[Rumor] Raptors interested in Malik Monk

I could live with that.

Does feel like Toronto would be a playoff team though so #9 would be the best pick in all of it.
 
The_Jamal said:
Pretty bad, especially if you don't have landing spots lined up for Monk/DDR/LaVine.

I'm a huge IQ fan, but the fact Ham has been whining about wings as the reason for all our downfall and he trades our best player to continue to glut our back-court. Awesome, lol
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We’re talking about a man who was once adamant that Keegan Murray wouldn’t even be a rotation player in the NBA
 
The_Jamal said:
Woah now, let's not be calling Poeltl blah. The rest though, yeah, pretty blah overall
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Sure, but he's a step down from Domas.

At any rate, I think I've been pretty consistent on this but I'll say it again: trading Domas means FULL TEARDOWN AND REBUILD. There is no "suddenly we're a playoff team", and there is no "let's try for the play-in", it's full tank full time.

And in that case, Poeltl doesn't really do much for us other than fill a spot in the starting lineup for a year before he opts out of Basketball Hell. All we really have left is the supporting cast for a good team (Keegan, Keon, maybe Carter) and good luck on keeping those guys until we're relevant again.

We'd get the #9 this year, where the can't-miss guys are already gone and we'd really be looking to get a solid-rotation-maybe-starter type. That's not even that great of a pick! Then two more picks that end up probably being junk because we made the Raptors good. This is digging a hole for the sake of digging a hole.

My strong preference, especially since we have time on his deal, is to take another shot at building around Domas, who is the best player we've had in a very long time. See if Perry/Doug can figure it out. Look at Domas as the anchor and Zach as the sparkplug, trade Monk and DDR to build a defensive core around them, figure out how to get one more offensive piece (maybe that's Keegan Unleashed, maybe there's another route) and see if it works. If it doesn't, fine, we can still trade Domas and get...get that much back two years from now.

But if we're dead set on trading Domas, we absolutely need a better package than that. I know a lot of people don't want to hear it, but in terms of impact Domas was a top-10 player in the league last year and he's under contract at a decent price for three years. That's a damn goldmine, and if we're full tank, we need to get like two very good young controllable players and 4-5 picks that could hit. We need the kind of package OKC can give us, not the kind of package Toronto can give us. Because if we're going to tank, we need to set ourselves up to rise again, not set ourselves up to keep on tankin'.
 
iowamcnabb said:
I just don’t get why Ham is completely ready to write off Carter after 30 games that he barely played in. That whole crew is guilty of that actually. Pitch and moan about defense for the last few years and then want to ship out one of the few guys that could be elite on that end
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They're just personalities, they have no ability analyze basketball at any sort of high level.
 
Capt. Factorial said:
Sure, but he's a step down from Domas.

At any rate, I think I've been pretty consistent on this but I'll say it again: trading Domas means FULL TEARDOWN AND REBUILD. There is no "suddenly we're a playoff team", and there is no "let's try for the play-in", it's full tank full time.

And in that case, Poeltl doesn't really do much for us other than fill a spot in the starting lineup for a year before he opts out of Basketball Hell. All we really have left is the supporting cast for a good team (Keegan, Keon, maybe Carter) and good luck on keeping those guys until we're relevant again.

We'd get the #9 this year, where the can't-miss guys are already gone and we'd really be looking to get a solid-rotation-maybe-starter type. That's not even that great of a pick! Then two more picks that end up probably being junk because we made the Raptors good. This is digging a hole for the sake of digging a hole.

My strong preference, especially since we have time on his deal, is to take another shot at building around Domas, who is the best player we've had in a very long time. See if Perry/Doug can figure it out. Look at Domas as the anchor and Zach as the sparkplug, trade Monk and DDR to build a defensive core around them, figure out how to get one more offensive piece (maybe that's Keegan Unleashed, maybe there's another route) and see if it works. If it doesn't, fine, we can still trade Domas and get...get that much back two years from now.

