Nene?

[nbrans]

Now that the AI trade is gone through Denver has huge salary commitments and they may be looking for relief from Nene's contract. We all know he's overpaid and that he's just coming off knee surgery, but he's big (6'11"), he's talented, he's athletic, he's young (24) and bigs like him are not available very often. He's a pretty big risk, but could be very good.

So, with that in mind:

Kenny Thomas
Jason Hart
Francisco Garcia

for

Nene
Earl Boykins
Julius Hodge

I'm not sure this would fly with Denver because it would essentially leave them without a backup center (unless you count Jamal Sampson), but it would be a way for Denver to get out from Nene's contract a bit -- Kenny's deal is cheaper and ends one year sooner. Jason Hart gives them a backup point guard who is a defensive specialist -- they're not going to need any more scorers.

If a condition of the trade is that Denver get a backup center, here's a three team variation involving Brad Miller:

Sacramento outgoing:
Brad Miller

Sacramento incoming:
Nene
Sarunas Jasikevicius

Indiana outgoing:
Jeff Foster
Shawne Williams
Sarunas Jasikevicius

Indiana incoming:
Brad Miller

Denver outgoing:
Nene
Linas Kleiza

Denver incoming:
Jeff Foster
Shawne Williams

 

[gunks]

I vote nay....

Way overpriced, injury prone, and hasnt really shown much. KT grabs more boards then him, Miller can block more shots then him. IMHO the guy is all hype no substance.

And if he doesnt work out Kings are going to be stuck with a huge contract thats JUST beginning....That would really hamper the rebuilding process.

And as someone said in another thread awhile back: Denver barely signed him and they're already trying to ditch him? Bad sign...


I say wait and go after Varejao or Darko.

 

[Smills91]

I can't think of a more overhyped played in the NBA than Nene,,,what exactly has he done in his career to garner a contract even HALF of what the Nuggz gave him. Let the Nuggz wallow in thier contract like the Knicks. The Nuggz mortgaged their future for the present...and it still won't be enough. Just say NO to Nene.

 

[Bricklayer]

I would do variation #1 instantly, but why would the Nuggets? We offer them no real cap relief, and steal talent. No chance there.

Version #2 = now I'm not really enthusiastic for us. Nene could still blossom, but at $10 mil that's a heck of a risk, and even if he does, he may very well not be much above the level Brad at least used to be at.


As an aside, Nene is a lot better than the previoius two posters think. But I just can't figure out whether he;s going to stay healthy and become a full time starter or struggle with injuries and be a 6th man. If he were earnign $5 mil a year, great gamble. $10 mil...you kind of need it to pan out.

If Denver really wanted salary relief though and wanted our enders, I'd seriously consider it. Be a lot like scoring Nene as a FA.

 

[LPKingsFan]

While I'm not exactly sold on Nene or his contract, I think nbrans's second deal exhibits an important potential strategy that shouldn't be overlooked. I think if we do look to move Brad, a deal involving the Pacers would be one of the more likely destinations. I'm not sure I want anything/anyone in particular from Indy, especially if we go all-out rebuild mode, but the potential for a three-team deal is there.

 

[nbrans]

I would do variation #1 instantly, but why would the Nuggets? We offer them no real cap relief, and steal talent. No chance there.

Version #2 = now I'm not really enthusiastic for us. Nene could still blossom, but at $10 mil that's a heck of a risk, and even if he does, he may very well not be much above the level Brad at least used to be at.


As an aside, Nene is a lot better than the previoius two posters think. But I just can't figure out whether he;s going to stay healthy and become a full time starter or struggle with injuries and be a 6th man. If he were earnign $5 mil a year, great gamble. $10 mil...you kind of need it to pan out.

If Denver really wanted salary relief though and wanted our enders, I'd seriously consider it. Be a lot like scoring Nene as a FA.

Can't disagree with your thoughts on the scenarios. And yeah, I agree that Nene is better than people are saying. The question, as you point out, is how much he's going to improve.

Here's a trade using enders that could work once Mo Taylor is available to trade in January. (Nene is BYC so these trades are tricky):

Corliss
Hart
Taylor

for

Nene
Boykins

or maybe more likely (to compensate Denver for giving up Boykins):

Corliss
Garcia
Hart

for

Nene
Boykins
Diawara

 

[thatguy]

The best scenario to acquire Nene passed yesterday.

If Philly really wanted expiring contracts, the Kings have several they could have included in that deal. Swap out Andre Miller for Corliss/Vitaly and they would have had almost $17 million coming off the books. The Kings likely would have had to part with Garcia or a pick which may have been a killer.

Plus, I think Philly might have had a hard time selling that trade to their fans.

