Marvin Bagley unbreaks hand!
- Thread starter Tetsujin
- Start date
Marvin has some basic issues on defense with a lack of fundamentals. The fact he wasn’t is Sac working on how to close out and stay down in his stance was disappointing. Marvin is well on his way to being mentioned with Darko in NBA lore.
That all being said, I would not get rid of him especially if we get the 9th pick as I expect. I think playing with Haliburton will be positive for him. He has physical talent so maybe he will pull his head out of his ass.
That all being said, I would not get rid of him especially if we get the 9th pick as I expect. I think playing with Haliburton will be positive for him. He has physical talent so maybe he will pull his head out of his ass.
There are number of things I wish Marvin did better, but I think most of it is corrected with time and experience. Unfortunately for him, injuries have taken away what he needs most, which is on court exposure to situations. But his talent is undeniable.
I go back and forth between wanting him to stay and thinking that a fresh somewhere else is best for him.
I go back and forth between wanting him to stay and thinking that a fresh somewhere else is best for him.
1) if you have doctors on staff, why NOT check the finger daily, change the splint, ect.?
2) when marvin returned, walton said, "he is a long way from game shape" - that indicates that the coach was not impressed with the shape he had kept himself in.
i disagree that only playing in games can keep you in game shape.; harden started the season in terrible shape but other guys (think jerry rice) are at full speed immediately because of their rigorous workouts.
3) marvin was in arizona where his dad lives. marvin's dad is a helicopter dad, hovering over his career (and coached his aau team). is there some reason to suppose that marvin is tuned in to the coaching staff rather than his father? if so, why not remain in sac where the coaching staff is?
belli was a different case, a guy at the end f his contract who might not get another. marvin is or was the future of the franchise.
4) if marvin has a low post game, i haven't seen it (although he is shooting threes at a decent rate). does he have a jump hook? is he a dunker? just what would you say his low post go-to move IS?
I've done a lot of thinking on Bagley. I've been a supporter of his since we drafted him, and I tried to stay away from the Doncic comparisons because they're nonproductive, and unfair to Bagley. He didn't ask to be drafted before Doncic, so to my mind, he came to the team with a clean slate. But it soon became obvious to me, that up until he arrived in the NBA, Bagley had been able to dominate with his athleticism and length. He was taller and quicker, and could jump higher than most of the opposition. That ended when he got to the NBA.
Don't get me wrong, those things still mattered, and certainly helped him, but he no longer automatically dominated. He was mostly looked at as a post player, but to these old eyes, he lacks the polish of a good post player. I didn't see the pump fakes or drop steps and reverse spin moves that players like Elton Brand, Hakeem Olajuwon, Bernard King, Adrian Dantley and most of the great post players used. And the results showed that. While that surprised me to some extent, I figured that it was something that he would develop along with the rest of his offense.
But here we are almost at the end of year three, and I can't honestly say that I've seen dramatic improvement in his game. Not the kind of improvement that I would expect from a player that many thought had the potential to become a superstar. There has been improvement! His outside shot is much better. He has a nice mid-range shot, which unfortunately he seldom uses. But in the post, he's still the same player. He's still trying to out quick his opposition, and with a scoring percentage of 71% at the basket, or within three feet of the basket, one could say, what's the problem.
I guess you could say there isn't one, until you find out that Barnes, Holmes, Whiteside, Fox, and even Metu score at a higher percentage within three feet of the basket than Bagley. And that Bagleys scoring percentage at the basket is almost identical this season as it was his first season. His rebounds per minute are almost identical to his first season. In other words, there hasn't been much improvement across the board. Now I can argue that there are many reasons for that outcome, and it's mostly lack of time on the floor. In three years, he's played in slightly more than half of the available games. And that matters!
So the looming question is, what is Bagley's future with the team going forward? Well, if I'm reading the tea leaves, my guess is that he doesn't have one. GM's tend to favor players that they drafted, and McNair didn't draft Bagley, any more than he hired Walton, who is also likely gone at years end (please God). I think the organization is ready to move on from Bagley. His on again and off again availability due to injuries has become more of a nuisance than a serious problem. He's sort of like a ghost that's hanging around. Somewhere!
I know that sounds a little harsh, but I've reached the point where I just don't care anymore. If he shows up one day and plays like a superstar, I'll be happy as a clam. But until that day happens, and I doubt it will in a Kings uniform, I simply don't care. I still wish him all the best, and I have no ill will towards him. But all my attention is on the team, and he hasn't been a part of the team for half of his professional career. At least not an active part.
