Waiting to unload?

[Fresno King]

Just wondering... does anyone else think Petrie is waiting to see what the team's record will be at the all-star break before making any moves? He may be thinking, if we're -- games out of the 8th playoff spot, we'll either tear the team down or make a playoff push with the current roster."

I think that's what he's doing - fielding calls for now to see what the interest is for Artest, Bibby and Miller - waiting to see what happens - and then make a trade or two IF we're too far out of it.

My two cents - if the Kings are 5 games or less out of the 8th spot at the break, Petrie will keep the roster intact, but I hope that's NOT what happens.

 

[Tarindel]

Just wondering... does anyone else think Petrie is waiting to see what the team's record will be at the all-star break before making any moves?

No, I don't believe so. He already knows the Kings aren't going to make the playoffs. Assuming 47 wins are necessary to make the 8 spot, the Kings have to win 33 out of their 47 next games (70%). While not impossible, the odds of that happening are minuscule.

 

[piksi]

If GP for one second still believes that we can make POs - he should be fired on the spot. This isn't a rocket science anymore.

 

[VF21]

I think Petrie is fielding offers but I also think those offers haven't been as forthcoming since both Artest and Bibby have been injured...

 

[PurpleHaze]

I'm sure GP is desperate to move any one of several players. It's been all over the the media since last season that the Kings are trying to trade Bibby. Artest is sure to go if the right offer comes along. Obviously, GP would love to package some expensive dead weight like K9, SAR, or even Miller if there's something out there worth pulling the trigger.

In the meantime, he's surely worried about Kings attendance. Tonight it was a shade over 14,000 and has been more like 12,000 or so for most home games this season. If this team were a joke and not playing hard any guess what the attendance might be?

 

[Circa_1985_Fan]

I think Petrie is fielding offers but I also think those offers haven't been as forthcoming since both Artest and Bibby have been injured...

Yeah, I think this is a part of it, and the more lucrative deals should be coming as we get closer to the deadline...if not, we'll just have to keep them, no biggy. We're going to be in the lottery, either way, unfortunately...depending on how you look at it. I wonder how much better the offers would be even if Ron and Mike were healthy, since they are still here, that must mean that the 'healthy' offers he got at the end of last season wern't all that good, either.

 

[SacTownKid]

If GP for one second still believes that we can make POs - he should be fired on the spot. This isn't a rocket science anymore.

Even I have come to the conclusion that it's time. The scary thing is this team could be a playoff contender, but just enough to work our way towards the back of the lotto again.

 

[Gary]

Not sure what's going on in Kings land. My buddy that works in the office hasn't heard any rumors or anything. Pretty much everything is as "usual" as usual gets.

I do like the Kings positions in dealing a SG/SF. I am surprised how many contending teams need this position filled. We have four options here. I am sure if it COULD be done that Petrie has probably been shopping Martin, Garcia, Salmons, or Artest in order to get a PF in here. I wouldn't be surprised if in the coming weeks as we get closer to the trade deadline if we hear names like Pau Gasol, Jermain O'Neal, Drew Gooden (meh), Darko Milicic (bleh), Udonis Haslem (again, bleh) put into print somewhere whether the Bee, or online as possible trade pieces, with the Kings being mentioned..

I can only see Petrie making a deal for someone who would improve this team. At this point it would only be Gasol, or O'Neal who would improve the team. Gooden, and Haslem wouldn't improve the Kings, and Darko would be too much of a wild card to take a chance on.

 

[DocHolliday]

Not sure what's going on in Kings land. My buddy that works in the office hasn't heard any rumors or anything. Pretty much everything is as "usual" as usual gets.

I do like the Kings positions in dealing a SG/SF. I am surprised how many contending teams need this position filled. We have four options here. I am sure if it COULD be done that Petrie has probably been shopping Martin, Garcia, Salmons, or Artest in order to get a PF in here. I wouldn't be surprised if in the coming weeks as we get closer to the trade deadline if we hear names like Pau Gasol, Jermain O'Neal, Drew Gooden (meh), Darko Milicic (bleh), Udonis Haslem (again, bleh) put into print somewhere whether the Bee, or online as possible trade pieces, with the Kings being mentioned..

I can only see Petrie making a deal for someone who would improve this team. At this point it would only be Gasol, or O'Neal who would improve the team. Gooden, and Haslem wouldn't improve the Kings, and Darko would be too much of a wild card to take a chance on.

I really don't want any of the people you named on this team. Drew Gooden isn't all that great, Udonis Haslem is terrible, Pau Gasol is huge contract the Kings don't need to be saddled with, and Jermain ONeal is damaged goods with a huge contract. We had one of those before, and got rid of it already.

 

[kupman]

Me thinks trades are very hard to pull-off in real life.

 

[Glenn]

I really don't want any of the people you named on this team. Drew Gooden isn't all that great, Udonis Haslem is terrible, Pau Gasol is huge contract the Kings don't need to be saddled with, and Jermain ONeal is damaged goods with a huge contract. We had one of those before, and got rid of it already.