 

[Smills91]

once again what has nene actually done in the nba to warrant even half his contract???? The guy is terrible.

 

[Bricklayer]

once again what has nene actually done in the nba to warrant even half his contract???? The guy is terrible.

I ahve no idea what your bug is with Nene, but he's hardly terrible. Never has been, never will be. And while I was a detractor after his overhyped rookie season, pointing out he neither boarded or blocked shots, in his last healthy season he had gotten much better in both those areas. Given that he came into the league at 20, may just have been a maturation thing.

 

[nbrans]

once again what has nene actually done in the nba to warrant even half his contract???? The guy is terrible.

10/6/1 block/1 steal in 23 minutes a game is nothing to sneeze at.

 

[SLAB]

10/6/1 block/1 steal in 23 minutes a game is nothing to sneeze at.

Nowhere near 60mil worth of stats.

And we think K9's contract is bad?

However Nene does have the potential to devlop, I still don't like the risk.

 

[Padrino]

nene is just the kind of risk i can see GP taking. he's young, has athleticism, and has plenty of room to improve. it'd be another steal for the kings, because the only reason the nuggets would really want to trade nene is to dump the contract in light of all the money they now have invested in so few players. that and he's injury prone. they wouldn't be looking for much more than enders, because like the posters above have said, nene hasn't really done much yet in the nba to prove he's worth his contract, so the nuggets won't get anything of realistic value in return. the first scenario proposed in this thread seems relatively likely, and i'd be happy with that trade. though, of course, i'm also not sold on nene. but when you're in rebuilding mode, and you're looking to win at some point in the not so distant future, some risks must be taken, and some luck must come your way. with nene, could be a bit of good luck...could be a bit of bad, but that's why they call it a risk.

 

[Venom]

I'm hoping the firesale starts soon, and that we start seeing trades like this. The two contracts I REALLY want to move are K9 and Miller. It would be nice to get enders back, but that's pretty doubtful, so better to role the dice on a young big like Nene.

 

[nbrans]

The best scenario to acquire Nene passed yesterday.

If Philly really wanted expiring contracts, the Kings have several they could have included in that deal. Swap out Andre Miller for Corliss/Vitaly and they would have had almost $17 million coming off the books. The Kings likely would have had to part with Garcia or a pick which may have been a killer.

Plus, I think Philly might have had a hard time selling that trade to their fans.

Actually, from the Kings' perspective, facilitating the AI trade by taking on Nene and giving Philly expirings would have made for a much, much better trade for both Denver and Philadelphia -- but why help them out?? If the Kings had played facilitator, Denver could have kept Miller, which would have made them even stronger. Philly would have gotten more expirings, which would have made them more of a player in free agency.

You have to believe Nene is still available. But now the Kings can go after Nene without over-helping two teams. Denver needs the expirings, but getting them that only gets them from a $75 million payroll to a $68-69 million payroll, it doesn't make them a better team. They still had to give up Andre Miller, weakening their roster. It's possible they might take a guy like Kenny Thomas just because it gives them a little bit of breathing room.

Now's the perfect time to pounce, not the other way around.

 

[D-Mass]

I'm in...get 'er done.

 

[thatguy]

Actually, from the Kings' perspective, facilitating the AI trade by taking on Nene and giving Philly expirings would have made for a much, much better trade for both Denver and Philadelphia -- but why help them out?? If the Kings had played facilitator, Denver could have kept Miller, which would have made them even stronger. Philly would have gotten more expirings, which would have made them more of a player in free agency.

You have to believe Nene is still available. But now the Kings can go after Nene without over-helping two teams. Denver needs the expirings, but getting them that only gets them from a $75 million payroll to a $68-69 million payroll, it doesn't make them a better team. They still had to give up Andre Miller, weakening their roster. It's possible they might take a guy like Kenny Thomas just because it gives them a little bit of breathing room.

Now's the perfect time to pounce, not the other way around.

I see things another way. You are the Denver GM and you get a call saying, 'We'll give you Kenny Thomas for Nene.' Do you not hang up the phone and have yourself one of the best belly-busting laughs you've ever had?

To make yourself better via trades sometimes require deals make sense for the other teams involved. That's why the Kings' best chance is gone. In addition, adding in a couple of Kings' expiring contracts wouldn't have made Philly a player in free agency any more so than they will be now - by my math, they'd still be far over the cap.

Denver's cap number looks to be in a bad way for the next two years, at least. Acquiring Kenny Thomas' contract does little to ease that situation. So maybe, maybe they would like an expiring or two for Nene, but you'd think they'd push to recover a pick or at least something of value for him. To me, that only makes sense.

