[Grades] Grades v. Knicks 2/15/12

If you were looking for signs of a tired team, where would you look?

  • Shooting percentage

    Votes: 5 15.6%
  • Three point percentage (no legs)

    Votes: 1 3.1%
  • Rebounding

    Votes: 4 12.5%
  • Defense

    Votes: 18 56.3%
  • Other

    Votes: 4 12.5%

  • Total voters
    32
  • Poll closed .

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#1
“Fatigue makes cowards of us all.” -- Vince Lombardi

You know, when I used to play tennis competitively I had a distinct M.O.. Oh, I could hit the ball very hard when I wanted to, but so could a lot of guys. But what I had that most did not was good coaching that allowed me to hit balls off both sides with various spins, and great endurance. And so I would grind people into dust. I would often drop the first set and not even care, I was just going to keep the ball alive, grind you left, right, short, then topsin lob you if you came in. Make every rally a dozen strokes or more if I could and rarely go for winners unless they were sure things. And there was a mehod to the madness. Because once guys started to tire, they would start to screw up. Even if they did not quit, fatigue does funny things to your head. You start to hesitate before chasing that ball, you start to go for big winners to try to end points early because you don't want to run anymore. If you dive for a ball, you don't get up you just let the point end. If you're lobbed over, you don't chase. The serve goes downhill, errors pile up as focus and form falter. Frustration results, and eventually in your heart of hearts you don't really want to be there and compete anymore. Then I had you.

Well my diagnosis of what happened tonight has a lot to do with tha very syndrome. We looked tired and a step slow, especially our main guys, and I don't think they in the end really wanted it the way they normally might. Reke found a second wind and sucked it up for decent play after half. DeMarcus never did -- something we have seen from him as far back as his first summer league, and possibly when he was sick earlier this season. Just a big kid, and when he's not feeling well maybe he doesn't fight through it. Guys tried to homerun it and juat take quick selfish shots. Hustle plays and the little things were forgotten about. Every shot by the opponent was a cause to hang your head. Think we were a tired team halfway beaten before the opening tip even went up.

Theme = you want some Pretty Boys? Gag. Oh, alright., as long as we're having a bad night, might as well go for the capper.

Boxscore

Salmons ( F ) -- big stage and needed a bounceback, and so promptly airballed his first shot and was off to his normal races. In his last 5 games he has shot 7-31 while averaging 3.2pts. This is a starter mind you averaging 25+min a game. Its just...he had a three game hot streak back there a couple of weeks ago, and now he's right back to being THE worst starter in the entire NBA. And we just won't quit playing him. Completely inexplicable. Somebody give me one reason why this wasn't another F? Missed everything again, many of them easy. No assists and didn't move the ball. He grabbed a couple of rebounds, but come on. Makes it so hard for our young starters. If an average SF starter might score 12-14ppg or something, and ours might give you 2 or 3 pts a game...you're asking 21yr old kids to make up an extra 10ppg just because you can't find one semi-competent veteran to plug a roleplayer hole? Grrr...

Channing Tatum -- I couldn't decide whether to go suit or cheesy beefcake, so I found this and went both. Thought of cheating and using a pic of he and gf (or former gf?) Jenna Dewan, because she's hot, but decided to play it straight.

Thompson ( D ) -- behind Linsanity, people forgot that Amare was back, or at least whatever is left of him, and JT could not handle him. Jason looked gassed too and really didn't get anything accomplished. No boardwork, not able to finish over Chander, and no ability to stop Amare in the early going while the Knicks were still using him. Never gathered hismelf and really looked like he had a plan or was thinking. Made a couple of good plays to start the 4th, making a good little pass to IT cutting inside and blocking a shot, and maybe that was just enough to head to the bench feeling good about himself, as he was done for the night a few minutes later.

Tom Hardy -- I know a girl who is totally obsessed with Tom Hardy and his big kissable girly lips. His ability and willingness to compeltely trandform his look from role to role is impressive though.

