Joerger Status. (He’s Fired)

The_Jamal said:
Oh great a "Back in my day, we walked 15 miles in the snow to school!" argument. The NBA has thankfully become quite a long ways since then.

-Not Joerger's fault that Vlade made that trade. He shouldn't have to risk his star's health to make up for that horrific GM decision.

-Why do you care about beating Skal Labs and Gary Trent Jr.? This game would have proven exactly nothing if Fox played 30 minutes or the 15 minutes that he did play. It'd have no impact on the future of this team in the slightest. What Joerger DID do was ensure that most of our main core gets to head into the offseason with a clean bill of health. He probably played Bagley and Bogdan too long as it is.
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I don't think you get to draw the line that way. The bigger picture is the overall record for the season - symbolic but nonetheless something important to the fans and something the players could hang their hats on. It evens out over the season - at the end of the day 40 wins is 40 wins. Nobody goes and looks at a teams record and says ah yes but 3 came against a team without player XYZ.

By the logic of your injury argument the starters shouldn't even have played this game at all. Why draw the line at halftime?
 
I knew the jig was up when Joerger had that dust up with Buddy during the game. Followed shortly by WCS complaining during a game about being pulled out. I don't care how you spin it, those aren't good signs.

Also, people missed the fact that everything we heard about the Williams vs. Joerger situation came from Joerger and his camp. They were pushing the narrative that Williams was a bad guy. Pushing hard. We don't know if others in the FO agreed or not.

So the signs things weren't right have been there all along. It's just the team was winning so some of the fanbase wanted to look past and see the positive. I can't blame them. But ........ time to see the situation for what it really is. The team didn't respond when the playoff push started. Motivation and preparation is a coaches responsibility.
 
KingsFanSince85 said:
Belly and WCS couldn’t have played a bit more? One of those two might not even be part of the team next season. What are they saving him for? SMH.

Again, they could have won this game easily with better rotation and better strategy to take advantage of a team playing only 6 players with 3 playing all 48. They didn’t need to play Fox or Buddy. But apparently they just didn’t care about the W ... which is sad considering the gain.
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Really all Joeger had to do was put Fox and Buddy back in for the final 6 minutes of the game, when the Kings got the game down to a 2 point game. The Kings would had won, if Joeger would had stuck with his normal rotation in the final 6 minutes.

6 more minutes and a 40 win season would had left a good taste in the players mouths going into the summer. Now, the players and fans are left to stew for the next 6 months.
 
I was a Joerger fan. The 2nd half changed that.

Realistically whos out there that is gettable?
Ettore Messina from the spurs?
Younger up and coming?
Monty Williams?
 
Capt. Factorial said:
Fire him. If he can't hold on to a 28-point lead against a G-league team, fire him.
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Couldn’t beat New Orleans G-League lineups either — not once but twice in the span of a week with one of the games at home.

Lost 2 games with a 28-pt lead. The first was still a 25 pt lead to start the 4th and the other was a 15-pt lead. In both games the team lost that lead in the first 3-5 minutes of the quarter.

At least the first game was on the core players and their lack of focus and defense. But tonight was a different story.

To be clear, my frustration and issues over how tonight’s game was handled doesn’t mean I’m lobbying for DJ to be fired. Cause I’m not.

I’m on record saying that I believe firing the coach would be a mistake given all the instability and coaching changes the past decade. I think they should stick with DJ for better or worse for another season or two. For a franchise desperate to change image and perception, firing another coach this soon could be very damaging. Not only for the National perception, but for these young players.
 
Kingsfan23 said:
You don’t fire good young energetic coaches

I’d sooner talk about Vlade’s status
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Last year happened. That colossal failure and who to hang it on was proven this year by the difference in play style and it says Vlade did his job well from the get. The other guy? Not so much.
 
The_Jamal said:
I'd like one person to respond with a logical reason to risk injury to Fox/Barnes/Buddy/WCS/Bjelica with a 28 point lead? Or should we have left Bagley and Bogdan in the final 6 minutes too, maybe let them get hurt?
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You can't play sports with the fear of injury. Can't coach that way either. Resting players right before playoffs is one thing. But that wasn't the situation.
 
ockingsfan said:
Really all Joeger had to do was put Fox and Buddy back in for the final 6 minutes of the game, when the Kings got the game down to a 2 point game. The Kings would had won, if Joeger would had stuck with his normal rotation in the final 6 minutes.