 

[rumpled]

He had the microfracture surgery didn't he? I gotta say no, I don't trust those guys. They're usually never the same again. Half a season of reports that he looks "explosive" isn't convincing me...who did I read that about before...

And then even if I get past that, there's the whole contract/performance ratio thing going on too.

Actually I'd gamble on those specific trades you proposed because we don't give up much. Can't see Denver doing those deals though, they obviously have high hopes.

 

[Macto420]

Now that the AI trade is gone through Denver has huge salary commitments and they may be looking for relief from Nene's contract. We all know he's overpaid and that he's just coming off knee surgery, but he's big (6'11"), he's talented, he's athletic, he's young (24) and bigs like him are not available very often. He's a pretty big risk, but could be very good.

So, with that in mind:

Kenny Thomas
Jason Hart
Francisco Garcia

for

Nene
Earl Boykins
Julius Hodge

I'm not sure this would fly with Denver because it would essentially leave them without a backup center (unless you count Jamal Sampson), but it would be a way for Denver to get out from Nene's contract a bit -- Kenny's deal is cheaper and ends one year sooner. Jason Hart gives them a backup point guard who is a defensive specialist -- they're not going to need any more scorers.

If a condition of the trade is that Denver get a backup center, here's a three team variation involving Brad Miller:

Sacramento outgoing:
Brad Miller

Sacramento incoming:
Nene
Sarunas Jasikevicius

Indiana outgoing:
Jeff Foster
Shawne Williams
Sarunas Jasikevicius

Indiana incoming:
Brad Miller

Denver outgoing:
Nene
Linas Kleiza

Denver incoming:
Jeff Foster
Shawne Williams

terrible trade idea...nene is not only a poor quality player, but hes an injurey prone poor quality player, and to top that off hes an a very ovrepaid injurprone poor quality player. sarunas is also a pretty bad player, extremely overrated b4 he came in i remember indiana talking about him so much and promoting his jersey, he turned out to be crap and now you want to take on these teams crap payers...i love it man

 

[BMiller52]

This trade would be good. We need size in the worst way.

 

[nbrans]

He had the microfracture surgery didn't he? I gotta say no, I don't trust those guys. They're usually never the same again. Half a season of reports that he looks "explosive" isn't convincing me...who did I read that about before...

And then even if I get past that, there's the whole contract/performance ratio thing going on too.

Actually I'd gamble on those specific trades you proposed because we don't give up much. Can't see Denver doing those deals though, they obviously have high hopes.

He didn't have microfracture, he tore his ACL. Much, much different situation.

 

[rumpled]

He didn't have microfracture, he tore his ACL. Much, much different situation.

Whups, my mistake. (again) Some of the same re-injury risk still applies though, I'm just leery of assuming players will get back to full speed after those major injuries.

 

[Macto420]

Whups, my mistake. (again) Some of the same re-injury risk still applies though, I'm just leery of assuming players will get back to full speed after those major injuries.

he most likely will never recover, hes shown that, is denver playing him much, no, thats due to either the injury or his lack of abilities, either way we dont want this cat, or his terrible contract, bringing in this guy and giving up brad would be the stupidist idead ever, brad will hopefully be back to a consistent 15ish point scorer, nene at his best pre injury was what a 9 point scorer. man this team cant even score who care about bigs right now, sht man we cant put the ball in the hole and you want to trade brad for nene

 

[nbrans]

I see things another way. You are the Denver GM and you get a call saying, 'We'll give you Kenny Thomas for Nene.' Do you not hang up the phone and have yourself one of the best belly-busting laughs you've ever had?

To make yourself better via trades sometimes require deals make sense for the other teams involved. That's why the Kings' best chance is gone. In addition, adding in a couple of Kings' expiring contracts wouldn't have made Philly a player in free agency any more so than they will be now - by my math, they'd still be far over the cap.

Denver's cap number looks to be in a bad way for the next two years, at least. Acquiring Kenny Thomas' contract does little to ease that situation. So maybe, maybe they would like an expiring or two for Nene, but you'd think they'd push to recover a pick or at least something of value for him. To me, that only makes sense.

From a basketball standpoint, yes, you're right. But from a financial standpoint I think Denver is going to look to cut costs however they can. They have $75 million in salary tied up next year. They tried to move Nene for expirings during the Iverson negotiations and they failed to do so. That means his price is low, but it doesn't mean he's suddenly off the table. Every dollar they can trim in salary is $2 in savings since they're so far into luxury tax land.

In any event, the Kenny Thomas trade probably isn't that realistic since they're probably going to want a backup center, but I don't agree with you that the AI trade makes a Nene deal less likely or that the Kings' best chance passed. If anything it makes them more desperate to move him and relieve some of that financial pressure.

