Butler/Gay Trade

macadocious

macadocious

Starter
#1
#1
I am not certain if Chicago would ever consider this, but I have heard they are a bit disenfranchised with Jimmy Butler. Apparently he is not listening to his coach. I don't know if this is just a fan reaction, or if it's the FO view as well. But if they are looking to trade Butler we could possibly offer them the following


In:
Bulter
Snell

Out:
Gay
McLemore
This years draft pick (remove restriction)
Filler such as Dukan or any of the Euros we have stashed.


We would not have to resign Rondo. We could easily run Buler/Collison back court have Curry be our 3rd guard/combo guard. This is assuming we can't dump Bellinelli and he goes back to what he was before a 12-20MPG spot up shooter.

We could then sign Barnes to a Max Deal at SF and we look like this

Collision/Curry
Butler/Bellinelli
Barnes/Cassipi
WCS/Acy
DMC/Koufos

Moreland, filler, filler, filler.
 
Dreadnought

Dreadnought

Bench
#2
#2
I don't see Butler/Cousins being a great fit, but I love Jimmy Butler the player. In my eyes, no way Chicago does this trade since they are essentially swapping Butler for a worse, older version of him that doesn't play defense as well. The pick is negligible, they might even prefer for us to convey next year.You'd have to expect WCS to be involved in this for this trade to really be considered, but I think we deserve to win a lopsided trade for once :p
 
bajaden

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#4
#4
Iced Espresso said:
May want to wait awhile with trades including our pick. 8-10 are all tied up with us included. Good chance we land 11 or later.
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Ahhhh, no! There's a faint chance we end up at number 11, but the only way that can happen is for a team behind us at 11, 12, 13, or 14, to jump into one of the top three spots and therefore move us back to the 11th spot. Very unlikely, but still possible. It's just as likely that we jump into one of the top three spots.
 
Iced Espresso

Iced Espresso

Starter
#5
#5
bajaden said:
Ahhhh, no! There's a faint chance we end up at number 11, but the only way that can happen is for a team behind us at 11, 12, 13, or 14, to jump into one of the top three spots and therefore move us back to the 11th spot. Very unlikely, but still possible. It's just as likely that we jump into one of the top three spots.
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It's a 9.4-9.5% chance 11-14 land.

Of course we'd have to be at 10 too.

But I'm a Kings fan, so if someone says there's a 10ish percent chance for it to rain on me walking into the arena, I all ready know it will.
 
Iced Espresso

Iced Espresso

Starter
#6
#6
Right now the 11 has a 2.9% the 12 2.5% the 13 2.2% the 14 1.8%

Hard to calculate our top 3 odds with 3 of us tied at the moment, but its under 7% with the tie.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#7
#7
At 6 or 7 we had a decent chance of moving up and no chance of losing the pick. At 10 we have a very small chance of moving up and a small chance of losing the pick. More self-inflicted misery.

As for the OT, the interesting thing about this trade idea (if Jimmy Butler is actually available) is that it presents a scenario where we could potentially bring in Thibodeau and two key players from his Chicago run with Joakim Noah available in free agency. I don't know that either one of them wants to re-enlist for Tom Thibodeau boot camp at this point, but adding the two best defenders and the head coach from a top 5 defense is an intriguing scenario to mull over.
 
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John Galt

John Galt

Starter
#8
#8
For once I have zero anxiety about the draft.

If we slip out of top 10 - that's fine. Chicago debt resolved. that's ok with me.

If we stay put in the 8-9-10 spot that's fine too. I don't care. zero expectation for me that this player gets minutes next year. Maybe a trade chip for Vlade I guess. thats ok with me.

If we win the lotto, whether or not we swap with Philly - then I'm really excited and will still have zero remorse over Vlade's pick-swap deal. It will be super fantastic if we get the 2nd pick and Philly gets the 1st. A small miracle and happy times. and that's ok with me too.

Nothing can happen in the draft to bum me out... for once.
 
Glenn

Glenn

Hall of Famer
#9
#9
John Galt said:
For once I have zero anxiety about the draft.

If we slip out of top 10 - that's fine. Chicago debt resolved. that's ok with me.

If we stay put in the 8-9-10 spot that's fine too. I don't care. zero expectation for me that this player gets minutes next year. Maybe a trade chip for Vlade I guess. thats ok with me.