6 more minutes and a 40 win season would had left a good taste in the players mouths going into the summer. Now, the players and fans are left to stew for the next 6 months.
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The mistake was not sprinkling in those young guys in the first half and then letting them take over in the 2nd. You can't run any game like it's 1A and 1B. Especially when the opposing side is embarrassed already. We've seen too much randomness rotation wise since Dave Joerger got here and random results is typically what follows.
 
Livinthedream said:
I knew the jig was up when Joerger had that dust up with Buddy during the game. Followed shortly by WCS complaining during a game about being pulled out. I don't care how you spin it, those aren't good signs.

Also, people missed the fact that everything we heard about the Williams vs. Joerger situation came from Joerger and his camp. They were pushing the narrative that Williams was a bad guy. Pushing hard. We don't know if others in the FO agreed or not.

So the signs things weren't right have been there all along. It's just the team was winning so some of the fanbase wanted to look past and see the positive. I can't blame them. But ........ time to see the situation for what it really is. The team didn't respond when the playoff push started. Motivation and preparation is a coaches responsibility.
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More importantly so is usage. How can anyone miss the mark as bad as he did last year playing clearly a fast paced team at the slowest pace in the league? It's mind boggling. Then to continuously drift away from the 3 point line and pick and roll this year. It's bothersome.
 
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SacTownKid said:
More importantly so is usage. How can anyone miss the mark as bad as he did last year playing clearly a fast paced team at the slowest pace in the league? It's mind boggling. Then to continuously drift away from the 3 point line and pick and roll this year. It's bothersome.
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We're supposed to give Joerger credit for performing above expectations when the low expectations for this season had a lot to do with his own horrible mismanagement of the talent last season. It's not like that was a different guy.
 
kingwin said:
I was a Joerger fan. The 2nd half changed that.

Realistically whos out there that is gettable?
Ettore Messina from the spurs?
Younger up and coming?
Monty Williams?
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The one that wants to run and let the players do what they do. You don't need some huge name, you need an X's and O's person. That type is someone you usually find being groomed on someone elses bench. I'd look towards Houston, Oakland, or maybe even the Kings own bench. That person could be named Dave Joerger or maybe Elston Turner. Don't forget, Elston Turner coached in preseason. That was the game the Kings first ditched the horn garbage and looked decent.
 
NME said:
We're supposed to give Joerger credit for performing above expectations when the low expectations for this season had a lot to do with his own horrible mismanagement of the talent last season. It's not like that was a different guy.
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He does deserve credit for sure but exactly right. This was a great season but you can't set the bar that low and then brag about getting over it. They have to break down what happened at the end here and use the stats to help determine how successful certain things were. What went right and what went wrong.
 
kingwin said:
I was a Joerger fan. The 2nd half changed that.

Realistically whos out there that is gettable?
Ettore Messina from the spurs?
Younger up and coming?
Monty Williams?
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I dunno, are any of them willing to act like they care about winning? To learn from failures and make changes to avoid repeating them? To make moves based on what is happening in front of their eyeballs? If they answer yes, I'm willing to give them a shot.
 
I want him back next year. But damn. It's playoffs or bust, and not just an 8 seed.
 
KingsFanSince85 said:
Couldn’t beat New Orleans G-League lineups either — not once but twice in the span of a week with one of the games at home.

Lost 2 games with a 28-pt lead. The first was still a 25 pt lead to start the 4th and the other was a 15-pt lead. In both games the team lost that lead in the first 3-5 minutes of the quarter.

At least the first game was on the core players and their lack of focus and defense. But tonight was a different story.

To be clear, my frustration and issues over how tonight’s game was handled doesn’t mean I’m lobbying for DJ to be fired. Cause I’m not.

I’m on record saying that I believe firing the coach would be a mistake given all the instability and coaching changes the past decade. I think they should stick with DJ for better or worse for another season or two. For a franchise desperate to change image and perception, firing another coach this soon could be very damaging. Not only for the National perception, but for these young players.
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I get what you're saying. Normally I would be saying just that. But for whatever reason, right now I'm just angry and I want to see the world burn.
 
pdxKingsFan said:
I want him back next year. But damn. It's playoffs or bust, and not just an 8 seed.
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It's kind of a tough situation to be in. This is why exit interviews and analysis are big this year. Dave Joerger is already a lame duck heading in next year and I think any idea that he should be extended should have evaporated after the play post all star if it were even in the cards to begin with. If he comes in as is with no extension next year then he's in that classic position of having about 20 prove it games to work with. I still think that's probably what happens but if it is a disappointing start have you wasted the season already? Tough decision indeed.
 
