Kings trade rumor SZN 2023-2024 edition!

[BosnianDiehard2.0]

Several things on the Siakam rumors…

I know there are those who question his fit with us. I for one am OK with sacrificing some three point shooting for more length, size and athleticism. This will be better suited for the Playoffs. Not to mention, Siakam is having a down year shooting wise, there’s been several years where he has been solid from 3.

Of course all this hinges on whether on Siakam would be willing to re-sign here, but if he is, I’m giving up HB/Huerter/Davion/and picks/pick swaps, and I’m not even thinking about it. Star players that are gettable for your team don’t come around often.

Bottom line is, a core of Fox/Siakam/Sabonis/Keegan puts us in potential contender status. I know we talk about how this team is young, but Fox is 26 with a play style depending on his athleticism, and Sabonis is 27 going on 28. His game will probably age better than Fox’s, but you still want to strike while this tandem is in its best years.

I also think the timeline works nice in that as Siakam begins aging, Keegan can officially take the mantle of “third star.” This would let Keegan continue to develop naturally at his own pace without forcing the third star stuff too early, and he can continue exerting more energy on defense.

 

[ick300]

HB is actually not that terrible last 2/3 games ...
Start to wonder if we don't have to find someone to trade for KH plus DM and just put HB in the second unit, with Lyles starting in his place ....
Instead of going wild on Siakam , Kuzma etc ...

 

[SacTownKid]

If you look at stats it's an absolute bloodbath. About the only case that can be made for Kuzma is that he's a better rebounder and he's got good assist numbers (on an incredible 31.6% USG). Well, I can tell you he wouldn't sniff those assist numbers in Sac with Fox and Domas dominating the ball. Why would we want to bring in an inefficient shooter with worse defensive stats than Barnes who has never had a USG% under 20% in his life and would likely not relish the role he'd be given? He's a slightly NEGATIVE Win Share player on 31.6% USG. Holy cow, that's not good.

We have a perfectly fine fifth option who can play the role that we need, who spaces the floor with efficient shooting, but since somebody needs to be henpecked he gets singled out by those who don't seem to understand that you're never going to have a team that starts five 20+ PPG guys. He's not a superstar. He doesn't have to be. But he's also not the steaming pile of rancid dog poop that he's being made out to be.

And I can pretty much guarantee that if we were to bring Kuzma in, I know who would be henpecked next. It would be Kuzma. So it goes.

Pretty much, he pretty much is everywhere he goes. And Kuz as a main iso creator is atrocious in terms of efficiency. Low to mid-30's stuff. Barnes not looking to score is one thing, but when he does he's been elite almost his whole career and incredibly efficient. Kuz is numbers and very little substance. Kuz would provide athletic ability and end to end ability in transition but not much else if he's topped out.

So you have Barnes who just won't score but can get it done when he does, then Kuz who just throws crap at the wall even if he shouldn't.

 

[jiimbob]

In the 2021 draft with Franz Wagner gone at 8 and our turn to draft I was hoping to hear Moses Moody‘s name called. In hind sight Sengun or Jalen Johnson should have been the pick but anyways, Moses has recently voiced his frustration in GS.
He's a SG so not our most glaring need but every time I see him play he looks pretty good. Not advocating for a trade because I don’t know enough about the overall product but wondering if a less obvious move, doesn't GS need a backup PG, be the way to go.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Pretty much, he pretty much is everywhere he goes. And Kuz as a main iso creator is atrocious in terms of efficiency. Low to mid-30's stuff. Barnes not looking to score is one thing, but when he does he's been elite almost his whole career and incredibly efficient. Kuz is numbers and very little substance. Kuz would provide athletic ability and end to end ability in transition but not much else if he's topped out.

So you have Barnes who just won't score but can get it done when he does, then Kuz who just throws crap at the wall even if he shouldn't.

I basically agree with all of this. I might have put the bolded part in terms of being willing/unwilling to play within a team concept. And I have an obvious preference between the two.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I don’t think Siakam is a good trade because of his contract as well , just he is one of the “hot” names
I see many people here voting for Grant but I read nowhere that he is at all available for trade … is he ?

