Run and Gun

B

burekijogurt

Starter
#1
#1
It seems that having an extreme pace as our play style is wearing the team down long term.
The play style is also vulnerable to B2Bs, players being out, age (Buddy better pace himself) etc...
Should we slow it down? Or rather can we slow it down? Do we have enough of a half-court game? Can we develop one?
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#2
#2
injuries also were piling up left and right. Bagley had two separate injuries he sat out with when the Kings were on a roll, Fox with his shoulder, Bogs with his toe, etc. Kings in the half court are a Horror show so I don't blame Dave for preaching run run run, but we knew that this wasn't sustainable for a 82 game season, just too much wear and tear with the constant flying too. The body needs rest. Buddy is the only one I can think of that hasn't missed time with any injury, that dude is an Iron Man.
 
B

burekijogurt

Starter
#4
#4
yeah even our young guys are feeling the effects of this. if we get to the point where the playoffs look unlikely (not saying this will happen, but if it does), we should start working on our half court game, develop the young guys and save everyone's bodies....

when Bagley was out with the knee Joerger mentioned in one of the post game interviews that he is running Bjelica into the ground. but regardless, I have not seen him not try.. I always see him closing out on 3 pt shooters, fighting for boards, running to take the ball out of bounds as Joerger is yelling go go go etc.. he is just missing shots (that could be legs) and has trouble defending faster 4s who can shoot from the outside.
 
C

Cojc

Bench
#7
#7
I have thought this was going to happen and have really believed the pace may catch up with us. The last 10 games or so we have been to up and down in our effort and really believed a lot of it was fatigue.

Granted in the NBA unless you have a really good team they will figure out how to stop you or even slow down what you are doing.

Just look at a few examples with the difference in rebounding getting worse and worse and we have not been scoring at a high rate for awhile.

Now our style fit our team as long as we are able to run teams into the ground with our pace.

We are still developing and must add a few pieces to help fix a few problems and it must start with our production from the sf position and our center position is really starting to hurt us nightly.
 
P

ppine

Starter
#8
#8
This is a great question. Lately the Kings have not changed their pace much, but are only scoring around 100 points or a little more. I think the league has adjusted their defenses to a large extent. They are ready to defend in transition. They cover the perimeter.

The Kings' play 10 guys. They are a young team. The fast pace is wearing but they should be able to withstand it. Maybe they need to play 12 guys. Maybe they need to stop pushing the ball after every made basket. Maybe they need to play better defense and rebound and out score their opponents.
 
G

Gguod

Bench
#9
#9
We could slow down the pace and play more half court but if I remember the numbers correctly, our half court efficency is pretty bad and its compensated by us running so much. So slowing the pace down might be neccesary (Im not sure wether it really is or isnt) but it will also hurt our offense and thus the amount of wins.
 
Kingster

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#10
#10
Other teams rest players. Boston is resting Horford. Toronto is resting Leonard. There are probably many more examples if you did the historical research. We know Pop is going to rest his vets, if he hasn't already done so; he always does. And these aren't "run and gun" teams. Shumpert deserves his own special category of "load management"/rest. As far as I can recall, this is the first time that any other Kings' players have been "rested." If they have and I don't remember it, it must have been a "one off." What I'm getting at is this - any idea that the Kings' style is unsustainable and infeasible may be overdone. Sure, Fox and Bjelica are sitting for rest. And Fox is the engine, so his game has probably affected this team more than any other player. But how many other teams around the league have rested their players? My guess is, quite a few.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/injuries/

Note: they have Fox out with a toe, which tells me that maybe some of the "injuries" they note may be in fact "rest."
 
B

burekijogurt

Starter
#11
#11
Kingster said:
Other teams rest players. Boston is resting Horford. Toronto is resting Leonard. There are probably many more examples if you did the historical research. We know Pop is going to rest his vets, if he hasn't already done so; he always does. And these aren't "run and gun" teams. Shumpert deserves his own special category of "load management"/rest. As far as I can recall, this is the first time that any other Kings' players have been "rested." If they have and I don't remember it, it must have been a "one off." What I'm getting at is this - any idea that the Kings' style is unsustainable and infeasible may be overdone. Sure, Fox and Bjelica are sitting for rest. And Fox is the engine, so his game has probably affected this team more than any other player. But how many other teams around the league have rested their players? My guess is, quite a few.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/injuries/

Note: they have Fox out with a toe, which tells me that maybe some of the "injuries" they note may be in fact "rest."
Click to expand...