But if we're dead set on trading Domas, we absolutely need a better package than that. I know a lot of people don't want to hear it, but in terms of impact Domas was a top-10 player in the league last year and he's under contract at a decent price for three years. That's a damn goldmine, and if we're full tank, we need to get like two very good young controllable players and 4-5 picks that could hit. We need the kind of package OKC can give us, not the kind of package Toronto can give us. Because if we're going to tank, we need to set ourselves up to rise again, not set ourselves up to keep on tankin'.
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Oh trust, you're preaching to the choir. I don't want to deal Domas either, but I think our window is just shot with this current core. We missed our chance. And to me, I'd rather cash our chips now, while we control all our future picks+the Fox return+year 1 of a new GM/coach core+a bunch of assets we can tear down and get good value on. Because then you have to go through ANOTHER likely GM/coach duo if this things fails in 2-3 years.

And I've said I don't think Vivek will sign off on it, but that would be the path i'd take. We're all just in limbo right now though because outside of a commitment to Christie, we have no real info on who or what he values on this roster or what direction we're going in.
 
The_Jamal said:
Oh trust, you're preaching to the choir. I don't want to deal Domas either, but I think our window is just shot with this current core. We missed our chance. And to me, I'd rather cash our chips now, while we control all our future picks+the Fox return+year 1 of a new GM/coach core+a bunch of assets we can tear down and get good value on. Because then you have to go through ANOTHER likely GM/coach duo if this things fails in 2-3 years.

And I've said I don't think Vivek will sign off on it, but that would be the path i'd take. We're all just in limbo right now though because outside of a commitment to Christie, we have no real info on who or what he values on this roster or what direction we're going in.
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Why? Why are people always wanting to rebuild the entire core. We don't need to do that. Domas is very adaptable to whatever we do. Why couldn't he play with a new slough of players while remaining as part of the core? I don't get why people always want to rebuild everything. If we rebuild we will have at least 3 seasons of 20-30 wins unless we get lucky like San Antonio.

Right now if we keep Domas and LaVine we have two pieces that can shoot, rebound and pass the ball (and hit 3pt shots over 40%). Why trade that away for picks or players that are inferior?
 
See_Hanks said:
Why? Why are people always wanting to rebuild the entire core. We don't need to do that. Domas is very adaptable to whatever we do. Why couldn't he play with a new slough of players while remaining as part of the core? I don't get why people always want to rebuild everything. If we rebuild we will have at least 3 seasons of 20-30 wins unless we get lucky like San Antonio.

Right now if we keep Domas and LaVine we have two pieces that can shoot, rebound and pass the ball (and hit 3pt shots over 40%). Why trade that away for picks or players that are inferior?
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Because what's the pathway out of being a 40-46 win team in the West and into true contender status? Or hell, even just a "for sure" top 6 playoff team? Does trading Monk and DDR get you enough to take a leap?

It's all about timing, to me. After Beam team 1; 48 win team, ascending talents all over the place, COY/EOY, played a fun/unselfish brand of ball, took the defending champs to 7 games. That's a team you say "You know what, we're committing to this core and moving future pieces to improve" Because there's some proof of concept there. If that squad traded 2 future FRP for Cam Johnson, you understand it.

Monte didn't though and it ended up being the downfall of his tenure here. We ran it back, stalled out to 46 wins and just never recovered that momentum. I didn't hate it at the time, because a lot of the deals being thrown around during that span were really bad, but we just never added more resources to actually improve the team meaningfully.

I just don't see any real justification to move those future pieces to improve this core and make a run though. Beam team 1 is long gone and we're left with a year 1 GM/Coach combo and a bunch of talented players that probably don't fit and have basically nothing on film for us to judge what sort of team this is.
 
See_Hanks said:
Why? Why are people always wanting to rebuild the entire core. We don't need to do that. Domas is very adaptable to whatever we do. Why couldn't he play with a new slough of players while remaining as part of the core? I don't get why people always want to rebuild everything. If we rebuild we will have at least 3 seasons of 20-30 wins unless we get lucky like San Antonio.

