Kings sign Darren Collison

Jkbiker

Jkbiker

Starter
#31
#31
Only possible sign n trade I can see would be Josh Smith if Detroit really wants to get rid of him

But we loose all leverage in sign n trade since we have no money to match, there is no threat

So it depends on what team IT signs an offer sheet with
and whether they decide if it is in their best interests to trade assets

But it appears FO was in a rush to get a Ranked #10 Backup guard to save 3 mil vs a No 2 ranked PG we could trade next year for value or at least a chance to pry away what we want in a S&T

Unless we get real lucky in S&T , we really screwed the pooch on this one
 
E

ESP47

All-Star
#33
#33
We weren't going to get anything more than a bad contract back from a S&T with IT. Do we really want to be stuck with an Outlaw 2.0 for the next few years?
 
R

Rug King

Bench
#34
#34
I think it's a good move. They like IT but he doesn't fit into their plans as the starting pg. They don't want to commit 8 mil/yr to somebody who doesn't fit into the system they want. This gives us a cheap veteran at pg while Ray gets another year experience.
 
Section 101

Section 101

All-Star
#36
#36
Padrino said:
it's a solid if unspectacular signing. they don't have the resources or the clout to knock it out of the park with a big signing or a big trade, and they've always appeared to be lukewarm about re-signing IT to a figure as high as $8 million per. and, as i said in a different thread, given the kings' cap situation, lack of roster flexibility, lack of trade assets, and overall lack of depth, they're really gonna have to bank on nik stauskas having an immediate impact next season. if stauskas can light it up from beyond the arc and legitimately share ball handling duties in year 1, then perhaps signing a stop-gap starting PG like darren collison works out fine. i certainly wouldn't consider collison an "upgrade" over IT, but he's cheaper than IT, he comes at a much lower usage rate, and he's a solid defender. that said, you would still need to get something useful back for IT in a sign-and-trade; he can't just walk for nothing, not when the kings are so barren of assets...
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I wouldn't call him a stop gap. There wasn't much of a drop off for the Clips when CP3 went down last year and he played with CP3 a lot in the playoffs cause they need him on the floor.

This is a good signing. Whether he starts or comes in as a 6th man his salary fits either way.
 
One and Done

One and Done

Bench
#37
#37
Collison is a good backup...not really amazing at anything but solid all around, except defensively.

That being said, he's failed at being a starting PG at every single stop he's been at. His weaknesses (operating halfcourt offense and overall defense) are better masked matching up to backup PG's.

I truly, truly hope that the front office will make further trades to address our severely long-term pass-first PG drought. We have committed ~19m to three players that do little to move the needle (Thompson, Williams, Terry) and outside of Terry, are not dead weight contracts. Hopefully more trades to come...we need passers and defenders!
 
P

pdizo916

Bench
#39
#39
Damn, you guys are so damn negative around here. This is a good deal IMO. He has been a career back up but I think he can flourish with Sacramento. He can also play defense even though he's "undersized" (same height as chris paul)

This site should be called kingsfansbitch.com because it seems like the majority of people complain about EVERYTHING. "Oh, he's overpaid," "Oh, he's too small," "Oh, we're settling for team's sloppy seconds!" NEWSFLASH: As of right now, Sacramento is one of the LEAST desirable destination to play basketball, and yet, the majority of you guys act snobbish in regards to talented players? Give me a break and get real Sacramento, LOL! IT may be a midget but he's still a hell of a talent. Collison may have been a career back up but that doesn't mean he's not talented. And this deal is a hell of alot better than the Landry deal last year. (we can all ***** at that one) Every player that is mentioned on this board is either ripped to shreds or over analyzed. It really makes me SMH because it seems like this board doesn't want any player to join the team...
 
Hoovtrain

Hoovtrain

All-Star
#40
#40
Heuge said:
Sloppy seconds. That's what we are happy with around here.

While this may work out, and I hope it will, this just doesn't seem prudent to me. This would be especially rough if we allow IT to walk, bleeding talent yet again. I sure hope there is a sign and trade to come.

