretty fair for both sides.

Nope. Outlaw is better than Salmons--this is where stats deceive--Outlaw is not only five years younger, but possesses all the athletic physical tools (freak wingspan, freak athleticism, good lateral quickness) to become a very good player in this league. And combine this with ability to rack up steals and blocks (he's shown great potential with this past), his ability to get to the line (once went 17-17 from the line in a game I believe), and his very good stroke (very smooth shooter--hits threes well), and he basically possesses all the tools you want out of your small forward. At least much better than Salmons, who flares up all his weaknesses at once when he plays his style of game--scores points, but gets tunnel vision way too often resulting in wayward shooting; the guy gets his stats, but read between the lines he's playing for a bad team. He becomes much much worse when he's not a go-to guy, and he won't amount to anything if he's forced to role player minutes with a role player usage rate. Outlaw has already shown that ability--Outlaw is better. And they would be stupid to trade Outlaw for Salmons, and if it was offered the Kings should immediately jump on it.

Originally Posted by nbrans

Trevor Ariza is an unrestricted free agent.

I like Ariza but the guy is only worth MLE $$$, plus we have Martin and Garcia--again, we can surely use that athletic defensive SF foil, but Ariza's not operating under the radar anymore and I'm pretty sure the Lakers would more than certain keep him over Lamar Odom, as he's a valuable contributor for them. And unless he's got Shawn Marion syndrome (and he does not), he'd be foolish to make the leap from an elite team to a wallowing team like us where he won't even get the minutes due to our aforementioned glut. We seriously need to get players back when they are under the radar so no one knows about them--Ariza a few years back would've been nice, but the guy who is like that now is Julian Wright. If we really want that SF breed to complement our crop of players, he's the guy.

 

[nbrans]

I'd much rather have Ariza than Garcia. I think if Ariza were given a starting job he'd produce at a very high level on both offense and defense. His PER is 17.50, he's been very consistent, and he's only 23. I'd give him $7 mil., just over the MLE. Of course, with Garcia already signed up for five more years at the MLE it complicates things. Do you want those two guys signed up for $13 million?

Reason # 1,278,987,253 it was stupid to sign Garcia to that extension.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

I'd much rather have Ariza than Garcia. I think if Ariza were given a starting job he'd produce at a very high level on both offense and defense. His PER is 17.50, he's been very consistent, and he's only 23. I'd give him $7 mil., just over the MLE. Of course, with Garcia already signed up for five more years at the MLE it complicates things. Do you want those two guys signed up for $13 million?

Reason # 1,278,987,253 it was stupid to sign Garcia to that extension.

I would be very nervous signing Ariza to anything long term. My roommate is a huge Lakers fan and so I have gotten to see every game this year. No doubt that Ariza is very talented, but mark my words, he will suffer a horrific injury at some point. Every Laker fan I know agrees. Ariza plays a bit like Gerald Wallace, careeing into the lane and has just enough athleticism and hops to be dangerous to himself, expecially when you consider he is rail thin.

 

[nbrans]

I would be very nervous signing Ariza to anything long term. My roommate is a huge Lakers fan and so I have gotten to see every game this year. No doubt that Ariza is very talented, but mark my words, he will suffer a horrific injury at some point. Every Laker fan I know agrees. Ariza plays a bit like Gerald Wallace, careeing into the lane and has just enough athleticism and hops to be dangerous to himself, expecially when you consider he is rail thin.

I'd rather have a player who is a danger to himself than a player than a player who is a danger to no one.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

I'd rather have a player who is a danger to himself than a player than a player who is a danger to no one.

Two different questions I suppose, I was just saying that I would be nervous about signing Ariza long term, because the odds are he won't finish the contract. That does not mean Garcia is better than Ariza.

