NFL thread for 2017-2018

[VF21]

NFL free agency starts at 1 p.m. PT on Thursday, March 9.

Here's a list of the top 101 Free Agents

Let the NFL discussions begin!

Personally, I'm going to be watching with baited breath to see the Colin Kaepernick feeding frenzy.

 

[LoungeLizard]

So....Brian Hoyer. Well, I suppose it's an upgrade from Kaep/Gabbert.

Giants signing Brandon Marshall gives them quite the receiver trio in OBJ/Shepherd/Marshall.

Interested to see where Romo ends up.

 

[VF21]

So....Brian Hoyer. Well, I suppose it's an upgrade from Kaep/Gabbert.

Giants signing Brandon Marshall gives them quite the receiver trio in OBJ/Shepherd/Marshall.

Interested to see where Romo ends up.

I just felt a cold shudder in the force.

 

[VF21]

Hrm. The last few minutes of the 49er game have definitely put a smile on my face. And the icing on the cake? It's against a team from LA.

 

[VF21]

You know what I see with this year's group of young 49ers? I see passion, enthusiasm and hunger. And those are very good things.

 

[VF21]

There are times when being a board moderator has its drawbacks. Watching #3 play for the 49ers is one of those times. I don't care if they pronounce it Betherd...that's not what's on the back of his jersey.

 

[VF21]

Watching the second game on Monday Night Football. The broadcast team of Rex Ryan and Beth Mowins with Sergio Dipp on the sidelines makes my ears hurt. Just when I thought ESPN couldn't get any worse...

 

[Variant]

I'm optimistic that the 49ers may actually remain entertaining to watch this year...

Also, the Seahawks are notorious slow starters, but their offense looks even worse than last year. Are the Rams the best team in the NFC West now?!

 

[Tetsujin]

The GOAT remains just as entertaining in retirement as he did in his long career
https://www.theringer.com/nfl/2017/...-wedding-crasher-san-francisco-49ers-bay-area

 

[VF21]

Sad news today as Dwight Clark (@DwightC87) has revealed that he has ALS.

“While I’m still trying to wrap my head around the challenge I will face with this disease over the coming years, the only thing I know is that I’m going to fight like hell and live every day to the fullest.” – Dwight Clark

 

[LoungeLizard]

As each week goes by with Jimmy G at QB, I can't help but feel more and more excited for next year. The final drive today to set up Gould for the game winning FG was very Bradyesque. After an offseason of work with Shannahan's playbook, a healthy Garcon, and a hopefully improved O-line, the Niners may have just turned the corner.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

I am a Dallas Cowboys fan. I feel bad for the Oakland Raiders fans out there. A folded piece of paper and DC not being able to hold on to the ball is definitely not how you want to go down in defeat.

 

[uolj]

As each week goes by with Jimmy G at QB, I can't help but feel more and more excited for next year. The final drive today to set up Gould for the game winning FG was very Bradyesque. After an offseason of work with Shannahan's playbook, a healthy Garcon, and a hopefully improved O-line, the Niners may have just turned the corner.

Yes. Jimmy G. I'm on board.

 

[VF21]

It's gonna take more to convince me Jimmy G is the real deal. Remember how we felt about Kaep at first? I want to believe but I'm afraid...

 

[uolj]

Umm... Kaepernick led the 49ers to the Super Bowl.

I'm higher on Garoppolo than I was on Kaepernick at the time. (Although I thought and still think both Alex Smith and Kaepernick are good quarterbacks that I'd be happy to have leading my team.) Obviously time will tell, but there are a number of things Jimmy G is doing that would make me comfortable if the 49ers sign him long term or give him the Franchise tag.

 

[VF21]

Umm... Kaepernick led the 49ers to the Super Bowl.

I'm higher on Garoppolo than I was on Kaepernick at the time. (Although I thought and still think both Alex Smith and Kaepernick are good quarterbacks that I'd be happy to have leading my team.) Obviously time will tell, but there are a number of things Jimmy G is doing that would make me comfortable if the 49ers sign him long term or give him the Franchise tag.

