Who do we draft?

[Jimbob]

@Jimbob
Totally understandable and we were typing our posts around the same time.

Your point still stands, Philly is sitting pretty. I am wondering if we can use our better pick and maybe Richardson or someone else to move up a few spots and grab at least one player we really want, if getting in to top 3 proves futile.

I would think some upward movement in this draft is possible, especially seeing many of the teams before us have covered the two strong positions in the draft. Sounds like Fultz goes #1 regardless, but say Jackson or Fox really seem high on our list then Vlade and crew have young pieces and that 2nd draft pick to offer.
It might seem a lot to give up but if there is star potential or a seemingly great fit higher in the draft, what do you do.

 

[dude12]

Not that anyone asked, but here's my Big Board (just prospect related, not taking teams into account)

1.Fultz
2.Jackson
3.Ball
4.Fox
5.Tatum
6. Monk
7. Collins
8. Ntilikina
9. Isaac
10. DSJ
11. Markkanen

Interesting list and could be accurate but after reading up on some of the mock lists and other sources, I think the upside potential of your 9, 10 and 11 may see them much earlier. The first 3 seem to be locks as of now. I personally don't think there is anyway that Ntilinka goes before DSJ....I think DSJ could go very high due to the explosiveness displayed and star potential as opposed to settling for Ntilinka who was described as a utility guard type.....good pick but not star potential.

Also think that Isaac has big time potential due to his length and think he is a wildcard. I see Monk falling to back part of top 11 somewhere and others rising.....literally have no feel for Collins but there sure are a lot of guys on here banging his drum.

 

[funkykingston]

Ntilikina and Monk wouldn't be my first choice pairing but I could see it working.

I don't know if Ntilinka has star potential (I think he needs to show the ability to get a step on defenders/more burst to have a chance at that) but he can be a very good defender, unselfish PG and a decent scorer. Then Monk could play a Lou Williams/Jamal Crawford/Bobby Jackson role as a sixth man and scoring PG.

 

[kingdivac]

Collins has been the next guy I've watched some tape on and man I'm wondering why the heck I waited so long. In virtually any other class, he'd be an easy top 5 pick. I've moved him way up my draft board and would grab him at 10 without question. Would even consider him at 8 if the board isn't looking all too favorable.

I think what stands out most of all is his outstanding floor presence for a young big man. If you never told me he was a 19 year old freshman, I would have thought he'd been playing for 4 years in college already. He's a very smooth (and good) athlete on both ends of the floor and you always feel like he's in the right place, making the right play and being insanely effective while doing so (70% TS with a 24% USG is crazy). He doesn't have Markkanen's offensive upside as a pure scorer, but he's still very skilled on that end and I do think he'll be able to extend his range to the 3pt line with his nice shot. He's a very capable rim-runner off the PnR and has the athleticism to finish plays effectively. Was a very effective rebounder in limited minutes at 18% TRB and is one of those players who goes and gets the ball rather than waits for it to come to him. With some rebounding concerns from the 3 guys we do have on the roster, this is a big plus in my eyes.

His post game is certainly better than Markkanen right now and his footwork is absolutely incredible for a 19 year old big man . He has that half-hook with both hands, the up and under move, the strength to finish with contact and great patience in the post.

I really like his upside as a rim protector at the next level as his timing on contesting shots is excellent. He's very active on the defensive end and always looking to put a hand up to contest shots.I don't have any concerns about his frame (although he could obviously continue to work on his body), as he looks ready now to compete in the paint against NBA bigs.

Really, the only major concern I have is he didn't get a lot of floor time this season. He flat out dominated in his minutes in all aspects, but I wish he we could have seen what he would have done with 30 MPG as opposed to 15. He's not a great passer at all yet, but with how skilled of an offensive player he is, I think that can be developed in time. He got in foul trouble too often this season, but that's to be expected with a young big man and how active he is on the defensive end

In Short:

The Good:
Post Game
Feel/Footwork
Athleticism
Rim-Protection with excellent timing
Quality Mid-range jumper that should extend to the 3pt line
High Energy
Size/Length/Frame
Rebounding
Can play the 4 and 5foot

The Bad:
Limited minutes
No Passing/Playmaking ability
Foul Prone

Not nearly as enamored with Collins as you are from his highlights....his foot speed is lacking, although he obviously has very keen shot blocking ability. I wonder about his offensive game translation in the NBA. His lack of foot speed will make him easier to guard. He does appear to have good range on his shot. He seems like a role player type in the NBA....something close to Kaminsky or at best Brad Miller without the passing ability and better shot blocking.. Too safe a pick with lower ceiling. Realize he's only a freshman, but would not want someone who could potentially end up another Spencer Hawes on the low side.