However, I am also a big Garcia fan. He can shoot, defend and plays hard every night and is a team player. Right now he is not the most efficient player, because we need him to extend beyond his capabilities. However, as our team improves, he can be an extremely efficient shooter who can occassionally put the ball on the floor. I still maintain the James Posey comparison for him. If Garcia were on a team like the Lakers, he would be getting much more fanfare draining open 3 after open 3 and fitting into their D.

 

[theclash4u5]

Portland trades: Raef LaFrentz, Ike Diogu, POR 1st
Portland receives: John Salmons, Mikki Moore, Marcus Banks

Sacramento trades: Brad Miller, Kenny Thomas, John Salmons, Mikki Moore
Sacramento receives: Shawn Marion, Ike Diogu, Raef LaFrentz, POR 1st

Miami trades: Shawn Marion, Marcus Banks
Miami receives: Brad Miller, Kenny Thomas

I could see all three of the teams saying yes, if Portland doesn't mind taking on Bank's contract + giving up a 1st.

 

[Arby's Roast Beef]

I'm not impressed with the Raef LaFrentz trade. Yes the $12 million expiring contract, yes the future 1st rounder, but we couldn't even pry any of the Blazers' young talent away? Salmons is not a point guard, but he gives them a legitimate wing scorer--I would think we could get at least Sergio Rodriguez out of the deal (we really need that pass-first point guard on our team). At least it's clearing space and getting picks, but it reeks similar to that of the Bibby deal (trade old for expirings/draft picks)--and that hasn't panned out yet at all.

As for Ariza, again, he's a useful player, but as you noted, Garcia's 5-year extension sort of negates getting him. We have Garcia and Martin on the books now, so even if we trade Salmons, Ariza probably would get at most the same amount of minutes as he is with the Lakers. And the aforementioned lack of Shawn Marion syndrome, the Lakers' (should be) desire to keep him--it's tough to get him. There's the slimmest of chances, but it shouldn't get to the point where we have to go above MLE for him, which we can't anyway because all of our $$$ is allotted to superstars Kenny Thomas, Shareef and Brad Miller. So it's almost a moot point here, and if you want someone of that prototype, Julian Wright is younger (only 21) and shows flashes of the same potential, yet isn't played by the Hornets. Get him instead.

 

[Vlade4GM]

Um. Sam Amick linked just linked to Hoopsworld.

Is the apocalypse nigh?

Anyway, they're saying what BayAreaKingsFan said: a possible deal that would be Salmons + filler for LaFrentz + 1st Rounder

Works for me.

Works for me too. Then ship Miller and Thomas to NY for Marbury and a future pick. I'm not sure what the earliest first rounder NY can trade, but I'll take it whenever it is. We'll have two future firsts and a ton of cap space.

 

[Vlade4GM]

We'd have to throw in either BJax, or Mikki and Douby to make it work (presumably the latter). But I don't expect a Portland pick will be very good for a while - we can totally get more for Salmons than trading expiring contracts and a late future pick. I don't imagine Portland wants to give up Bayless, but I'd rather aim high than take a lowball offer like LaFrentz and a pick in the 20s.

While Salmons is a good player, I really don't think he's the type that's going to land a better rebuilding package than a large expiring and a first round pick.

 

[Bibby.10]

Eh. I guess I wouldn't mind it, as long as we get Brad Miller out in another deal so we can be major players this upcoming offseason. I'd rather the first be next years than this years since we already have 2 this year and it's not a very deep class.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

While Salmons is a good player, I really don't think he's the type that's going to land a better rebuilding package than a large expiring and a first round pick.

I just think that Salmons has good production for his cost. If we can't get anything better than a high-20s pick for him (because Portland is going to be good for some time) then we should hold on to him. I understand that "we should hold on to Salmons" is not a popular view around here. So be it.

And remember that Petrie refused to trade Artest (to the point that we risked him walking for nothing) without getting adequate return at the deadline last year when Denver refused to include Kleiza as well as their pick. I believe Salmons will be the same story. Pick and a kid, or we keep him until the next round of trading starts.

