Still defending Vlade? (split from game thread)

Is it time to fire Vlade?


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  • Poll closed .
Are these “Luka didn’t want to come” remotely credible? Or is it a rumor that’s growing legs and taking on its own life to make us feel better?

Seems like something Grant Napear would be spewing at every available second of every day if it was true.
Givony kept saying it at the time, but I just chalked up to the Woj & Co sniping of Vlade/Vivek because PDA. But these recent whispers have a hint of truthiness, at least for me. I’ve never been able to square the Atlanta trade—it’s just so weird. I watched a lot of Trae, he was exciting, but OU was a dumpster fire and it was clearly because of Trae’s inability to play defense and keep his team involved. There is no way an NBA GM would pick Trae over Luka, not even for an extra 1st. Just no chance. You would have to actively dislike the idea of winning. Look, he’s exhilarating when the shots are falling...but come on. But, Atlanta were pushing the button on a full reset anyway, and was the one team in the top 4 that could afford to take Luka and play hard ball.
 
Looks like this link has what seems to be the official answer: https://www.yahoo.com/sports/luka-doncic-kings-honestly-thought-200055129.html

I'm now officially for firing Vlade and the whole front office... No excuse for this...
While I wanted the pick to be Luka, I'm still supporting Bagley and think his game will come around.

Even so are the KIngs and in turn us fans really better off with Vlade being fired and a complete reset? New GM is going to want his own coach and players. Even if Fox and Bags are retained this would mean the third coaching change in their short careers!

The Ariza trade may be a clue to what might happen though. Ariza was clearly one of Walton's favorites. This trade helped Portland lower their luxury tax. So IMO this trade had owners hand prints all over it.

If their is a reset I hope it starts at the top and the new owner in charge has crazy deep pockets like a Burkle.

There has been so much turmoil with the Kings I have to admit to becoming ambivalent about the direction the Kings take.

My point is I will watch and support the team as I have since becoming a Fan when Geoff Petrie was hired. I do think there will be some changes. And if there is I prefer a full reset starting with Vivek. Otherwise I prefer standing pat with Vlade and Walton and hoping a fun to watch team develops.
 
I also hope Bags comes around too. I also believe it's very possible that canning the Vladfather and staff won't help, and perhaps hurt even more.

I 100% agree this does start at the top, and Vivek needs to go. Only problem is, how would he unless he sells his stake? That's a decision only he can make, essentially firing himself.

We may not have a choice but to sit and watch this chit show until some sort of miracle occurs.

Hoping for miracles!
 
While I wanted the pick to be Luka, I'm still supporting Bagley and think his game will come around.

Even so are the KIngs and in turn us fans really better off with Vlade being fired and a complete reset? New GM is going to want his own coach and players. Even if Fox and Bags are retained this would mean the third coaching change in their short careers!

The Ariza trade may be a clue to what might happen though. Ariza was clearly one of Walton's favorites. This trade helped Portland lower their luxury tax. So IMO this trade had owners hand prints all over it.

If their is a reset I hope it starts at the top and the new owner in charge has crazy deep pockets like a Burkle.

There has been so much turmoil with the Kings I have to admit to becoming ambivalent about the direction the Kings take.

My point is I will watch and support the team as I have since becoming a Fan when Geoff Petrie was hired. I do think there will be some changes. And if there is I prefer a full reset starting with Vivek. Otherwise I prefer standing pat with Vlade and Walton and hoping a fun to watch team develops.
I agree with this. Vivek's pockets may not be deep enough. Controlling shares with ~30% ownership. What I would expect from that is what Atlanta went through with a potentially fractured ownership group. Competing agendas with competing priorities.
 
