Why Does It Matter if Tyreke Is a "Point Guard"?

[Mitch Richmond]

I consistently see talk on this board regarding the debate between whether or not Tyreke is a "pure point guard" or not. My question to you is, why does it matter?

You need a SUPERSTAR and a STAR to win a title in this league. Tyreke will be a superstar. There is no denying that. So there is one of the two peices we need. You don't need a "Pure Point Guard" to win a title. You need a superstar, a star, and role players that compliment them.

We as fans should be worrying about anyone on our roster can develop into that second bannana (Robin to Reke's Batman) and take our team to the next level. In my opinion the only person capable of this is Donte, but I do not see it happeening honestly. The Kings are CLOSE to having the roleplayers we need to fill out the roster, it's that STAR and defensive bigman that we are lacking.

All of this Is Reke a PG? Is he not a PG? talk needs to stop. IT DOES NOT MATTER WHETHER OR NOT HE IS A POINT GUARD, THE KID IS GOING TO BE A SUPERSTAR IN THIS LEAGUE!!! In fact, let's look at teams in the league who have Superstars and a second star.

Lakers: Kobe (Pau)
Cavs: Bron (Mo/Antwan)
Denver: Melo (Billups)
Dallas: Dirk (Caron)
OKC: Durant (Westbrook)
Spurs: Duncan (Ginobli/Parker)
Boston: Pierce (Garnett/Ray)

Do you see a common theme here? They all happen to be the best teams in the league. And it doesn't matter whether they have a "pure point guard" or not. In fact you could argue that NONE of them have a "pure point guard" (except OKC).

Put the argument to rest, it's pointless.

 

[LPKingsFan]

For me, the whole point of PG positioning matters not for role in intiating the offense--indeed, as you indicate, most superstars out there dominate the ball enough to be the defacto PG in their system, thus most teams with such stars don't have the typical PG but intead have the Mo Williams, Derek Fisher, mold, guys who merely bring the ball up the court, but then hand it off to the superstar to run the offense. In fact the one exception you list in Westbrook, I'd say doesn't have a traditional point guard game either, although you did miss the obvious Kidd .

That said, I and I think most here like the idea of having Evans play at the point guard positoin (again without regards to who brings the ball up or whatever) because of the mismatch possibilities. Evans is a beast no matter who is on him (see the Artest spin move) but I think the team will succeed best when other teams have to guard him with their point guards. That means having a bigger guard next to him on whom other teams can't hide thieir PGs.

Right now, I'm fine with the Beno/Reke tandem as long as the Reke/Cisco tandem gets a lot of minutes too. Ultimately, I'd prefer the Reke/Cisco tandem to start and bring Beno off the bench. In either case, what matters is not getting a "pure, pass first PG" next to Reke, but simply someone who can dribble, play defense, and hit the jumpers that Reke creates on his drives. Both Beno and Cisco have shown they can do that (well, maybe not the defense), but in my mind the edge goes to the taller guard in order to force the mismatch against Reke.

 

[Mitch Richmond]

For me, the whole point of PG positioning matters not for role in intiating the offense--indeed, as you indicate, most superstars out there dominate the ball enough to be the defacto PG in their system, thus most teams with such stars don't have the typical PG but intead have the Mo Williams, Derek Fisher, mold, guys who merely bring the ball up the court, but then hand it off to the superstar to run the offense. In fact the one exception you list in Westbrook, I'd say doesn't have a traditional point guard game either, although you did miss the obvious Kidd .

That said, I and I think most here like the idea of having Evans play at the point guard positoin (again without regards to who brings the ball up or whatever) because of the mismatch possibilities. Evans is a beast no matter who is on him (see the Artest spin move) but I think the team will succeed best when other teams have to guard him with their point guards. That means having a bigger guard next to him on whom other teams can't hide thieir PGs.

Right now, I'm fine with the Beno/Reke tandem as long as the Reke/Cisco tandem gets a lot of minutes too. Ultimately, I'd prefer the Reke/Cisco tandem to start and bring Beno off the bench. In either case, what matters is not getting a "pure, pass first PG" next to Reke, but simply someone who can dribble, play defense, and hit the jumpers that Reke creates on his drives. Both Beno and Cisco have shown they can do that (well, maybe not the defense), but in my mind the edge goes to the taller guard in order to force the mismatch against Reke.

I couldn't agree with you more. Which brings me again to question why people care if Reke is a "point guard" or not. It does not matter. He is a ball dominant superstar.

 

[TTown Kings]

It doesn't...

 

[Peja]

It doesn't...

Word!

He only needs to improve his FT and 3P shooting percentage. The rest is not important(or should I say rest=mateen)

 

[PurpleHaze]

Point guard, Pure point guard, True point guard, Lead guard, Combo guard, Scoring guard, Defensive guard stopper, Off the ball guard, On the ball guard, Kings big guard, NBA star guard, Number 13, Just a basketball player, Just Tyreke...