 

[Vlade4GM]

If Salmons can't command more now (putting up the best stats of his career) then it's not going to get better as he gets a year older. It's simply unrealistic to think we can get a first rounder and a prospect for him, teams know that what Salmons does for our team isn't the same as what he's going to do for their team. So I don't see why it's ever going to get better. Was waiting to trade Artest worth it? Well, when you comapre the Denver and Houston packages straight up it was, but when you take in the aspect that losing Artest probably would've added more lins and a better draft pick. This is as high as Salmons' value is reaistically going to get, and he has no purpose in this rebuild as anything more than a trading chip.

 

[Sptsjunkie]

If Salmons can't command more now (putting up the best stats of his career) then it's not going to get better as he gets a year older. It's simply unrealistic to think we can get a first rounder and a prospect for him, teams know that what Salmons does for our team isn't the same as what he's going to do for their team. So I don't see why it's ever going to get better. Was waiting to trade Artest worth it? Well, when you comapre the Denver and Houston packages straight up it was, but when you take in the aspect that losing Artest probably would've added more lins and a better draft pick. This is as high as Salmons' value is reaistically going to get, and he has no purpose in this rebuild as anything more than a trading chip.

Yeah, I think the key difference between Salmons and Artest is that Artest was a big talent who's personality affected his trade value. However, he gained value because he was going into the final year of his contract. Salmons value is peaking now, but if his attitude continues to suffer he will lose value and his deal still has 3 years left, so he will not be an expiring contract for another two years.

 

[kingsfan101]

If Salmons can't command more now (putting up the best stats of his career) then it's not going to get better as he gets a year older.

I don't think we can get much more for Salmons. While he is certainly a productive player for his price, he has the sorry rep (largely earned) of playing much worse when coming off the bench, and/or, when he is not the focus. Plus, his contract runs through 2011, when half the league is preparing for 2010. Good as he is, he is not a star. We are unlikely to get a lot for him.

This trade does achieve a few things for us though
1. Gives us an added pick. Might not be worth much, but at least it gives some hope. Plus we might be able to combine multiple picks, to either move up the draft, or for some trade.
2. Frees up PT for Cisco, and hopefully Greene.
3. More importantly, it saves the owners some dough. Not only is John's contract off for next two years, we save 2M that would have been needed to buy out Miki. Plus, if I recall correctly, insurance pays most of Raef's salary.

Might not mean much to us as fans, but in these financial times, owners can't but like a trade that shall save them some serious cash, particularly for a team going nowhere.

 

[VF21]

It is the overall tone of what GP is saying. For example, he has to be "very open minded about what type of things you might consider and what immediate impact it might have".
Considering that he's talking about how bad the Kings are right now, I presume he's talking about a trade to bring in players which are good now. That would do absolutely nothing for us.

This part, too.



Why is it troubling? We knew it would happen. We're rebuilding (I hope) for jeez sake. If sucking through a rebuild surprises him, he's not very smart. Here he again shows the desire to win a few extra games which will only have a negative effect for the future.

Anyway, regarding the Portland trade. I'd be down for LaFrentz + 1st rounder for Salmons. Even better if we can get Koponen or Sergio off them, but not a deal-breaker. Not only do we get the chance to bring in talent in the draft, it also opens up minutes for Donte.

-

Um, are we reading the same stuff?

Sorry, but I think you're trying to read waaaaaaay too much into something. Petrie isn't in a "win now" mode by any kind of assessment you could conceivably come up. He has, in fact, repeatedly commented that he's working towards 2010.

Why do people continue to act as though Geoff Petrie is the enemy who wants the team to fail or, alternatively, continue to suck? He doesn't like this. If he pulls the trigger on a deal, it's going to be with the future in mind. If that were not true, he would never have gotten rid of Bibby or Artest.

 

[VF21]

I don't think we can get much more for Salmons. While he is certainly a productive player for his price, he has the sorry rep (largely earned) of playing much worse when coming off the bench, and/or, when he is not the focus. Plus, his contract runs through 2011, when half the league is preparing for 2010. Good as he is, he is not a star. We are unlikely to get a lot for him.

