2021 NBA Draft Superthread
- Thread starter Tetsujin
- Start date
The pushback is what fit is there for a post big on this team and he's not an anti bagley at all. He's a different type of Bagley. Defensive issues, stretch ability concerns, undersized for a center. Sounds the same to me. Sabonis is a decent player but the impact is not great for those types right now. Both Sabonis and Bagley are also quicker than Sengun. I think the Kanter comps for Sengun are far more accurate. Sengun could be the outlier but this franchises track record taking skill bigs is terrible dating back to a similar prospect in Spencer Hawes.
McNair & co worked out both Williams and Sengun along with quite a few other prospects. I think what's been lost in the shuffle is that the Kings pretty much got any prospect projected in the 5-14 range (and quite a few others in the 16-24 range as well as 2nd rounders and UDFA) to workout for them. That's a HUGE shift from years past where guys refused to even come to Sacramento as part of the pre-draft process.
With a very small sample size, McNair has shown himself to at least be a competent GM which this team hasn't had since Petrie. Is Sengun really worth drafting in the top 10? I don't know. But I could say the same for Moody & Wagner (who I like) and guys like Giddey (who no one got to workout), Kuminga, Mitchell etc who I don't or who concern me a lot more than other options.
But given that this year the Kings front office has had a chance to workout and interview most of these kids and they've so far had a good track record, I'm not going to worry about it. Until they show me that they've screwed up consistently I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. So I don't think I'll get too worked up by who they pick unless I feel like it's a massive reach.
As for Williams, yeah, he's got a slight build. He's also a potential home run swing in possibly the late teens or early 20s where it's worth making those types of gambles. It wouldn't surprise me if he goes a lot higher than most mocks currently have him, but if not, and the Kings could get him at 22 I think that's a bit hard to complain about.
With a very small sample size, McNair has shown himself to at least be a competent GM which this team hasn't had since Petrie. Is Sengun really worth drafting in the top 10? I don't know. But I could say the same for Moody & Wagner (who I like) and guys like Giddey (who no one got to workout), Kuminga, Mitchell etc who I don't or who concern me a lot more than other options.
But given that this year the Kings front office has had a chance to workout and interview most of these kids and they've so far had a good track record, I'm not going to worry about it. Until they show me that they've screwed up consistently I'll give them the benefit of the doubt. So I don't think I'll get too worked up by who they pick unless I feel like it's a massive reach.
As for Williams, yeah, he's got a slight build. He's also a potential home run swing in possibly the late teens or early 20s where it's worth making those types of gambles. It wouldn't surprise me if he goes a lot higher than most mocks currently have him, but if not, and the Kings could get him at 22 I think that's a bit hard to complain about.
I disagree. Sabonis is a very good player. He's had a BPM of over 3 three years in a row and a vorp of 8 in a 3 year stretch. That is most definitely an anti Bagley when you rely on skills and iq rather than your second jump. The physical profile and skillset is very similar to Sabonis who most definitely doesn't struggle defensively in the NBA. Nitpicking is how you lose on on very good players. This type of talent at 9 is a very good value.
Workouts are overrated. Quincy Douby, Papa G, workout marvels. And one of the reasons I'd bet that the Kings have players interested is because of De'Aaron Fox. Now the Kings need to make every move they do make based around that Fox kid. Otherwise we know what happens when they muck everything up around that star. They lose them eventually. I still think after pick 5 or 6 there is not consensus unless you are randomly pulling something out of thin air or focusing too much on advanced stats. With Sengun, everything you see has to be related back to style and differences between leagues as well.
All the prospects at 9 are different based on position and need. And I still think the Kings need to be more concerned with not BLOWING another lotto pick rather than scoring a home run since they've blown too many in the last number of years and their cap is starting to harden. Even if someone ends up a superstar as an offensive player, if you can't fit them in they won't become that here. C'mon, look at Bagley. They still have a number 2 pick with way more potential than anyone at 9 this year rotting away because he never got the green light when he wasn't injured.
Sengun to me is the type of pick they'd put on the backburner and if they think they can afford to do that they are wrong. Especially when definite wing options in a wing dominated league right now will be at 9 that will play now and as such at the very least build value as an asset. If the Kings made the 10th seed last year they are likely out of the window where these wings will be so then it's a crap shoot. They just happened to land in the exact tipping point area of where the legit potential wings will be in this draft. The safer positional gamble to me is a better bet than a non-fit, non-value position gamble even if that player can put up 25 a game. If Sengun is the next Greg Monroe/Kanter, where's the true value there right now?