If we win the lotto, whether or not we swap with Philly - then I'm really excited and will still have zero remorse over Vlade's pick-swap deal. It will be super fantastic if we get the 2nd pick and Philly gets the 1st. A small miracle and happy times. and that's ok with me too.

Nothing can happen in the draft to bum me out... for once.
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Exactly! You read my mind.
 
Section 101

Section 101

All-Star
#10
#10
macadocious said:
I am not certain if Chicago would ever consider this, but I have heard they are a bit disenfranchised with Jimmy Butler. Apparently he is not listening to his coach. I don't know if this is just a fan reaction, or if it's the FO view as well. But if they are looking to trade Butler we could possibly offer them the following


In:
Bulter
Snell

Out:
Gay
McLemore
This years draft pick (remove restriction)
Filler such as Dukan or any of the Euros we have stashed.


We would not have to resign Rondo. We could easily run Buler/Collison back court have Curry be our 3rd guard/combo guard. This is assuming we can't dump Bellinelli and he goes back to what he was before a 12-20MPG spot up shooter.

We could then sign Barnes to a Max Deal at SF and we look like this

Collision/Curry
Butler/Bellinelli
Barnes/Cassipi
WCS/Acy
DMC/Koufos

Moreland, filler, filler, filler.
Click to expand...
Don't think we can remove it without Philly's approval. It would have to be a post draft trade where we didn't remove the restriction.
 
2

206Fan

All-Star
#11
#11
I don't think that deal is good enough for Butler. If we trade for Butler, Cousins will have to be included in the deal.

I honestly don't think Butler-Cousins would work out. It would be like Tyreke-Cousins all over again..
 
E

ESP47

All-Star
#14
#14
I'm afraid the Bulls fans and franchise would laugh at us for proposing that. Gay is getting older and on a downward career swing. McLemore has zero value and Dukan is a mid level D League player who isn't even a prospect. The only value in that would be what is most likely going to be the 10th pick in the draft.
 
John Galt

John Galt

Starter
#15
#15
Section 101 said:
Don't think we can remove it without Philly's approval. It would have to be a post draft trade where we didn't remove the restriction.
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I was wondering about that. Once the lottery has happened and Philly is higher, can they still stop us from making a trade with the Bulls that swaps our #9 this year in exchange for the protected pick we owe them? I mean isn't that protected pick an asset that Chicago can spend however they want - including trading it back to us for an unprotected pick?

I can see Philly having some rights pre-lotto after all that's what the swap is for - they bought our ping pong balls. But once the draft order is established we ought to be able to deal our current pick any way we like - including for our own protected pick.
 
Mike

Mike

Bench
#16
#16
I can't see that deal working out because even with the critics Jimmy Butler may have in Chicago, he is still a two time all star and two time NBA All-Defensive Second Team selection. And this season he's putting up over 20 ppg again and playing to a decent level. I don't see him being the issue on that Chicago team, but if they wanted to get rid, we would need to offer more than that...

- Rudy Gay has the ability to put up 20 ppg, but he's never been an all star, and he's never been consistent enough on the defensive end to be one of the better two way players in the league. He's a glorified chucker that doesn't play consistent defense.
- Ben McLemore has been a bust so far. Granted maybe a new team could benefit him and kick start his career, though his value is pretty low at the minute.
- If we could remove the protection from this year's draft pick that would be good, but I think we have the 10th pick as it stands before the lottery, and while that can land you a good player, it doesn't necessarily land you a difference maker.
- The filler isn't really worth talking about.

For me, if we want to get a deal done for Jimmy Butler we would have to give up more. I think they would have some interest in Rudy Gay and maybe they like Ben McLemore as a low risk addition with upside under the right coaching. But on top of that I think we would have to include someone like WCS or Darren Collison (they may like the idea of having this guy as their back up to Rose), plus another future first round pick to even get them to the table. I doubt a near 30-year old chucker, a draft bust, filler, and one first round pick is going to seal the deal for a player of Butler's caliber.