He may have led us to the Super Bowl but we didn't win and we certainly went downhill quickly afterwards. I want to know that Jimmy G is more than a one season wonder. I don't want my heart broken ... again.

 

[uolj]

Fair enough. He's certainly no sure thing.

I'll take the Harbaugh/Smith/Kaepernick era coming back in a heartbeat, though. Super Bowl victory or no.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

If I am allowed to do so, I want to throw in my 2+ cents on CK. Being a Dallas fan myself, I've had my fair share of opinions on quarterbacks coming through the Cowboys' system. The years since Troy Aikman have been rough to watch. I won't dive too deep into Cowboys' quarterbacks since this is about CK, the Niners, and their current situation. I will say this much, though. I was never a Tony Romo fan. Not at all.

Now, on to Mr. CK, the former Niner. The guy was a good quarterback. The casual football fan in me will never deny that fact. Where he lacked, in my honest opinion, was in his arm strength. Now, some of you might be wondering, "eMBarkat10n, what in the blue heck are you talking about? Colin had a GREAT arm!!!" Yes, he had a great arm. But I think he only needed a GOOD arm. Because he had a great arm, he tried too hard, and too much, to make the long passes of 30+, 40+, 50+ yards downfield. I think the Niners would have flourished with CK taking the snaps if he stayed with the short passes for 5 - 10 yards, as opposed to going DEEP all the time. I am not sure if this was more so him wanting to display his arm strength, or if it was the coaching staff calling those long passes downfield all the time for him. But, my observations during his tenure as a Niners quarterback told me that his game was not the most effective for a 4 quarter NFL football game.

 

[uolj]

He was capable of being a top 10 QB in the right system, but overall was (and is) probably a slightly below average starter. I don't know if "arm strength" is the primary reason he wasn't better. I don't remember him going deep that much at all, actually. Putting touch on his passes was a problem but not so much of a problem that it prevented him from being successful. Then again, if you didn't like Romo, maybe you are only ok with hall of fame talent and anything less isn't worthy.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

He was capable of being a top 10 QB in the right system, but overall was (and is) probably a slightly below average starter. I don't know if "arm strength" is the primary reason he wasn't better. I don't remember him going deep that much at all, actually. Putting touch on his passes was a problem but not so much of a problem that it prevented him from being successful. Then again, if you didn't like Romo, maybe you are only ok with hall of fame talent and anything less isn't worthy.

My knock on Tony Romo was not as a result of his skill. Just like CK, the guy was talented. But only for the 17 regular season weeks. Once the postseason hit, Romo was nowhere to be found. So, it was not so much his regular season performance that made me not like him at all. It was what he did (or didn't do, for that matter) after week 17 concluded that made me not like him at all.

 

[uolj]

Sorry, that argument has always seemed weak to me. The number of chances he had in the postseason and the fact that he was clearly excellent in other "clutch" situations makes it clear to me that if there was any worse performance it was more about random variation or the specific teams they were playing than anything wrong with Romo.

I mean, have you actually looked back at his playoff games to see how he did? In 2014, if they had ruled Bryant's "catch" a touchdown would you have thought differently about Romo's performance there? No matter what stat you like he was very good in the playoffs that year, and outplayed Rodgers in that game.

Feels like people get this narrative applied to them and then the only way to break free of it is for the team to win regardless of how well you actually play.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

Sorry, that argument has always seemed weak to me. The number of chances he had in the postseason and the fact that he was clearly excellent in other "clutch" situations makes it clear to me that if there was any worse performance it was more about random variation or the specific teams they were playing than anything wrong with Romo.

I mean, have you actually looked back at his playoff games to see how he did? In 2014, if they had ruled Bryant's "catch" a touchdown would you have thought differently about Romo's performance there? No matter what stat you like he was very good in the playoffs that year, and outplayed Rodgers in that game.

Feels like people get this narrative applied to them and then the only way to break free of it is for the team to win regardless of how well you actually play.