He doesn't fit the timeline of the team here (I live in Portland). Although there's a lot of arguing back and forth about timelines and who knew what when, they had supposedly agreed on contract terms to keep Dame here. Even if that's false, Dame didn't go public until after the signing was announced and the big FA money dried up. So best case they signed him to show Dame they were serious about winning, worst case they signed him so they could trade him rather than lose him for nothing.

Portland is at least 3 seasons away from play-in contention and maybe more because they seriously lag behind the other young teams right now. And while I suspect they'd be a prime contender to poach Jordi they are doing absolutely no favors letting the current young core continue to play under Billups. He is Walton bad at this point.

Folks here also like Thybulle but I think that will be a tougher get.

And unfortunately I don't see our trade assets as great fits. But they probably would take picks because they also have an unstable ownership situation and picks over long term contracts are attractive in a sales scenario.

 

[ick300]

Wow, thanks man , great explanation
Damn this trade period is more interesting than the games , especially if we had played Pelicans ….

 

[Tetsujin]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1744394108418863610

Masai: “I want Keegan”
Monte: “No, take HB instead.”
Masai: “…Lemmie think it over”

 

[Tetsujin]

https://twitter.com/statuses/1744421693240570343

not sure telling everyone “the King didn’t want to trade a 23 year old who was one three from tying the made threes in a game record for a fifty game rental of Pascal Siakam” is a good way of making them look stupid.

 

[Tetsujin]

This also tells me that there must absolutely be no market for Pascal at this point and the Raptors are trying to drum up any sort of momentum for a trade

 

[Capt. Factorial]

This also tells me that there must absolutely be no market for Pascal at this point and the Raptors are trying to drum up any sort of momentum for a trade

Yes, the trade market for a guy on an expiring deal who can't sign an extension and is openly expecting a free agent deal that's about 150% of market value is probably quiet for a reason. You don't mortgage your future for a rental. If Siakam were locked up for 3-4 years at $35M he'd garner a basketful of picks and a Keegan-level prospect. But he's not.

 

[Vinny Basketballerino]

Let’s pretend it is Barnes, huerter, Mitchell for Siakam. If the worry is siakam doesnt re-sign we would be 41 million under next years projected cap. That would give us freedom to get Malik paid. His contract looks to be in the 20 mil a year range. Would still be able to get players in at least the caliber of the 3 we traded. I

A salary dump by default does not seem to be a bad idea here... because things have changed and we are now a potentially attractive destination for FA's. This trade also clears some room for Sasha... one would hope.

I continue to speculate that Sasha is not playing precisely because he is in our long term plans. It just makes zero sense for us to have brought him over, played him, confirmed that he wasn't a defensive liability and that his shooting was legit... only to bench him and trade him?

Monty is not that impulsive.

 

[joemama]

 

[iowamcnabb]

I’m glad Monte sees the importance of making a trade early (if you are going to make one) to give the team a runway to gel. With that statement, maybe we see something by the end of next week or not at all. If he doesn’t see what he wants, you let Keegan grow for one full year and then reevaluate trade options in the off season. All the pieces we are putting on the block will be available to trade this offseason too so no need to rush. Make the right trade

 

[KingsFanSince85]

Seeing that the Kings are reportedly only willing to deal, Huerter, HB and Mitchell and some 2nd rounders, I can see Kuzma as a likely trade target for Monte. Seeing that his contract is reasonable for a #3 or #4 on a playoff team, I think he would be an upgrade.

You’re thinking wrong.

The guys is a net zero. The Lakers got better when they benched him then got rid of him. If he was half as good as some here have fooled themselves into believing, the Wizards wouldn’t be 6-29 this season.

Volume chuckers that are liabilities on the defensive end aren’t “upgrades”. The KINGS have enough liabilities on that end of the floor. They certainly don’t need another.

He’s not a good fit for any team that is serious about winning. Certainly not given his current contract.