That said, I do like the idea of a Collison / Butler / Barnes / WCS / Cousins starting line up. But obviously there would be concerns of the fit with Cousins but a scorer that plays high level defense would be a good addition. The other question mark would be whether Barnes would want to join a team in which he would be the third option on offense, he's already the fourth or fifth option on the Warriors. The kid has star talent so I think his next landing spot he should want to get paid, while also getting the chance to be a potential go to guy or second option. But I like the idea of your line up and rotation.
 
upinsmoke

upinsmoke

All-Star
#18
#18
We can acquire the assets to get Butler but we're going to have to get creative. With the draft order and playoffs still undecided and even ultimately what Vlade is going to do with DMC, we don't know what we have yet asset wise or what mindset other teams are in so it's impossible to frame work a deal without speculation right now.
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#20
#20
3 team deal?

Bulls Get: Smart, Cauley-Stein, Koufos, & #8
Bulls Give: Butler & Gibson

Celtics Get: Gay & McLemore
Celtics Give: Smart

Kings Get: Butler & Gibson
Kings Give: Gay, Cauley-Stein, McLemore, Koufos, & #8


PG - Collison/Curry
SG - Butler/Belinelli/Anderson
SF - Casspi/Butler
PF - Gibson/Acy
C - Cousins

If you dump Belinelli for cap space, it leaves us with ~$24 mil in cap space. We could look to sign someone like Fournier to come off the bench behind Butler & Casspi and a decent backup big like J. Hill.
 
twslam07

twslam07

All-Star
#22
#22
I'd rather hang on to Cauley-Stein. He could be a poor man's Anthony Davis. Cauley-Stein can be a DPOY type player one day and he has shown flashes of his offensive potential (jumper, pick & roll finisher, transition offense, taking people off the dribble). 3-5 years from now, Cousins & Cauley-Stein could be a very, very scary frontcourt. If you draft a guy like Dunn, you're left with a young core in Dunn/Cauley-Stein/Cousins who (on paper) compliment each other well, have great size/length, and are all great defenders.
 
R

randymoss1881

Starter
#24
#24
D-Wade said:
Word is Rudy was spotted at Miami game last night. Maybe we can get one of their rookies for him.
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I doubt we get Winslow but
Gay/8/Ben for Winslow

Gives us 39 mill in cap
Offer Anderaon max(22mill)
Than offer Bazemore 17mill

Collison/curry
Bazemore/Marco
Winslow/Casspi
Anderson/WCS
DMC/KK

A very good defensive team
 
2

206Fan

All-Star
#25
#25
randymoss1881 said:
I doubt we get Winslow but
Gay/8/Ben for Winslow

Gives us 39 mill in cap
Offer Anderaon max(22mill)
Than offer Bazemore 17mill

Collison/curry
Bazemore/Marco
Winslow/Casspi
Anderson/WCS
DMC/KK

A very good defensive team
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I'm sorry, but you don't give up Gay/8/Ben for Winslow.. You're better off trading down from 8 and picking up a defensive wing like Winslow + a PG.
 
R

randymoss1881

Starter
#26
#26
206Fan said:
I'm sorry, but you don't give up Gay/8/Ben for Winslow.. You're better off trading down from 8 and picking up a defensive wing like Winslow + a PG.
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For a rookie who is only gonna get better Winslow will be a stud. His defense is already good and the heats best defensive units are the ones with him on it. Now it's really Gay/8 for Winslow. Ben is a zero no matter what anyone says and we ain't winning with Gay as a core piece. Rather spread those shots to Ryan Anderson and a FA SG
 
King Baller

King Baller

All-Star
#27
#27
randymoss1881 said:
For a rookie who is only gonna get better Winslow will be a stud. His defense is already good and the heats best defensive units are the ones with him on it. Now it's really Gay/8 for Winslow. Ben is a zero no matter what anyone says and we ain't winning with Gay as a core piece. Rather spread those shots to Ryan Anderson and a FA SG
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I don't think the salaries would allow a trade. Miami would have to give more salary.
 
KingsFanSince85

KingsFanSince85

All-Star
#30
#30
SacKings384 said:
Rudy Gay AND the 8th pick for Winslow? Are you crazy?
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Yeah, I like Justice Winslow -- a lot -- but that seems a bit steep. But, to get a seemingly up and coming,athletic and skilled Kawhi Leonard type player, you are likely going to have to overpay. Even then I'm not sure Miami would even consider a deal like that. It would depend upon their time table for Wade/Bosh and whether they value Rudy's scoring abilities enough.
 
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