[Game] Kings @ Spurs 11/11/24 5pm PST, 8pm EST

[iowamcnabb]

Hitting 2PT FG also makes the other team take the ball out of bounds and allows the Kings to set their defense. The effect would be more than just FGs made

.

I don’t think anyone is calling for us to be top 5 in three pointers attempted or anything. What we are asking is for us to be in the top half of the league in makes and attempts while also being top 2/3rd or better in 3 point defense. That’s not unimaginable and frankly we should expect it if we want to win 50 games.

 

[The_Jamal]

I don't think you can assume that we won't be a better team if we do that. More made baskets means less transition opportunities for the other team. We're already good at generating extra possessions with steals. Converting those transition three points attempts into layups or free throws would also help to boost our scoring average. If we're getting more shot attempts than the other team every night, hitting a greater percentage of the shots we do take, and we continue to convert the vast majority of our free throw attempts I think it's conceivable that we could be better and overcome that 3pt gap. We've already had one of the better point differentials in the league even with the atrocious 3pt shooting. What's so hard to understand about "play to your strengths"?

We literally do. We're probably the highest combined team in the NBA between 2PT FGA/FTA, and %'s on those shots. You thinking we don't is just mind-boggling, I don't understand why you don't get it. We're ALREADY bottom third in 3PA. We're NOT chucking like you claim.


Your suggestion does not work in the modern NBA. Sorry, just doesn't. NBA teams figured out that 3>2 and we've seen historic amounts of attempts over the last 10 years for that reason. The Lakers have been the only champion in the last 11 years to not be a good-great 3pt shooting team. And they had the leagues best defense, a much younger LeBron/AD who sun-ran his mid-range shooting during that playoff run. If we have any hope of this team being a playoff contender, much less a title contender, they just have to shoot better. We aren't going to go anywhere punting 6-10 3PM every game.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

We're 6th in PPG on the season. So that's not true either. Also I just posted that we're near the top of the league in 2P FG, FTA, FTM and 2PFG%. So we're actually doing exactly what you're suggesting; attacking the paint.

But you don't have an answer for how to overcome 14.7 PPG in 3pt deficits every game. So essentially what you're suggesting is add 8 more 2PT FGM/game. We shoot 60% from 2 (dubious if that's real, but just for the sake or argument), so we'd have to take roughly 13-16 less 3PA/game, to hit those numbers and make up the deficit.

That would put us at 20 3PA/game on the low end and 17 3PA/game on the high end. It's not a solution.

It only works for a good winning %, if they can figure out a way to defend the 3 better

 

[iowamcnabb]

There are threes you can do very little about like Wemby’s 30 footers but the spray threes have to have a counter right? Everytime a player drove we would help and then they would spray to a shooter or a passer who would move the ball to the corner. Super easy set shots. Happened a ton in this game and last. I wish I knew X’s and O’s like a coach but there just has to be a solution to that

 

[KingsFanSince85]

Are you suggesting that if we dropped to 30th in 3PA and converted all those shots to middy's, that we'd be a better team? That we could overcome 6-10 3PM difference every game?

If we had Shaq in his prime on our team converting 58-60% of his shots (it’d likely be 65+% today with smaller defenders and less allowable contact) then — yes — we’d easily overcome that difference every single game.

But in place of that, I got nothing. There’s no Shaq or even Tim Duncan in our future.

This team doesn’t need to shoot more 3’s, they just need to make more of the ones they’re taking. And they more than have the ability to do so. It’s not as if Huerter, Monk, Keegan, Fox, Lyles, McDermott, etc, are or have been poor 3 point shooters throughout their careers.

Fox is arguably the only one that has been in the past, but even he’s developed into at least an average deep shooter.

There’s really no good reason for this poor shooting to continue ALL season. At some point it should start trending upward.

But if it doesn’t, perhaps, yes, they should consider taking less of them. Makes little sense to take shots you aren’t hitting relatively consistently.

 

[iowamcnabb]

The frustration is in the past we needed to be hot from 3 to win most nights. Now we just need to be average and we can’t pull that off. We have had one 40+ % game this season out of 11 games!

 

[captain bill]

Road game B2B without Monk was a schedule loss but the garbage outside the big 3 was unacceptable. Huerter with too many bonehead plays. Felt like we were challenging Wemby too much underneath the basket. He had one of the worst best 3 point shooting nights given how bad his misses were.

