Lakers-Kings deal after Dec.15(I am not here to insult you)

L

LakerEric

Prospect
Well, it not like the early 2000s for either of us anymore. So, with that in mind, I think there is a deal that may help the Kings and Lakers. Here goes:

Odom, Crittenton, Kwame, 2009 #1

for

Artest, Miller, Thomas

The trade gets you under the cap much sooner. Odom may or may not stick, but he is a good player whose two greatest stengths, rebounding, passing, and ball handling, will be better utilized in Sac. Critt is an outstanding talent, but with Farmar and Fisher their isn't any time for him. Kwame is a last year and the number one helps. You are giving up Ron, who is the best player in the deal. But there is a solid chance he leaves at year's end, when the Kings will have little leverage. Miller is still solid, but I would think you would rather include him for Kwame simply for the cap. Thomas is obviously somebody you would love to get rid of. If you would rather keep Miller, I have no problem giving you Odom, Crittenton, and a number one for K.Thomas and Artest. Because Critt cannot be dealt until Dec. 15th, this potential deal will have to wait. But I want to run it by you guys to get an idea if the deal is attractive to Kings fans. I look forward to responses and look forward to talking with good fans.
 
I'm waiting to see what our other resident Laker fan has to say. Gargy?

;)
 
Interesting trade. I like Odom, but wonder if he may be a bit too "Old" for a team rebuilding. But taking Thomas and Miller offer our hands would be a Godsend. I rather have Farmer than Crittenton, but I doubt the Laker will let him go. The only hesitancy in trading Miller is our lack of a starting center. But we can practically sign any FA center and do the same job he's doing now... okay where do we sign?
 
I guess it surprises me how many Laker fans are against the deal. Lamar does not fit well with the current Laker team with Fisher, Farmar, Bynum. Less passes, dribbling, and rebounding. Critt does have nice talent, but with Farmar and Fisher playing time is scarce. Kwame and Miller are different players, but the cap space will help Sac, and the Lakers will not have any space for two or three years anyway. The number one is filler, but it is next year's number one. Artest is a guy who will do things without the ball that Lamar cannot do and give the Lakers an infusion of defense and energy. It is a fair, but steep price, but the Kings probably would not accept anything else.
 
I don't like Artest to LA at all, but that deal I would do. I think Salmons/Thomas for Kwame/Sasha would be more realistic.
 
I like it for the most part, except I think that it would have to be Farmar instead of Crittenton.

Artest is a great 2-way player. And I have never been scared that he would go berzerk and ruin our franchise. So that argument has no weight in the overall picture IMO. So that leaves the overall picture as us giving up a bit too much talent for what we get in return. Taking KT off of our hands is a blessing, I like Kwame's expiring, the #1 is sweet, even though it would likely be in the low 20's range. With Miller playing his best since his surgery, and with Artest becoming Kobe's Pippen, I think the deal would have to include Farmar.

Odom, Farmar, Brown and #1

for

Artest, Miller, KT

You still get more talent in the trade, but we fill some needs at PF and PG, while not taking on any bad contracts. With the draft pick, a nice rebuilding move.
 
BawLa said:
I like it for the most part, except I think that it would have to be Farmar instead of Crittenton.

Artest is a great 2-way player. And I have never been scared that he would go berzerk and ruin our franchise. So that argument has no weight in the overall picture IMO. So that leaves the overall picture as us giving up a bit too much talent for what we get in return. Taking KT off of our hands is a blessing, I like Kwame's expiring, the #1 is sweet, even though it would likely be in the low 20's range. With Miller playing his best since his surgery, and with Artest becoming Kobe's Pippen, I think the deal would have to include Farmar.

Odom, Farmar, Brown and #1

for

Artest, Miller, KT

You still get more talent in the trade, but we fill some needs at PF and PG, while not taking on any bad contracts. With the draft pick, a nice rebuilding move.
Click to expand...

I can't give you Farmar. If you would like to leave Miller out, fine. But Farmar is emerging now, and Critt is younger but with lots of talent. Maybe the Lakers will give a first round pick this year instead of next to sweeten it, but I am 85% sure the Lakers will not deal Farmar.
 
I am not sure if I take the trade.. If the pick was a 2008 pick I would. Only reason is that we are supposedly rebuilding. I am not sure how the rest of the fans see us whether it be rebuilding or just sticking at that mediocrity level, but us Kings fans believe in the rebuild no matter how bad of a job is being done.

Anyhow, I take the trade for a 2008 pick, and no for the 2009. :D
 
I would do the trade. It hurts the Lakers' interior defense (Brown, when healthy, is very good at man-to-man defense), but greatly improves their perimeter defense (Artest can guard the opposition's primary perimeter player). That allows Kobe to concentrate more on the offensive end, and also gives the Lakers a legitimate second scoring option. (Odom isn't, and never will be.) The Kings get rid of two bad contracts. Miller's passing skills would likely fit better in the Lakers' triangle offense. The Kings can actually start Odom at PF, and start Salmons again at SF, which I think he earned in the first seven games of the season. Crittenton has lots of upside, but Farmar is already the Lakers' best point guard.
 