 

[Vinny Basketballerino]

I’m glad Monte sees the importance of making a trade early (if you are going to make one) to give the team a runway to gel. With that statement, maybe we see something by the end of next week or not at all. If he doesn’t see what he wants, you let Keegan grow for one full year and then reevaluate trade options in the off season. All the pieces we are putting on the block will be available to trade this offseason too so no need to rush. Make the right trade

Monte is creating win-win scenarios for the team. Make a trade now? Win. Don't make a trade? Win. Future is bright.

 

[Vinny Basketballerino]

Here's my best case scenario for this trade deadline:

We trade Heurter and Barnes (and Davion if needed) for Siakam. We bring Siakam over but make zero efforts to integrate him into the offense. Use him in spot minutes. This makes way for Sasha. Begin to play Sasha more. He blossoms. Siakam doesn't resign. and we now have 40+M in cap space. Resign Malik. Sign borderline all star defensive free agent SF/PF that pairs well with Sasha in the starting five. Win championship next year.

Everyone will say they saw it coming, but I'm the only one that did.

Lasagna for all.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

James Ham reportedly insinuating Raptors were asking for Monk not Keegs.

 

[The_Jamal]

James Ham reportedly insinuating Raptors were asking for Monk not Keegs.

Saw that. Which, is great news for us. If we didn't have confidence that we'd be resigning him this off-season, why wouldn't we ship him out for a talent like Siakam?

 

[Joshoua]

Yes, the trade market for a guy on an expiring deal who can't sign an extension and is openly expecting a free agent deal that's about 150% of market value is probably quiet for a reason. You don't mortgage your future for a rental. If Siakam were locked up for 3-4 years at $35M he'd garner a basketful of picks and a Keegan-level prospect. But he's not.

I think everyone agrees Keegan wasn’t even an option it’s Messi’s (however you spell it) doing his regular bull crap. He’ll get barnes and a future first, Wiggins and a future first or watch Siakam walk to Philly this year

https://twitter.com/statuses/1744394108418863610

Masai: “I want Keegan”
Monte: “No, take HB instead.”
Masai: “…Lemmie think it over”

https://twitter.com/statuses/1744397260790563112

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Saw that. Which, is great news for us. If we didn't have confidence that we'd be resigning him this off-season, why wouldn't we ship him out for a talent like Siakam?

Agreed though somehow terrifying if some team goes nuts and offers him 25m per how does he say no to that?

please please please tell met ATL is capped out lol

 

[iowamcnabb]

It’s good news that they turned down a Monk trade but bad news that the Raptors are interested. I figured the IQ trade would take them out of the running for Malik. Their cap space situation is unclear at the moment. Depends on what kind of contracts they take back in a Siakam deal

 

[iowamcnabb]

I wonder if Monte has a deal worked out with Atlanta to remove protections on the ‘24 pick if and when we make a deadline deal. I’m guessing yes

 

[The_Jamal]

Agreed though somehow terrifying if some team goes nuts and offers him 25m per how does he say no to that?

please please please tell met ATL is capped out lol

I mean, I think it might have to be more than that. If a team offered 25 mil/season, that ends up being like 20ish mil more over the life of a contract that we can offer. I dunno, Monk is awesome, but seems unlikely the teams with space are gonna shell 100 mil out. Or that he'll want to go to a rebuilding situation.

 

[SacTownKid]

Monte has basically been talking with the Raptors for what? Over a year now? Whatever trades that could possibly have been discussed have been. So far Monte has been doing business largely out in the open and probably on purpose. How long were there John Collins rumors? Well, he didn't get Collins but did do business with the Hawks eventually. Rumors he wanted Domas came to fruition as well. Maybe these talks with the Raptors end up with other pieces besides Siakam coming back. Who knows.

 

[SacTownKid]

I wonder if Monte has a deal worked out with Atlanta to remove protections on the ‘24 pick if and when we make a deadline deal. I’m guessing yes

Would that be a deal breaker though? I mean, this draft isn't looking so hot and that pick will be in the 20's. Most teams seem to want those picks waaay down the line so they can bet long term and score big if the team bombs out. Monte can make those types of deals but I can see why he wouldn't want to send a Mitchell or Gobert level package back unless that player coming back is a legit superstar. Siakam is close, but yet so far haha.