Cousins ( C- ) -- briefly got off to a good start wiht scores inside and out. But you could just sense it was jnot the same physical relentless guy int ehre from the start. Twice Reke drove and dropped passes off to Demarcus right on the rim, and both times Cousins did some ugly underhand flip thing off the bottom of the backboard. Wasn't get much accomplished on the glass, and kind fo created his own foul trouble in a lazy reaching sort of unfocused way -- and again see my notes on fatigue above. Then lost his cool because of it. Knocked down some long jumpers, but that was kind of it. And I will note here as I have elsewhere, that I have a lingering suspicion that as many advances as DeMarcus has made, that he still may struggle to fight through fatigue, and you may especially see it in his rebounding. That was the story of his very first summer league for us -- he went from dominant to just a jumpshooter with no rebounding in the space of a week as he got more and more tired. When he was under the weather around the time of that Houston trip early in the season, again he produced his word borading efforts of the season. And here again -- just not the same physical force he normally has been. Reminds you he's still just a kid, and he needs to learn to suck it up in these situations.

Milo Ventimiglia-- you know, in certain shots this guy projects a certain whiny arrogance that makes me want to hit him. In my experience that is almost a 100% guarantee that women like him.

Thornton ( D+ ) -- spotted up for threes early, but only hit 1 of 3. There may have been a plan on our part, or maybe it was just on his, for him to aggressively attack Lin on offense, because he was nothing if not aggressive early. And so were the Knicks, who were going t protect Linsanity at all costs, and were actually resorting to doubling Marcus out near the three point line to get the ball out of his hands. You see that with Reke, but don't think we've seen that thrown at Thornton all year, and he looked flustered by it. On the other end fo the floor unfortunatley Marcus was again not doign much. Staying in Lin's general vicintiy, and calling it a day. Still was easily our leading scorer in the first half, but it all felt very forced as he (and little IT) were really chucking the ball up at a shot a minute rate. Came out in the third and was still forcing at every opportunity, but they weren't falling, and became the first of the big three guys to sit the rest of this one out.

Ed Westick
 
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Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#2
Evans ( C+ ) -- got off to as bad a start as everyone else. Was getting caught on screens and wrongfooted against Lin on defense as he wasn't getting it done. Pressing too much on offense the other way as everybody was playing too fast and nobody was being patient. Got the feeling the Linsanity event may have been effecting us. Greeted Lin's return by taking him into the paint and going over him with the little jumper, but still not showing ability to stay on front of him on the other end. No energy, and all the jumpers were short as well. Energy picked up in the third on both ends of the court, and while you could tell he absolutely did NOT want to shoot any more jumpers, the Knicks were playing so far off him that he eventually stareted just squaring up and taking little standstill jumeprs, and knocking them down at a pretty good rate. Could have had several more assists than he did as well, but so many of our guys were just so far off that its a mirale he even got the ones he did. Eventually worked his way into an ok game for him here -- really the only starter to do so. But nowhere near the level of effort needed to pull the ret of the team out of its deep funk.

Ewan McGregor

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Bench

Greene ( B- ) -- in early for Cousins to guard Amare, and immediately stripped him on his first possession . Nice athletic finish on the leakout. And then...got benched for the rest of the game while everybody else sucked? What exactly IS it with Donte anyway? I always assumed he must have slept wiht Westphal's wife to get treated the way he did there, but what is it now while Salmons is just such an disaster? Does Smart have a daughter? Donte you dirty dawg you.

Idris Elba

Thomas ( C ) -- messy outing that included being booed everytime he did anything by a Garden crowd who remembered the original Isiah Thomas all too well, and a stern talking to by Smart after he took the I have to provide a spark thing too far and just started selfishly, and stupidly, charging into the paint and throwing up garbage. In the early going set up Jimmer for an early three, but not nearly big enough to defend Schumpert. On the other hand he WAS able to defend Lin, who just isn't as quick as people are making him out to be, but his own offense was all forces and some bad selfish shots hurt us. Some deep garabgeime points to make the boxascore look better than the game. I don't actullay think is a C BTW, but the numbers kind of dictated it deserved some consideration.

Jake Gyllenhaal -- of course there has long been some question if this one is really for you ladies at all.