LakerEric said:
I can't give you Farmar. If you would like to leave Miller out, fine. But Farmar is emerging now, and Critt is younger but with lots of talent. Maybe the Lakers will give a first round pick this year instead of next to sweeten it, but I am 85% sure the Lakers will not deal Farmar.
Click to expand...

There is no evidence that Ron will leave Sacramento. One is that he needs three years with a team to establish his Bird rights. There is plenty of evidence that Kobe wants to leave LA. As long as we are dealing in fantasy, why not come up with a trade that moves Kobe to Sacto? If you can't do it, why not?

When you come up with the answer to "why not" you will have the answer to why I wouldn't want to give up Artest.
 
Glenn said:
There is no evidence that Ron will leave Sacramento. One is that he needs three years with a team to establish his Bird rights. There is plenty of evidence that Kobe wants to leave LA. As long as we are dealing in fantasy, why not come up with a trade that moves Kobe to Sacto? If you can't do it, why not?

When you come up with the answer to "why not" you will have the answer to why I wouldn't want to give up Artest.
Click to expand...

Comparing Kobe to Artest is off base. Sorry, but it is. Second, I never said he would leave Sac. But Sac has cap problems anyways. Is tying up Ron long term what you want? I am not sure. By the way, Kobe still may be traded, but the Kings obviously don't make sense because they are young and rebuilding and would not give the Lakers what they need in return. And the possibility of Artest leaving is greater because he does not seem like a Sacto guy, plus it may be a few years before they can contend again.
 
EatMoreChicken said:
Actually Artest still has Bird rights as long as he's not waived or signs a FA to another team. He won't renounce his Bird rights by trading him.

But you have a good point, Glen. We're dealing in complete fantasy here. There's little point debating or arguing.
Click to expand...

That is the whole point of message boards. If you are against the deal, fine. I totally respect that. But I came here to discuss it from a hoops standpoint, not to ruffle feathers.
 
Glenn said:
There is no evidence that Ron will leave Sacramento. One is that he needs three years with a team to establish his Bird rights. There is plenty of evidence that Kobe wants to leave LA. As long as we are dealing in fantasy, why not come up with a trade that moves Kobe to Sacto? If you can't do it, why not?

When you come up with the answer to "why not" you will have the answer to why I wouldn't want to give up Artest.
Click to expand...

Actually Artest still has Bird rights as long as he's not waived or signs a FA to another team. He won't renounce his Bird rights by trading him.

But you have a good point, Glen. We're dealing in complete fantasy here. There's little point debating or arguing.

Here's a little blurb from the LA times:

After several seasons playing with a gaping hole at point guard, the Lakers now have veteran Derek Fisher and surging second-year player Jordan Farmar.

Jackson, however, insisted on talking about rookie Javaris Crittenton, who has had very little playing time.

"Even though I'm sheltering this young man, he's going to be a player," Jackson said." We know that. He's got a future with this club."

LINK

Sounds like he's talking up Crittenton for a trade. :)
 
EatMoreChicken said:
Actually Artest still has Bird rights as long as he's not waived or signs a FA to another team. He won't renounce his Bird rights by trading him.

But you have a good point, Glen. We're dealing in complete fantasy here. There's little point debating or arguing.

Here's a little blurb from the LA times:

After several seasons playing with a gaping hole at point guard, the Lakers now have veteran Derek Fisher and surging second-year player Jordan Farmar.

Jackson, however, insisted on talking about rookie Javaris Crittenton, who has had very little playing time.

"Even though I'm sheltering this young man, he's going to be a player," Jackson said." We know that. He's got a future with this club."

LINK

Sounds like he's talking up Crittenton for a trade. :)
Click to expand...

By the way, Crittenton can be traded now. It does not have to be Dec.15th. And I agree about talking him up, unless they intend to play Crittenton, Farmar, and Kobe at the same time, which is possible. The Lakers will deal Javaris in the right deal because of Farmar.
 
LakerEric said:
Comparing Kobe to Artest is off base.
Click to expand...

Why? I didn't say they were equals, did I? Your answer seems to indicate you wouldn't trade Kobe to us because it isn't in our interest.

Let us fantasize and say he's in our interest. Kobe and Bynum for Artest, Cisco, and Miller sounds good to me. It helps solidify our middle where we are weak, it trades young building blocks, and we would put up with having Kobe while our young guys are maturing.
 
Oh, and EatMoreChicken, if Artest leaves the Kings at the end of this year with no trade, he loses his Bird rights or I'm missing something. Isn't that what Kings fans are afraid of - that he'll exercise his option and leave?

I guess I should have said "to maintain" instead of "to establish."
 
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Glenn said:
Let us fantasize and say he's in our interest. Kobe and Bynum for Artest, Cisco, and Miller sounds good to me. It helps solidify our middle where we are weak, it trades young building blocks, and we would put up with having Kobe while our young guys are maturing.
Click to expand...
You don't think that Martin's development would be severely retarded by Bryant being on the team? Because I do; I am one of many who feel as though Martin will never be the number one option on a winning team, but I'd prefer to see him paired up with a dominant post player, or a great swingman, not a superior player that plays the exact same position.
 