I don't know how it works in Spain, but in the U.S. a general manager would NEVER call out a potential draftee for refusing to play for a team. You see rumors of that sort of stuff pretty frequently, but never do you see the team do anything but cover it up. I don't know if the recent rumors Luka threatened to stay in Europe are true or not (in fact, I have no idea what the source is) but this video is not good evidence to the contrary.
im pretty confident in my source on this topic. Nothing is 100% but some are more credible than others and I was told this data before the draft. Luka is a PR machine. He isn’t going to come out and say it publicly but staying at Real Madrid was a real option.
 
If it was Luka would Joerger make him earn his minutes? I think he would have:) so the Same is true for MBIII!
Fox came off the bench for much of his first season, but I'm not sure that's because of an "earning" situation as much as it was a process of developing a PG. I can give Joerger the benefit of the doubt with Marvin because of this, but I'm not 100% certain. The recent news throws unbias treatment in question.
 
I don't think I am buying that Luka wouldn't come here. But it's not implausible. It's certainly much different with an established European than it would be with an American player threatening to play overseas.

If I have any qualms about this though it's that we didn't do what the Hawks did immediately after us and work out a deal to get something extra. But if JJJ was withholding medical info that certainly changes the equation and creates big cause for alarm.

The stuff about Joerger from the Athletic is frickin childish. Makes me sad. And also provides some confirmation bias to my take that he tanked the final few games of the season to keep us from .500 as some kinda petty FU to the FO.
 
I don't think I am buying that Luka wouldn't come here. But it's not implausible. It's certainly much different with an established European than it would be with an American player threatening to play overseas.

If I have any qualms about this though it's that we didn't do what the Hawks did immediately after us and work out a deal to get something extra. But if JJJ was withholding medical info that certainly changes the equation and creates big cause for alarm.

The stuff about Joerger from the Athletic is frickin childish. Makes me sad. And also provides some confirmation bias to my take that he tanked the final few games of the season to keep us from .500 as some kinda petty FU to the FO.
In the other thread an article was posted basically saying that after Vlade and co visited him, he expected to be picked by them.
 
In the other thread an article was posted basically saying that after Vlade and co visited him, he expected to be picked by them.
Everybody expected it. I slammed my steering wheel as the pick was made. Doesn't mean there was no behind the scenes funny business, though the photo of Vivek's kid and Luka to me indicated they were all chums.
 
In most year's draft Bagley at 2 would be fine as he has been decent but unfortunately the one year he was drafted was the same year a future all star was in the draft. Vlade has been good at times and bad at others, but if we don't make the playoffs this year I think it is time for him to go
 
This has turned into another long thread so apologies if I repeat anything allready said. 50% of me has always thought there is more to the Donic story than Vlade’s inabilities to evaluate talent. Vlade more than anyone should have been in the know.

It’s unfortunate, but I don’t judge him on that near as much as his other misses and decisions. I might be alone here but trading down the 2017 10th for the 15th and 20th, which we will soon have nothing to show for, and to a lesser extent his crippling moves with the Sixers is why I think Vlade should step down as GM. I believe Joe Dumars allready has a role with the Kings so thinking / hoping he transitions into the GM position.
 
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VF21

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This has turned into another long thread so apologies if I repeat anything allready said. 50% of me has always thought there is more to the Donic story then Vlade’s inabilities to evaluate talent. Vlade more than anyone should have been in the know.

It’s unfortunate, but I don’t judge him on that near as much as his other misses and decisions. I might be alone here but trading down the 2017 10th for the 15th and 20th, which we will soon have nothing to show for, and to a lesser extent his crippling moves with the Sixers is why I think Vlade should step down as GM. I believe Joe Dumars allready has a role with the Kings so thinking / hoping he transitions into the GM position.
It's pretty much all been said already but that's to be expected in a thread like this.

At this point, unless Vlade makes some new egregious error, all the complaints against him have already been aired. But at least they're in one thread and not sprinkled over and over again throughout all the discussions.
 