I would love to have Gasol. He is moderately disgruntled with the Griz. He could be acquired via a trade of Bibby or a couple of our 2s and 3s. (The details aren't the issue) As such a trade requires a salary match (essentially), Gasol's salary is not the issue either. I would like a great pf right now to take advantage of the developing and developed talents of our small guys in a period where Brad is still able to contribute something. That means right now.

Who do you suggest we get and why?

 

[Gary]

I don't think this team can compete on a nightly basis with the type of players we have. The great thing about our situation is that we have 6 players who can all start and fill in nicely at PG/SG/SF, and there are a few contending teams that are a SG/PG/SF from a championship. This team is a solid PF away from playoff contention, and a couple years with that big away from contending again.

This might be something interesting, or maybe not, but Moore in our wins is averaging 9.3ppg 5.6rpg 0.6bpg. In losses Moore averages 7.6ppg 6.4rpg 0.5bpg. Moore's averages pretty much are the same win or lose.. He seems to give us all he has either way.

Now take Miller for example... He averages 17.2ppg 10.3rpg 3.8apg 0.9bpg in wins which are borderline all-star numbers, and in losses Miller averages 11.9ppg 8.0rpg 3.1apg 1.1bpg which are just average.

See the disparity? We lack a PF who can produce. Take Moore, and bring him off the bench, and get a PF in here who can give us 18ppg 10rpg, and a block and a half, and all of a sudden we are winning much more games. We are seriously a decent PF away from winning a lot more games. Miller cannot do it on his own on the front line, and I applaud him for his stellar play this season, but the guy needs some front court help.

Personally I think Gasol would be the answer we are looking for. On this team Gasol would be the difference between 35, and 50 wins.

 

[DocHolliday]

I would love to have Gasol. He is moderately disgruntled with the Griz. He could be acquired via a trade of Bibby or a couple of our 2s and 3s. (The details aren't the issue) As such a trade requires a salary match (essentially), Gasol's salary is not the issue either. I would like a great pf right now to take advantage of the developing and developed talents of our small guys in a period where Brad is still able to contribute something. That means right now.

Oh, and Gasol isn't bad, but he's over-paid.

Who do you suggest we get and why?

I never said I had the answer, I said I didn't agree with this idea. I don't concern myself too much with these thngs. If I was getting paid to, then I would. Other than that I wait to see what happens in real life, when it happens.

What would I like to happen? Well if Geoff chooses to trade Bibby or Ron, then I want to see Kenny packaged with either one of them, to bring back a couple slightly bloated contracts that end oat the end of this year. I don't really care who it is, even if they are horrible and are getting paid WAY more than they are worth, like Kenny Thomas. I just want the contracts to end at the end of this season.

 

[VF21]

I can only see Petrie making a deal for someone who would improve this team. At this point it would only be Gasol, or O'Neal who would improve the team.

Jermaine O'Neal is NOT the player he used to be. He would not improve the Kings, especially as we try and build for the future. He would, IMHO, actually be worse than what we already have because he carries the "superstar" baggage with him.

 

[Kingster]

Just wondering... does anyone else think Petrie is waiting to see what the team's record will be at the all-star break before making any moves? He may be thinking, if we're -- games out of the 8th playoff spot, we'll either tear the team down or make a playoff push with the current roster."

I think that's what he's doing - fielding calls for now to see what the interest is for Artest, Bibby and Miller - waiting to see what happens - and then make a trade or two IF we're too far out of it.

My two cents - if the Kings are 5 games or less out of the 8th spot at the break, Petrie will keep the roster intact, but I hope that's NOT what happens.

I think - and hope - that Petrie doesn't need a few more games to know what kind of team he has. But you may be right. Maybe he is doing the typical Petrie thing - waiting and seeing.....

Bye the way, Petrie WILL NOT MAKE A DEAL! He will dissapoint AGAIN. I say that with the full knowledge that I could be wrong. Strange things happen, right? I just refuse to put myself in a position of hope, only to have Petrie sit there in his office waiting and seeing. We've (at least some) have been waiting for this deal to happen for over two years now. I don't even know what "waiting for Godot" means, but whatever it does mean I've been waiting for this Godot for a seeming eternity now. I repeat - PETRIE WILL NOT MAKE A DEAL!

 

[Gary]

Jermaine O'Neal is NOT the player he used to be. He would not improve the Kings, especially as we try and build for the future. He would, IMHO, actually be worse than what we already have because he carries the "superstar" baggage with him.

He is taking fewer shots, and his knee is bothering him, but his "hops" are still there. O'Neal is rebounding at about the same pace, and blocking a couple shots a game as he usually does.

He's not at the point Webber was where Webber couldn't even get up high enough to block a shot. When I see blocks going down to less than 1 per game than I would worry about O'Neal.

I feel he has a good 3-4 years left in him before he declines to less than 10 points, 6 boards, and a block. But you are right. I just realized he's 30 this year, which is getting kind of old for someone with knee problems.

 

[John Galt]

He is taking fewer shots, and his knee is bothering him, but his "hops" are still there. O'Neal is rebounding at about the same pace, and blocking a couple shots a game as he usually does.

He's not at the point Webber was where Webber couldn't even get up high enough to block a shot. When I see blocks going down to less than 1 per game than I would worry about O'Neal.