 

[SacTownKid]

We literally do. We're probably the highest combined team in the NBA between 2PT FGA/FTA, and %'s on those shots. You thinking we don't is just mind-boggling, I don't understand why you don't get it. We're ALREADY bottom third in 3PA. We're NOT chucking like you claim.


Your suggestion does not work in the modern NBA. Sorry, just doesn't. NBA teams figured out that 3>2 and we've seen historic amounts of attempts over the last 10 years for that reason.

I agree, you can't just stop shooting 3's. The types of 3's the Kings are shooting, that is the issue, and for right now when the junky needs a fix they have to get to the line or a high percentage shot closer to the best areas of their 3 best players. It is what it is. I still believe potentially spacing the floor in a different way like utilizing the post a little more could help. It would be worth a shot at least. The Kings are higher in the post up stats this season over last and are in the top 6 currently in terms of possessions, but they are also number 2 in PPP when doing so scoring 1.18 per possession. That's DOMINANT in the modern game. They are in the 96th percentile. They might want to look more into that.

 

[iowamcnabb]

I think that starting lineup net rating may take a hit this game

and Keegan haha

 

[Caccia]

If they continue to shoot poorly from 3, what would you suggest? Try something different, or just more of the same?

Better screens, more drive-and-kick three-point attempts. A lot of times, our guys are not as wide-open as the other team's players. That will lead to a disparity in 3P%.

 

[Caccia]

The Kings can sign someone to a 10-day contract, another sharpshooter or a power forward. They have an empty roster spot. And they need bench help now.

The next eight games, without Monk, are critical to how the season will play out. Currently, the Kings are in last place in the division.

 

[Sam0ah]

I am not a coach, but its obvious this team is much better at getting good 2pt shots. Why not do that over and over again until double teams start happening and then pass out for open triples. Why work so hard against the strength of your team?

 

[sactowndog]

Once again the Kings have half the made 3’s of the opponent. At 26.3% we have yet another game under 30%. We have played 1 team in the top 6 and 3 teams in the bottom 5. We are barely above .500

At this point the winless preseason cannot be ignored. This team is a poor team. Yes I am a partial season ticket holder and will be spending my money on this team so spare me the being negative comments.

But the facts are we are 11 games into the season plus 4 preseason games. The primary discussion at this point should be when do we tank to make sure we keep our draft pick.

 

[mdme]

The team clearly is clearly in its head. You see players all hesitate and think before shooting the 3 ball. There was a sequence when multiple kings players initially faked a three coz they were clearly thinking then tried to drive then kicked out to another open 3pt shooter who did the same thing. This was repeated 3-4 x before trey took a three without thinking about it and scored.

 

[coolhandluke]

Once again the Kings have half the made 3’s of the opponent. At 26.3% we have yet another game under 30%. We have played 1 team in the top 6 and 3 teams in the bottom 5. We are barely above .500

At this point the winless preseason cannot be ignored. This team is a poor team. Yes I am a partial season ticket holder and will be spending my money on this team so spare me the being negative comments.

But the facts are we are 11 games into the season plus 4 preseason games. The primary discussion at this point should be when do we tank to make sure we keep our draft pick.

Talk about an overreaction. A tanking team doesn't sign Deebo.

The 3-point defense and offense are both frustrating but it's not time to throw in the towel. Given the talent, it is depressing that the coaching staff is not playing to our team strengths. Understanding the personnel and adapting the strategies should be the course of action. We will see if Mike Brown and his coaching staff can adapt or not.

 

[The_Jamal]

I can't do it, see yall next game thread.

 

[captain bill]

Once again the Kings have half the made 3’s of the opponent. At 26.3% we have yet another game under 30%. We have played 1 team in the top 6 and 3 teams in the bottom 5. We are barely above .500

At this point the winless preseason cannot be ignored. This team is a poor team. Yes I am a partial season ticket holder and will be spending my money on this team so spare me the being negative comments.

But the facts are we are 11 games into the season plus 4 preseason games. The primary discussion at this point should be when do we tank to make sure we keep our draft pick.

Every moment in human history til the sun dies out is a point preseason records should be ignored

 

[Makaveli]

It’s tough to watch opposing team hit 4 straight threes and we miss 4 straight. Like shoot 2’s 12-8 run is better than 12-0. We can’t shoot 3’s fox is mid, Debo never has been able to, Kevin is once every 3 games. I’m not sure wtf Keegan is doing his demeanor is all fine and good when is he playing well. But it makes it worse when he isn’t. Looks like a fn idiot out there that is lost in space

 

[sactowndog]

Talk about an overreaction. A tanking team doesn't sign Deebo.