 

[The_Jamal]

Not nearly as enamored with Collins as you are from his highlights....his foot speed is lacking, although he obviously has very keen shot blocking ability. I wonder about his offensive game translation in the NBA. His lack of foot speed will make him easier to guard. He does appear to have good range on his shot. He seems like a role player type in the NBA....something close to Kaminsky or at best Brad Miller without the passing ability and better shot blocking.. Too safe a pick with lower ceiling. Realize he's only a freshman, but would not want someone who could potentially end up another Spencer Hawes on the low side.

Huh?

1. Highlights are a bad way to get a feel for a player

2. Collins is a very good athlete. Even still, footspeed means very little to me for a big man. It's far more about his lateral quickness and explosive ability, both of which are very good. It's not like we're asking him to play SF and guard on the perimeter the whole game.

3. Collins does not have a low ceiling whatsoever. He has very real 2-way potential and his footwork and patience in the post along with a great jumper is special for a big man his size. I don't see how you can call his ceiling low when ball-handling and playmaking are the only things he can't do at a really high level. Which.... isn't a problem for a big man.

That move at :25 seconds is what I'm talking about. Patience, fantastic foot-work, ability to finish with the left-hand and a little dream-shake on top. There aren't many bigs left in the NBA who can pull off that kind of post move.

 

[kingdivac]

Huh?

1. Highlights are a bad way to get a feel for a player

2. Collins is a very good athlete. Even still, footspeed means very little to me for a big man. It's far more about his lateral quickness and explosive ability, both of which are very good. It's not like we're asking him to play SF and guard on the perimeter the whole game.

3. Collins does not have a low ceiling whatsoever. He has very real 2-way potential and his footwork and patience in the post along with a great jumper is special for a big man his size. I don't see how you can call his ceiling low when ball-handling and playmaking are the only things he can't do at a really high level. Which.... isn't a problem for a big man.

That move at :25 seconds is what I'm talking about. Patience, fantastic foot-work, ability to finish with the left-hand and a little dream-shake on top. There aren't many bigs left in the NBA who can pull off that kind of post move.

He doesn't look like a very good athlete - more like a good athlete. Foot speed in the NBA means quite a bit for any player in any position - don't kid yourself - to say otherwise is just plain wrong. I didn't see great lateral quickness like Cauley-Stein, but I did see very good/quick reactions in his blocking and decent footwork. However, top tier guards in the NBA will eat Collins up on Pick-and-Rolls, and likewise smaller players in the NBA will strip the ball from him with regularity if he puts the ball down near the rim. His shot blocking ability is where he stands out - he could be the best shot-blocker in the draft - he obviously has excellent reactions....but I wouldn't draft someone based on that alone. Kings already have Cauley-Stein. Collins might be an upgrade at backup Center - he looks better than Papa right now, but I doubt he'll be an All-Star.... like I said, Kaminsky is the best comparison with a bit better athleticism....I dont see Collins starting, at least not for a couple years. I could be wrong, he could develop into a good player, but I just don't see a starter (yet) much less ever an All-Star - that's lower ceiling imo. I would rather the Kings get Issac or to a lesser degree Markennen - or even trade down for 1 lower pick now and a pick in 2019 for their #10. Who knows you may get your wish, and they draft Collins anyway.....they might draft Collins for his shot blocking alone.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

The folks praising Collins are correct in their evaluations. His post play is very advanced. He is a terrific big man prospect. He would be a tough call for me if I were in Vlade's shoes. It's not hard to imagine that Collins ends up being better center than WCS and Papa in 5-6 years. But, do you invest in a marginally better center prospect with the opportunity cost of grabbing a wing prospect? Tough call. I would probably lean heavily on Joerger's input regarding projected development of all three centers.