The timing seems odd too. Now the Kings have less leverage in the IT sign and trade world.
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I am certainly not happy with it. But this is the reality this franchise is faced with and i've resigned myself to that...and now just express myself with extreme bitterness and skepticism
 
Kingfanpaul

Kingfanpaul

Starter
#41
#41
pdizo916 said:
Damn, you guys are so damn negative around here. This is a good deal IMO. He has been a career back up but I think he can flourish with Sacramento. He can also play defense even though he's "undersized" (same height as chris paul)

This site should be called kingsfansbitch.com because it seems like the majority of people complain about EVERYTHING. "Oh, he's overpaid," "Oh, he's too small," "Oh, we're settling for team's sloppy seconds!" NEWSFLASH: As of right now, Sacramento is one of the LEAST desirable destination to play basketball, and yet, the majority of you guys act snobbish in regards to talented players? Give me a break and get real Sacramento, LOL! IT may be a midget but he's still a hell of a talent. Collison may have been a career back up but that doesn't mean he's not talented. And this deal is a hell of alot better than the Landry deal last year. (we can all ***** at that one) Every player that is mentioned on this board is either ripped to shreds or over analyzed. It really makes me SMH because it seems like this board doesn't want any player to join the team...
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That seems like a bit of an overreaction to me. Most people here seem to believe it was a solid signing. Of course not everyone will be happy, but it's not like this thread is full of people complaining. You can analyze any move made by any team and there will be some people that won't like it, unless you're signing LBJ I guess. People have different opinions, that's what makes for good debates.
 
SwishKing

SwishKing

G-League
#42
#42
pdizo916 said:
Damn, you guys are so damn negative around here. This is a good deal IMO. He has been a career back up but I think he can flourish with Sacramento. He can also play defense even though he's "undersized" (same height as chris paul)

This site should be called kingsfansbitch.com because it seems like the majority of people complain about EVERYTHING. "Oh, he's overpaid," "Oh, he's too small," "Oh, we're settling for team's sloppy seconds!" NEWSFLASH: As of right now, Sacramento is one of the LEAST desirable destination to play basketball, and yet, the majority of you guys act snobbish in regards to talented players? Give me a break and get real Sacramento, LOL! IT may be a midget but he's still a hell of a talent. Collison may have been a career back up but that doesn't mean he's not talented. And this deal is a hell of alot better than the Landry deal last year. (we can all ***** at that one) Every player that is mentioned on this board is either ripped to shreds or over analyzed. It really makes me SMH because it seems like this board doesn't want any player to join the team...
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LOL. Right? We could sign Lebron James and people would still find a reason to complain.
 
kupman

kupman

Starter
#44
#44
Not great, but not too shabby either.

My greatest fear was IT signing elsewhere without a suitable replacement and putting all of our eggs in the Ray basket. I will sleep better knowing that will not be the case.
 
PurpleHaze

PurpleHaze

All-Star
#45
#45
pdizo916 said:
Damn, you guys are so damn negative around here. This is a good deal IMO. He has been a career back up but I think he can flourish with Sacramento. He can also play defense even though he's "undersized" (same height as chris paul)

This site should be called kingsfansbitch.com because it seems like the majority of people complain about EVERYTHING. "Oh, he's overpaid," "Oh, he's too small," "Oh, we're settling for team's sloppy seconds!" NEWSFLASH: As of right now, Sacramento is one of the LEAST desirable destination to play basketball, and yet, the majority of you guys act snobbish in regards to talented players? Give me a break and get real Sacramento, LOL! IT may be a midget but he's still a hell of a talent. Collison may have been a career back up but that doesn't mean he's not talented. And this deal is a hell of alot better than the Landry deal last year. (we can all ***** at that one) Every player that is mentioned on this board is either ripped to shreds or over analyzed. It really makes me SMH because it seems like this board doesn't want any player to join the team...
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What?! Clear majority of the thread so far are praising or at least giving a nod to the signing, not majority complaining. Sure there's always going to be some naysayers with every move unspectacular 28 wins back-to-back Kings make. Did you complain when majority were ripping IT endlessly for months and months - not because they hated him - but because they simply preferred the midget as 6th man.
 