 

[Rookie]

I doubt at this point that anyone would say that Evans can't play the PG but rather some still think he would be better at the SG position.

But it doesn't matter when you have a superstar...you don't need a PG to run the play. The superstar is the General.

 

[mac]

It only mattered up to the point where it no longer mattered

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Why does it matter if Evans is a "Point Guard?"

Answer spoilered below:

Spoiler

You're welcome.

 

[Nazman]

It only mattered up to the point where it no longer mattered

Tyreke as point guard? What does it matter?
Several obvious answers in my mind;
Magic Johnson, Jason Kidd, Kevin Stockton and Steve Nash just to name a few. Points guards are a special breed. They can drive and penetrate, they can score from anywhere and this pedigree has. But the key element of a point guard is that their rash of skills to include the fact that they are dangerous from anywhere on court and can dish w/ lightening speed is that "they make their teammates better."

They have a third eye so to speak. They see the court and feel the flow of the game with raw instincts that are beyond question when observed. It's open to debate but that's just not who Tyreke is. Not that pedigree and hasn't enhanced the play of his peers despite a run of triples this past few weeks. And still not clear if he can be that franchise player that literally carries the entire team forward on his back. Say what you will about who Tyreke has to work with on court. He just doesn't feel like a 1.

 

[mac]

Tyreke as point guard? What does it matter?
Several obvious answers in my mind;
Magic Johnson, Jason Kidd, Kevin Stockton and Steve Nash just to name a few. Points guards are a special breed. They can drive and penetrate, they can score from anywhere and this pedigree has. But the key element of a point guard is that their rash of skills to include the fact that they are dangerous from anywhere on court and can dish w/ lightening speed is that "they make their teammates better."

They have a third eye so to speak. They see the court and feel the flow of the game with raw instincts that are beyond question when observed. It's open to debate but that's just not who Tyreke is. Not that pedigree and hasn't enhanced the play of his peers despite a run of triples this past few weeks. And still not clear if he can be that franchise player that literally carries the entire team forward on his back. Say what you will about who Tyreke has to work with on court. He just doesn't feel like a 1.

That's fine...but it doesn't answer the question of why it matters. Kobe and Lebron make their team mates better ... to a certain level at least. They aren't point guards. Don't see Nash or Stockton or Kidd winning a ring anywhere...I see Derek Fisher with a few.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

Short answer is that it doesn't matter because he is obviously a special player.

The long answer revolves around the belief that a great pure PG will turn all the scrubs around him into all-stars coupled with the belief that a natural SG playing PG is nothing more than a ball hog and black hole.

 

[Löwenherz]

I always thought Evans was a linebacker.

 

[Mitch Richmond]

That's fine...but it doesn't answer the question of why it matters. Kobe and Lebron make their team mates better ... to a certain level at least. They aren't point guards. Don't see Nash or Stockton or Kidd winning a ring anywhere...I see Derek Fisher with a few.

Exactly. Dwade, LeBron, Kobe, Jordan... none are point guards. All make (made) their team better and had those same abilities as you listed.

 

[Chupacabra]

You can knock many point guards for the same thing that Evans gets knocked for. There are also some things that Evans gets criticism for that simply arent true. I think its also an issue because Evans is clearly listed as a point guard. Somehow people arent able to grasp that the Kings starting lineup lists Evans as the point guard.

It seems to me that the main mistake people make when making point guard comparisons with Tyreke is that they choose the best point guards that have ever played. " If Evans doesnt play like Jason Kidd, Magic Johnson, John Stockton...etc well then he must not be a point guard. Mehmet Okur likes to shoot 3 pointers, isnt a good defensive player, isnt a great rebounder, fits none of the characteristics of a stereotypical center. However, Mehmet Okur is a center. Why isnt this reasoning used ?

 

[VF21]

It doesn't...

Ding! Ding! Ding!

We have a winner...

 

[Superman]

Word!

He only needs to improve his FT and 3P shooting percentage. The rest is not important(or should I say rest=mateen)

Because of his style of play, I'm more concerned with his midrange shot than his three point shot. When Dwayne Wade started pulling up mid-drive and knocking that midrange shot down consistently, he became an unstoppable force. Right now, when Reke gets ready to go to the rack, he just has to go and see what happens. Either he's going for the layup, or he's gonna kick to a teammate, if someone is open. There will come a time when he will be able to stop and pop, which will keep his man from playing off of him so far. And built off that shot will come a little stepback jumper that he'll use against physical defenders.

I don't have a lot of hope for him from distance, but with the midrange jumper, 12-18 feet, he'd be deadly. And that's definitely a shot that he can add and eventually rely on.

 

[roasthawg]

It doesn't matter at all what you classify Evans as... PG, SG, G, whatever. All that matters is what type of player fits best next to him. To me that's a guy like Beno.