I know I could have talked about his defense, but it would be hard to attack one horse without attacking the entire stable. Lets face it, when your last in the league in defense, you can't blame it on just one player. It's a team effort. Or lack thereof.. The Kings are also last in transition defense. The King are last in defense after a made basket. As a matter of fact, the Kings are last in almost every defensive category. To my mind, when your last in everything, but you have players on your team that have previously been good defenders, then it's mostly a coaching problem. I'll leave it at that.
Don't get me wrong, those things still mattered, and certainly helped him, but he no longer automatically dominated. He was mostly looked at as a post player, but to these old eyes, he lacks the polish of a good post player. I didn't see the pump fakes or drop steps and reverse spin moves that players like Elton Brand, Hakeem Olajuwon, Bernard King, Adrian Dantley and most of the great post players used. And the results showed that. While that surprised me to some extent, I figured that it was something that he would develop along with the rest of his offense.
But here we are almost at the end of year three, and I can't honestly say that I've seen dramatic improvement in his game. Not the kind of improvement that I would expect from a player that many thought had the potential to become a superstar. There has been improvement! His outside shot is much better. He has a nice mid-range shot, which unfortunately he seldom uses. But in the post, he's still the same player. He's still trying to out quick his opposition, and with a scoring percentage of 71% at the basket, or within three feet of the basket, one could say, what's the problem.
I guess you could say there isn't one, until you find out that Barnes, Holmes, Whiteside, Fox, and even Metu score at a higher percentage within three feet of the basket than Bagley. And that Bagleys scoring percentage at the basket is almost identical this season as it was his first season. His rebounds per minute are almost identical to his first season. In other words, there hasn't been much improvement across the board. Now I can argue that there are many reasons for that outcome, and it's mostly lack of time on the floor. In three years, he's played in slightly more than half of the available games. And that matters!
So the looming question is, what is Bagley's future with the team going forward? Well, if I'm reading the tea leaves, my guess is that he doesn't have one. GM's tend to favor players that they drafted, and McNair didn't draft Bagley, any more than he hired Walton, who is also likely gone at years end (please God). I think the organization is ready to move on from Bagley. His on again and off again availability due to injuries has become more of a nuisance than a serious problem. He's sort of like a ghost that's hanging around. Somewhere!
I know that sounds a little harsh, but I've reached the point where I just don't care anymore. If he shows up one day and plays like a superstar, I'll be happy as a clam. But until that day happens, and I doubt it will in a Kings uniform, I simply don't care. I still wish him all the best, and I have no ill will towards him. But all my attention is on the team, and he hasn't been a part of the team for half of his professional career. At least not an active part.
I know I could have talked about his defense, but it would be hard to attack one horse without attacking the entire stable. Lets face it, when your last in the league in defense, you can't blame it on just one player. It's a team effort. Or lack thereof.. The Kings are also last in transition defense. The King are last in defense after a made basket. As a matter of fact, the Kings are last in almost every defensive category. To my mind, when your last in everything, but you have players on your team that have previously been good defenders, then it's mostly a coaching problem. I'll leave it at that.
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I agree with just about everything you said. I would add that although Bagley shoots a lower percentage than a few of the players on the team at the rim, he is also asked to create his shot more often than those other players. Outside of Fox of course. Catching a pick and roll lob from Fox when the defense is keyed in on him, is not as difficult as attempting to score one on one. It can be argued that Bagley shouldn't try to score one on one, but then I think the team would be wasting an important attribute.
Well, 64.6% of his shots inside the three point line are assisted and 91% of his three pt attempts are assisted. That means that roughly 35% of his shots are self created, and I don't have the stats on what percentage of those are successful. However, my point wasn't as much about him shooting a lower percentage than some of his teammates, but more about his lack of improvement over the last three years. As I said, it is somewhat understandable with the injuries. But at the same time, a GM has to deal with results, not excuses, regardless of what they are.
It’s certainly not fair to blame all the defensive problems on Marvin. But my bigger problem is we are three years in and his defensive footwork is no better. Nothing about a broken hand stops you from working on your defensive footwork.
I think the myth of Bagley being a hard worker has been put to rest. I started pretty positive on the kid but this last month was the deal breaker. He has all the physical tools to be a top NBA player but sadly it seems to stop there.
I think the myth of Bagley being a hard worker has been put to rest. I started pretty positive on the kid but this last month was the deal breaker. He has all the physical tools to be a top NBA player but sadly it seems to stop there.