Padrino

Padrino

All-Star
#47
#47
Section 101 said:
I wouldn't call him a stop gap. There wasn't much of a drop off for the Clips when CP3 went down last year and he played with CP3 a lot in the playoffs cause they need him on the floor.

This is a good signing. Whether he starts or comes in as a 6th man his salary fits either way.
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well, it may turn out that he's not a stop gap, but neither does the signing scream "long-term starter" to me. that said, i agree with your final point; at 3/$16 million, there's flexibility in what the kings can do with darren collison. they can slot him in as the starter for the time being, and if a better option presents itself somewhere down the pipeline, then they can easily shift him into a back-up role while not overpaying for those services (as with carl landry)...

at one time, IT presented a similar kind of flexibility. but the problem with playing isaiah thomas starter minutes last season and asking him to carry a heavy offensive load during a contract year was that it boosted his value quite a bit on the free agent market. the kings inadvertently priced themselves out of retaining thomas' services at a flexible salary figure. hopefully they'll be able to execute a worthwhile sign-and-trade of thomas to bring back a contributor of some kind, but those options will be limited...

either way, i'm satisfied with the collison signing. if cousins and gay continue to develop chemistry, if stauskas can have an immediate impact as an efficient 3-point shooter and occasional ball handler, and if collison can function effectively as a do-a-little-bit-of-everything roleplayer, the kings might be able to win a few more games. the bench still needs a lot of work, though...
 
Jkbiker

Jkbiker

Starter
#48
#48
So Detroit may still be in the running, but we will not have any leverage in any S&T negociations?


Alex Kennedy: Pistons continue to express serious interest in Isaiah Thomas, per source. They may pursue him even harder, knowing Kings unlikely to match. Twitter @AlexKennedyNBA

Rumors tagsDetroit Pistons, Sacramento Kings, Free Agency, Isaiah Thomas
- See more at: http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm#sthash.LS0fET13.dpuf
 
Hoovtrain

Hoovtrain

All-Star
#49
#49
Jkbiker said:
So Detroit may still be in the running, but we will not have any leverage in any S&T negociations?


Alex Kennedy: Pistons continue to express serious interest in Isaiah Thomas, per source. They may pursue him even harder, knowing Kings unlikely to match. Twitter @AlexKennedyNBA

Rumors tagsDetroit Pistons, Sacramento Kings, Free Agency, Isaiah Thomas
- See more at: http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm#sthash.LS0fET13.dpuf
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Why would you compromise your leverage? It's like they were so desperate/scared to grab a PG, they may have screwed themselves with a S&T..not as though i had high expectations anyways on what they would have gotten back.
 
MassachusettsKingsFan

MassachusettsKingsFan

All-Star
#50
#50
Hoovtrain said:
Why would you compromise your leverage? It's like they were so desperate/scared to grab a PG, they may have screwed themselves with a S&T..not as though i had high expectations anyways on what they would have gotten back.
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One thought I had, somewhat conspiracyish ..

Sign Collison before Thomas signs an offer sheet, Kings lose leverage, with time teams inevitably drop out of Thomas chase because cap space was used elsewhere, offers for Thomas come down. Thomas signs lower than expected offer sheet because teams think Kings are out of it, Kings match and keep Thomas at a lower number.

Unlikely. Would be an interesting tactic though.
 
Hoovtrain

Hoovtrain

All-Star
#51
#51
MassachusettsKingsFan said:
One thought I had, somewhat conspiracyish ..

Sign Collison before Thomas signs an offer sheet, Kings lose leverage, with time teams inevitably drop out of Thomas chase because cap space was used elsewhere, offers for Thomas come down. Thomas signs lower than expected offer sheet because teams think Kings are out of it, Kings match and keep Thomas at a lower number.