 

[kingsboi]

Huh?

1. Highlights are a bad way to get a feel for a player

2. Collins is a very good athlete. Even still, footspeed means very little to me for a big man. It's far more about his lateral quickness and explosive ability, both of which are very good. It's not like we're asking him to play SF and guard on the perimeter the whole game.

3. Collins does not have a low ceiling whatsoever. He has very real 2-way potential and his footwork and patience in the post along with a great jumper is special for a big man his size. I don't see how you can call his ceiling low when ball-handling and playmaking are the only things he can't do at a really high level. Which.... isn't a problem for a big man.

That move at :25 seconds is what I'm talking about. Patience, fantastic foot-work, ability to finish with the left-hand and a little dream-shake on top. There aren't many bigs left in the NBA who can pull off that kind of post move.

I only saw one jumpshot attempted in that video. Is he a capable mid range/deep shooter? He seems to have nice form so there is no reason to believe he can't be an adequate shooter.

 

[Kingster]

Your right about making a deal with the Suns regardless of whether their number one, or number three. Move up into the top three, and you definitely solve one of your problems, either at PG or SF. As far as Fultz goes, he only made one mistake last year, and that was committing to Washington. Although it didn't hurt him as for as where he'll get drafted, because he will be the first pick in the draft. I can talk about Ball, and pick out quite a few things that bother me. When I talk about Fultz, the only thing I can think of, is that I wish his focus was a little better on defense. That's it folks! He has no obvious flaws that leap out at you. He has the makings of a superstar.

If it's that obvious about Fultz, then it's unlikely whoever has the #1 pick will trade it, no matter what they are offered.

 

[The_Jamal]

I only saw one jumpshot attempted in that video. Is he a capable mid range/deep shooter? He seems to have nice form so there is no reason to believe he can't be an adequate shooter.

yeah, he has a really nice shot and a good release; just didn't take many attempts. That probably goes back to the limited minutes he got this season as we really don't know what a full offensive game from him looks like with 30+ minutes. But he definitely comes in with a good jumper.

 

[The_Jamal]

He doesn't look like a very good athlete - more like a good athlete. Foot speed in the NBA means quite a bit for any player in any position - don't kid yourself - to say otherwise is just plain wrong. I didn't see great lateral quickness like Cauley-Stein, but I did see very good/quick reactions in his blocking and decent footwork. However, top tier guards in the NBA will eat Collins up on Pick-and-Rolls, and likewise smaller players in the NBA will strip the ball from him with regularity if he puts the ball down near the rim. His shot blocking ability is where he stands out - he could be the best shot-blocker in the draft - he obviously has excellent reactions....but I wouldn't draft someone based on that alone. Kings already have Cauley-Stein. Collins might be an upgrade at backup Center - he looks better than Papa right now, but I doubt he'll be an All-Star.... like I said, Kaminsky is the best comparison with a bit better athleticism....I dont see Collins starting, at least not for a couple years. I could be wrong, he could develop into a good player, but I just don't see a starter (yet) much less ever an All-Star - that's lower ceiling imo. I would rather the Kings get Issac or to a lesser degree Markennen - or even trade down for 1 lower pick now and a pick in 2019 for their #10. Who knows you may get your wish, and they draft Collins anyway.....they might draft Collins for his shot blocking alone.

The comparing white players to other white players thing is lazy analysis. Drives me nuts when people do it, same when people compare Euros to other Euros.

Collins and Kaminsky are completely different players. Collins for starters was 3 years younger than Kaminsky when he comes out (important to remember) and he already has a far better post-game and footwork repertoire than Kaminsky does. Collins can actually rebound at a high level while Frank somehow had less than a 10% TRB last season (and we thought we had a low-rebounding big in WCS...) Kaminsky took 355 3s last year, compared to 175 shots at the rim; he's basically the pure definition of a stretch big with his low rebounding numbers.