I was listening to the Ryen Rusillo podcast episode where he discussed Kobe. He had Bobby Marks on, who was part of the Nets front office for many years, of course. I bring it up because he discussed the 1996 draft. They had Kobe in for workouts three times—and they had the #8 pick. A week before the draft, Arn Tellem, Kobe’s agent at the time, came in for a meeting with the Nets front office. Tellem informed the Nets that under no uncertain terms were they to draft Kobe. He would play in Italy rather than sign with the Nets. It was Cal’s first year, and he was worried about not being able to sign his #8 pick. They took Kerry Kittles.

Anyway, I had never heard anything about that, and Marks has been in media for many years now as one of Woj’s buddies. I hope one day we get the true story on the Luka draft because it made little sense that night, and even less now.
 
I was listening to the Ryen Rusillo podcast episode where he discussed Kobe. He had Bobby Marks on, who was part of the Nets front office for many years, of course. I bring it up because he discussed the 1996 draft. They had Kobe in for workouts three times—and they had the #8 pick. A week before the draft, Arn Tellem, Kobe’s agent at the time, came in for a meeting with the Nets front office. Tellem informed the Nets that under no uncertain terms were they to draft Kobe. He would play in Italy rather than sign with the Nets. It was Cal’s first year, and he was worried about not being able to sign his #8 pick. They took Kerry Kittles.

Anyway, I had never heard anything about that, and Marks has been in media for many years now as one of Woj’s buddies. I hope one day we get the true story on the Luka draft because it made little sense that night, and even less now.
It was legit though since Kobe spent time in Europe and going from HS to the pros wasn’t an thing back than. So I don’t blame the nets for taking that threat seriously
 
I was listening to the Ryen Rusillo podcast episode where he discussed Kobe. He had Bobby Marks on, who was part of the Nets front office for many years, of course. I bring it up because he discussed the 1996 draft. They had Kobe in for workouts three times—and they had the #8 pick. A week before the draft, Arn Tellem, Kobe’s agent at the time, came in for a meeting with the Nets front office. Tellem informed the Nets that under no uncertain terms were they to draft Kobe. He would play in Italy rather than sign with the Nets. It was Cal’s first year, and he was worried about not being able to sign his #8 pick. They took Kerry Kittles.

Anyway, I had never heard anything about that, and Marks has been in media for many years now as one of Woj’s buddies. I hope one day we get the true story on the Luka draft because it made little sense that night, and even less now.
as most of us know, Billy Owens and agent did a similar thing to us in 91except we actually picked him with the 3rd. That seemed so messed up at the time but in the end the Warriors bailed us out in a good way. I could never figure why they broke up run TMC
 
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I was listening to the Ryen Rusillo podcast episode where he discussed Kobe. He had Bobby Marks on, who was part of the Nets front office for many years, of course. I bring it up because he discussed the 1996 draft. They had Kobe in for workouts three times—and they had the #8 pick. A week before the draft, Arn Tellem, Kobe’s agent at the time, came in for a meeting with the Nets front office. Tellem informed the Nets that under no uncertain terms were they to draft Kobe. He would play in Italy rather than sign with the Nets. It was Cal’s first year, and he was worried about not being able to sign his #8 pick. They took Kerry Kittles.

Anyway, I had never heard anything about that, and Marks has been in media for many years now as one of Woj’s buddies. I hope one day we get the true story on the Luka draft because it made little sense that night, and even less now.
I don't think this story applies to Luka. He said himself he expected to go to Sacramento, stated in a January 17 piece by Sam Amick in the Athletic:

“They came to Madrid (to see him play for Real Madrid and to share a dinner on June 5, 2018),” the 20-year-old Doncic told The Athletic about the Kings’ contingent’s visit during the draft process. “They came with the owner. Everybody came, so I honestly thought they were going to pick me.”
So, I asked, was it ever made clear to him why they didn’t?
“I mean, I think it’s because of Euroleague; it’s different basketball,” Doncic said. “I was averaging in Europe — in the Spanish League — like 12 points (per game). And in Euroleague 14 (points per game). So it’s different basketball.”
By the time Doncic’s visit was nearing an end, he offered one final moment that might send Kings fans crying into their pillows again. When a local reporter showed Doncic a picture of a fan who had created his own Doncic Kings jersey, the Mavs star stopped our brief conversation, sat up in his chair to take a closer look, and smiled. And then, for reasons that only he knows, he requested that the picture be text-messaged to the team’s PR man, Scott Tomlin, so he could keep it as a keepsake of sorts.
“Can you send that?” he said. “I want to see that.”