2007 - fumbled a snap on a field goal attempt, and then failed to get into the end zone for the score against the Seahawks.
2008 - threw a pick in the end zone in a comeback attempt against the Giants.
End of 2008 regular season - threw 3 interceptions, and 0 touchdowns in a December game against the Eagles
2009 - 3 fumbles (2 lost), threw 1 interception, and was sacked 6 times against the Vikings
2010 - DNQ for the postseason
2011 - OK, he played with an injured hand, with pretty good stats, so I won't pin this loss on him
2012 - Week 17 against the Redskins, being in a tie with Washington for the division crown - 2 interceptions on first two drives of the game, and then a 3rd on the final drive of the game, which sealed the deal for Washington.
2013 - OK, he led the time to a W in week 16 but, unfortunately, was injured for the week 17 game, so I won't pin this loss on him either.
2014 - This is probably the one game in which I agree he played very well, but we were unfortunate because of the Bryant catch/touchdown ruling. (Which, by the way, I actually agreed with the refs on)

I don't have to look at any more stats to see how he did. The guy choked when it mattered the most. Period. 2007, 2008, 2008 regular season, 2009, 2012 regular season. If my math is right, that's 5 times.

 

[uolj]

I think you made my point. You count 5 times:

2007: A reference to single play, the fumbled snap.
2008: A reference to single play, one interception.
2008 regular season: a regular season game, ignoring the other regular season games he played well in, including three straight victories at the end of the following regular season to get the team into the playoffs.
2009: A reference to a bad game on the road with Miles Austin (!) as his top receiver a week after a very good game against the Eagles in the playoffs.
2012: Again, a regular season game, ignoring other regular season games.

Uhh... that happens to all good quarterbacks. Do I need to find five times Montana or Brady or Staubach or insert your QB of choice here "choked" by making one bad play or having one bad game? Re-arrange the timing of a few years in Brady's career and he absolutely gets pegged as a QB that can't do it in the clutch. But because his successes came before his failures, he is considered the opposite.

I mean, you're welcome to not be a fan of Romo if you don't like his style or even "just because", but he was clearly talented and accomplished and capable of playing well when it mattered.

By the way, here's a good read, that gives a take similar to mine on why the arguments against Romo and his clutchness are overblown.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

I think you made my point. You count 5 times:

2007: A reference to single play, the fumbled snap.
2008: A reference to single play, one interception.
2008 regular season: a regular season game, ignoring the other regular season games he played well in, including three straight victories at the end of the following regular season to get the team into the playoffs.
2009: A reference to a bad game on the road with Miles Austin (!) as his top receiver a week after a very good game against the Eagles in the playoffs.
2012: Again, a regular season game, ignoring other regular season games.

Uhh... that happens to all good quarterbacks. Do I need to find five times Montana or Brady or Staubach or insert your QB of choice here "choked" by making one bad play or having one bad game? Re-arrange the timing of a few years in Brady's career and he absolutely gets pegged as a QB that can't do it in the clutch. But because his successes came before his failures, he is considered the opposite.

I mean, you're welcome to not be a fan of Romo if you don't like his style or even "just because", but he was clearly talented and accomplished and capable of playing well when it mattered.

By the way, here's a good read, that gives a take similar to mine on why the arguments against Romo and his clutchness are overblown.

And I, too, think you made my point. All of the other QB's you listed ended up winning the big game before their career(s) ended. Romo didn't.

I mean, you're welcome to not be a fan of Romo if you don't like his style or even "just because", but he was clearly talented and accomplished and capable of playing well when it mattered.

What was his record in December/January? When it mattered more than in August/September/October/November?

 

[eMBarkat10n]

Jon Gruden to coach the Oakland/Las Vegas Raiders..... 10-year deal.....Holy Poo-Poo!!!! I, for one, am excited to see what he can bring to the table as a head coach in today's NFL. However, I think 10 years is an insanely long contract for a head coach.

Just my opinion, though.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

The game is different from when Gruden had success. We shall see.