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Mr. S£im Citrus said:
You don't think that Martin's development would be severely retarded by Bryant being on the team? Because I do; I am one of many who feel as thought Martin will never be the number one option on a winning team, but I'd prefer to see him paired up with a dominant post player, or a great swingman, not a superior player that plays the exact same position.
Click to expand...

I'm just fantasizing and in my fantasy I blotted out that reality.
 
LakerEric said:
Odom, Crittenton, Kwame, 2009 #1

for

Artest, Miller, Thomas
Click to expand...


Are you kidding me? We've been trying to trade Artest for a #1 pick for ages. No team was dumb enough to part with a #1 for that psycho. This trade is like giving us two #1 picks (Crittenton and 2009). Plus, we get rid of KT! Jesus, where do we sign up?

What are you going to do with Miller with Bynum on your team? Well, doesn't matter. I don't care, take Miller and KT. And I'll even throw in a case of hard liquor, you'll need them next time Artest punches somebody and get himself suspended for the rest of the season.
 
LakerEric said:
I can't give you Farmar. If you would like to leave Miller out, fine. But Farmar is emerging now, and Critt is younger but with lots of talent. Maybe the Lakers will give a first round pick this year instead of next to sweeten it, but I am 85% sure the Lakers will not deal Farmar.
Click to expand...

Then you can't get a deal done.

Unless if Farmar is the second coming of Jason Kidd or Steve Nash, I would let him go. You have to give to get after all. And getting Artest and Miller makes instantly vaults your team from competing for the 8th seed to competing for the 4th seed.

Look, you guys drafted Crittenton, you saw something you liked. He is your project, not ours. So Farmar and 2008 #1 pick or no deal. :cool:


In my proposed trade your lineup would look something like this:

PG - Fisher/Crittenton
SG - Kobe/Evans/Karl
SF - Artest/Walton/Radman
PF - Turiaf/Cook/KT
C - Bynum/Miller/Mihm

And you could even run out Fisher, Kobe, Artest, Miller and Bynum and have a dynamic offense that would be good inside and out. Since Artest has some ballhandling skills, you can afford to lose Farmar, and subsequently give Crittenton time to develop in a situation where he isn't depended upon.

Our lineup:

PG - Bibby/Udrich/Farmar
SG - Martin/Douby
SF - Salmons/Garcia
PF - Odom/Williams/Watkins/SAR
C - Hawes/Brown/Moore

We clear up some room for youth, get some rebuilding pieces and now have more flexibility in moving Bibby and SAR.

If Farmar is holding your deal up then you are doomed to wallow in mediocrity.
 
BawLa said:
Then you can't get a deal done.

Unless if Farmar is the second coming of Jason Kidd or Steve Nash, I would let him go. You have to give to get after all. And getting Artest and Miller makes instantly vaults your team from competing for the 8th seed to competing for the 4th seed.

Look, you guys drafted Crittenton, you saw something you liked. He is your project, not ours. So Farmar and 2008 #1 pick or no deal. :cool:


In my proposed trade your lineup would look something like this:

PG - Fisher/Crittenton
SG - Kobe/Evans/Karl
SF - Artest/Walton/Radman
PF - Turiaf/Cook/KT
C - Bynum/Miller/Mihm

And you could even run out Fisher, Kobe, Artest, Miller and Bynum and have a dynamic offense that would be good inside and out. Since Artest has some ballhandling skills, you can afford to lose Farmar, and subsequently give Crittenton time to develop in a situation where he isn't depended upon.

Our lineup:

PG - Bibby/Udrich/Farmar
SG - Martin/Douby
SF - Salmons/Garcia
PF - Odom/Williams/Watkins/SAR
C - Hawes/Brown/Moore

We clear up some room for youth, get some rebuilding pieces and now have more flexibility in moving Bibby and SAR.

If Farmar is holding your deal up then you are doomed to wallow in mediocrity.
Click to expand...

You may be right, it could halt a deal. But I think the two are close enough in talent to where one of the teams will budge. I think you guys would take Crittenton, but we'll have to see.
 
Another option:

Artest, SAR, KT, Moore

for

Odom, Brown, Crittenton, Mihm, 2008 #1 pick

*Mihm and Moore should be able to be traded around the same time.

LA gets their man in Artest, and they don't give up much to get him. They take on salary that stinks, but they are stuck salary-wise for the next 3 years anyway so no biggie right? :rolleyes:
 
LakerEric said:
You may be right, it could halt a deal. But I think the two are close enough in talent to where one of the teams will budge. I think you guys would take Crittenton, but we'll have to see.
Click to expand...

Heh, I thought you were dealing with me. :D

You are talking about our front office, and only god knows what they are thinking.

I'd say there is just as much a chance that our team takes Critt in that deal as there is a chance that your FO gives up Farmar in my deal.
 
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