Fredette ( C- ) -- split a pair of threes set up by IT. Got jumped again by a team doubling him near the halfcourt line and taking the ball away -- teams know they can do that now. Able to get out on the break and get a few FT opportunities, although mostly in the garbagetime again.

Cristiano Ronaldo
 
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Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#3
Hickson ( D+ ) -- poor plays on both ends to start., Got a runout from Reke late in the 4th, and at least showed good hustle with a face first dive to knock a ball away on defense and cause a 24 second violation. But this was another of those games where whatever the numbers may say, it just doesn't feel like there is any plan or rhythm to what he is doing out there. Empty stats, and not many of them.

The Most Interesting Man In The World

Hayes ( C ) -- in and immediately missed an embarrassing little 4ft flip while 6ft from the rim. Watching his offense is approaching painful levels. I could do better. Good defense on Amare, whihc was obviously a mistake tonight, as both he and Donte were soon benched, and played the fewest minutes on teh team for having the audacity to play it.

Josh Hartnett

Outlaw ( B+ ) -- hey, you get all the way down here, you actually get a semi-bright spot. Started in traditional Outlaw fashion, missing a shot and creating a turnover for us with a bad pass in transiton. But got a couple of easy dunks on the break from Reke and notably actually bothering Lin a little with length on defense. Disastrous mistake late in the half as Novak hit the three on him and he ran into him too for the 4pt play. We weren't ever really competitive here, but that play bumped it from a 10pt game to a 14pt game and may have sapped whatever little fight we had. In the garbagetime added a three, as well as a jumper off a screen on a called play otu of a timeout. the last play being interesting just because he actually looked competent and comfortable doing that, while he has bascially blown every single assisted shot he has been given this year because he always has to dribble away insted of just catch and shooting. Maybe he needs plays called for him to be comfortable? Given the liklihood of that happeneing not sure that would be a good thing.

Boris Kodjoe

Whiteside ( INC ) --was thinking woohoo, justified me staying with it so long. And then...ugh. Pulled over trying to block a shot, leaving the weakside open for the Knicks to grab the board and dunk ala a Duane Causwell play. Wild spin move for his first attempt, and later added a catapult jumper tha had no chance. Wasn't reacting well on rebounds, and looked slow and sluggish overall sort of cruising around. It was similar to what we saw in preseason, and makes me wonder a bit because neither this game nor preseason looked like the same guy we saw in summer league a year and a half ago. Could the injury have slowed him down that much? The weight gain (which he needed to do)? Maybe he is hooked on valium. In any case glad he finally got some run. Just wish it had been under better circumstances and/or that he had shown more reaosn for optimism.

Hey, he's a musician, and muscians r hawt, right?
 
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#6
Knicks were same situation and they got a up and coming guy who just started playing bball from his couch and also is coping with fatigue pretty badly. Oh and they were without Carmelo. No excuses. Absolutely none. I do not like how you are giving them an excuse. They are an extremely young team, and a young team should be able to compete better than this.
 

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#7
I agree about the being tired, and yes anyone who's actually played competitively knows it can make you look dumb. You don't think or execute correctly when tired.

Now, there was more to it than that tonight, but it clearly played a roll. Our frontline was putrid. Aside from barely decent numbers by Cuz, we got nothing. 2-14 combined from JT/Salmons/JJ/Hayes. No help defense whatsoever.

Reke didn't play well in the first half, but did decently in the 2nd. Can't think of anyone who hit an open jumper off him besides an early jumper from Thornton. Really caused NY to pack the paint. I was disappointed with Reke on defense, and yes I think some of it was him being tired, but he has to do better. Thornton was nonexistent on defense.

Still have no answer for Smarts substitutions. Donte can't seem to get any kind of consistent run, even though every other sf is killing us. Seemed Smart finally took a hint and realized how much Hayes is hurting us, but then turned around and gave those minutes to Outlaw and JJ. WTF?
 