I've come around on Tony Romo, he was better than he gets credit for. Anyhow, regardless of his QB performance, he is bar none the most insightful commentator we have on TV right now.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

The game is different from when Gruden had success. We shall see.

I've come around on Tony Romo, he was better than he gets credit for. Anyhow, regardless of his QB performance, he is bar none the most insightful commentator we have on TV right now.

He is a great commentator. Definitely knows the game. I will never hesitate to give the guy THAT much.

And, yes, I will agree with you that he was better than he gets credit for. Like I always say about Tony Romo. The guy was a GREAT regular season quarterback. He was definitely talented enough to take a team (Cowboys) to the playoffs. I will give the guy that much credit. He took us to the playoffs. It's just what he ended up doing once he got there that was the issue. And, for the times we didn't get there, he did play, for the most part, a large role in that happening (costly interceptions, fumbling a snap on a field goal attempt and then proceeding to not be fast enough to get into the end zone). As I also illustrated, I will give the guy a break the few times he was injured late in the season when we proceeded to miss the playoffs. Injuries are a part of the game and, unfortunately, Tony missed too many key games as a result.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

The game is different from when Gruden had success. We shall see.

I've come around on Tony Romo, he was better than he gets credit for. Anyhow, regardless of his QB performance, he is bar none the most insightful commentator we have on TV right now.

Which is what makes this hire most intriguing to me. This hire kinda reminds me of when we (Kings) hired Paul Westphal. He tried to run the same crap that made his Suns teams successful in the 90's. Problem with that was.....Those were the 90s...We needed to play, and we needed him to coach, in the 2000s...

Hopefully, Jon doesn't fall into that same trap in Oakland/Las Vegas. And can quickly adapt his coaching style to today's game...

 

[pdxKingsFan]

He is a great commentator. Definitely knows the game. I will never hesitate to give the guy THAT much.

And, yes, I will agree with you that he was better than he gets credit for. Like I always say about Tony Romo. The guy was a GREAT regular season quarterback. He was definitely talented enough to take a team (Cowboys) to the playoffs. I will give the guy that much credit. He took us to the playoffs. It's just what he ended up doing once he got there that was the issue. And, for the times we didn't get there, he did play, for the most part, a large role in that happening (costly interceptions, fumbling a snap on a field goal attempt and then proceeding to not be fast enough to get into the end zone). As I also illustrated, I will give the guy a break the few times he was injured late in the season when we proceeded to miss the playoffs. Injuries are a part of the game and, unfortunately, Tony missed too many key games as a result.

But it's a team game. Brady ended both of his final drives in his two lost superbowls with interceptions or 4th down incompletions, but he also lead them on potential winning drives with ~2 mins remaining, just the Giants were the team with time on the clock at the end to complete a winning drive. He also had a winning drive vs. the Seahawks saved by his defense (to be fair the defense also almost blew it a few plays prior).

And then you have a guy like Favre who won a single super bowl fairly early and then threw countless playoff ending interceptions and was a pure gunslinger that people love to death.

And then there are folks like Elway and Manning who received much criticism for not winning the big one but are now probably rated accurately on account of late career super bowl wins that were largely on the backs of running backs or the defense.

 

[eMBarkat10n]

But it's a team game. Brady ended both of his final drives in his two lost superbowls with interceptions or 4th down incompletions, but he also lead them on potential winning drives with ~2 mins remaining, just the Giants were the team with time on the clock at the end to complete a winning drive. He also had a winning drive vs. the Seahawks saved by his defense (to be fair the defense also almost blew it a few plays prior).

And then you have a guy like Favre who won a single super bowl fairly early and then threw countless playoff ending interceptions and was a pure gunslinger that people love to death.

And then there are folks like Elway and Manning who received much criticism for not winning the big one but are now probably rated accurately on account of late career super bowl wins that were largely on the backs of running backs or the defense.

The problem with your comparison of Romo to Favre, Elway and Manning is that......All 3 ended up winning the big game before hangin' 'em up for good. Tony did not.