I feel he has a good 3-4 years left in him before he declines to less than 10 points, 6 boards, and a block. But you are right. I just realized he's 30 this year, which is getting kind of old for someone with knee problems.

I think O'Neal is a loser and I don't want him - I would rather let our bad contracts expire in God's good time than make a deal for O'Neal.

I would rather get Stoudamire or even Brand. A Gasol deal would be fine with me.

 

[bloom]

Me thinks trades are very hard to pull-off in real life.

Me thinks you're right.

I really don't want any of the people you named on this team. Drew Gooden isn't all that great, Udonis Haslem is terrible, Pau Gasol is huge contract the Kings don't need to be saddled with, and Jermain ONeal is damaged goods with a huge contract. We had one of those before, and got rid of it already.

Thank You. Some of the players that people mention just make me cringe. I really don't want Gooden, Haslem and Jermain ONeal. I don't like Gasol either, but I guess I wouldn't mind him compared to all those other guys who'd probably do nothing for us.

 

[dude12]

Gasol puts up some nice numbers but he makes way more than he should. If he's so good why don't they win more. They have some decent pieces around him and have had some talent in the past.

 

[Glenn]

Gasol puts up some nice numbers but he makes way more than he should. If he's so good why don't they win more. They have some decent pieces around him and have had some talent in the past.

All Stars usually end up being over paid. That's the nature of things in the NBA. Then again he was a bargain when younger. Owners just keep folding and giving in to the demands.

It takes more than one star to win. Phoenix has Marion, Stoudamire and Nash and haven't won it all. Gasol seems to be a Kevin Martin type player - not willing or able to carry a team but a great second fiddle.

Although I wouldn't hook my wagon to the Artest star, he is more a leader than Martin and Gasol. I'd love to see the three on the same team and see what happens. Two great 2nd fiddles and a first fiddle "wanna be" might work out well together. By necessity it would mean Bibby had to be gone.

 

[Oscar]

All Stars usually end up being over paid. That's the nature of things in the NBA.

All Stars are not overpaid. Team owners hire them to put fans in the seats. They are paid what they are worth. And what they are worth is what they and their reps can negotiate. It's a simple economic system and despite what people think about certain players who they think are "way overpaid," it works.

 

[Glenn]

All Stars are not overpaid. Team owners hire them to put fans in the seats. They are paid what they are worth. And what they are worth is what they and their reps can negotiate. It's a simple economic system and despite what people think about certain players who they think are "way overpaid," it works.

I'm not sure how to determine "overpaid" then. I guess if owners ae willing to pay, no one is over paid. If you believe this article http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_qn4188/is_20070415/ai_n19016501 teams are losing money.

The players are lucky most owners see this as one mega hobby and losing money is part of the economic model.

 

[fnordius]

I think that most owners aren't in it for short term profit, I think they're in it for equity gains. As that article pointed out, Charlotte was the only team in the NBA whose value decreased last year. When owners cash out, they usually seem to pocket at least $100M, which is pretty lucrative as hobbies go.

But I also agree that the stars are overpaid. When the NBA started, the highest paid player in the league was making $8,000 a year, and the salary cap for teams was $55K. Between 1946 and 1985, the cap rose to $3.6M, at which point the average player would have been making $240K a year, which ain't bad for a recent college graduate. By '95 it was $16M, and with the average player making over $1M/yr., anyone with a lick of sense who had the opportunity to get into the NBA, would. It's not like a regular job, or playing outside of the US, could compete with that. And yet, in the last 12 years, pay has almost quadrupled; the cap is now $56M, and most teams are well over cap. Pay in Europe currently ranges from several thousand dollars a year to a million or so, for major stars. The NBA pays $427K to undrafted rookies, and $18.3M to stars. (Some older contracts run up to $23.75M/yr, the $18.3M limit's fairly recent, and goes up every year.)

What I'd like to know is who the NBA is competing with. If pay dropped by 75%, tomorrow, the average player would still be making around a million a year, and we could still lure athletes away from foreign leagues. And what else are potential players going to do? It's not like most of these guys are giving up positions as CEOs of Fortune 500 companies to play basketball. What job could Kenny Thomas find that would compete with guaranteed job security while making $1863 a minute to scowl on the bench?

I think that the NBA's business model is broken, that they're pricing a lot of fans out of the market, and pricing a lot of cities out of the market. They seem to have decided that they'd make money no matter what, and that cities would happily subsidize them by ponying up a half a billion dollars for a money-losing arena just for the privilege of having a team. Overpaying players is just one symptom of the bigger problem.

 

[dude12]

All Stars are not overpaid. Team owners hire them to put fans in the seats. They are paid what they are worth. And what they are worth is what they and their reps can negotiate. It's a simple economic system and despite what people think about certain players who they think are "way overpaid," it works.

OK...looking at your criteria of owners paying players to put people in seats, Memphis is failing as they rank 27th in the league (we are 25) in attendance. Gasol doesn't put people in the seats as much as winning does. Gasol is tied for 25th in player salary according to Hoopshype. Bibby by the way is 27. I would say in this case, it doesn't work.