#9
tired isn't an excuse, do you think players like Kobe, Lebron, Wade etc give a damn if they are playing a back to back? hell no, they are playing hard every game.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#10
tired isn't an excuse, do you think players like Kobe, Lebron, Wade etc give a damn if they are playing a back to back? hell no, they are playing hard every game.
a) it effects them too. Every team's numbers go down on the second of back to backs.; but
b) I guarantee you that ift effected those vets a lot more when they were kids having to adjust to big minutes and carrying a team every night, develop good night before routines and avoid the dumbness kids get tempted into etc. Our guys are still learning to be pros. Few are born with it. Let them do it for a while, as a team too, and they'll get better.
 
#11
Knicks just played the night before in Toronto being involved in a hard fought game coming down to the wire. You think they weren't tired as well?

Execution is key. Yes, both teams were tired. But, one executed and played intelligently, while the other is a team full of dimwits.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#12
Knicks just played the night before in Toronto being involved in a hard fought game coming down to the wire. You think they weren't tired as well?

Execution is key. Yes, both teams were tired. But, one executed and played intelligently, while the other is a team full of dimwits.


Not the way it works. That's something you say BEFORE the game. During the game it was pretty obvious one team had a helluva lot more energy than the other. And who could blame them? They won that game last night, are flying high as a kite on Linsanity, playing in front of an electrified home crwod after coming home and cuddling with their hunnies last night. Meanwhile our kiddies shuffle into a new city full of distractions at 3 in the morning and face all that.

Its something we have especially seen with Reke and Cousins this season./ You forget how young they are, but they have defintely shown the burden of carrying an NBA franchise from time to time this year. And that's fine. A good thing even. On the job training. next season they'lll be mroe ready to face it.
 
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#13
I'm tired of excuses.

We lose a close game, and it's because we're a young team.
We get run out of the building on a back to back, and it's because we're tired.

Seems like every time we lose, it's an excuse. Every team in the NBA has to deal with what we're dealing with right now. Sure, we've played more road games than home games, but that's just another excuse.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#14
I'm tired of excuses.

We lose a close game, and it's because we're a young team.
We get run out of the building on a back to back, and it's because we're tired.

Seems like every time we lose, it's an excuse. Every team in the NBA has to deal with what we're dealing with right now. Sure, we've played more road games than home games, but that's just another excuse.
And every single team in the league has reasons for losing too. You don't just lose at randoom. Factors go into it. Some lose because they are too old, not talented enough, too small, poorly coached, whatever. Those are "excuses" too. They are also facts.

Our facts are that we are the youngest team in the NBA and have 3 very young players, 2 of whom would still be eligible to play in the Final Four this year, carrying a huge load because our bench has been one of the worst in basketball. If you don't think our outcomes would be different if our 3 young guys were suddenly all 26 yr old 5-6yr vets, with a strong bench of contributing vets behind them, I don't know what to say.
 
#15
And every single team in the league has reasons for losing too. You don't just lose at randoom. Factors go into it. Some lose because they are too old, not talented enough, too small, poorly coached, whatever. Those are "excuses" too. They are also facts.

Our facts are that we are the youngest team in the NBA and have 3 very young players, 2 of whom would still be eligible to play in the Final Four this year, carrying a huge load because our bench has been one of the worst in basketball. If you don't think our outcomes would be different if our 3 young guys were suddenly all 26 yr old 5-6yr vets, with a strong bench of contributing vets behind them, I don't know what to say.
Love it. People need to wake up and realize that basketball is won by the #6-9 guys on the bench, not the 2 star players averaging a triple double every game (although that would help). Dirk went god mode in the palyoffs last year, but there's no chance The Mavericks are champions without guys like Stevenson, Peja, Barea, Haywood, etc. We don't have a single role player who fits into that mold on a consistent basis. Add in a coaching change mid-season, a franchise being lead by a 22year old and a 21 year old and you get the product you're seeing on the floor.
 
#17
Yea, this team is young, but they are also overrated and nowhere near as talented as many believe.
Yet we have one of the most talented offensive and rebounding centers to come into the league in years and one of the most physically dominant guards in the league. The talent is their but the supporting pieces need to be improved and everything needs some time to gel.
 