 

[Superman]

It doesn't matter at all what you classify Evans as... PG, SG, G, whatever. All that matters is what type of player fits best next to him. To me that's a guy like Beno.

Very true. I was critical of Beno because he hadn't done anything to warrant that big contract he got, but he just looks much better as Reke's wingman than he has since 2007.

 

[VF21]

Very true. I was critical of Beno because he hadn't done anything to warrant that big contract he got, but he just looks much better as Reke's wingman than he has since 2007.

As a slight aside, I think at least partial credit for Beno's performance this year can be attributed to having a real coach on the sidelines instead of just a guy in a suit.

 

[Superman]

As a slight aside, I think at least partial credit for Beno's performance this year can be attributed to having a real coach on the sidelines instead of just a guy in a suit.

I'm good with that.

 

[Kingsguy881]

It matters if you are a purist and stuck in 1969.

 

[BosnianBaller_]

Because of his style of play, I'm more concerned with his midrange shot than his three point shot. When Dwayne Wade started pulling up mid-drive and knocking that midrange shot down consistently, he became an unstoppable force. Right now, when Reke gets ready to go to the rack, he just has to go and see what happens. Either he's going for the layup, or he's gonna kick to a teammate, if someone is open. There will come a time when he will be able to stop and pop, which will keep his man from playing off of him so far. And built off that shot will come a little stepback jumper that he'll use against physical defenders.

I don't have a lot of hope for him from distance, but with the midrange jumper, 12-18 feet, he'd be deadly. And that's definitely a shot that he can add and eventually rely on.

totally agree. he needs that mid range jumper to become a star because he's had some trouble when teams clog the lane. just focus on the jumper and don't even worry about the 3. i think wade has actually taken a step back in his production because he has fallen in love in taking too many 3s. stick to your strengths

 

[swisshh]

It matters in how you build the team. If you go about building the team as though Evans is the PG then you are not going to build a legit contender. If you build the team with Evans as a ball dominant combo guard then you are much more likely to build a legit contender. The key is that those are two different teams you are building.

People point out Derek Fisher and Mo Williams as non-traditional PGs on contender teams. The thing is, Tyreke is not either of those players. He is the player they are paired next to. If you put Tyreke into their role then you are wasting his talent.

 

[Chupacabra]

It matters in how you build the team. If you go about building the team as though Evans is the PG then you are not going to build a legit contender. If you build the team with Evans as a ball dominant combo guard then you are much more likely to build a legit contender. The key is that those are two different teams you are building.

People point out Derek Fisher and Mo Williams as non-traditional PGs on contender teams. The thing is, Tyreke is not either of those players. He is the player they are paired next to. If you put Tyreke into their role then you are wasting his talent.

Says you, based on nothing. Derrick rose isnt a traditional point guard either. He isnt a bad piece to have. This whole "traditional vs. non-traditional....true vs. not true" thing is being entirely over used/over analyzed. Mainly by yourself. You seem to have a VERY narrow sense of what basketball is and how its played.

 

[cstorm]

As a slight aside, I think at least partial credit for Beno's performance this year can be attributed to having a real coach on the sidelines instead of just a guy in a suit.

Ahhh, but a very nice suit.

 

[slugking50]

It matters if you are a purist and stuck in 1969.

^^^^

 

[mac]

It matters in how you build the team. If you go about building the team as though Evans is the PG then you are not going to build a legit contender. If you build the team with Evans as a ball dominant combo guard then you are much more likely to build a legit contender. The key is that those are two different teams you are building.

People point out Derek Fisher and Mo Williams as non-traditional PGs on contender teams. The thing is, Tyreke is not either of those players. He is the player they are paired next to. If you put Tyreke into their role then you are wasting his talent.

You have a valid point there in some sense but I'd like to give my counter-argument. We don't really need to 'build' around Evans at the guard positions, I think the organisation is quite set on having Garcia and Beno here for a long term because they fit quite well with Tyreke. Whether you call Evans the PG or a ball dominant combo guard he won't play well with the likes of Wall. (I just thought of a joke, if you have Wall as your star player then you build around the wall ...) Anyway, my point is that the focus of our rebuilding now should be clearing the SF logjam as well as solidifying our big man spots. The guard positions IMO are more or less settled, and thus it doesn't matter if you call Tyreke a PG or a ball dominant combo. Either way he needs to have good 3 point shooters around him to best utilise his driving ability, and we also need a stronger post presence regardless of what he's called.

What I find ironic is that despite us running an inverted princeton offense for so long, nobody called Vlade or Webber the point guard... Hey, they were setting guys up and making their team mates better. As far as I'm concerned this whole "point guard" title is being overly read into. It's just a position, you have 5 guys on the court and the title is simply a position so that guys know what their general role is. Imagine if every basketball coach had to tell each guy exactly what to do, exactly who to defend, exactly who was gonna bring the ball up, who you're supposed to find on the break etc.