I think Amick is one of the better reporters out there, especially where it relates to the Kings, and this story makes it hard for me to believe that Luka would have declined to come to Sacramento.

But even if that was the case, Vlade held all the cards: Vlade could have called his bluf and see if he was willing to jeopardize his dream of coming to the NBA by playing hardball or at least try and get leverage out of the situation by trading the pick to the Mavs. Bagley may not have been available at the Mavs spot (I think he would have been), but there were other good players to be had (better ones, some might argue).
 
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If the Kings do not make the playoffs, Vlade has to go. That seems likely at this point in the season.

As I mentioned in this thread a month or so ago, as much as I respect Vlade, he has to bear the responsibility for the picks, trades, and signings. Both good and bad.

My one true hope is the Kings sign a GM, who is willing to actually rebuild and pursue alternative routes to acquire assets. Vlade has done neither of those things during his tenure as GM.
 
Now that the Knicks have fired Steve Mills and is bring in a new President of basketball operations in Leon Rose, I'm sure Scott Perry will be let go pretty soon.

Scott Perry was a very calming presence when he was with the Kings and the Kings had their most productive draft with taking D'Arron Fox the few months he was with us. He seemed like a respected basketball mind and had good relationships with player agents other teams GMs.

Maybe a potential candidate for GM of the Kings this off season?
 
If the Kings do not make the playoffs, Vlade has to go. That seems likely at this point in the season.

As I mentioned in this thread a month or so ago, as much as I respect Vlade, he has to bear the responsibility for the picks, trades, and signings. Both good and bad.

My one true hope is the Kings sign a GM, who is willing to actually rebuild and pursue alternative routes to acquire assets. Vlade has done neither of those things during his tenure as GM.
Not going to happen. This deadline showed us that the FO is perfectly content to run this core back next season and they bought into the "injuries" being the reason we're 12 games under .500. Off-season is going to be resigning Bogi, the 8-10th pick and the 2 2nd picks. Perhaps an MLE guy.
 
Well, the deadline has passed and all we did was get out of the Dedmon contract (a player Vlade signed). Basically he just handed a team two picks for his mistake.

Bye Vlade!
Well, half the contract at least. I think it's quite possible that Parker opts in next year. He'd had a decent season but if this injury keeps him out as long as I've seen projected (march-ish) then he's got very little time to pop back up on teams radars this season.
 
I was listening to the Ryen Rusillo podcast episode where he discussed Kobe. He had Bobby Marks on, who was part of the Nets front office for many years, of course. I bring it up because he discussed the 1996 draft. They had Kobe in for workouts three times—and they had the #8 pick. A week before the draft, Arn Tellem, Kobe’s agent at the time, came in for a meeting with the Nets front office. Tellem informed the Nets that under no uncertain terms were they to draft Kobe. He would play in Italy rather than sign with the Nets. It was Cal’s first year, and he was worried about not being able to sign his #8 pick. They took Kerry Kittles.

Anyway, I had never heard anything about that, and Marks has been in media for many years now as one of Woj’s buddies. I hope one day we get the true story on the Luka draft because it made little sense that night, and even less now.
Makes a lot of sense, as I recall hearing that Geoff Petrie really liked Kobe and was set to take him with #14. I'm sure the KINGS were told the same thing by Tellum. But it wasn't in Petrie's nature to be bullied off a player he wanted. Which is probably why Jerry West had to trade up to #13 right in front of the KINGS to nab Mamba.