Unlikely. Would be an interesting tactic though.
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I like the way you think. Please put in your resume for the Kings GM position.
 
S

sdballer

Starter
#52
#52
A decent move. Won't make us a contender but probably the best option available right now.

To not waste IT as an asset, let's do:
IT/Landry/bruski to Detroit for smith.

Still have Ben and our expirings as assets for other pieces.

It's a start.
 
Jerichoholic

Jerichoholic

Bench
#54
#54
est.1999 said:
IT was a chucker on a bad team. Collison was huge for the Clippers in many 4th quarters last season, including the playoffs. Solid signing.
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Exactly! It all comes down to usage rate when looking at effectiveness. When Thomas came off the bench at the beginning of the year he averaged about 17 points per game in about 25 minutes per game. When he became the starter he averaged about 20 points per game in about 37 minutes per game. That's just 3 points more in 12 additional minutes. Minutes go up by 48%, points go up by just 18%, not to mention the lower shooting percentages and the even worse defense. It's hard to play consistent effort defense when playing that many minutes and being relied on to score so much which is why his defense was noticeably worse when he got the starting job. Bottom line, Thomas was not as effective as some people like to think.

Now we have Collison who will have a lower usage rate and still be effective which does a couple things. It allows our best two players (Cousins and Gay) to have a higher usage rate if necessary. Also and perhaps more importantly, our younger players can get a higher usage rate which allows development and grows confidence.

Last year we had the Big 3 and a bunch of scrubs. This year we have the Big 2, a solid starter, and perhaps a group of young players who were scrubs, but now can blossom into something better than that resulting in a better all-around team. That is the hope.
 
Tetsujin

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#56
#56
usernamepassword said:
HAHAHA, F*** you too, Simmons.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" lang="en"><p>Darren Collison was in the 2009 Draft -he&#39;s been on 5 teams already. I like that Vivek has pushed Sacramento into nonstop WTF mode.</p>&mdash; Bill Simmons (@BillSimmons) <a href="https://twitter.com/BillSimmons/statuses/484730818586099712">July 3, 2014</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
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In other news today, water is wet.
 
Mass

Mass

Starter
#57
#57
I think it's a good signing! Finally some D! And I'm pretty sure Collison will be better than people expect for this team.

Then, they didn't compromise their leverage at all for a s&t. Detroit is desperately trying to trade Smith. Monroe does not want him there. Van Gundy knows he's not a SF. So, if this is really what they were talking about, this deal is still on the table. Detroit can't wait to get rid of Smith.
 
Jkbiker

Jkbiker

Starter
#58
#58
sdballer said:
A decent move. Won't make us a contender but probably the best option available right now.

To not waste IT as an asset, let's do:
IT/Landry/bruski to Detroit for smith.

Still have Ben and our expirings as assets for other pieces.
It's a start.
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So if we lost our leverage , why would Detroit take Landry off our hands?

If they were playing Smith at the 3 , then maybe they want Dwill instead, plus he is an expiring next year

We might have said "no way" before , but now ?
 
U

usernamepassword

Prospect
#59
#59
I don't mind this pickup at all. If we use the stretch provision on Terry, we may even be able to re-sign IT. Collison was one hell of a sixth man last year for the clips. I'd like to see him be that here.
 
kupman

kupman

Starter
#60
#60
MassachusettsKingsFan said:
One thought I had, somewhat conspiracyish ..

Sign Collison before Thomas signs an offer sheet, Kings lose leverage, with time teams inevitably drop out of Thomas chase because cap space was used elsewhere, offers for Thomas come down. Thomas signs lower than expected offer sheet because teams think Kings are out of it, Kings match and keep Thomas at a lower number.

Unlikely. Would be an interesting tactic though.
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I think that this is a reasonable theory. Not saying that the Kings will re-sign IT, but the DC signing could lower the IT value, making a re-signing at least more feasible/cost effective.
 
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