[
KingsFanSince85 said:
BS. The likes of Magic, Jordan, Bird, etc typically played all or most of 82 and didn’t take the last game off because ‘they might get hurt’.

Furthermore, this wasn’t a totally meaningless game. Not only a chance for 40 wins for a franchise desperately trying to shakes old labels and establish a winning mentality — not to mention a golden opportunity to further diminish lottery odds of the pick they surrendered. Now instead of guaranteed 14th, they are tied with 2 other teams.

In short, this game was important enough to push for a W instead of allowing players that haven’t set foot on court all season in a KINGS uniform to blow a 28-point lead against another lineup full of scrubs. This wasn’t a hard game to ensure victory.
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Not only that but how about pride in not letting Portland get a higher seed. But hey we live in a day of DNP for ****ing load management, LOAD MANAGEMENT!
 
Joshoua said:
[

Not only that but how about pride in not letting Portland get a higher seed. But hey we live in a day of DNP for ****ing load management, LOAD MANAGEMENT!
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I brought this up in the game thread and posted links, but all anybody has to do is check out the boxscore from the final games of the year last season — which I’d argue had less meaning than the final games this season — to see the hypocrisy behind the excuses being handed out like candy.

In a game tonight that had at least some meaning and benefit to the team, the core players played 10-15 minutes less than they did in those meaningless games last season.

But here’s the ironic twist. At the end of the season last year when they could benefit from losing games to better lottery odds, they played starters heavy minutes and tried to win games which could have hurt them.

But this year in the exact opposite position where they could benefit from winning games to lessen lottery odds of a draft pick they no longer own, they rested starters and seemingly didn’t care about winning a game that could have helped them in several ways.

Go figure.
 
SacTownKid said:
It's kind of a tough situation to be in. This is why exit interviews and analysis are big this year. Dave Joerger is already a lame duck heading in next year and I think any idea that he should be extended should have evaporated after the play post all star if it were even in the cards to begin with. If he comes in as is with no extension next year then he's in that classic position of having about 20 prove it games to work with. I still think that's probably what happens but if it is a disappointing start have you wasted the season already? Tough decision indeed.
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Also, how do you sell a free agent like Vucevic to come in when there is a lame duck coach? The players would be unwilling to sign long term contracts here next year.
 
The end of this season has been a mini unraveling debacle. The team and coach score a "C-/D+" since mid February, compared to a "B" for much of the season prior. Final grade is a C+ for the whole year. They went .333 (9-18) starting from the away Denver game on after hovering around .500 most the earlier season. There is little to indicate they will make the Playoffs next season without significant improvements in Team defense on OPPG and Team FTs, both of which they rank towards the bottom of the league. There is no excuse next year for major FT improvement. That means much extra FT work for all players below 80%. Every player should strive for 80% or better. Defensive change is a taller order, but must get major focus also. Team needs to spend some extra time in the off-season on these two problem areas if they're serious about playoffs next season. Numero Uno is defense - if they want to bring back the same players, they need much work on communication, awareness, off the ball-help, double-teaming, scouting, pick-and-rolls, shot-blocking, shot-clock close-outs and awareness, fouling vs. layups, eliminating matador tendencies, fitness leveling/, active vs. passive responses, not giving up on breaks against., and switching. Switching into poor defensive matchups during screens was a regular and repeated problem the whole season that never improved. It was the "splinter that never got removed" the whole season.. But there's 3-4 months to refocus and see how serious the team to improving their collective outome.
 
KingsFanSince85 said:
I brought this up in the game thread and posted links, but all anybody has to do is check out the boxscore from the final games of the year last season — which I’d argue had less meaning than the final games this season — to see the hypocrisy behind the excuses being handed out like candy.

In a game tonight that had at least some meaning and benefit to the team, the core players played 10-15 minutes less than they did in those meaningless games last season.

But here’s the ironic twist. At the end of the season last year when they could benefit from losing games to better lottery odds, they played starters heavy minutes and tried to win games which could have hurt them.

But this year in the exact opposite position where they could benefit from winning games to lessen lottery odds of a draft pick they no longer own, they rested starters and seemingly didn’t care about winning a game that could have helped them in several ways.

Go figure.
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Because.
Development
Matters.

It's not the same situation, don't try to pretend it is. Fox and Buddy especially are in a completely different phase of their career now than they were at the end of the season. It's also not Joerger's responsibility to save Vlade from his horrible decision with that trade. Perhaps Vlade should learn to manage a team and a roster first and not rely on luck to acquire talent.
 
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