 

[twslam07]

Alright I think I might have figured out a trade for Grant & Thybulle/Caruso (seems POR fans don't really want to trade Thybulle so this will be for Caruso):



-------------------------------------

CHI Gets: Jonathan Isaac & Future SAC 1st (Protected Top 10 From 2026-2030; Otherwise, Nothing Conveyed)
CHI Gives: Alex Caruso, Andre Drummond, & Terry Taylor
Why for CHI? Bulls lean into their rebuild and starting selling off their old, win now vets. They get a lightly protected 1st as well as take a flyer on Isaac who should be able to get some minutes considering they don't have great frontcourt depth.

PG - White / Carter / Ball
SG - LaVine / Dosunmu / Terry
SF - DeRozan / Phillips
PF - Williams / Craig
C - Vucevic / Isaac

-------------------------------------

ORL Gets: Kevin Huerter, Andre Drummond, & Terry Taylor
ORL Gives: Jonathan Isaac, Gary Harris, & 2024 ORL 1st (Protected Top 10 From 2024-2030; Otherwise, 2030 MIL 2nd & 2030 ORL 2nd)
Why for ORL? The Magic are the 4th seed with a 19-12 record, but are 30th in 3PA per game and 3P%. They desperately need some shooting to space the floor for Banchero & Wagner. Huerter gives them a great movement shooter to keep defenses honest. He's also young enough to grow with their young core. This also doesn't impact their cap space too much next season as they'd still have $44.8 mil in cap space during the 2024 offseason with the following players under contract: Suggs, Anthony, Huerter, Black, Houstan, F. Wagner, Howard, Banchero, Carter, & M. Wagner.

PG - Suggs / Anthony / Fultz
SG - Huerter / Black / Houstan
SF - Wagner / Howard / Taylor
PF - Banchero / Ingles / Okeke
C - Carter / Bitadze / Wagner / Drummond

-------------------------------------

POR Gets: Harrison Barnes, Gary Harris, & 2024 ORL 1st (Protected Top 10 From 2024-2030; Otherwise, 2030 MIL 2nd & 2030 ORL 2nd)
POR Gives: Jerami Grant
Why for POR? They get an asset for Grant to further add to their rebuild and get useful vet to help mentor the kids (or to flip for another asset down the road).

PG - Brogdon / Henderson / Mays
SG - Simons / Thybulle / Harris / Rupert
SF - Sharpe / Walker / Murray
PF - Barnes / Camara / Wainwright
C - Ayton / Williams / Reath / Brown

-------------------------------------

SAC Gets: Jerami Grant & Alex Caruso
SAC Gives: Harrison Barnes, Kevin Huerter, & Future SAC 1st (Protected Top 10 From 2026-2030; Otherwise, Nothing Conveyed)
Why for SAC? Grant gives them an upgrade at PF who is a very solid complement next to Sabonis with his size, length, athleticism, defense, rim protection, and high volume shooting. He also gives us another go-to scorer which can come in handy come playoff team if teams are focusing on neutralizing Fox, Monk, Murray, and Sabonis. Caruso gives us a huge defensive upgrade at SG while still being able to knockdown open C&S 3s to keep the floor spaced for Fox/Sabonis.

PG - Fox / Ellis / Mitchell
SG - Caruso / Monk / Duarte / Jones
SF - Murray / Vezenkov / Edwards
PF - Grant / Lyles / Toscano-Anderson
C - Sabonis / Len / McGee

-------------------------------------

@iowamcnabb mentioned it earlier, but I’m still thinking a trade like this would be the best path to take.

