coolhandluke
Starter
I guessed it might be a OT game but never thought he took that many threes when he was still Ason Kidd. Rookie mistake that he corrected over the course of his career.
Keegan Murray
- Thread starter Tetsujin
- Start date
I think back to the last time we had a top 4 pick and we were winning for a nice stretch of the season and didn't need our rookie to contribute big numbers or even start. Keegs is earning his minutes. He came in off the bench his first game and made a statement on the court and with the exception of a rough November he's been proving he belongs in the starting rotation ever since. All while continuing to grow and evolve as an NBA player and take on/earn an ever increasing role AND playing winning basketball. We are blessed to have him.
Not fondly, I hope!
That situation can only reasonably match one season in Sacramento history - the team's high-water mark was 3 games over .500, we finished 4 games under .500, fired our coach, and the top-4 pick floundered for two and a half years before being shipped off at the trade deadline in the final year of his rookie deal.
Not fondly, because that rookie wasn't content to grow with the team and instead sabotaged the whole friggin thing. I'm just flummoxed by how anyone could think that Keegan is the beneficiary somehow of the team being good. Most good teams don't start rookies.Not fondly, I hope!
I do think he's really benefiting from his current situation, but the double-edged-sword is that he actually still has to play really well to stay on the floor for a good team. He doesn't get the typical top 5 pick leash. So the fact that he's proving to be a 30+ MPG starter on a good team without having to be the focal point of the offense.. bodes so well for his future.
What's interesting is he's like showing skills backwards; most rookies don't come in with an elite off-ball game, and elite movement and C&S 3pt shooter and a versatile wing defender. Especially at 6'9. You're almost always hoping some of those skills develop down the line. The guy had the biggest workload in college basketball last year and he's just seamlessly fit right into an elite role player/shooter role for the Kings like it was nothing. That's a rare quality for any rookie, much less a top 5 pick.
We might not see it this season, but I'm hoping we start introducing more of his post-work or maybe where he's the screener in the PnR or PnP and working actions off of that.
"Keegan, how does it feel to win your 3rd Finals MVP?"
"Oh, it feels good. Team played well"
He benefits in that he can focus on doing what he does best and slowly improving, but his three point shooting is obscene and despite being a fixture in the Western Conference rookie of the month awards, he frequently falls outside of the top 5 rook ranking charts. So he's making a personal sacrifice for the team for sure. Plus like you say, he won't stay on the floor if he falls on his face or decides to make it about personal accolades. Lucky for us he was raised right and isn't that kind of guy.
NewArena
All-Star
Turn the sprinkler systems on! Remember this game right here, folks.
KainLear
Starter
I guess in my mind I was thinking of a "fortunate situation" more than anything...
Livinthedream
All-Star
I guess in my mind I was thinking of a "fortunate situation" more than anything...
The most fortunate thing about the situation is a stable GM, competent coach and an owner who no longer thinks he knows more about basketball than the basketball lifers/professionals.
No way to know how players careers would have shaken out, but some of the most recently despised Kings players had their best years under Malone and Jaeger. That's with 2 of 3 pieces I listed being broken.
competent coaching is huge.
KainLear
Starter
Yeah, I was looking at how we treated Bagley overall in comparison.
The way he had to perform from day 1 largely because he wasn't the consensus pick. Granted, it wasn't like we didn't give him opportunities. I was just contemplating if their position were to reverse, Bagley could fare better in this current roster and Murray might falter with that 2018-2020 roster.
The Kings were having their best season in years with Bagley as a backup. Bagley (or his dad) decided that wasn't good enough and he needed to start. We were better than the Mavericks in 2018-2019. The problem with Bagley was Bagley.
If Keegan had Keegan is #1 before the team programmed into him then this would be a nightmare scenario for him and us. Thankfully his dad didn't raise him that way.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Keegan IS a stretch 4. Bagley was trying to become that. That said Marvin was far more productive no matter how you slice it.
To be totally fair to Marvin we didn't have a true position for him to play, although he may not have had a true position given his skills maybe just projected him towards being a traditional 2000 era PF.
