Still defending Vlade? (split from game thread)

[Showtime]

Fox is in year 3. This is when he should start coming into his own as a point guard. He’s ahead of schedule.

Marvin is oozing with potential - and still very raw. By the end of next year - he will be a beast. He and Richaun could be a front court that other teams fear - the wrecking crew.

Buddy is going to make shots and Barnes is pretty steady. There is a lot to like going forward.

What games are you watching?

Buddy is wildly inconsistent. Same with Barnes, who can look like the #1 iso go-to option to invisible very quickly. Buddy cannot seem to get his game together and still makes poor decisions and hasn't improved defensively.

Fox is great if he can stay on the court.

Nothing that Bagley has shown has indicated that vast improvement is a forgone conclusion. That's a tremendous "TBD" with him. I hope he does, but there isn't exactly signs that's happening. Yes, he's been hurt, but even if he wasn't he's in the situation where foul trouble and defense keeps him out of games.

 

[Showtime]

Yep.

Why do you think Vivek hired him?

Myself and a couple others put forth the idea of Vlade remaining in a POBO role with an actual GM making personnel decisions (or vice versa with the titles). Vlade can remain the public face while others make the basketball decisions.

 

[Joshoua]

yeah Vlade was saved by the swap. If he was 3 we might have picked Josh Jackson.

We pick swapped from 3 to 5. Boston had Brooklyn’s #1. Philly then traded 3 (plus more) for 1, I believe?

We probably still have Fox but I remember draft day reports saying “The Kings like Fox but they LOVE Josh Jackson.” So maybe him without the swap. Lol

Ya my bad but I belive we walk out Ruth Jackson or fultz that year without the swap. Vlade would have traded up for fultz the hype was high for him coming out and we would have all supported it and of course Jackson was ranked higher that fox and we apparently liked him

 

[okrim]

Ya my bad but I belive we walk out Ruth Jackson or fultz that year without the swap. Vlade would have traded up for fultz the hype was high for him coming out and we would have all supported it and of course Jackson was ranked higher that fox and we apparently liked him

There are many things to have a go at Vlade for but this one seems odd to me. He wanted Fox all along.

 

[Joshoua]

There are many things to have a go at Vlade for but this one seems odd to me. He wanted Fox all along.

I’m not going at him I’m actually using this to defend the 76ers pick trade and I think that’s how it would’ve came out. Just cause they say they focused on Fox doesn’t make it true it’ll make sense to say that about the guy you drafted.

 

[okrim]

I’m not going at him I’m actually using this to defend the 76ers pick trade and I think that’s how it would’ve came out. Just cause they say they focused on Fox doesn’t make it true it’ll make sense to say that about the guy you drafted.

There were reports that the Kings were trying to move up before the draft in order to secure Fox because they were concerned Phoenix would pick him. I don't agree with the assertion that they would've taken Jackson ahead of Fox as their actions (according to the reports anyway) before the draft and after all point to that.

The Fultz part I won't comment on but as you said most people would've supported that move.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

I’m pretty sure they were going Mitchell if Fox was gone. They had Mitchell in twice and there were a lot of rumors draft week that Mitchell was going to sneak into the top 5.

 

[est.1999]

At this point, I’m rooting for highest pick possible and vlade being fired. I’m going to give this team one more chance at redemption and then I’m out.

 

[miltonap]

I've never been on the fire Vlade wagon. Ever, I could usually always see the thought process and idea behind his moves. And I appreciated the fact he was a people and seemingly good person in an organization that desperately needed a culture change.

But the Bagley over Doncic decision was definitely unacceptable. The Giles situation doesn't make me feel too great either.

I think the Bagley decision really is a fireable offense.

 

[L'Optimisme]

I've never been on the fire Vlade wagon. Ever, I could usually always see the thought process and idea behind his moves. And I appreciated the fact he was a people and seemingly good person in an organization that desperately needed a culture change.

But the Bagley over Doncic decision was definitely unacceptable. The Giles situation doesn't make me feel too great either.

I think the Bagley decision really is a fireable offense.

Did you say so at the time?

 

[L'Optimisme]

At this point, I’m rooting for highest pick possible and vlade being fired. I’m going to give this team one more chance at redemption and then I’m out.

Contrary to my persona I'm not above criticizing, and some may remember I was livid over the Cousins trade...

MOD NOTE: Portions of this post have been removed.

 

[L'Optimisme]

I just deleted a huge post in response. What’s the point. No matter what we post. No matter how many times we show you how inept this franchise and vlade are, you are a kings fan and choose not to acknowledge it. That’s cool. The kings desperately need fans like you. I just choose not to drink the red cool-aide. And I fully acknowledge that you are probably a lot happier for it too. Have a great New Years........

Nothing wrong with being a critical fan when it's warranted. Nothing wrong with having a preference for a critical view in general. What I don't tolerate are fans that resent people who prefer to be positive because they see that as a threat to their worldview. I'm glad you're not like this. Losing streaks always generate blame that seeks an outlet and it's beyond predictable that the firing of a coach or gm will be called for during one. It just strikes me as reactionary. I'm hearing a lot of "I told you so's" and threats to stop being a fan, both of which I find very weak. Criticize the team. Critizize decisions. Criticize leadership. But be open to rebuts.

