Kings trade JT, Nik and Landry to Sixers (renamed)

When you start off by saying Rondo doesn't play defense I can't take anything else you say seriously.

You have to account for the fact that he was disgruntled severely last year, basically knowing his time in Boston was up, and then the usage problems with Carlisle in Dallas.

We're talking about a 4x All Defensive team player here. He may have lost half a step, but the guy can play defense. It's just a matter of getting him to buy in and team chemistry.
Can we stop making excuses for this guy, take his word for it?
http://www.cbssports.com/nba/eye-on...-i-havent-played-defense-in-a-couple-of-years

dude was saying he haven't played defense for "a couple of years" and than he went to Dallas and thought why not let the streak continue..
 
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If I had to choose between Danny Green and Rajon Rondo, I would choose Danny Green, or anyone decent who can catch-shoot-drive. I feel that we need that more than another PG, especially considering the fact that one of Rajon's weaknesses is his shooting.
 
Cousins salary.. Basketball ref and Hoopshype has his contract at $14,728,844 for the 2015 season. Spotrac and Basketball Insiders has it $15,851,950

Using your numbers, if you subtract the unguaranteed contracts, your total goes to 56,465,523 which mean there's a total cap space of 10,534,477. You include getting rid of Landry's contract, and the numbers goes to roughly $17,000,000.

So we basically have 10,534,477 in cap space if we waive our unguaranteed contracts.

Is there something I'm missing? I'm just curious, because I'm really trying to figure it out..
Basketball Insiders is correct.

All teams must have at least 12 roster spots accounted for at all times, so if you have 9 players on your roster, you have to have 3 undrafted rookie FA cap holds to act as placeholders. The undrafted rookie FA cap hold is $525,093 each.

Right now, we have 11 players under contract (Collison, McCallum, Stockton, McLemore, Stauskas, Gay, Thompson, Landry, Moreland, Cousins, Willie Cauley-Stein). That means we already have one undrafted rookie FA cap hold in place to bring us back to 12 players. If we were to do the trade that involved trading Landry and our pick protection for a future pick, we'd have to add another undrafted rookie FA cap hold since we would now only have 10 players under contract.

Same goes for the unguaranteed contracts. If we were to waive Moreland, McCallum, and Stockton, we would have to add 3 more undrafted rookie FA cap holds ($525,093 + $525,093 +$525,093 = $1,575,279).

As you can see, dropping players from our team for instant cap relief still results in us adding some cap holds. Now if we had 15 players under contract and we waived an unguaranteed contract, we wouldn't have to add a cap hold because we are above 11 players.
 
So literally, we've gotten to the point where we can't even believe what a player says from his own mouth, unbidden??
We believe a reporter over a person's own words?

Tell me, Eileen - why would Demarcus have gone out of his way to (controversially) say Rondo was the best point guard last summer, and maintain that he could play with him?
What possible reason would Demarcus have to lie then?

Jesus, is there ANYthing we fans can use to base our NBA understanding on, or are they all clowning us deliberately?
(see: "Malone and PDA actually have no problem with each other")
 
I think one of the best outcomes from this free agency period would be as follows:
  1. The salary cap gets bumped up to $69,100,000 (this would give us $9,997,083 in cap space).
  2. Trade Landry to Chicago while removing the protection of the 2016 1st Rounder for a future protected 2nd Rounder. This would give us $15,971,990 in cap space.
  3. Sign Danny Green to a $50,000,000/4 year contract (will be $11,687,182 in the first year of his contract). This will leave us with $4,809,901 in cap space.
  4. Sign Cory Joseph to a $20,577,676/4 year cont (will be $4,809,901 in the first year of his contract). This will leave us with $525,093 in cap space.
  5. Trade Ben McLemore, Ray McCallum, & David Stockton for Wilson Chandler
  6. Sign Cole Aldrich using the Room Exception.
  7. Sign Andre Miller, John Lucas III, Omri Casspi, Drew Gooden, & Reggie Evans to veteran minimum deals
Our roster would look like this going into next season:
PG - Collison/Joseph/Miller/Lucas
SG - Green/Stauskas
SF - Gay/Chandler/Casspi
PF - Thompson/Gooden/Evans/Moreland
C - Cousins/Cauley-Stein/Aldrich

We could run a tight 8 man rotation of Collison, Green, Gay, Thompson, Cousins, Joseph, Chandler, & Cauley-Stein with Stauskas and Aldrich seeing limited time. There's a lot to like about this roster. First of all, it's loaded with veterans who can help us win now, while also having a good amount of youth (Joseph, Stauskas, Cauley-Stein, Cousins).