Right now if we keep Domas and LaVine we have two pieces that can shoot, rebound and pass the ball (and hit 3pt shots over 40%). Why trade that away for picks or players that are inferior?
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lol building around Domas/lavine good luck winning more than 45 games
 
The_Jamal said:
Because what's the pathway out of being a 40-46 win team in the West and into true contender status? Or hell, even just a "for sure" top 6 playoff team? Does trading Monk and DDR get you enough to take a leap?

It's all about timing, to me. After Beam team 1; 48 win team, ascending talents all over the place, COY/EOY, played a fun/unselfish brand of ball, took the defending champs to 7 games. That's a team you say "You know what, we're committing to this core and moving future pieces to improve" Because there's some proof of concept there. If that squad traded 2 future FRP for Cam Johnson, you understand it.

Monte didn't though and it ended up being the downfall of his tenure here. We ran it back, stalled out to 46 wins and just never recovered that momentum. I didn't hate it at the time, because a lot of the deals being thrown around during that span were really bad, but we just never added more resources to actually improve the team meaningfully.

I just don't see any real justification to move those future pieces to improve this core and make a run though. Beam team 1 is long gone and we're left with a year 1 GM/Coach combo and a bunch of talented players that probably don't fit and have basically nothing on film for us to judge what sort of team this is.
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With Lavine and domas as our tandem we’re bringing a fork to a gun fight

Luka/lebron
SGA/Jdub
Ant/Randle
Houston
AD/Irving
Steph/Butler
Kawhi/Harden
Wemby/Fox
 
Capt. Factorial said:
Sure, but he's a step down from Domas.

At any rate, I think I've been pretty consistent on this but I'll say it again: trading Domas means FULL TEARDOWN AND REBUILD. There is no "suddenly we're a playoff team", and there is no "let's try for the play-in", it's full tank full time.

And in that case, Poeltl doesn't really do much for us other than fill a spot in the starting lineup for a year before he opts out of Basketball Hell. All we really have left is the supporting cast for a good team (Keegan, Keon, maybe Carter) and good luck on keeping those guys until we're relevant again.

We'd get the #9 this year, where the can't-miss guys are already gone and we'd really be looking to get a solid-rotation-maybe-starter type. That's not even that great of a pick! Then two more picks that end up probably being junk because we made the Raptors good. This is digging a hole for the sake of digging a hole.

My strong preference, especially since we have time on his deal, is to take another shot at building around Domas, who is the best player we've had in a very long time. See if Perry/Doug can figure it out. Look at Domas as the anchor and Zach as the sparkplug, trade Monk and DDR to build a defensive core around them, figure out how to get one more offensive piece (maybe that's Keegan Unleashed, maybe there's another route) and see if it works. If it doesn't, fine, we can still trade Domas and get...get that much back two years from now.

But if we're dead set on trading Domas, we absolutely need a better package than that. I know a lot of people don't want to hear it, but in terms of impact Domas was a top-10 player in the league last year and he's under contract at a decent price for three years. That's a damn goldmine, and if we're full tank, we need to get like two very good young controllable players and 4-5 picks that could hit. We need the kind of package OKC can give us, not the kind of package Toronto can give us. Because if we're going to tank, we need to set ourselves up to rise again, not set ourselves up to keep on tankin'.
Click to expand...

This is definitely the nervousness I carry with respect to Perry's first couple of years on the job. He either needs to commit to a retool around Domas or he needs to commit to a proper rebuild. I'd prefer the latter, because I agree with @The_Jamal; I think our window is shot with this core (and that's mostly because I do not believe in Zach LaVine at all, nor do I believe he has any significant trade value at this stage). I'd rather Perry rebuild now while there are teams itching to deal, particularly in the Eastern Conference. The Kings can be bad for a few years while LeBron, Curry, Durant, etc. sunset their careers, and compile enough darts to throw at the draft board in the process that they can try to get back into the playoff discussion again while there are fewer future Hall of Famers dotting the Western Conference landscape.

What I don't want is for Perry to ride the middle, thinking he can acquire "win now" pieces for Domas that are going to dramatically reshape this roster into a playoff contender. I just don't see it. DDR, Monk, and to a lesser degree, LaVine could be traded for pieces that might help Perry retool around Domas, but if Domas is getting traded, it should be to set the Kings on the path to a rebuild. 100%.
 
