Is Kenny Thomas untradable?

[hammystyle]

That wouldn't happen to be Kings History For Dummies would it?


Truly a "triumphant day in history".

Never mind we have won less, still pay the entire salary for less production, haven't been able to move any of the "flexible pieces" for anything of worth, traded away an icon, and won't even benefit from the mega-expiring contract that Philly will have next summer. You really need to try to sell that crap someplace where the people are...well, a little denser might be a start. Gullible would help too.

It's only a year and a half after the trade and we already have 10 mil in expiring contracts, plus I think Monia is off the books. So 11 million. KT could be traded this summer. Whether or not anything happens with KT we still have a lot more financial flexibility than we otherwise would have over the next two years. If Webber is here last summer, I really doubt that SAR comes here, and KT+SAR's contributions DO make up for Webber's production while providing way way better defense. Between last year with the Sixers and the year before with th Kings the team has been worse with him on the floor then when he's off it.

Bottom line, it was a move that had to be made. It was a flat out shock that Webber made it through the last two years relatively unscathed. Whe he left we had no decent front-court depth and an injury to him would've absolutely paralyzed the team. If he was still on the team this year it would've been the same deal because I highly doubt SAR would be here.

 

[VF21]

You may doubt if SAR would have come here, but I certainly don't. Having Webber here wouldn't have changed his mind, IMHO. He would have loved to be part of a team with Chris Webber and he would certainly have been looking at a playoff bound team. As others have said, THAT is what SAR was looking for. He never was all about starting. Some of his fans may have been, but he showed a lot more class and dedication to the TEAM concept.

It may have been a flat-out shock to you that Webber has been able to play but that doesn't make it that hard to accept for those of us who tried all along to tell people that he did still have value, that some of you were not giving him a fair amount of time to rehab, etc.

Once again, you're using hindsight to act as though this was a really clear-cut decision at the time. It wasn't, by any stretch of the imagination. And I continue to find it highly amusing and somewhat tragic that you have to rewrite history to rationalize your beliefs. Had Webber actually been injured, you would have been shreiking "See, we told you so!" from the highest rafters. Well, he hasn't been injured and what's good for the goose should be good for the gander.

 

[Bricklayer]

Yes and no, team that have good C or dominant 1st option can really use SAR's post game.

Hou - Swift for SAR
LAL - KBrown or DGeorge for SAR
Chi - Tyson for SAR + ?
Bos - olowokandi for SAR + ?(I know this is bad)
Cle - anyone except LBJ/Z for SAR...

I am not saying Kings should trade SAR but we can't find a taker for KT maybe it is better off to trade SAR for a rebounder.

Ok...I think I detect somebody who's been watching the World Cup for the last few weeks.

In the last week or so:
-- Houston traded Swift back to Memphis, well kind of, since he refuses to report

-- Chicago traded Chandler to New Orleans for PJ Brown and JR smith

-- Olowokandi is a FA right now


No big deal, and beside the general point though. I actually think SAR might be a bad fit in both Houston and Cleveland because he would get in the way of their big centers down low, and clog up the lane for TMac and LeBron. Would seem more likely he would fit someplace where they lacked post guys.

Not sure at all about the Lakers either -- just, call it a hunch, that SAR isn't a PJ triangel player. jsut doesn't feel right, and doesn't do all the other things PJs PFs have always done.

Also of course is the fact that this is different from Kenny -- you can make a case for trying to "dump" Kenny's salary even for relatively little return. But I don't think we really want to just "dump" Reef -- he has his uses and may actually be signed to a good contract, ro at least a reasonable pne, for a player of his talent. If we moved SAR, I would want an actual talented guy back, just a guy talented in areas more useful to us.

 

[nbrans]

You may doubt if SAR would have come here, but I certainly don't. Having Webber here wouldn't have changed his mind, IMHO. He would have loved to be part of a team with Chris Webber and he would certainly have been looking at a playoff bound team. As others have said, THAT is what SAR was looking for. He never was all about starting. Some of his fans may have been, but he showed a lot more class and dedication to the TEAM concept.