I guess that is the point, if other teams, who are not playing every night at the pace Kings play at, feel that they need to rest their players, than it stands to reason that the wear and tear the Kings players are experiencing is elevated. Is it manageable or are we going to see reduced output/efficiency?
 
E

ESP47

All-Star
#12
#12
I've heard of fast paced teams slowing down in the playoffs but it's hard to imagine a bunch of early 20 something year olds burning out at the halfway point of a season. There's other good teams that are up there in the pace leaderboard, how come they're not tired but the Kings are? Fox is 55th and Buddy is 59th in the league in minutes played and they've played the most on the team. If Thibs was the coach and these guys were all playing 35+ minutes every game, I'd say that it's probably a legitimate excuse but as of right now I don't see the evidence for it on a team wide basis.

The Kings seem to beat most of the bad teams and lose to most of the good teams. Unfortunately most of the teams in the West are pretty good so the odds are stacked against the Kings this year. We really have no way of knowing if they're tired unless they or the coach admits it. Sounds like Joerger admitted Beli was tired and that's not surprising given his age and body type. I think we're just seeing them get beat by better teams and if they aren't better, usually it's on a long road trip, back to back or a game with an odd start time. The back to back losses have been pretty irritating but the rest are kind of run of the mill losses that most .500 teams have.
 
M

mac

All-Star
#13
#13
ESP47 said:
I've heard of fast paced teams slowing down in the playoffs but it's hard to imagine a bunch of early 20 something year olds burning out at the halfway point of a season. There's other good teams that are up there in the pace leaderboard, how come they're not tired but the Kings are? Fox is 55th and Buddy is 59th in the league in minutes played and they've played the most on the team. If Thibs was the coach and these guys were all playing 35+ minutes every game, I'd say that it's probably a legitimate excuse but as of right now I don't see the evidence for it on a team wide basis.

The Kings seem to beat most of the bad teams and lose to most of the good teams. Unfortunately most of the teams in the West are pretty good so the odds are stacked against the Kings this year. We really have no way of knowing if they're tired unless they or the coach admits it. Sounds like Joerger admitted Beli was tired and that's not surprising given his age and body type. I think we're just seeing them get beat by better teams and if they aren't better, usually it's on a long road trip, back to back or a game with an odd start time. The back to back losses have been pretty irritating but the rest are kind of run of the mill losses that most .500 teams have.
Click to expand...
Minutes aside, I recall some stat about some of the players running the most distance wise in the game. Think Buddy is one of the top in the league
 
Kingster

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#15
#15
burekijogurt said:
I guess that is the point, if other teams, who are not playing every night at the pace Kings play at, feel that they need to rest their players, than it stands to reason that the wear and tear the Kings players are experiencing is elevated. Is it manageable or are we going to see reduced output/efficiency?
Click to expand...
It's hard to say. The main guy to be concerned about is Fox. (With the integration of Bagley and Giles into the lineup that should make it much easier to keep the front court rested). I'd feel more comfortable though if the Kings had a Fox "lite" player as a sub at the point guard, Dennis Schroder, for example, who could keep up the pace and put defensive pressure on opposing point guards, but those kind of guys aren't in great supply. I think the Kings are just doing the best with what they've got right now. They certainly can't slow the pace down a lot to "out-skill" other teams. They just aren't experienced enough for that. The Kings are getting a nice rest before Memphis. Then very soon is the All Star break. I would think they will be plenty rested before entering into the last couple months of the season.
 
P

ppine

Starter
#16
#16
If the Kings continue their fast pace, and still hover a little over 100 points, I think you can make a case for using more discretion in when to push the ball. When you play fast you get more opportunities, but so do your opponents. If you are getting lots of opportunities and still scoring 100-105 points a game it might be better to play fast part of the time.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.