• Caruso or Thybulle would slot in quite nicely as our starting SG and give us an elite defender while Grant would also give us an upgrade defensively at PF.
• Caruso/Thybulle, Murray, and Grant are all above average rim protectors for their position (which would come in handy around Sabonis).
• You’d still have good spacing around Fox/Sabonis as Caruso/Thybulle, Murray, and Grant can all knock down 3s at a solid clip.
• Grant gives them another legitimate go-to scorer to help lessen the load for our other options. And it technically gives us a solid go-to scorer at every position to take advantage of matchups (PG - Fox, SG - Monk, SF - Murray, PF - Grant, C - Sabonis)
• Allows us to finish the game with more offense/shooting (Monk) or more defense (Thybulle/Caruso) depending on the situation.

Regarding the debate of Thybulle vs. Caruso…

• Thybulle is a few years younger (more in line with our timeline), is much longer than Caruso (helping improve our below average length), and is probably a better lockdown, one-on-one defender.
• Caruso is a more reliable shooter, better rebounder, better ball handler, and better passer

I go back and forth on which one I’d prefer. I’m leaning towards Caruso at the moment…

• He seems to have that infectious energy that would really help us avoid games like yesterday.
• A perimeter of Thybulle, Murray, and Grant is a bit light on ballhandling and passing. Could see it stall out without another ball handler/passer out there to keep the ball moving around.
• Grant has not been a good rebounder this far in his career. Thybulle is also below average for his position. Caruso’s rebounding would help offset Grant’s weakness a bit
• If Thybulle’s 3PT shooting reverts back to his career average (.343), our spacing could be impacted. While if Caruso’s 3PT shooting reverts back to his career average (.375), we’d be able to manage.

 

[iowamcnabb]

Would that be a deal breaker though? I mean, this draft isn't looking so hot and that pick will be in the 20's. Most teams seem to want those picks waaay down the line so they can bet long term and score big if the team bombs out. Monte can make those types of deals but I can see why he wouldn't want to send a Mitchell or Gobert level package back unless that player coming back is a legit superstar. Siakam is close, but yet so far haha.

What I meant was he currently doesn’t have access to the ‘26 pick until we are for sure in the playoffs this year. He could just trade a first available first round pick I suppose.

 

[Kingster]

James Ham reportedly insinuating Raptors were asking for Monk not Keegs.

This makes more sense to me - trading one rental for another.

 

[Kingster]

@iowamcnabb mentioned it earlier, but I’m still thinking a trade like this would be the best path to take.

• Caruso or Thybulle would slot in quite nicely as our starting SG and give us an elite defender while Grant would also give us an upgrade defensively at PF.
• Caruso/Thybulle, Murray, and Grant are all above average rim protectors for their position (which would come in handy around Sabonis).
• You’d still have good spacing around Fox/Sabonis as Caruso/Thybulle, Murray, and Grant can all knock down 3s at a solid clip.
• Grant gives them another legitimate go-to scorer to help lessen the load for our other options. And it technically gives us a solid go-to scorer at every position to take advantage of matchups (PG - Fox, SG - Monk, SF - Murray, PF - Grant, C - Sabonis)
• Allows us to finish the game with more offense/shooting (Monk) or more defense (Thybulle/Caruso) depending on the situation.

Regarding the debate of Thybulle vs. Caruso…

• Thybulle is a few years younger (more in line with our timeline), is much longer than Caruso (helping improve our below average length), and is probably a better lockdown, one-on-one defender.
• Caruso is a more reliable shooter, better rebounder, better ball handler, and better passer

I go back and forth on which one I’d prefer. I’m leaning towards Caruso at the moment…

• He seems to have that infectious energy that would really help us avoid games like yesterday.
• A perimeter of Thybulle, Murray, and Grant is a bit light on ballhandling and passing. Could see it stall out without another ball handler/passer out there to keep the ball moving around.
• Grant has not been a good rebounder this far in his career. Thybulle is also below average for his position. Caruso’s rebounding would help offset Grant’s weakness a bit
• If Thybulle’s 3PT shooting reverts back to his career average (.343), our spacing could be impacted. While if Caruso’s 3PT shooting reverts back to his career average (.375), we’d be able to manage.

It's not close for me. I'd take Caruso. He has the defensive grit, BBIQ and enough shooting. He instantly becomes the starting SG.