I don't know if Shareef himself said it, but here's what Blazers GM John Nash said at the time:

"Our sense is he wants to play for and be a starter for a contending team"

Shareef passed up opportunities with San Antonio and Miami in favor of New Jersey and Sacramento because the latter two teams had starting spots open.

Shareef has shown himself to be a team player, but that doesn't mean he was looking to be a backup and would have been happy backing up Webber.

 

[hammystyle]

It may have been a flat-out shock to you that Webber has been able to play but that doesn't make it that hard to accept for those of us who tried all along to tell people that he did still have value, that some of you were not giving him a fair amount of time to rehab, etc.

Once again, you're using hindsight to act as though this was a really clear-cut decision at the time. It wasn't, by any stretch of the imagination. And I continue to find it highly amusing and somewhat tragic that you have to rewrite history to rationalize your beliefs. Had Webber actually been injured, you would have been shreiking "See, we told you so!" from the highest rafters. Well, he hasn't been injured and what's good for the goose should be good for the gander.

Where did I rewrite history? Because I said that it was expected that he'd get gurt again? It was and still is. Either way, I'm still happy they made the trade. I'm happy that we have two expiring contracts and KT as opposed to Webber. Whether you want to acknowledge it or not, we actually do have flexibility because of that trade. KT may or may not be tradable but we have 11 million coming off the books next year. If we make a trade for a big man those contracts are a good start. Truth is, it really didn't matter to me at all who they got, I just think the team had no future with him.

I find it amusing and tragic you keep bringing him up in threads for no reason.

 

[VF21]

Where did I rewrite history? Because I said that it was expected that he'd get gurt again? It was and still is. Either way, I'm still happy they made the trade. I'm happy that we have two expiring contracts and KT as opposed to Webber. Whether you want to acknowledge it or not, we actually do have flexibility because of that trade. KT may or may not be tradable but we have 11 million coming off the books next year. If we make a trade for a big man those contracts are a good start. Truth is, it really didn't matter to me at all who they got, I just think the team had no future with him.

I find it amusing and tragic you keep bringing him up in threads for no reason.

Hey, whatever floats your boat.

We will never agree on this so I see no need to continue.

Have a nice day.

 

[VF21]

I don't know if Shareef himself said it, but here's what Blazers GM John Nash said at the time:

"Our sense is he wants to play for and be a starter for a contending team"

Shareef passed up opportunities with San Antonio and Miami in favor of New Jersey and Sacramento because the latter two teams had starting spots open.

Shareef has shown himself to be a team player, but that doesn't mean he was looking to be a backup and would have been happy backing up Webber.

I might have thought that before I got to see SAR the person as well as the player, nbrans. But my respect for him in both regards has grown immensely. I think he would have seriously considered coming to Sacramento ... but we'll never know for sure.

Anyway, this whole thing started out as a discussion of the demand for Kenny Thomas. I think I've really made my thoughts on that pretty clear, so I'm bowing out of this discussion.

 

[kingkung]

Sacramento

 

[Bricklayer]

I don't know if Shareef himself said it, but here's what Blazers GM John Nash said at the time:

"Our sense is he wants to play for and be a starter for a contending team"

Shareef passed up opportunities with San Antonio and Miami in favor of New Jersey and Sacramento because the latter two teams had starting spots open.

Shareef has shown himself to be a team player, but that doesn't mean he was looking to be a backup and would have been happy backing up Webber.

Given his available choices at that time, having just been dumped by the Nets, our deal would still have been as good as he was going to get. There was no "starting spot on a contender" that was going to happen.

Of course I am also once again wondering why it even matters. Sheer speculation, and you damn well need Reef to fall into our lap (through luck mind you) to even make the whole thing less than a compeolte disaster. Hell, if Ron doesn't fall into our lap through complete luck the whole thing is STILL a complete disaster as we had none of the look of a playoff team and were spiraling into the lottery.

 

[LPKingsFan]

I think KT would be a decent enough fit on the Nets, Wiz, and maybe Suns.

Which would mean a swap for Jason Collins or Etan Thomas, either of whom I'd be ok with as a backup defensive role player.

 

[BigSong]

Given his available choices at that time, having just been dumped by the Nets, our deal would still have been as good as he was going to get. There was no "starting spot on a contender" that was going to happen.