The 3-point defense and offense are both frustrating but it's not time to throw in the towel. Given the talent, it is depressing that the coaching staff is not playing to our team strengths. Understanding the personnel and adapting the strategies should be the course of action. We will see if Mike Brown and his coaching staff can adapt or not.

Notice I said at what point not start now. But if this team fails to make the play-offs and loses their draft pick I would fire Monte on the spot.

 

[sactowndog]

After 11 games we are the worst 3 point shooting team in the league and 27th on opponent 3 point shooting. That combination is not a recipe for success

 

[iowamcnabb]

The Spurs tied their franchise record for threes in a game tonight with 22.

if it wasnt for the poor three point defense all year I would probably just chalk this one up to a hot shooting night against us on the second night of a back to back. Hard to do that with the track record though

 

[kingsboi]

After 11 games we are the worst 3 point shooting team in the league and 27th on opponent 3 point shooting. That combination is not a recipe for success

when you are worse than the Magic from three, you know something is off

 

[SacTownKid]

The Spurs tied their franchise record for threes in a game tonight with 22.

if it wasnt for the poor three point defense all year I would probably just chalk this one up to a hot shooting night against us on the second night of a back to back. Hard to do that with the track record though

And the track records say the shooting on offense will come up. The defense however.... no, not in this deflections > actually sticking somewhere close to your man style of defense. Brown had a one hit wonder with the Dubs and tools to do it and even though last season once he ditched it and he saw this team climb to near the top of the league for a stretch he's still choosing to die on that hill. The Kings use these gambling philosophies on both ends when it doesn't have to be that way.

 

[Folsomkingsfan]

We can't hit 3's, we can't stop players from hitting 3's, and we have arguably the worst bench in the league. It's a miracle we are 6-5 considering on paper it looks like we are tanking for Cooper Flagg

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

And the track records say the shooting on offense will come up. The defense however.... no, not in this deflections > actually sticking somewhere close to your man style of defense. Brown had a one hit wonder with the Dubs and tools to do it and even though last season once he ditched it and he saw this team climb to near the top of the league for a stretch he's still choosing to die on that hill. The Kings use these gambling philosophies on both ends when it doesn't have to be that way.

I'd like to see them play straight up man to man defense, with no help off a capable shooter at the 3 point line. I'd bet it works better than what they've been doing

 

[hrdboild]

We literally do. We're probably the highest combined team in the NBA between 2PT FGA/FTA, and %'s on those shots. You thinking we don't is just mind-boggling, I don't understand why you don't get it. We're ALREADY bottom third in 3PA. We're NOT chucking like you claim.


Your suggestion does not work in the modern NBA. Sorry, just doesn't. NBA teams figured out that 3>2 and we've seen historic amounts of attempts over the last 10 years for that reason. The Lakers have been the only champion in the last 11 years to not be a good-great 3pt shooting team. And they had the leagues best defense, a much younger LeBron/AD who sun-ran his mid-range shooting during that playoff run. If we have any hope of this team being a playoff contender, much less a title contender, they just have to shoot better. We aren't going to go anywhere punting 6-10 3PM every game.

I'm not talking about the whole season, I'm not talking about grand strategy, I'm only saying that in this game we went away from our bread and butter and hunted 3pt shots instead of getting to the line and it cost us. Granted the officials have not been calling fouls on obvious contact the last two games but I don't think that means we should stop going at defenders and just dribble into 3pt shots early in the clock or refuse driving lanes so that we can pass the ball around the perimeter until someone wants to shoot it. That style of offense is absolutely infuriating to watch, and I can't believe you are watching this happen and think our problem is that we're not shooting enough. We routinely waste half a quarter firing blanks and putting 0 points on the board. No amount of defense is going to win when you cannot score even a single point for 6 straight minutes.