We would have good defenders at every single position (Collison/Joseph at PG, Green at SG, Chandler at SF, Thompson/Cauley-Stein at PF, & Cousins/Aldrich at C). With our defensive versatility, we should be able to match-up with most if not every team in the league. Rim protection would be good with Cousins, Cauley-Stein, Aldrich, & Moreland (if he starts to show signs he can cut it in the NBA).

Shooting and spacing should be very good as well. Collison, Joseph, Green, Stauskas, Gay, Chandler, Casspi, & Gooden would all be respectable from beyond the arc to help create space for Cousins. Even Thompson has a midrange jumper that can help space the floor when he's in.

The starting unit is well balanced with two go-to options (Cousins & Gay) an unselfish 3rd scorer (Collison) and two roleplayers (Thompson & Green). Collison/McLemore/Gay/Thompson/Cousins was the 5th best rotation in the NBA last year. Replacing McLemore with Green should only improve that rotation (and if Cauley-Stein is able to catch on quickly, he may be able to improve it further).

The bench would be much improved as well. Joseph, Chandler, & Cauley-Stein is the beginning of a very solid bench. With an up and coming lottery pick (Stauskas) and a tough, defensive C (Aldrich) available on the deep bench, this unit should not disappoint.

I still think it's very unlikely we are able to sign Green, and I haven't heard any rumors that we're interested in Joseph yet so this scenario is very unlikely. But hey one can dream, right?
 
K

KingMilz

Guest
The thing with Danny Green to me unless we get another starting player along with him we are not making the playoffs. We need a 3rd player who's a legit difference maker (for example a healthy Wes/Middleton who's now off the table.)

I rather trade for Chandler who makes 8-9 million than go after Green (who would be more expensive), I do like the idea of signing Gooden to a minimum he still had plenty of juice in his still springy legs and he can stroke it nowdays.
 
The thing with Danny Green to me unless we get another starting player along with him we are not making the playoffs. We need a 3rd player who's a legit difference maker (for example a healthy Wes/Middleton who's now off the table.)

I rather trade for Chandler who makes 8-9 million than go after Green (who would be more expensive), I do like the idea of signing Gooden to a minimum he still had plenty of juice in his still springy legs and he can stroke it nowdays.
Well Chandler doesn't have the chops to be a full-time SG at this point in time. Green does. Not to mention Green is a much better 3pt shooter.

Let's put it this way. I'd much rather sign Green to a 4 year contract without giving up any assets vs. trading assets for Chandler who only has 1 year left on his deal.

In my scenario Chandler as the main backup wing behind Green & Gay would make for one of the better wing rotations in the league. I think chandler defending opposing backup SGs will be fine, but I wouldn't trust him to lineup against the team's best SG day in and day out and expect him to have success.

To your first point, I think you're underestimating our roster (or at least the one I just hypothetically made). There's plenty of guys who can score the ball, shoot the ball, defend, play-make, handle the ball, etc. in my situation.

I think at this point you could say that 4 of your 5 starting positions are set with PF still being the one you're looking to upgrade. Hopefully, Cauley-Stein develops into that starter, but that's yet to be seen...
 
K

KingMilz

Guest
Well Chandler doesn't have the chops to be a full-time SG at this point in time. Green does. Not to mention Green is a much better 3pt shooter.

Let's put it this way. I'd much rather sign Green to a 4 year contract without giving up any assets vs. trading assets for Chandler who only has 1 year left on his deal.

In my scenario Chandler as the main backup wing behind Green & Gay would make for one of the better wing rotations in the league. I think chandler defending opposing backup SGs will be fine, but I wouldn't trust him to lineup against the team's best SG day in and day out and expect him to have success.

To your first point, I think you're underestimating our roster (or at least the one I just hypothetically made). There's plenty of guys who can score the ball, shoot the ball, defend, play-make, handle the ball, etc. in my situation.

I think at this point you could say that 4 of your 5 starting positions are set with PF still being the one you're looking to upgrade. Hopefully, Cauley-Stein develops into that starter, but that's yet to be seen...
O whoops did not see that you had WC in your scenario cause I assumed he would be starting along with Gay (since by all reports they said hes playing PF)/Green which would interest me. Than yeah that's not to bad I'd be excited entering the year with a core of Cuz/WCS/Gay/WC/Green/DC you got 3 hard working spacers/athletes along with the shot making of Gay/Cuz.
 
O whoops did not see that you had WC in your scenario cause I assumed he would be starting along with Gay (since by all reports they said hes playing PF)/Green which would interest me. Than yeah that's not to bad I'd be excited entering the year with a core of Cuz/WCS/Gay/WC/Green/DC you got 3 hard working spacers/athletes along with the shot making of Gay/Cuz.
A Collison/Green/Chandler/Gay/Cousins lineup would be interesting, but I'm not sure if I would like to see that as our starting unit. You can't deny the spacing for Cousins would be excellent (Catch and Shoot 3PT%: Collison - 38%, Green - 45%, Chandler - 34%, & Gay - 36%).

Both Chandler and Gay are solid rebounders at SF and Cousins is obviously an excellent defensive rebounder. Not to mention Collison and Green are not bad rebounders either. It's possible that we could still be decent on the boards in order to take advantage of the ball handlers/spacing on the offensive side, but I'm always going to lean towards defense and controlling the boards which makes me want to start Thompson/Cauley-Stein next to Cousins. I wouldn't be opposed to bringing that rotation along slowly to see if it is the real deal, but I wouldn't like to put all my eggs in the "move Gay to PF" basket.

I will say though the main reason why I'm intrigued by it is that we are essentially replacing a defensive PF (Thompson/Cauley-Stein) for a defensive wing. It's not like we are replacing this defensive PF for a soft/offensive focused wing. Collison, Green, & Chandler would be a very good defensive group on the perimeter, and with a rim protector like Cousins, perhaps that perimeter defense will be enough to be a good defensive group.
 
I think one of the best outcomes from this free agency period would be as follows:
  1. The salary cap gets bumped up to $69,100,000 (this would give us $9,997,083 in cap space).
  2. Trade Landry to Chicago while removing the protection of the 2016 1st Rounder for a future protected 2nd Rounder. This would give us $15,971,990 in cap space.
  3. Sign Danny Green to a $50,000,000/4 year contract (will be $11,687,182 in the first year of his contract). This will leave us with $4,809,901 in cap space.
  4. Sign Cory Joseph to a $20,577,676/4 year cont (will be $4,809,901 in the first year of his contract). This will leave us with $525,093 in cap space.
  5. Trade Ben McLemore, Ray McCallum, & David Stockton for Wilson Chandler
  6. Sign Cole Aldrich using the Room Exception.
  7. Sign Andre Miller, John Lucas III, Omri Casspi, Drew Gooden, & Reggie Evans to veteran minimum deals
Our roster would look like this going into next season:
PG - Collison/Joseph/Miller/Lucas
SG - Green/Stauskas
SF - Gay/Chandler/Casspi
PF - Thompson/Gooden/Evans/Moreland
C - Cousins/Cauley-Stein/Aldrich

We could run a tight 8 man rotation of Collison, Green, Gay, Thompson, Cousins, Joseph, Chandler, & Cauley-Stein with Stauskas and Aldrich seeing limited time. There's a lot to like about this roster. First of all, it's loaded with veterans who can help us win now, while also having a good amount of youth (Joseph, Stauskas, Cauley-Stein, Cousins).

We would have good defenders at every single position (Collison/Joseph at PG, Green at SG, Chandler at SF, Thompson/Cauley-Stein at PF, & Cousins/Aldrich at C). With our defensive versatility, we should be able to match-up with most if not every team in the league. Rim protection would be good with Cousins, Cauley-Stein, Aldrich, & Moreland (if he starts to show signs he can cut it in the NBA).

Shooting and spacing should be very good as well. Collison, Joseph, Green, Stauskas, Gay, Chandler, Casspi, & Gooden would all be respectable from beyond the arc to help create space for Cousins. Even Thompson has a midrange jumper that can help space the floor when he's in.

The starting unit is well balanced with two go-to options (Cousins & Gay) an unselfish 3rd scorer (Collison) and two roleplayers (Thompson & Green). Collison/McLemore/Gay/Thompson/Cousins was the 5th best rotation in the NBA last year. Replacing McLemore with Green should only improve that rotation (and if Cauley-Stein is able to catch on quickly, he may be able to improve it further).

The bench would be much improved as well. Joseph, Chandler, & Cauley-Stein is the beginning of a very solid bench. With an up and coming lottery pick (Stauskas) and a tough, defensive C (Aldrich) available on the deep bench, this unit should not disappoint.