See_Hanks said:
If we rebuild we will have at least 3 seasons of 20-30 wins unless we get lucky like San Antonio.
Click to expand...
Yes, we may have at least 3 seasons of 20-30 wins if we rebuild. But, if we rebuild right, we will follow those 3 seasons of 20-30 wins with many more seasons of 50-60 wins.

The path we're currently on right now may never lead us to more than maybe 2-3 seasons of 50-60 wins before we're all back here talking about what needs to be done to improve the roster.
 
Padrino said:
This is definitely the nervousness I carry with respect to Perry's first couple of years on the job. He either needs to commit to a retool around Domas or he needs to commit to a proper rebuild. I'd prefer the latter, because I agree with @The_Jamal; I think our window is shot with this core (and that's mostly because I do not believe in Zach LaVine at all, nor do I believe he has any significant trade value at this stage). I'd rather Perry rebuild now while there are teams itching to deal, particularly in the Eastern Conference. The Kings can be bad for a few years while LeBron, Curry, Durant, etc. sunset their careers, and compile enough darts to throw at the draft board in the process that they can try to get back into the playoff discussion again while there are fewer future Hall of Famers dotting the Western Conference landscape.

What I don't want is for Perry to ride the middle, thinking he can acquire "win now" pieces for Domas that are going to dramatically reshape this roster into a playoff contender. I just don't see it. DDR, Monk, and to a lesser degree, LaVine could be traded for pieces that might help Perry retool around Domas, but if Domas is getting traded, it should be to set the Kings on the path to a rebuild. 100%.
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If Perry commits to a rebuild, do you think that he will be able to talk Vivek into doing the same?
 
In my opinion we should trade DDR, LaVine and Monk before Domas. If we trade Domas do it in another year or two.

I think two of those guys could be traded right now for a young player and a pick and LaVine might fetch more either at the deadline or next year when he'll be expiring. There's no reason to trade Domas first and keep the others.
 
QWERTYLICIOUS said:
If Perry commits to a rebuild, do you think that he will be able to talk Vivek into doing the same?
Click to expand...

Well, Perry's not committing to a rebuild without Vivek's approval in the first place, but to answer your question, no I don't think he'll be able to convince Vivek of the merits of a rebuild. That Silicon Valley "break stuff" toxicity seems to run deep with Vivek. But after 12 years, you'd think he'd realize you can't shortcut your way to a playoff contender in Sacramento. In Los Angeles, sure, Luka Doncic just falls into your lap during the twilight of LeBron's career. That's how it goes if you're the Lakers. Not so for the Kings. I just hope it doesn't take another decade for Vivek to figure it out.
 
pdxKingsFan said:
In my opinion we should trade DDR, LaVine and Monk before Domas. If we trade Domas do it in another year or two.

I think two of those guys could be traded right now for a young player and a pick and LaVine might fetch more either at the deadline or next year when he'll be expiring. There's no reason to trade Domas first and keep the others.
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Well if you deal Domas, you deal the whole chest.
 
Padrino said:
I just hope it doesn't take another decade for Vivek to figure it out.
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Prepare to be disappointed...is all I am going to say here.
Vivek is gonna Vivek, unfortunately.
I just hope something within him drastically changes, though, and he reverses his course and lets his front office do the heavy lifting.
 
The_Jamal said:
Well if you deal Domas, you deal the whole chest.
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Some seem to think he's the whole problem, I think those are mostly Fox loyalists who believe Domas is solely responsible for Brown and Fox's departures. They also tend to think Keegan has peaked instead of being misused. Fortunately nothing Perry has said indicates he thinks that way, and Perry has also indicated (in the past) that he wasn't a LaVine fan, but I just think Domas changed the culture of this club instantly and even if we're winning 30-40 games he's a valuable piece if we trade everyone else for picks.

I'd much rather stockpile other teams picks and still be able to root for us to win every night. Hard to do that if we sell off Domas.
 
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