The following is not directed at you, but: I made one single point, and it's pissing people off - namely, the fact that our top two stars have missed significant time this season weakens the argument about placing the blame solely on Vlade for the this season's woes . Some people on here are behaving like absolute children, and the reaction to me making a logical point during this hysteria is a sign that people are really just looking to satisfy an emotional need for a scapegoat.

I will not apologize for being excruciatingly insightful about the behavior and motives of people on this board.

And Happy New Year!!

 

[chief bromden]

Contrary to my persona I'm not above criticizing, and some may remember I was livid over the Cousins trade...

MOD NOTE: Portions of this post have been removed.

What was your previous name?

 

[fansinceday1]

What was your previous name?

I was just gonna ask that!
It’s oddly familiar.........

 

[burekijogurt]

What was your previous name?

I was just gonna ask that!
It’s oddly familiar.........

Can't touch this!

 

[peacelate]

Even if the Kings get a high draft pick, Vlade will most certainly blow it. His talent evaluation cannot be trusted, and that is very concerning when you're a small market team that cannot attract free agents.

 

[The_Jamal]

At this point, I’m rooting for highest pick possible and vlade being fired. I’m going to give this team one more chance at redemption and then I’m out.

Yep, I want this thing to bottom out as quickly and hard as possible. The absolute worst thing that can happen is we win 34 games, get the 11th pick in the draft and everyone gets to coast into next year on that "we'll be fine if there's no injuries" and we waste another 2 years with this core going absolutely nowhere.

 

[Groovygreg]

Besides Holmes, and some might argue Joseph to some extent, Vlade invested money (and too much of it at that) in the wrong players. Barnes and Hield are not good values in the grand scheme of things, and the $39 million dollar man (aka Dedmon) obviously has been a complete bust. These types of burdensome contracts serve to decimate a franchise long-struggling to put something other an inferior product on the court. Poor decisions on personnel ultimately will spell curtains for Divac.

 

[Groovygreg]

So what's your point? Keep Vlade because the next guy might be worse? What kind of logic is that? I don't trust Vivek either but this team is heading back into the lottery and you can't trust Vlade to make the right draft pick when he's shown over and over that he usually gets it wrong (especially on the biggest draft pick of them all)

With the exception of Fox, Vlade's drafts have been poor. It's really not even debatable.

Papagiannis and Malachi Richardson are out of the league. Frank Mason (high second round pick) is essentially out of the league. Skal (who they gave up on and actually was a decent late first round pick) was traded for a guy that will be out of the league soon. Justin Jackson sucks and may be out of the league soon. Harry Giles they gave up on already and apparently they're expecting him to be out of the league soon too. Cauley-Stein's career is plummeting and he may be out of the league soon too.

You then throw in an underwhelming Bagley who can't stay healthy and a bunch of other second round picks that have not amounted to anything (while other teams are finding some absolute gems in the second round.....) and all we're left with is Fox. One good draft selection in five years.

That synopsis would be funny - if it wasn’t so disheartening in its accuracy.

 

[upinsmoke]

Please Vlade step down.

 

[Kings_of_California]

Bagley over Doncic is legitimately Bowie over Jordan level bad. It's actually on that level.

Was Bowie consensus #1 back in the day or was Jordan the obvious pick? Actual question, I have no idea.

 

[forza kings]

I never understood what made Vlade Divac qualify for a GM of an NBA franchise. He was a great player. Probably could’ve made a good coach with his high basketball IQ and personality, but a GM? I don’t think so.

 

[fnordius]

I never understood what made Vlade Divac qualify for a GM of an NBA franchise.

I was thinking about this recently. Geoff didn't always have an easy go of it, but got his degree in sociology from Princeton. PDA went to relatively obscure schools, ending up with qualifications to be a less than great lawyer. Vlade was playing professionally when he was in his last year of high school, with an emphasis on mechanical engineering, but I don't know if he finished.

I really don't know what qualifies one for that job!

 

[Livinthedream]

Bagley over Doncic is legitimately Bowie over Jordan level bad. It's actually on that level.

Was Bowie consensus #1 back in the day or was Jordan the obvious pick? Actual question, I have no idea.

Olajuwan was the #1 pick. Jordan was not a consensus pick. If I remember what I read correctly, the Bulls weren't enamored with him because they wanted a Center.

 

[SLAB]

I really don't know what qualifies one for that job!

Easy; The fans and radio talking heads love him and forgive/excuse his awfulness. It shows a false sense of steadiness in what has been a trainwreck of a franchise.

 

[miltonap]

Did you say so at the time?

I was super pissed and thought they effed up but gave them the benefit of the doubt at the time

 

[SLAB]

I was super pissed and thought they effed up but gave them the benefit of the doubt at the time

I immediatly posted an explitive meme on my IG and bailed on this board for a few months because I was so distraught. Lol

 

[Sactown ExPat]

I was thinking about this recently. Geoff didn't always have an easy go of it, but got his degree in sociology from Princeton. PDA went to relatively obscure schools, ending up with qualifications to be a less than great lawyer. Vlade was playing professionally when he was in his last year of high school, with an emphasis on mechanical engineering, but I don't know if he finished.

I really don't know what qualifies one for that job!

Are we really pretending one needs a prestigious degree, if any, to be a GM?

 

[fnordius]

Are we really pretending one needs a prestigious degree, if any, to be a GM?

Not at all, but some sort of evidence of managerial competence, or at least some slight training on the subject, might be nice. None of our recent GMs has had that.

 

[L'Optimisme]

What was your previous name?

I am... The Hammer.