Team USA, NBA players and Bogi?

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
#32
Wonder how would the opponents of Bogi doing whatever he wants within the contract react if their employees or customers start telling them what to do in their own free time for any reason.
At the same time, if I decide that instead of getting a good night's sleep I'm going to go out clubbing every night until 3 AM, causing me to stumble into work with a hangover most days and sometimes to fall asleep at my desk I'm not sure I expect my employer to put up with that for too long.

If Bogdan's offseason activities are detrimental to his ability to perform on his *guaranteed* NBA contract, I think it's a bit naïve to expect the front office to just turn a blind eye. They're paying him $8M+ per year to play basketball at the best of his ability, not to sit around on the bench with ice on his knees and buddy up with the guys. They can pay people a lot less to do that.
 
#33
Wonder how would the opponents of Bogi doing whatever he wants within the contract react if their employees or customers start telling them what to do in their own free time for any reason.
If my free time activities affected my work performance you can darn sure bet my employer would say something.
 
#35
At the same time, if I decide that instead of getting a good night's sleep I'm going to go out clubbing every night until 3 AM, causing me to stumble into work with a hangover most days and sometimes to fall asleep at my desk I'm not sure I expect my employer to put up with that for too long.

If Bogdan's offseason activities are detrimental to his ability to perform on his *guaranteed* NBA contract, I think it's a bit naïve to expect the front office to just turn a blind eye. They're paying him $8M+ per year to play basketball at the best of his ability, not to sit around on the bench with ice on his knees and buddy up with the guys. They can pay people a lot less to do that.
If your employer knew about your clubbing activities and signed you up anyway, that risk is included in contract and you might not get a new one again or you will get fired.
This employee knew very well what is included in their Bogdan package. History of nba teams signing up international players and resigning them again despite them playing over summer shows what offices think about that.
This is not about offices, they are ok.
 
#36
I look at the player as a individual person. They have gotten hurt in many ways. But when they have a track record of their non nba play effecting what they do to get that big check from the nba?

His two years here his play has been diminished from his playing overseas.
The first year he gave us everything we wanted till he wore down from continuous play.
And last year his injuries effected his play for most of the season.

Hey god and country I really really understand it.

But if you want to get paid about twice or more in the nba than you would get in Europe you should have a balanced idea of how and where you should be using your playing time.
 
#37
At the same time, if I decide that instead of getting a good night's sleep I'm going to go out clubbing every night until 3 AM, causing me to stumble into work with a hangover most days and sometimes to fall asleep at my desk I'm not sure I expect my employer to put up with that for too long.

If Bogdan's offseason activities are detrimental to his ability to perform on his *guaranteed* NBA contract, I think it's a bit naïve to expect the front office to just turn a blind eye. They're paying him $8M+ per year to play basketball at the best of his ability, not to sit around on the bench with ice on his knees and buddy up with the guys. They can pay people a lot less to do that.
How does that situation apply here? It's more like: If your job gave you 3-4 months off a year, and you decided to go participate in the same job activities during your time off, during working hours, before your job picked back up again, you wouldn't expect your employer to put up with that if it was within the bounds of your contract? I know teaching isn't that physical (albeit mentally draining), but there are a lot of teachers that have a similar schedule to the NBA, and choose to teach during the summer for various reasons. Now, if those teachers were out partying til 3 am during their school year, then yeah, I'm sure the employer wouldn't put up with that. If Bogdan was out partying until 3am the night before a game, I'm sure the Kings would have a problem with that too. Is that really what's happening here?

Can we guarantee that if he rested instead of playing, he wouldn't gain 20 lbs. and then get hurt at the start of the season?
 
#38
How does that situation apply here? It's more like: If your job gave you 3-4 months off a year, and you decided to go participate in the same job activities during your time off, during working hours, before your job picked back up again, you wouldn't expect your employer to put up with that if it was within the bounds of your contract? I know teaching isn't that physical (albeit mentally draining), but there are a lot of teachers that have a similar schedule to the NBA, and choose to teach during the summer for various reasons. Now, if those teachers were out partying til 3 am during their school year, then yeah, I'm sure the employer wouldn't put up with that. If Bogdan was out partying until 3am the night before a game, I'm sure the Kings would have a problem with that too. Is that really what's happening here?

Can we guarantee that if he rested instead of playing, he wouldn't gain 20 lbs. and then get hurt at the start of the season?
I think you are missing the point. No one is saying a word about Bjelicia because he didn’t play 4-5 years straight and lack of rest didn’t impact his play during the NBA season. No one is talking about Jokic as he skipped Eurobasket last year to rest and work on his game.

Only Bogdan has played every tournament and hasn’t had a summer off since 2015!! What is worse is Serbia is a very good team which qualifies for, and goes deep in, every tournament. And Bogdan has clearly been impacted for 2 years in a row. Bogdan’s situation is pretty unique among NBA players.
 

Capt. Factorial

This Is Why We Can't Have Nice Things
Staff member
#39
How does that situation apply here? It's more like: If your job gave you 3-4 months off a year, and you decided to go participate in the same job activities during your time off, during working hours, before your job picked back up again, you wouldn't expect your employer to put up with that if it was within the bounds of your contract? I know teaching isn't that physical (albeit mentally draining), but there are a lot of teachers that have a similar schedule to the NBA, and choose to teach during the summer for various reasons. Now, if those teachers were out partying til 3 am during their school year, then yeah, I'm sure the employer wouldn't put up with that. If Bogdan was out partying until 3am the night before a game, I'm sure the Kings would have a problem with that too. Is that really what's happening here?
It's called an analogy. I went with sleep for a normal person because professional basketball is physically demanding in a long-term way that most other people's jobs are not. We saw just this most recent season that the NBA extended the length of the regular season by several weeks to allow players more in-season rest. Professional athletes of all sports are well-known to take long breaks during the offseason and then ramp back up for the start of the season, and it's not because they don't love playing their sport of choice, it's because they've found their bodies need that.