And yes I know that 3 > 2 because I've been alive for the past 10 years. This is hardly breaking news. I've made the exact same argument myself over and over again. But the NBA meta does change every 10 years or so. And 3 is only greater than 2 if the shots go in. If they don't go in than 2 is greater than 0. I'm sure Coach is saying the exact same thing you are in every timeout because we've heard him say it over and over again already -- keep shooting, the numbers say that they're going to start falling. But what if they don't? Continuing to shoot in that context to me amounts to just conceding the game. I have no problem with what you are saying as a theory but I just want wins however we can get them. If the 3pt shots aren't falling -- please please please try something else. Don't just shrug it off and assume we'll get them next game. Don't go down firing like it's the damn All-Star game and assume that you're going to dig yourself out of a hole because the odds say eventually you'll make a few.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

I'm not talking about the whole season, I'm not talking about grand strategy, I'm only saying that in this game we went away from our bread and butter and hunted 3pt shots instead of getting to the line and it cost us. Granted the officials have not been calling fouls on obvious contact the last two games but I don't think that means we should stop going at defenders and just dribble into 3pt shots early in the clock or refuse driving lanes so that we can pass the ball around the perimeter until someone wants to shoot it. That style of offense is absolutely infuriating to watch, and I can't believe you are watching this happen and think our problem is that we're not shooting enough. We routinely waste half a quarter firing blanks and putting 0 points on the board. No amount of defense is going to win when you cannot score even a single point for 6 straight minutes.

And yes I know that 3 > 2 because I've been alive for the past 10 years. This is hardly breaking news. I've made the exact same argument myself over and over again. But the NBA meta does change every 10 years or so. And 3 is only greater than 2 if the shots go in. If they don't go in than 2 is greater than 0. I'm sure Coach is saying the exact same thing you are in every timeout because we've heard him say it over and over again already -- keep shooting, the numbers say that they're going to start falling. But what if they don't? Continuing to shoot in that context to me amounts to just conceding the game. I have no problem with what you are saying as a theory but I just want wins however we can get them. If the 3pt shots aren't falling -- please please please try something else. Don't just shrug it off and assume we'll get them next game. Don't go down firing like it's the damn All-Star game and assume that you're going to dig yourself out of a hole because the odds say eventually you'll make a few.

What is perplexing, is that some will seemingly push to the side what worked so well in the 4th quarter and overtime in Phoenix. Why not try that in a 1st quarter against the Suns in the next game?

 

[OptimusRhyme]

The Kings can sign someone to a 10-day contract, another sharpshooter or a power forward. They have an empty roster spot. And they need bench help now.

The next eight games, without Monk, are critical to how the season will play out. Currently, the Kings are in last place in the division.

just bring TD back on a 10 day. at least he knows the system and can hit shots

 

[hrdboild]

What is perplexing, is that some will seemingly push to the side what worked so well in the 4th quarter and overtime in Phoenix. Why not try that in a 1st quarter against the Suns in the next game?

Exactly. We have two very strong examples of what works and what doesn't work within the same game. What kind of sense does it make to lean on the offense that's not working and ignore the offense that won you the game? Sure it's not going to win you any awards for creativity and it flies in the face of what's working for every other winning team but who cares? A win is a win. At least try it.

And here's what I mean by chucking. Fox, DeRozan, and Sabonis all shot the ball well today. Their combined FG% was 52.8%. Their combined 3pt% was 44.9% and they accounted for all 9 of our FTA. Let's instead look at everyone not named Fox, DeRozan, or Sabonis in this game... Murray, Huerter, Lyles, McDermott, McLaughlin, and Ellis took 38 shots and 29 of them were from 3pt range. Of those 29 3pt attempts they made 6 for a whopping 20.6%. We let our role-players shoot us out of this game.

 

[reptilexcq2]

This team has a problem with focus on winning. I thought the Spurs are just a bad team...turnover the ball and just out of synch early in the game and yet we're not able to capitalize on them. Wemba is just a tall and useless player, with the exception of his height, he's a horrible player...has no strength to back down anybody, settle for long 3 is just a weak way of showing that he can't do much under the basket. If you take away his height, he become a total garbage player imo. If he develop into Giannis where he attack relentlessly and create havoc inside the paint, then and only then can you say oh dammm... he's going to become great. But I don't see it now...just too fragile, weak and lack strength.

As for the Kings, Huerter and Keegan struggling with the shots are the reason we lost this game. Keegan didn't do much to contribute to the team. Not only that, Keegan make stupid errors that cost the team...jump up when Barnes do a pump fake and throwing pass to a teammate when he's not looking...I mean come on man...get your junk together. This team also need discipline. When your team is down by 10pts or more and you're in dire need of a basket, you're going to Huerter for 3? Really? This is just dumb basketball at its finest. They ought to go to DeRozen more often. I rather see a DeRozen contested shot than seeing a Huerter wide open 3. Huerter is a streak shooter....can never rely on him on a consistent basis. He's going to kill the team more often than not.