So other than Collins being a much better athlete (don't kid yourself on the "bit better"), better rebounder, better post-player, playing inside-out rather than outside-in and being a better rim protector, they are exactly the same player.

 

[Kingsfan23]

Would you move the pick for Boston's Brooklyn 18?

I'm thinking if they land a top PG pick but fell in love with Collins/Markannen who dropped as well to help their front court?

 

[KingsFanSince85]

The folks praising Collins are correct in their evaluations. His post play is very advanced. He is a terrific big man prospect. He would be a tough call for me if I were in Vlade's shoes. It's not hard to imagine that Collins ends up being better center than WCS and Papa in 5-6 years. But, do you invest in a marginally better center prospect with the opportunity cost of grabbing a wing prospect? Tough call. I would probably lean heavily on Joerger's input regarding projected development of all three centers.

I think it's been proven time and time again throughout the history of the draft that the best thing to do is take the very best player that's available to you. If that player happens to play a position you're already loaded at, so be it. The more good and talented players you have -- the more options you have.

The best example is and always will be the Blazers passing on Michael Jordan in favor of Sam Bowie because they already had a 2-guard in Clyde Drexler. Obviously, the Kings won't have that same level of predicament with their draft position and current talent on the team -- but the point remains. Take the best player available and sort it all out later.

 

[The_Jamal]

Would you move the pick for Boston's Brooklyn 18?

I'm thinking if they land a top PG pick but fell in love with Collins/Markannen who dropped as well to help their front court?

This just isn't the draft to move down in. No matter who's there at 10, he has a chance of being a really damn good player. And we have plenty of youth depth (Buddy, Skal, Papa, WCS, Bogdan+3 rookies) to where adding more doesn't make a lot of sense.

 

[funkykingston]

Another player who could make a push into the top 10 is Terrance Ferguson.

Pre draft workouts will be huge for him, but he definitely has the tools.

That would likely push somebody I like down to the Kings.

 

[Jimbob]

Another player who could make a push into the top 10 is Terrance Ferguson.

Pre draft workouts will be huge for him, but he definitely has the tools.

That would likely push somebody I like down to the Kings.

That would be nice. He played for Adelaide so not that much exposure here. Draft boards have a few players inching their way up, I look forward to workouts when it all actually makes more sense.

 

[Sactown ExPat]

I think it's been proven time and time again throughout the history of the draft that the best thing to do is take the very best player that's available to you. If that player happens to play a position you're already loaded at, so be it. The more good and talented players you have -- the more options you have.

The best example is and always will be the Blazers passing on Michael Jordan in favor of Sam Bowie because they already had a 2-guard in Clyde Drexler. Obviously, the Kings won't have that same level of predicament with their draft position and current talent on the team -- but the point remains. Take the best player available and sort it all out later.

Yeah, but while it is not hard to imagine him being the best in 5-6 years, he'll mostly just be different from the other two, and so it comes down to what Vlade and Joerger are trying to build. Joerger's projected development of the three centers would be the overwhelming factor for me. We are also moving towards a league where you can only play one true big man at a time, so we are already very redundant with our youth bigs. The BPA may not turn out to be the BPA if we cannot develop them as the BPA on our roster.

 

[miltonap]

Yeah, but while it is not hard to imagine him being the best in 5-6 years, he'll mostly just be different from the other two, and so it comes down to what Vlade and Joerger are trying to build. Joerger's projected development of the three centers would be the overwhelming factor for me. We are also moving towards a league where you can only play one true big man at a time, so we are already very redundant with our youth bigs. The BPA may not turn out to be the BPA if we cannot develop them as the BPA on our roster.

Reminds me of the situation in Philly, very true

 

[LA King Fan II]

Sign Jrue Holiday for Conley $.

Then draft a point Guard at #8, and Zach Collins, Jordan Bell. Then make sure we get rid Collison, Gay, Afflalo, Mcelmore, and Lawson in hopes of one solid veteran.

I'd be happy with.

Holiday
#8 pick
Hield or Richardson
Bogdanovich
Jordan Bell
Labissiere
Wcs
Koufas
Papa
Collins
Temple
One Solid Veteran (Otto Porter, Gallinari)

 

[Suicide King]

I hope to NOT see any large contracts incoming unless there are picks attached. This next season is about growing our young core, not trying to start climbing the ladder towards playoffs with big singings.