Bogdan is one of the not-too-many players who has pretty openly been neglecting to get himself what most NBA players would consider adequate rest during the offseason. Bogdan has spent the last year, if not two, playing at what does not appear to be peak physical condition and dealing with long-term nagging injuries. And the question under discussion is whether these two things are related, and whether his employer does, or ought, to have some recourse.

Can we guarantee that if he rested instead of playing, he wouldn't gain 20 lbs. and then get hurt at the start of the season?
No, we can't. But it feels like that argument belongs in a heretofore (I believe) unenumerated category of logical fallacy that I'll call Argumentam ad mater anxia - The Worried Mother Fallacy, where a potential outlier consequence of position A is amplified to argue in favor of position B while ignoring that it is an outlier and also ignoring that position B also has potential outlier consequences.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#40
Wrong. You’re mischaracterizing. Yes, rest would be good. But you’re not acknowledging that he was injured to begin his second season and then struggled to catch up. I’m not excusing his overall sub-par play last year, nor overlooking the fact that WE would be better off if he rested when he needs rest. But you gotta be fair about it.
Yes, the injuries have been a factor. Are the injuries related to his lack of rest? Who knows. Lack of rest/injuries ==> Inconsistent Play, has been the thesis of many for quite a while now. I guess if and when he has an inconsistent upcoming year we can all wonder if it was attributable to his lack of rest, i.e. playing in the Euro league, during the summer. And around and around we go....:rolleyes:

Personally, I'm tired of the merry-go-round.
 
#41
I think the idea that Bogdan had a bad season overall, and that is it rest related, is overblown.
He did have a really bad shooting year, but even his 41.8/36/86.7 is better than our new backup PG's 41.2/32.2/69.8. The other stats are in line 3.5/3.8/1.0 to 3.4/3.9/1.1. Cory will provide better perimeter defense, but that's why he is paid 30% more. Speaking of Cory, he will be playing for team Canada.

EDIT: don't mean to pick on Cory, just trying to say that for his role he as been doing good, rest or no rest.
 
#42
I think the idea that Bogdan had a bad season overall, and that is it rest related, is overblown.
He did have a really bad shooting year, but even his 41.8/36/86.7 is better than our new backup PG's 41.2/32.2/69.8. The other stats are in line 3.5/3.8/1.0 to 3.4/3.9/1.1. Cory will provide better perimeter defense, but that's why he is paid 30% more. Speaking of Cory, he will be playing for team Canada.

EDIT: don't mean to pick on Cory, just trying to say that for his role he as been doing good, rest or no rest.
Well both Bogi and Joeger talked about him being tired in year 1. In year 2, he regressed in percentage and turnovers and Katye and others talked about him being hurt. Injuries and fatigue are absolutely related.

As for Cory, I’m glad be is playing for Canada but I don’t think he has been playing year around since 2015. In fact, I would guess you would be hard pressed to find a single other player who has.
 
#43
And the question under discussion is whether these two things are related, and whether his employer does, or ought, to have some recourse.
But those are not the main points of this thread and specially recourse by employer has been mentioned in passing at best (and that would be interesting conversation).

As OP and the most of the posts are focusing on is Bogi's personal decision and judgement, and criticizing him because he chose what they do not like.
Perfectly good stuff for TDOS and understandable from consumer perspective, but still hypocritical.

Regarding the drunk night analogy... I wish analogy has a similar saying as word assume has.
 
#44
It's called an analogy. I went with sleep for a normal person because professional basketball is physically demanding in a long-term way that most other people's jobs are not. We saw just this most recent season that the NBA extended the length of the regular season by several weeks to allow players more in-season rest. Professional athletes of all sports are well-known to take long breaks during the offseason and then ramp back up for the start of the season, and it's not because they don't love playing their sport of choice, it's because they've found their bodies need that.

Bogdan is one of the not-too-many players who has pretty openly been neglecting to get himself what most NBA players would consider adequate rest during the offseason. Bogdan has spent the last year, if not two, playing at what does not appear to be peak physical condition and dealing with long-term nagging injuries. And the question under discussion is whether these two things are related, and whether his employer does, or ought, to have some recourse.



No, we can't. But it feels like that argument belongs in a heretofore (I believe) unenumerated category of logical fallacy that I'll call Argumentam ad mater anxia - The Worried Mother Fallacy, where a potential outlier consequence of position A is amplified to argue in favor of position B while ignoring that it is an outlier and also ignoring that position B also has potential outlier consequences.
Thanks for the elaboration. I needlessly tried to pick apart your analogy when I got the gist, sorry about that.
 
#45
I think you are missing the point. No one is saying a word about Bjelicia because he didn’t play 4-5 years straight and lack of rest didn’t impact his play during the NBA season. No one is talking about Jokic as he skipped Eurobasket last year to rest and work on his game.

Only Bogdan has played every tournament and hasn’t had a summer off since 2015!! What is worse is Serbia is a very good team which qualifies for, and goes deep in, every tournament. And Bogdan has clearly been impacted for 2 years in a row. Bogdan’s situation is pretty unique among NBA players.
Yeah, I'm probably getting too nitpicky. I agree that rest is important and that it seems he could use some extra rest.