I still think it's very unlikely we are able to sign Green, and I haven't heard any rumors that we're interested in Joseph yet so this scenario is very unlikely. But hey one can dream, right?
I know it's probably not a popular opinion, but with the way the league is going I'd much rather keep Ben than trade him for Chandler- since it will cost us heavily to retain Chandler next summer, and I don't think we are in a spot where we need that kind of move.
Also I'm pretty sure Gooden will get more than vet minimum.
 
K

KingMilz

Guest
A Collison/Green/Chandler/Gay/Cousins lineup would be interesting, but I'm not sure if I would like to see that as our starting unit. You can't deny the spacing for Cousins would be excellent (Catch and Shoot 3PT%: Collison - 38%, Green - 45%, Chandler - 34%, & Gay - 36%).

Both Chandler and Gay are solid rebounders at SF and Cousins is obviously an excellent defensive rebounder. Not to mention Collison and Green are not bad rebounders either. It's possible that we could still be decent on the boards in order to take advantage of the ball handlers/spacing on the offensive side, but I'm always going to lean towards defense and controlling the boards which makes me want to start Thompson/Cauley-Stein next to Cousins. I wouldn't be opposed to bringing that rotation along slowly to see if it is the real deal, but I wouldn't like to put all my eggs in the "move Gay to PF" basket.

I will say though the main reason why I'm intrigued by it is that we are essentially replacing a defensive PF (Thompson/Cauley-Stein) for a defensive wing. It's not like we are replacing this defensive PF for a soft/offensive focused wing. Collison, Green, & Chandler would be a very good defensive group on the perimeter, and with a rim protector like Cousins, perhaps that perimeter defense will be enough to be a good defensive group.
Yeap that line up sort of reminds me what the Knicks (less talented) had prior to the Melo trade when Amare was putting up monster numbers and easily a top 5 MVP candidate. They had something like Amare/Gallo/Ill Will/Landry Fields (rookie)/Felton and they played really well together now when you compare that to our hypothetical squad we are literally better at every position including Ill Will who is now a better player than he was than.

That sort of line up could really maximize Cousins although that's all theory it could turn into a disaster also. I like those blend of players since they will allow us to play small or we could move Wilson to the bench and go big playing JT/WCS.
 
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I know it's probably not a popular opinion, but with the way the league is going I'd much rather keep Ben than trade him for Chandler- since it will cost us heavily to retain Chandler next summer, and I don't think we are in a spot where we need that kind of move.
Also I'm pretty sure Gooden will get more than vet minimum.
I actually was not too favorable on that Chandler trade I made up. We're basically sending out a promising young player which we can keep for another 6 years if we wanted to for a player who might bolt in a year.

Now having said that, the odds say that Chandler will be a better than McLemore this next season, and considering we're in a position to try and go all-in to retain Cousins, I find us in a difficult position to turn down veteran help especially when those veterans can defend and hit 3pt shots.

If we do sign Green, it's in our best interest to trade McLemore or Stauskas for a more established veteran. Chandler came to mind in regards to fit, availability, and the Karl connection.

That's fine if Gooden gets more than the veteran minimum. We could look at guys like Villanueva or Turkoglu as backups.
 
Yeap that line up sort of reminds me what the Knicks (less talented) had prior to the Melo trade when Amare was putting up monster numbers and easily a top 5 MVP candidate. They had something like Amare/Gallo/Ill Will/Landry Fields (rookie)/Felton and they played really well together now when you compare that to our hypothetical squad we are literally better at every position including Ill Will who is now a better player than he was than.

That sort of line up could really maximize Cousins although that's all theory it could turn into a disaster also. I like those blend of players since they will allow us to play small or we could move Wilson to the bench and go big playing JT/WCS.
If Gay is thought of as a PF by Karl, Casspi would come in handy. You still have Green, McLemore/Stauskas, Chandler, & Casspi as your wing rotation with Gay obviously having the ability to swing down for some minutes at SF.

I already mentioned the catch and shoot 3PT% of the starters (Catch and Shoot 3PT%: Collison - 38%, Green - 45%, Chandler - 34%, & Gay - 36%), but the catch and shoot 3PT% for the bench guards and wings would be excellent as well (Joseph - 41%, McLemore - 37%, & Casspi - 40%). One things for sure, Cousins would have plenty of room to operate. The big question is how a small team like that could defend the paint/rim and control the boards. However, the fact that we would have 3 defensive bigs on our bench (Thompson/Cauley-Stein/Aldrich) makes me feel better.