All the prospects at 9 are different based on position and need. And I still think the Kings need to be more concerned with not BLOWING another lotto pick rather than scoring a home run since they've blown too many in the last number of years and their cap is starting to harden. Even if someone ends up a superstar as an offensive player, if you can't fit them in they won't become that here. C'mon, look at Bagley. They still have a number 2 pick with way more potential than anyone at 9 this year rotting away because he never got the green light when he wasn't injured.
Sengun to me is the type of pick they'd put on the backburner and if they think they can afford to do that they are wrong. Especially when definite wing options in a wing dominated league right now will be at 9 that will play now and as such at the very least build value as an asset. If the Kings made the 10th seed last year they are likely out of the window where these wings will be so then it's a crap shoot. They just happened to land in the exact tipping point area of where the legit potential wings will be in this draft. The safer positional gamble to me is a better bet than a non-fit, non-value position gamble even if that player can put up 25 a game. If Sengun is the next Greg Monroe/Kanter, where's the true value there right now?
I never said he wasn't but his team of decent vets is still stuck in the back end of the lotto just a few picks behind the Kings. Sabonis to me is different as well. He's quicker and flat out faster than Sengun. On both ends. And while Sengun shows passing ability potential, Sabonis is on another level and also clearly their star BTW. No way does Sengun get that kind of role here and that will effect his value from day 1 as a result. And Bagley is plenty skilled BTW. Skilled but not used for those skills, some of the same offensive skills and iso skills you see out of Sengun. So, they can fit in Sengun without a legit 3 ball but Bagley is iced? Nah, not betting on that one. Bottom line, 9 to me has a variety of different types of players and knowing the Kings history, and needs, taking an upside offensive undersized big is asking for trouble.
If Sengun is the pick, they have to clear the decks for him to produce the way they never did for Bagley.
If Sengun is the pick, they have to clear the decks for him to produce the way they never did for Bagley.
I disagree with that. And a max contract already given out disagrees as well. At a certain point the more you fudge around the more your options deplete since only getting marginally better means less options in the draft. Less options in FA and trades since your cap is hardening. The Kings have been through this exact thing 3-4 times since Adelman. They scored on Haliburton and filling the one major hole they have on the wing as that position has only become more valuable and tougher to fill will give them much better odds of improving the way they supposedly want to.
And how you end up passing on Doncic? Again, Doncic was a clear top 5 pick. If the Kings were in that position and Green/Suggs who aren't a fit really either were there that's a totally different story. If Sengun is at 9 he's in a spot of the draft where you clearly don't have a guaranteed Doncic according to the teams above you. Pre NBA Doncic wouldn't last till 9 this year either. If Sengun were perceived as Doncic was he wouldn't be even a remote option at 9. However, relying on workouts do show you have much you can F up a pick since Bagley had a really nice one himself.
And how you end up passing on Doncic? Again, Doncic was a clear top 5 pick. If the Kings were in that position and Green/Suggs who aren't a fit really either were there that's a totally different story. If Sengun is at 9 he's in a spot of the draft where you clearly don't have a guaranteed Doncic according to the teams above you. Pre NBA Doncic wouldn't last till 9 this year either. If Sengun were perceived as Doncic was he wouldn't be even a remote option at 9. However, relying on workouts do show you have much you can F up a pick since Bagley had a really nice one himself.
I don't think there are any superstar wing prospects at 9 so i'm willing to really think outside the box at this pick. I get that a 6'10" post guy sounds like a bad fit in the current NBA, but his profile both negative and positive is very similar to Sabonis who is a very good player and certainly much better than a lot of wings that end up getting taken around this spot yearly.
An even slightly less athletic/quick Sabonis is just like an undersized Jokic. It can make a WORLD of difference. You starting heading into Monroe/Kanter territory at that point. Which is still good, but if you still have the most highly valued position on the wing not filled or filled with GR3/Harkless types you're treading water. If the Kings drafted Sengun and saw the next Jokic/Sabonis that's fine. They better darn well give him the same rope they have withe their teams. I brought this up in another thread. Jokic wasn't Jokic until they got rid of Nurkic and handed the keys over to him. They never do that and you don't have a Jokic.
I just don't think the Kings can afford to take somone and say, "In 5 years he'll be a star!". They've blown too many picks and trades to have that luxury.
I just don't think the Kings can afford to take somone and say, "In 5 years he'll be a star!". They've blown too many picks and trades to have that luxury.