#18
Not the way it works. That's something you say BEFORE the game. During the game it was pretty obvious one team had a helluva lot more energy than the other. And who could blame them? They won that game last night, are flying high as a kite on Linsanity, playing in front of an electrified home crwod after coming home and cuddling with their hunnies last night. Meanwhile our kiddies shuffle into a new city full of distractions at 3 in the morning and face all that.
i disagree, you have 2 teams playing a back to back that was close. both had reason to be tired. one sucked it up, the other used it as an excuse. yes the knicks won and could have been riding off the win. kings played the bulls and were down 3 late in the game. we could have used that to build on. also i read somewhere that both teams where in the air heading to new york at the same time so thats not really an excuse either. it's plain and simple we just got beat by the better team tonight.
 
#19
Not the way it works. That's something you say BEFORE the game. During the game it was pretty obvious one team had a helluva lot more energy than the other. And who could blame them? They won that game last night, are flying high as a kite on Linsanity, playing in front of an electrified home crwod after coming home and cuddling with their hunnies last night. Meanwhile our kiddies shuffle into a new city full of distractions at 3 in the morning and face all that.

Its something we have especially seen with Reke and Cousins this season./ You forget how young they are, but they have defintely shown the burden of carrying an NBA franchise from time to time this year. And that's fine. A good thing even. On the job training. next season they'lll be mroe ready to face it.
All true but I thought our guys would rise up because they knew linsanithy would be there, they knew how inportant it is to look good in madisonsquare, they knew they'd be tired, they've done this, experienced this before. But they didn't behave that way at all.

I appreciate your forgiving, understanding nature but I can't go as far as you have this evening. Go (eat healthy and sleep healthy) Kings!!!!!
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#20
it's plain and simple we just got beat by the better team tonight.
which has nothing to do with anything really since the complaints are with how WE played and why we played that way.

Tired. Young. Don't know how to prepare or play through it yet. That is the way it goes, and has gone for every young team at some point or the other. The Knicks on the other hand are full of veteran players and former stars. But it really wasn't about them. Contrary to hype they really didn't play great, we just played awfully. There were reasons for that. When people use the "don't use excuses" cliche its actually saying don't look for reasons. Don't use your head. Which is, by definition, dumb. You have a problem or failing, you figure out what it is so that you can take a shot at correcting it. The idiot over on the side bleating "no excuses!" all the time will never figure it out and never be able to fix it.

Fortunately the sources of many of our problems can be found on a calendar, and will naturally self correct over time.
 
#21
Wow - if it's so hard for the Kings' youngsters to actually be professional, show up at the game after the entire day off, and work hard for a couple hours after years of professional multi-million dollar experience in the NBA.... I wonder what it must be like for Jeremy Lin, who hasn't even made 1 million dollars yet, slept on a couch and has averaged 3 minutes a game for the past year, to suddenly play 7 games in 11 days, average 40+ minutes a game, have the attention of the world on him, and somehow he has the energy not to dog it on the court the way the Kings did.
And he's playing the most mentally demanding position in the NBA.

I am sick to death of these freaking excuses. It's time for some personal responsibility with these Kings.

It's not JUST because of youth, inexperience, or playing a back-to-back in an away city.

It's also about pride, hustle, professionalism, and heart.

And I'm sorry, but the ONLY player that has all of the above on this team is IT.
 
#22
which has nothing to do with anything really since the complaints are with how WE played and why we played that way.

Tired. Young. Don't know how to prepare or play through it yet. That is the way it goes, and has gone for every young team at some point or the other. The Knicks on the other hand are full of veteran players and former stars. But it really wasn't about them. Contrary to hype they really didn't play great, we just played awfully. There were reasons for that. When people use the "don't use excuses" cliche its actually saying don't look for reasons. Don't use your head. Which is, by definition, dumb. You have a problem or failing, you figure out what it is so that you can take a shot at correcting it. The idiot over on the side bleating "no excuses!" all the time will never figure it out and never be able to fix it.