 

[thatguy]

From a basketball standpoint, yes, you're right. But from a financial standpoint I think Denver is going to look to cut costs however they can. They have $75 million in salary tied up next year. They tried to move Nene for expirings during the Iverson negotiations and they failed to do so. That means his price is low, but it doesn't mean he's suddenly off the table. Every dollar they can trim in salary is $2 in savings since they're so far into luxury tax land.

In any event, the Kenny Thomas trade probably isn't that realistic since they're probably going to want a backup center, but I don't agree with you that the AI trade makes a Nene deal less likely or that the Kings' best chance passed. If anything it makes them more desperate to move him and relieve some of that financial pressure.

I understand where you are coming from. But let me ask a somewhat related question. If Nene were included in the deal instead of Miller, do you think Miller would be on the block? And for cheap? Because they'd be in a similar cap situation for next year and the one after.

 

[nbrans]

I understand where you are coming from. But let me ask a somewhat related question. If Nene were included in the deal instead of Miller, do you think Miller would be on the block? And for cheap? Because they'd be in a similar cap situation for next year and the one after.

I think because they have so much less depth at the guard position that Miller was more valuable to them than Nene, hence the attempts to find a third team to take on Nene. That's why I'm glad the Kings didn't participate -- if it's between the two I think the Nuggets would be a better team with Miller on the roster than Nene. Not because Nene's not good, but because he doesn't mesh well with AI. He's more of a low post guy and not the dirty work type of guy that works well with AI. Reggie Evans, Camby, Najera are great fits with that roster, not so much Nene.

So to answer your question, no, I don't think Miller would be on the block. With Nene gone it would have relieved their financial situation enough (especially from a long-term perspective) that they probably would have kept Miller.

But now that Miller is gone I still think Nene's available. The cost/benefit to Denver to have Nene on the roster just isn't there.

 

[thatguy]

I think because they have so much less depth at the guard position that Miller was more valuable to them than Nene, hence the attempts to find a third team to take on Nene. That's why I'm glad the Kings didn't participate -- if it's between the two I think the Nuggets would be a better team with Miller on the roster than Nene. Not because Nene's not good, but because he doesn't mesh well with AI. He's more of a low post guy and not the dirty work type of guy that works well with AI. Reggie Evans, Camby, Najera are great fits with that roster, not so much Nene.

So to answer your question, no, I don't think Miller would be on the block. With Nene gone it would have relieved their financial situation enough (especially from a long-term perspective) that they probably would have kept Miller.

But now that Miller is gone I still think Nene's available. The cost/benefit to Denver to have Nene on the roster just isn't there.

Again, I get what you are saying. But, from my perspective, the Kings won't have a chance to get Nene. I think the Nuggets, somewhat to your point above, will be looking for a distributor. And I don't think the Kings have the right combo of players/contracts to pull that off.

 

[nbrans]

Again, I get what you are saying. But, from my perspective, the Kings won't have a chance to get Nene. I think the Nuggets, somewhat to your point above, will be looking for a distributor. And I don't think the Kings have the right combo of players/contracts to pull that off.

Good points. They could really use a backup point like, say, Brevin Knight and they could also really use a backup center like, say, Dale Davis. I guess it depends on how much they value Nene vs. how much they want to get rid of his contract. Given Nene's recent injury, his contract and the fact that they shopped him to no avail, my impression is that his value isn't such that they can be very choosy. But if they really don't care about paying tax they could hold onto him until the right deal comes along.

 

[LPKingsFan]

What if Denver wanted all expirings+Garcia?

Corliss/Hart/Garcia for Nene/Hodge works, and gets rid of any concerns re: Boykins, getting Brad Miller involved, etc.

 

[Macto420]

nene is not good, and is injured..someone like wilcox would be better, better contract, less injury prone, and a better player

 

[hrdboild]

All you people who keep saying Nene is injured and a shadow of his former self, that's what everyone was saying about Amare two weeks ago. If you want to really take advantage of a "buy low" situation you actually have to take a chance. The guy missed a whole year. It's going to take him time to get properly conditioned for a full game of NBA basketball. It's true he's not any kind of holy grail big man. At his best he's always been a scorer, not all that much of a rebounder or shot blocker. But he's a lot better than anything we've got going. It's too bad Denver went and signed him to a ridiculous contract. That would make me think twice about trading for him, but this is about the only chance you're ever going to have to get in on the ground floor with a young and established big man and keep him around for awhile. I could see it going either way, but I wouldn't dismiss it outright like some people here are doing because of a few weeks of basketball. He's back in the starting lineup now. They're slowly increasing his minutes. Now would be the time to get him. Even a couple weeks down the line it might be too late.