If we aren't able to sign Green, perhaps we look to sign Carroll instead if playing Gay at PF is the end all be all. It basically means we would have to rely on McLemore and Stauskas at SG if this is the case. In this scenario, I'm not sure it's worth it to trade one of our young SGs for Chandler (due to the fact that we would only have 1 SG on the roster with no real cap room to bring in another). I think you'd have to roll with a Collison, Joseph, McLemore, Stauskas, Carroll, & Casspi rotation which would still be very solid for perimeter defense and floor spacing.

If we can't sign any significant wing player (but have the ability to bring Afflalo, Belinelli, or Stuckey aboard), I think we could explore a Stauskas/McCallum/Stockton trade for Chandler and roll with Collison, Joseph, McLemore, Afflalo/Belinelli/Stuckey, Chander, & Casspi as the rotation.

If we have no luck signing any real wing this offseason, perhaps we can free up the 2016 pick by trading Landry and the removal of the protection for a future 2nd Rounder. After that, we can then try to offer a 2017 pick swap and a 2018 1st to lure Chandler away from Denver. Then we could roll with Collison, Joseph, McLemore, Stauskas, Chandler, & Casspi as the rotation.

There are a lot of options/scenarios. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out.
 
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I actually was not too favorable on that Chandler trade I made up. We're basically sending out a promising young player which we can keep for another 6 years if we wanted to for a player who might bolt in a year.

Now having said that, the odds say that Chandler will be a better than McLemore this next season, and considering we're in a position to try and go all-in to retain Cousins, I find us in a difficult position to turn down veteran help especially when those veterans can defend and hit 3pt shots.

If we do sign Green, it's in our best interest to trade McLemore or Stauskas for a more established veteran. Chandler came to mind in regards to fit, availability, and the Karl connection.

That's fine if Gooden gets more than the veteran minimum. We could look at guys like Villanueva or Turkoglu as backups.
My thoughts exactly considering Ben, plus since the rookie scale will be so small relative to the cap, he will give you way more room to improve the team going further than extending Chandler- and if Chandler bolts that's a loss.

I agree with you that we would probably need to trade one of them, but I would've try to look for a trade on Nik to get another guy on a rookie contract but different position back.

"go all-in to retain Cousins"- we still have him under contract for 3 more seasons, going all-in on this season isn't the smart play if it costs us later, especially considering that even if we can get the lineup you suggested there is a good chance we won't make the playoffs.

But out of all the scripts out there, I'll take this one in a heartbeat.
 
My thoughts exactly considering Ben, plus since the rookie scale will be so small relative to the cap, he will give you way more room to improve the team going further than extending Chandler- and if Chandler bolts that's a loss.

I agree with you that we would probably need to trade one of them, but I would've try to look for a trade on Nik to get another guy on a rookie contract but different position back.

"go all-in to retain Cousins"- we still have him under contract for 3 more seasons, going all-in on this season isn't the smart play if it costs us later, especially considering that even if we can get the lineup you suggested there is a good chance we won't make the playoffs.

But out of all the scripts out there, I'll take this one in a heartbeat.
We could always opt for a 3 way deal.

Kings Get: Wilson Chandler
Kings Give: Carl Landry, Ray McCallum, Remove 2016 Pick Protection, The Right to Swap 2017 1st Rounders, & a 2018 1st Round Pick (Lottery Protected)

Bulls Get: Randy Foye & Ray McCallum
Bulls Give: Kirk Hinrich & Kings' 2016 1st Rounder (Top 10 Protected)

Nuggets Get: Carl Landry, Kirk Hinrich, Kings' 2016 1st Rounder (Unprotected), The Right to swap 2017 1st Rounders with the Kings, & Kings' 2018 1st Rounder (Lottery Protected)
Nuggets Give: Wilson Chandler & Randy Foye

Kings would have ~$9.7 mil in cap space after this trade. Sign Joseph, sign a solid backup C, use the room exception on Casspi, sign Andre Miller & Gooden to veteran minimums, and call it a day.

PG - Collison/Joseph/Miller/Stockton
SG - McLemore/Stauskas
SF - Gay/Chandler/Casspi
PF - Thompson/Cauley-Stein/Gooden/Moreland
C - Cousins/Aldrich

Or

PG - Collison/Joseph/Miller/Stockton
SG - McLemore/Stauskas
SF - Chandler/Casspi
PF - Gay/Thompson/Gooden/Moreland
C - Cousins/Cauley-Stein/Aldrich

Added Chandler without giving up the immediate youth we currently have should be an attractive option. This team still has many vets to help us compete now, but it has a solid next generation lineup of Joseph/McLemore/Stauskas/Cauley-Stein/Moreland/Cousins.

Can anyone tell yet that I want to work in the Kings FO? Haha
 
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