Fortunately the sources of many of our problems can be found on a calendar, and will naturally self correct over time.
Consistency has been a problem with the Kings. Sure over time our players are going to get better, but is that really the way to go? Maybe the key is a whole nother issue, something that's not related to fatigue and youth. Looking at the Knicks, they were having trouble winning games even with Melo/Stat/Chandler and their veterans and roleplayers. Then Lin gets serious playing time, and they go on a streak. Now purely from a basketball standpoint, what Lin did was give their team a legitimate PG, somebody to pull everybody together and work as a team. Maybe that's what the underlying issue is. Or we can give it more time and hopefully the things a PG usually gives - consistency and leadership among other things - will be learned by our guys. We actually do have a choice - we have IT and Jimmer who can play that position, but i dont know how IT can be the guy given the obvious defensive issue, and Jimmer though slow can still play that role if given the minutes needed. In any case it seems Smart wants to keep the Thornton/Reke backcourt going so we'll have to wait it out and hope they're learning.
 
#23
which has nothing to do with anything really since the complaints are with how WE played and why we played that way.

Tired. Young. Don't know how to prepare or play through it yet. That is the way it goes, and has gone for every young team at some point or the other. The Knicks on the other hand are full of veteran players and former stars. But it really wasn't about them. Contrary to hype they really didn't play great, we just played awfully. There were reasons for that. When people use the "don't use excuses" cliche its actually saying don't look for reasons. Don't use your head. Which is, by definition, dumb. You have a problem or failing, you figure out what it is so that you can take a shot at correcting it. The idiot over on the side bleating "no excuses!" all the time will never figure it out and never be able to fix it.

Fortunately the sources of many of our problems can be found on a calendar, and will naturally self correct over time.
i just think people are getting tired of the same excuses as a defense where there are holes in the defense. young? knicks are playing an undrafted 2nd year player with little experience. fields and walker arent exactly old vets. shumpert is a rookie that got alot of playing time. the knicks are young too. someone in another thread stated the avg age difference between the kings 24.7 vs knicks without melo is 26. if thats true, i dont see that much difference. i just dont see age or being tired as an excuse since the knicks should have been tire and are young too. now i can think of other reasons that could have lead to the loss. like having salmons out there instead of donte. putting jimmer out there on bill walker. i would have kept evans on lin more. it seemed most of his lobs were when thornton was on him (but just going off memory so i could be wrong) and i think thorntons defense has been suspect lately. how about telling whoever is guarding the 3 pt specialist to not leave them. ie dorrell wright, kyle korver, steve novak. pick n roll/lobs killing you? how bout play the zone test test lins outside shooting that analyst are questioning. stuff like that are reasons i felt lead to the loss.
 
#24
Consistency has been a problem with the Kings. Sure over time our players are going to get better, but is that really the way to go? Maybe the key is a whole nother issue, something that's not related to fatigue and youth. Looking at the Knicks, they were having trouble winning games even with Melo/Stat/Chandler and their veterans and roleplayers. Then Lin gets serious playing time, and they go on a streak. Now purely from a basketball standpoint, what Lin did was give their team a legitimate PG, somebody to pull everybody together and work as a team. Maybe that's what the underlying issue is. Or we can give it more time and hopefully the things a PG usually gives - consistency and leadership among other things - will be learned by our guys. We actually do have a choice - we have IT and Jimmer who can play that position, but i dont know how IT can be the guy given the obvious defensive issue, and Jimmer though slow can still play that role if given the minutes needed. In any case it seems Smart wants to keep the Thornton/Reke backcourt going so we'll have to wait it out and hope they're learning.
Yes it is. OKC should and is our model of success. They went through the struggles needed for a couple years and are now a powerhouse team in the NBA and should be for a very long time. Give Reke and Cousins time to develop chemistry, start adding consistent productive vets, and let Smart install the system the way he wants. Then we will likely start to see the improvement we are all hoping for
 
L

LWP777

Guest
#25
How much longer can this John Salmons nightmare go on? Seriously. He is our starting ****ing SF and in the past 5 games he's scored 2, 3, 4, 5 and 2 points. And it's not like he's not getting minutes. He's averaged about 25 minutes a game during that stretch. It's a horrible example to set for our young guys that we continue to start him and give him meaningful minutes. It shows them that failing miserabley is acceptable and that there are no consequences for it. We could pick up a D-Leaguer RIGHT NOW who would give us more on BOTH sides of the ball. This is a ****ING joke.
 

