this has become a sloppy, and turnover prone team

KP said:
What do you expect? They traded away their best passer. They are gonna have to adjust big time, they haven't been without a great passing big man at the top of the key for 6 years. Their whole offense was predicated on that, I can't believe people didn't see that. Hopefully Brad can run some more stuff in the high post for us and open up the lane down low for backcuts.
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I think technically Bibby is the best passer.
 
SacTownKid said:
I think technically Bibby is the best passer.
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Most assists, but he may actually have been the 4th best passer as recently as a year ago. He never has been nearly as creative as the Vlade/Webber/Doug trio. Just can get more places becuase of his size/ball handling.
 
Folks its gonna take time. I think Kenny, Corliss, and Skinner are going to flourish in our system. You know how I know that? B/C it seems like anyone can if previous examples give us any idea. How many guys have come here and had their team game greatly improve. Its no coincidence. Give it time and PRACTICE, you see a lot of people say the games are like practice but they aren't. You can't stop a game at any point and go over different plays until the guys fully understand them. The Kings have basically gotten by on one on one play recently and the new guys have come to the table and proven that they can do the one on one thing fairly well.

Plus a teams cohesion doesn't only effect the offensive game. Defense is a team game as well. When they get the practice time I fully expect this team to be a much better defensive unit then the Kings have had in a long long time.
 
SacTownKid said:
Folks its gonna take time. I think Kenny, Corliss, and Skinner are going to flourish in our system. You know how I know that? B/C it seems like anyone can if previous examples give us any idea. How many guys have come here and had their team game greatly improve. Its no coincidence. Give it time and PRACTICE, you see a lot of people say the games are like practice but they aren't. You can't stop a game at any point and go over different plays until the guys fully understand them. The Kings have basically gotten by on one on one play recently and the new guys have come to the table and proven that they can do the one on one thing fairly well.

Plus a teams cohesion doesn't only effect the offensive game. Defense is a team game as well. When they get the practice time I fully expect this team to be a much better defensive unit then the Kings have had in a long long time.
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The other players added to the Kings over the years were targeted acquisitions. There is a difference. We went out and got those other guys (the Christies, the Brads) BECAUSE we thought they could excel in our system. These guys are different. They are a random collection of players who arrived in town to match salaries with Webb. Not every player can play in our system. Most, in fact, cannot. Looking at their games, these guys are somewhere in the middle. KT is the best fit with his facing jumper and some minor passing ability. Corliss less so, but he's played for us before even though he can't do the things we normally like. Skinner is a better fit than most thug players because he has a few skills. But nowhere near the skills of the big guys we have always had (in the good years). There are worse fits for the system, but there are also many better.

The system isn't magic -- it just rewards unselfish players with passing skills and jumpshots.
 
Bricklayer said:
The other players added to the Kings over the years were targeted acquisitions. There is a difference. We went out and got those other guys (the Christies, the Brads) BECAUSE we thought they could excel in our system. These guys are different. They are a random collection of players who arrived in town to match salaries with Webb. Not every player can play in our system. Most, in fact, cannot. Looking at their games, these guys are somewhere in the middle. KT is the best fit with his facing jumper and some minor passing ability. Corliss less so, but he's played for us before even though he can't do the things we normally like. Skinner is a better fit than most thug players because he has a few skills. But nowhere near the skills of the big guys we have always had (in the good years). There are worse fits for the system, but there are also many better.

The system isn't magic -- it just rewards unselfish players with passing skills and jumpshots.
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A lot of this "system" relies on movement. These players just came from a "system" that relied on movement but not the same kind of movement. The movement in Philly was in order to move out of AI's way so he could score. Once these guys know where to go on the court I think it will work very well. Kenny Thomas is very fast and I think will pose a serious threat when he knows what his role is. The same with the other guys.
 
Passing fundementals do not require praticing...If the players learn to go back to the basics then the turnovers will decline. The players shouldn't attempt behind the back passes and no look passes (that includes the point guards). Basic until they understand each other. And could someone please teach our guards to stay in front of thier opponents so they will stop having free access to the basket (damm).......
 
gman23 said:
Passing fundementals do not require praticing...If the players learn to go back to the basics then the turnovers will decline. The players shouldn't attempt behind the back passes and no look passes (that includes the point guards). Basic until they understand each other. And could someone please teach our guards to stay in front of thier opponents so they will stop having free access to the basket (damm).......
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I will agree with you on th defense but I completely disagree with you on the passing. there has been no behind the back passes since Webber left.

The problem with some of the Kings turnovers is the fact they think someone is going to be somewhere and they cut a different way. This only comes with practice! These guys do not know each other it will take about 10-15 games to get to know each others quirks in a game. If they had time to practice it would only take a week or so, but they don't.
 
Diehard Jim said:
I will agree with you on th defense but I completely disagree with you on the passing. there has been no behind the back passes since Webber left.