Let the kids play and learn together under the coaching staff and a few vets on reasonable deals. Ideally they get accustomed to each other and the system, try hard every night but we still get a good pick.
Summer of 2018 you make your transition to signing the best FAs you can and go full bore for a playoff spot.

Just my 2 coppers.

 

[bajaden]

Not nearly as enamored with Collins as you are from his highlights....his foot speed is lacking, although he obviously has very keen shot blocking ability. I wonder about his offensive game translation in the NBA. His lack of foot speed will make him easier to guard. He does appear to have good range on his shot. He seems like a role player type in the NBA....something close to Kaminsky or at best Brad Miller without the passing ability and better shot blocking.. Too safe a pick with lower ceiling. Realize he's only a freshman, but would not want someone who could potentially end up another Spencer Hawes on the low side.

Wow! Man, you have to watch him play in a game, and not a bunch of Youtube stuff. Collins is a very good athlete and there's nothing wrong with his foot speed. He has an excellent post game. He's a very good rebounder and most of all, he's a tough hombre. You sure you wern't watching his teammate Karnowski. Now he slow and doesn't move well. But Collins, man, I don't know what to say except you must have been watching a different Collins.

 

[funkykingston]

But Collins, man, I don't know what to say except you must have been watching a different Collins.

A couple Tom Collins definitely tend to slow me down. . .

 

[bajaden]

I only saw one jumpshot attempted in that video. Is he a capable mid range/deep shooter? He seems to have nice form so there is no reason to believe he can't be an adequate shooter.

Collins only attempted 21 threes this season, making 1o of them for a 47.6% average. His overall shooting percentage was 65.2%. He also grabbed around 6 rebounds a game in just 17 minutes of time.

 

[Hansel]

I got the feeling we are going to trade down again with one of the picks and then pick some euro guy like Kurucs.

 

[Mass]

This just isn't the draft to move down in. No matter who's there at 10, he has a chance of being a really damn good player. And we have plenty of youth depth (Buddy, Skal, Papa, WCS, Bogdan+3 rookies) to where adding more doesn't make a lot of sense.

I don't think he's suggesting to move down, but to trade one of our picks for Brooklyn's pick in 2018.

 

[CelticsFan]

Just my opinion but Celtics have two first round Euros picked last year in the first round stashed overseas now and plan to have them on the roster next year ( both are bigs). I don't see them moving the Brookly pick next year unless it's for an established player

 

[Hansel]

Just my opinion but Celtics have two first round Euros picked last year in the first round stashed overseas now and plan to have them on the roster next year ( both are bigs). I don't see them moving the Brookly pick next year unless it's for an established player

Zizic was a steal, the kid is going to be good, if not great.

 

[funkykingston]

Would you move the pick for Boston's Brooklyn 18?

I'm thinking if they land a top PG pick but fell in love with Collins/Markannen who dropped as well to help their front court?

If my top 8 guys are all gone - Fultz, Jackson, Fox, Ball, Isaac, Tatum, Ntilikina, and Smith then I'd absolutely consider trading #10 for next year's Nets pick. They aren't going to be good next year either.

 

[Folsomkingsfan]

Sign Jrue Holiday for Conley $.

Then draft a point Guard at #8, and Zach Collins, Jordan Bell. Then make sure we get rid Collison, Gay, Afflalo, Mcelmore, and Lawson in hopes of one solid veteran.

I'd be happy with.

Holiday
#8 pick
Hield or Richardson
Bogdanovich
Jordan Bell
Labissiere
Wcs
Koufas
Papa
Collins
Temple
One Solid Veteran (Otto Porter, Gallinari)

No on Holiday. He's a great player, but 15 and 7 with Ok defense isn't worth that kind of money. I'd rather just draft a guard and try and pry Shaun Livingston from Golden State. He seems like he would be a pheromone mentor.

 

[Spike]

I'd rather just draft a guard and try and pry Shaun Livingston from Golden State. He seems like he would be a pheromone mentor.

Pheromone?