Of course I am also once again wondering why it even matters. Sheer speculation, and you damn well need Reef to fall into our lap (through luck mind you) to even make the whole thing less than a compeolte disaster. Hell, if Ron doesn't fall into our lap through complete luck the whole thing is STILL a complete disaster as we had none of the look of a playoff team and were spiraling into the lottery.

still being the operative word there. in hindsight trading Webber was a bad idea, but we STILL were able to muddle through with some good acquisitions .

my question to you is who do you blame, the MAloofs (did they want to move Webber), or Petrie?

 

[VF21]

We muddled through but I can't help but wonder what might have happened if they hadn't been in such a hurry to get rid of him. I don't think it's a matter of blame. The Maloofs, I believe, made a business decision based on risk AND a desire to put the team in Peja's hands. Unfortunately, that wasn't the right choice but it was theirs to make, which became pretty clear once Webber was gone and NO ONE seemed willing to step up into any kind of leadership role.

 

[ParniValjak]

I might have thought that before I got to see SAR the person as well as the player, nbrans. But my respect for him in both regards has grown immensely. I think he would have seriously considered coming to Sacramento ... but we'll never know for sure.

Anyway, this whole thing started out as a discussion of the demand for Kenny Thomas. I think I've really made my thoughts on that pretty clear, so I'm bowing out of this discussion.

I very much doubt it. He had a chance to go to a reigning premier who were more of a contender than we would have been with Webber and turned them down. He wanted to go to a play-off team where he would have been a starter. I am pretty sure that if he wanted to be a bencher for someone, SA would be so far in front it wouldn't be funny. The choice would have been to be a bencher for a true contender and reigning champion or be a bencher for a play-off team thats a fair way off contending. Tough choice that one

 

[Fresno King]

We muddled through but I can't help but wonder what might have happened if they hadn't been in such a hurry to get rid of him. I don't think it's a matter of blame. The Maloofs, I believe, made a business decision based on risk AND a desire to put the team in Peja's hands. Unfortunately, that wasn't the right choice but it was theirs to make, which became pretty clear once Webber was gone and NO ONE seemed willing to step up into any kind of leadership role.

I've always thought this was Bibby's team for the taking, but he just isn't that kind of a leader. To hear the Maloofs call Ron Artest the face of the franchise is almost comical because: a) that person should be Bibby, and b) Artest hasn't even been part of the franchise for an entire season.

Going with Peja as that person before the trade was a TERRIBLE idea.

 

[Goo]

Ok...I think I detect somebody who's been watching the World Cup for the last few weeks.

In the last week or so:
-- Houston traded Swift back to Memphis, well kind of, since he refuses to report

-- Chicago traded Chandler to New Orleans for PJ Brown and JR smith

-- Olowokandi is a FA right now


quote]

Wow I need a new user name now, and your right too much world cup the last few weeks.

 

[Bricklayer]

Ok...I think I detect somebody who's been watching the World Cup for the last few weeks.

In the last week or so:
-- Houston traded Swift back to Memphis, well kind of, since he refuses to report

-- Chicago traded Chandler to New Orleans for PJ Brown and JR smith

-- Olowokandi is a FA right now


quote]

Wow I need a new user name now, and your right too much world cup the last few weeks.

Naw -- I kinda like "goo".

Was amused that you chose those particular players though. There were hundreds of guys you could have chosen around the league and nobody would have raied an eyelash. But no, you had to go with a who's who list of recent tradees and FAs.

 

[Kings113]

I wouldn't be surprised if we can't get Etan Thomas/Magloire/Swift for KT, we settle for Malik Rose. Obviously not near the best we could get for Kenny, and is another tweener foward...but he's better and versatile defensively, can board, good team player, brings energy, has a good attitude and doesn't mind coming off the bench. Won two rings with the Spurs as well. I wouldn't mind him really, but still would need to get a shotblocker somewhere on the roster.

Just a thought.

 

[6th]

Is Kenny Thomas untradable?

If we cannot find someone who will take him and his contract off our hands.......then, YES! The longer we have to keep this "moveable piece" of the Webber trade, the more it feels untradeable.

 

[sauce-26]

Not in any way bashing Webber. But if we can move him with one leg left and his 62 million contract, we can move Thomas.