If Keegan has proved anything this year, it's that he's fully 100% capable of being a full-time wing. He answered that question whether he'd be stuck at the 4 or if he could defend up to smaller wings/guards. Brown has answered that for us with some of the premium defensive assignments he'd had this year.
Livinthedream
All-Star
Kinda all I was getting at. All of the younger players played better under Malone and Jaeger. Ben Mclemore was an NBA player under Malone and D'antoni. Not so much under lesser coaches.
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SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
Depends on what "wing" means I guess. Right now he's far more stretch 4 than a wing in the mold of a modern one which is more of a guard than anything. He's the 4/3 that was predicted and less 3/4 and certainly not a 3/2. I think your skills right now dictate what you are, defensively? He can guard a little up and a little down I guess.
I mean you say stretch 4, but he's barely played the 4 this season lol. B-Ball Ref has him 85% at the 3, 14% at the 4 and 1% at the 2. Which from the eye test, is absolutely correct imo. He's defended up to guards like Mitchell far more than he's defended down vs bigger wings/bigs like a Siakam.
I would actually love to see him more at the stretch 4 with like Huerter-Monk-Fox at the 1-2-3 positions, but Brown has pretty much exclusively played him as a wing and at times the defensive stopper on the best perimeter player. That makes his season all the more impressive considering it's basically an entirely different position than he played at Iowa.
SacTownKid
Hall of Famer
I wasn't saying they are playing him as a stretch 4, he is one, and that's not a bad thing and dependent on development could change. In terms of his offense he's very much indeed a lower usage Klay Thompson without the handle right now. Although in plenty of sets it's really just a title since he's for sure playing off the ball or being assisted on almost all of his offense while averaging 1.6 apg per 48. The truth is the Kings basically run two guys that are looking to play off the ball at 3/4 but in the end, Barnes and his iso scoring and shot creation clearly dictates that he's playing more G/F than Murray. So you can either say they aren't playing a 4, which they aren't, few teams really do in a traditional sense, but that doesn't mean Murray isn't one. Give him the 4 man game he got in college and see if his game expands. Right now Murray is best described as a shooter.
The Kings are forcing Keegan into an off-ball perimeter role.
I don't think people realize how much of a post-player Keegan was at in college. He made a living in the paint and the inside game was his bread and butter. However, Sabonis operates those lanes for us. I think the forward positions are more of a wash today than ever. I still remember being adamantly against the Pacers moving Paul George to PF.
I'm not sure if we'll ever see Iowa Keegan here. The role he's playing now vs. the role he played at college is so different. You hear people say how the floor spacing gets much better in the NBA, but in our case, we're a bit more crowded because it's reserved for Fox and Sabonis.
If anything, I think we're gonna see Summer League Keegan. He was more perimeter-oriented and we didn't see the same traditional post-ups as we did in Iowa. We saw a lot more dribble drives to the rim. But this isn't going to be until next year and beyond.
I don't think people realize how much of a post-player Keegan was at in college. He made a living in the paint and the inside game was his bread and butter. However, Sabonis operates those lanes for us. I think the forward positions are more of a wash today than ever. I still remember being adamantly against the Pacers moving Paul George to PF.
I'm not sure if we'll ever see Iowa Keegan here. The role he's playing now vs. the role he played at college is so different. You hear people say how the floor spacing gets much better in the NBA, but in our case, we're a bit more crowded because it's reserved for Fox and Sabonis.
If anything, I think we're gonna see Summer League Keegan. He was more perimeter-oriented and we didn't see the same traditional post-ups as we did in Iowa. We saw a lot more dribble drives to the rim. But this isn't going to be until next year and beyond.
Keegan having 5,000 points in 50 career games is pretty dang good. He's on pace
Section 101
All-Star
That's better than Wilt!!! 100 ppg average.
I know some people have wondered why his brother is being mocked mid to late 1st when Keegan was taken #4. While they have some similarities in terms of playing styles, Keegan is just another level better at everything basketball related.
This includes athleticism! While Keegan isn’t a flashy dunker, there were many times where he would just casually dunk over defenders just because he could. He’s a very good athlete, and his brother isn’t on that same level imo.
NSFW: rare Keegan emotion
Look at him casually just dunking over 2 NBA defenders like it’s 9-5:
