How about Buddy and a 2022 first (top 10 protection) for Will Barton and Jamychal Green? Give the kings far more balance and a deeper bench. You can play Green at the 4 next to bagley where he can defend a bit and space the floor. Barton is a solid shoot and defender and it removes some of the logjam between fox/buddy/hali. Barton would need to agree to opt in to his contract or go for an extension at around the same level.
Off season targets
- Thread starter cwebb2002
- Start date
Sure, it just seems like there aren't many players available in general. Teams like the Kings, Warriors, Pelicans and Pacers have all been rumored to be looking for veteran help in exchange for draft capital and yet the only players I've seen rumored in trades are Ben Simmons and Buddy. Even realistic theoretical trades seem difficult to put together.
Noel has come surprisingly cheap thus far. Over his entire career, the biggest single-year salary that he has had was last year's 1/$5.0M contract with the Knicks. It doesn't really help him that he typically hasn't been a starter (last year and his first two years excepted) and that he doesn't play huge minutes and isn't a scoring threat.
The Knicks have $50M+ in cap space and are going to be throwing around some silly contracts this offseason, but somehow I think they're going to blow that money on big-name players and not Noel. They don't have even Early Bird rights on him, which means that they're going to be limited to offering $6M with non-Bird rights (probably a tad more than the room exception). We can comfortably offer more than that with our MLE without really breaking the bank. Honestly, depending on what our roster looks like (do we make any trades, who do we draft) it might not be a terrible move if we brought back Holmes with the Early Bird at about $11M (if he doesn't get a big offer elsewhere) AND signed Noel to something like $6.5-7M with our MLE to take the "Whiteside-but-we'll-actually-let-him-play" role.
The Knicks have $50M+ in cap space and are going to be throwing around some silly contracts this offseason, but somehow I think they're going to blow that money on big-name players and not Noel. They don't have even Early Bird rights on him, which means that they're going to be limited to offering $6M with non-Bird rights (probably a tad more than the room exception). We can comfortably offer more than that with our MLE without really breaking the bank. Honestly, depending on what our roster looks like (do we make any trades, who do we draft) it might not be a terrible move if we brought back Holmes with the Early Bird at about $11M (if he doesn't get a big offer elsewhere) AND signed Noel to something like $6.5-7M with our MLE to take the "Whiteside-but-we'll-actually-let-him-play" role.
I would think if Holmes does get big offer from CHA, hopefully we can pick up Noel with that 7m MLE the promise of more playing time in front
of Metu and Jones
My biggest concern is that while we wait on CHA to make the Holmes offer, Mavs or Toronto swoop in on Noel
before we get a chance to
I dont think our plans include trying to get both
Timing will be key here
of Metu and Jones
My biggest concern is that while we wait on CHA to make the Holmes offer, Mavs or Toronto swoop in on Noel
before we get a chance to
I dont think our plans include trying to get both
Timing will be key here
I would be perfectly ok with that scenario playing out. I remember being shocked when I found out we got Holmes at $5mil per year and equally as shocked when I saw Noel was making the same last year. Sounds like he has a lot of interest so far. I'm guessing he will wind up with at least an $8mil contract and Holmes somewhere in the $10-12mil range. Noel might require more of a Kings tax since it seems like there are much better teams than us that are interested in him as well.
Either way it's just good to know McNair is most likely interested in fixing the defensive concerns of this team.
Either way it's just good to know McNair is most likely interested in fixing the defensive concerns of this team.
I think this is a super appealing route, even though I do really like some of the wings in this draft. Between Holmes/Noel you're getting 48 minutes of excellent defense and a legit lob threat on offense that doesn't dominate possessions. We were also a total disaster when Holmes was out last year, on both ends honestly, so locking down the C position with 2 quality players is a solid idea.
I do wonder what that would do for Bagley though? If we dedicate 20+ mil (estimated) to the 2 center options, that leaves no room for Bagley to develop any time at the position.
I do wonder what that would do for Bagley though? If we dedicate 20+ mil (estimated) to the 2 center options, that leaves no room for Bagley to develop any time at the position.
If Marvin is still here and this puts the frontline as Noel and Bagley at C and PF then that is a unit very unlike the teams making headway recently. And not in a good way. Draft one of these SG's and they could have the all string bean team for sure. lol. Also the Kings get even more limited in terms of spacing since Noel is pretty much an at the basket player. I mean compare the shots charts here:
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/nerlens-noel-2021-shot-chart
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/2021-richaun-holmes-shot-chart
Noel as a decent cheaper shorter term backup guy is a good call. Maybe even better than bringing Holmes back at a 10+ million a year deal but him being a starter, let alone anything more than what you got out of Whiteside in the games he played is questionable.
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/nerlens-noel-2021-shot-chart
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/2021-richaun-holmes-shot-chart
Noel as a decent cheaper shorter term backup guy is a good call. Maybe even better than bringing Holmes back at a 10+ million a year deal but him being a starter, let alone anything more than what you got out of Whiteside in the games he played is questionable.
As stated, is that a bad thing? Especially Theis, if I were Monte he'd be my main target anyway. He's a decent defender, comfortable in switch, isn't big body much like Holmes but Noel is like the one guy that makes Holmes look like a heavyweight anyway. Here is Theis' shot chart:
https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/daniel-theis-shot-chart
Yeah, I think the Kings could use that kind of spacing. He's not a great 3 point shooter but he's also not a super high volume one so it's not terrible.
When you look back at last year, the thing that jumps out is that the Kings had the worst defense of all time. I personally don't look back and think they could have won 5-10 more games if they just had a floor spacer at the 5. A lot of things stick out about last year but spacing isn't one of them. Holmes getting bullied by a decent amount of the bigger centers does stick out though.
Honestly I don't even consider Bagley as a piece moving forward. If the Kings have Holmes/Noel as the 5, I'm envisioning Barnes, Harkless type free agent, Wagner, Jalen Johnson etc sharing minutes at the 3-4 next to those guys. If Bagley is in the mix then the defense is probably going to be bad regardless of who else is in there.
Our perimeter defense from our best guards is so bad that we can't afford to go with a floor spacing type center that's just okay on defense. The team needs balance on the defensive end more than it needs the paint open even more for a player we have that's already scoring 25ppg. It would be nice to be able to get a Brook Lopez type player but that's not realistic.
Honestly I don't even consider Bagley as a piece moving forward. If the Kings have Holmes/Noel as the 5, I'm envisioning Barnes, Harkless type free agent, Wagner, Jalen Johnson etc sharing minutes at the 3-4 next to those guys. If Bagley is in the mix then the defense is probably going to be bad regardless of who else is in there.
Our perimeter defense from our best guards is so bad that we can't afford to go with a floor spacing type center that's just okay on defense. The team needs balance on the defensive end more than it needs the paint open even more for a player we have that's already scoring 25ppg. It would be nice to be able to get a Brook Lopez type player but that's not realistic.
If they think adding Noel is going to help drastically on it's own then this team is doomed. He'll help but most of that badness was attributed to the fact that as a coach in his first 2 seasons Walton is horrendous prior to the deadline. Spacing wasn't an issue mainly because Holmes wasn't totally inadequate as a spacer as indicated in the shot charts. Noel not having that same floater is huge. There are obviously benefits to a player like Noel but this team can't consider what they've done as something to build on if they get significantly worse in spreading the floor which is mandatory now.
And this didn't sound like it had to do with the idea of Holmes/Noel as your center rotation, which is interesting, but rather replacing one with the other. Yeah, if they play small I think it would be OK and if Bagley continues to shoot like he did it will help but Bagley/Noel is not something I think would be wise to pair up if the cost is too high.
And this didn't sound like it had to do with the idea of Holmes/Noel as your center rotation, which is interesting, but rather replacing one with the other. Yeah, if they play small I think it would be OK and if Bagley continues to shoot like he did it will help but Bagley/Noel is not something I think would be wise to pair up if the cost is too high.
Well obviously nothing is going to drastically help this team other than getting an all star but adding one of the best defensive centers to the worst defensive team in history has got to have some sort of positive impact.
Spacing isn't a huge issue when you have Fox handling, 3 shooters and a player like Noel at the 5. That's what the pick and roll is for. Spacing would be a big issue if you had Noel and Simmons or Noel and Holmes out there at the same time. I'm not worried about centers that can't shoot. There are a ton of them around the league that have done just fine without a 3 point shot. There's only a select few that can defend and shoot well enough to spread the floor and those guys aren't available.
The Kings are in trouble if they're making decisions based on building around Bagley right now. If this was 2 or 3 years ago I'd be perfectly fine with it but the writing is starting to be written on the wall at this point. A Bagley/anyone available to the Kings pairing is a bad pairing at this point. Either Bagley proves he can play or he needs to be gone but they can't play him at the 5 and win and they can't forego defense to try and make the offense a little better. There needs to be balance.
Spacing isn't a huge issue when you have Fox handling, 3 shooters and a player like Noel at the 5. That's what the pick and roll is for. Spacing would be a big issue if you had Noel and Simmons or Noel and Holmes out there at the same time. I'm not worried about centers that can't shoot. There are a ton of them around the league that have done just fine without a 3 point shot. There's only a select few that can defend and shoot well enough to spread the floor and those guys aren't available.
The Kings are in trouble if they're making decisions based on building around Bagley right now. If this was 2 or 3 years ago I'd be perfectly fine with it but the writing is starting to be written on the wall at this point. A Bagley/anyone available to the Kings pairing is a bad pairing at this point. Either Bagley proves he can play or he needs to be gone but they can't play him at the 5 and win and they can't forego defense to try and make the offense a little better. There needs to be balance.
I would think so. And if that were the center pairing it's not bad as long as those deals are not super long considering if it doesn't work, then it's likely rebuild on the fly time. And having an overpaid veteran center rotation that's not exactly the prototype you see deep in the playoffs will be a bit of a rock to crawl out from under on top of the other cap boulders already there.