This trade does achieve a few things for us though
1. Gives us an added pick. Might not be worth much, but at least it gives some hope. Plus we might be able to combine multiple picks, to either move up the draft, or for some trade.
2. Frees up PT for Cisco, and hopefully Greene.
3. More importantly, it saves the owners some dough. Not only is John's contract off for next two years, we save 2M that would have been needed to buy out Miki. Plus, if I recall correctly, insurance pays most of Raef's salary.

Might not mean much to us as fans, but in these financial times, owners can't but like a trade that shall save them some serious cash, particularly for a team going nowhere.

Good points all and I think it's along the lines of what the FO would be hoping to accomplish.

 

[Dime Dropper]

-

Um, are we reading the same stuff?

Sorry, but I think you're trying to read waaaaaaay too much into something. Petrie isn't in a "win now" mode by any kind of assessment you could conceivably come up. He has, in fact, repeatedly commented that he's working towards 2010.

Why do people continue to act as though Geoff Petrie is the enemy who wants the team to fail or, alternatively, continue to suck? He doesn't like this. If he pulls the trigger on a deal, it's going to be with the future in mind. If that were not true, he would never have gotten rid of Bibby or Artest.

If you'd read on a few posts, you'd have seen that I agreed with stsjunkie that I was, in fact, reading too much into it. I'm just a little nervous we'll make a bad move, don't see the need to feel all defensive about it!

 

[VF21]

Ah, okay. Sorry...

 

[est.1999]

if it's a future pick and not this years and/or we don't recieve a young promising talent in return than this trade sucks major balls

 

[Bibby.10]

if it's a future pick and not this years and/or we don't recieve a young promising talent in return than this trade sucks major balls

This class sucks! I'd much rather have a high 20's pick next year then a low 20's this year.

 

[nbrans]

if it's a future pick and not this years and/or we don't recieve a young promising talent in return than this trade sucks major balls

Frankly, given how weak this draft is, I'm not sure a future draft pick would be such a bad thing.

 

[Vlade4GM]

This class sucks! I'd much rather have a high 20's pick next year then a low 20's this year.

Yeah, I'd have to agree with this.

 

[ElRey]

if it's a future pick and not this years and/or we don't recieve a young promising talent in return than this trade sucks major balls

Raef Lafrenz is no good to anybody other than his expiring contract. Portland's first round picks this year and any year in the near future is worth nothing as well since they are a top talent team now. So we'll pretty much be trading Salmons for cap space.

 

[Bibby.10]

Frankly, given how weak this draft is, I'm not sure a future draft pick would be such a bad thing.

Yeah, exactly. I'm not so sure Petire doesn't prefer the future pick rather then this years.

 

[Bibby.10]

Raef Lafrenz is no good to anybody other than his expiring contract. Portland's first round picks this year and any year in the near future is worth nothing as well since they are a top talent team now. So we'll pretty much be trading Salmons for cap space.

Worth nothing?

See Exhibit A: Kevin Martin's Draft Position

 

[ElRey]

Worth nothing?

See Exhibit A: Kevin Martin's Draft Position

Like others have said, it's a very weak draft class this year...good luck trying to find another Kevin Martin in this years draft...not impossible but very unlikely. Unless there's some player that Petrie has his eye on in Siberia that nobody knows about.

 

[Bibby.10]

Like others have said, it's a very weak draft class this year...good luck trying to find another Kevin Martin in this years draft...not impossible but very unlikely. Unless there's some player that Petrie has his eye on in Siberia that nobody knows about.

We wouldn't be getting a pick this year. It's a future pick.

 

[Kings Faithful]

I don't like this trade....i at least want to pick up a new young player to get excited about. If Bayless was involved id be down. I think we should try to make a deal with Milwaukee and try to get Sessions now that Redd is down and out.