The problem with some of the Kings turnovers is the fact they think someone is going to be somewhere and they cut a different way. This only comes with practice! These guys do not know each other it will take about 10-15 games to get to know each others quirks in a game. If they had time to practice it would only take a week or so, but they don't.
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Kings only had 12 turnovers last night(granted some were pretty blatant) and there problem now is cohesion on the defensive side. The guards, again, torched us last night because Mobley and Bibby can't guard anyone right now......I'm really "anxious" to see what Wade does tomorrow night. :rolleyes:

For the life of me I can't understand how Mo only gets 6 minutes last night when the team is playing their 4th game in 5 nights and they look beat down and could have used some energy.
 
Ryle said:
The guards, again, torched us last night because Mobley and Bibby can't guard anyone right now......I'm really "anxious" to see what Wade does tomorrow night. :rolleyes:

For the life of me I can't understand how Mo only gets 6 minutes last night when the team is playing their 4th game in 5 nights and they look beat down and could have used some energy.
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Man I forgot about Wade,,He's gonna kill Mobley...we need to probably play more zone, I don't know if Shac is playing, and if he is zone is definetly they way to go
 
Man oh man, give it a month. It takes a while to develop a little chemestry. The guys acquired need some practice time.

I predict you should see everything you need to know on the state of the Kings in a month.
 
Mobley needs to learn how to pass then he wont get so many turnovers. The new Kings are no longer the assist magicians we are used to seeing.
 
This is team in transition.

It could get a LOT worse before it begins to get better. If some of you are simply interested in watching a team win, you might want to watch the Spurs.

We're gonna go through some really rough times. It's inevitable. We can support the team OR we can start finding ways to pick them apart at each and every opportunity.

Personally, I still LOVE THIS TEAM but realistically I'm not expecting them to do the impossible. We had a really good ride and I enjoyed every single minute of it. I'll enjoy this time, too, but in a different way. Right now, the guys are out there playing on heart and instinct and determination. They haven't had much chance to even get to know each other - three of them don't even have places to call home when they get off the plane tomorrow night.

Let's remember that and have just a bit of patience.

GO KINGS!!!!!
 
you guys think im only referring to the games in which we have the new guys ? this has been going on a lot...our turnover average isnt too high i think, but we get turnovers during crucial possessions...even when we had webb, webb would try behind the back passes a lot, and they would convert into turnovers...i remember one game, i think it was couple weeks back...webb did a behind the back pass that got turned over and mobley did the same thing the next possession.......you guys just refuse the admit the obvious, this problem has been going on a long time....and some guy said francis had a good game against us, he did but does that mean he doesnt have turnover problems ? your kidding me, he is one of the most turnover prone guys in the league...why do you think hes not the point guard anymore ?
 
GoSACtown said:
you guys think im only referring to the games in which we have the new guys ? this has been going on a lot...our turnover average isnt too high i think, but we get turnovers during crucial possessions...even when we had webb, webb would try behind the back passes a lot, and they would convert into turnovers...i remember one game, i think it was couple weeks back...webb did a behind the back pass that got turned over and mobley did the same thing the next possession.......you guys just refuse the admit the obvious, this problem has been going on a long time....and some guy said francis had a good game against us, he did but does that mean he doesnt have turnover problems ? your kidding me, he is one of the most turnover prone guys in the league...why do you think hes not the point guard anymore ?
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Our To's were 13pg/best in the league before the Webb trade. The last 5 games we avg. 16.4pg/23rd in the league. I think a lot of that can be explained by guys not knowing each other yet. But I don't see why you think they turned the ball over too much before...
 
GoSACtown said:
you guys think im only referring to the games in which we have the new guys ? this has been going on a lot...our turnover average isnt too high i think, but we get turnovers during crucial possessions...even when we had webb, webb would try behind the back passes a lot, and they would convert into turnovers...i remember one game, i think it was couple weeks back...webb did a behind the back pass that got turned over and mobley did the same thing the next possession.......you guys just refuse the admit the obvious, this problem has been going on a long time....and some guy said francis had a good game against us, he did but does that mean he doesnt have turnover problems ? your kidding me, he is one of the most turnover prone guys in the league...why do you think hes not the point guard anymore ?
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Any general comments about the state of this team before Feb. 24, 2005 are now and forever irrelevant. This is not the same team and it never will be, for good or bad.

But one thing? A team whose turnovers are too low is a team who isn't passing. Doing the prediction game tallies I've noticed the Kings seem to perform best when they end up with somewhere between 10-14 turnovers because it generally means they ARE passing, and a few just get away.
 
VF21 said:
Any general comments about the state of this team before Feb. 24, 2005 are now and forever irrelevant. This is not the same team and it never will be, for good or bad.

But one thing? A team whose turnovers are too low is a team who isn't passing. Doing the prediction game tallies I've noticed the Kings seem to perform best when they end up with somewhere between 10-14 turnovers because it generally means they ARE passing, and a few just get away.
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like i said, turnovers happen, but unforced ones get me angry, and the ones where ppl just try to force it in when there is no chance....like fine if a defender is hustling and steals the pass, but when there are 2 ppl there and u throw it anyways, thats what i dont like...
 
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