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#26
Consistency has been a problem with the Kings. Sure over time our players are going to get better, but is that really the way to go? Maybe the key is a whole nother issue, something that's not related to fatigue and youth. Looking at the Knicks, they were having trouble winning games even with Melo/Stat/Chandler and their veterans and roleplayers. Then Lin gets serious playing time, and they go on a streak. Now purely from a basketball standpoint, what Lin did was give their team a legitimate PG, somebody to pull everybody together and work as a team. Maybe that's what the underlying issue is. Or we can give it more time and hopefully the things a PG usually gives - consistency and leadership among other things - will be learned by our guys. We actually do have a choice - we have IT and Jimmer who can play that position, but i dont know how IT can be the guy given the obvious defensive issue, and Jimmer though slow can still play that role if given the minutes needed. In any case it seems Smart wants to keep the Thornton/Reke backcourt going so we'll have to wait it out and hope they're learning.
That's definitely a large part of it. The second part is just not have the shooters necessary to be a good team. That also, is the stark contrast between NY and the Kings. Not being able to shoot the ball is inherently demoralizing, which in turn leads to a "tired" team. The third part is having the professionalism to take care of your body and come out and play every single night. To my mind, the Kings don't have enough of any of the above.

Regarding IT, I think there's too much emphasis put on his size. He's a good defensive player. He has the quickest feet of any King. He got into Lin in a major way. The first play in which he was in the game he was all over Lin, and Lin, because he's a smart dude, tried to post him up. But, it didn't work. He missed. I'd rather have Lin try to post up IT any day than have Thornton or Tyreke on him and have him slashing to the hole or being unguarded and throwing lob passes for dunks. Posting up isn't exactly the forte of most guards in the NBA. We shouldn't be concerned about it when it comes from the point guard position. More than anything, it's quickness and speed that make point guards effective, and IT has that.
 

Bricklayer

Don't Make Me Use The Bat
#27
i just think people are getting tired of the same excuses as a defense where there are holes in the defense. young? knicks are playing an undrafted 2nd year player with little experience. fields and walker arent exactly old vets. shumpert is a rookie that got alot of playing time. the knicks are young too. someone in another thread stated the avg age difference between the kings 24.7 vs knicks without melo is 26. if thats true, i dont see that much difference. i just dont see age or being tired as an excuse since the knicks should have been tire and are young too. now i can think of other reasons that could have lead to the loss. like having salmons out there instead of donte. putting jimmer out there on bill walker. i would have kept evans on lin more. it seemed most of his lobs were when thornton was on him (but just going off memory so i could be wrong) and i think thorntons defense has been suspect lately. how about telling whoever is guarding the 3 pt specialist to not leave them. ie dorrell wright, kyle korver, steve novak. pick n roll/lobs killing you? how bout play the zone test test lins outside shooting that analyst are questioning. stuff like that are reasons i felt lead to the loss.
There were of couse a thousand papercuts that go into a loss like this, coaching errors, preparation errors, etc. And yes the Knicks came into the season with delusions of championshp contention and ARE a better team than us, especially at home while we're on the road. All that said the root source of so many of the problems remains and will remain youth, until youth is naturally dispelled by age. if you take the Miami Heat and age regress eeryone on tehir roster to 15 and they are complete **** and would go 0-82. You fast forward everybody on the roster to 21 and they are much better, maybe even competitive some nights, but still a bad team by NBA standards. No make them all 25-29 and in the prime of their careers and they are a contending juggernaught. Time and experience heal a variety of wounds. Cosnider our home/road record. Another classic sign of youth. At home over the last month we have become formidable most nights. Go onthe road, and like most young teams we just don't have the experience to pull it off and look bad.
 
#28
What I want to know is, why didn't the Knicks look tired? They played the night before as well. Why is fatigue such an issue for the Kings? Aren't young guys supposed to have more stamina and endurance?
 
#29
What I want to know is, why didn't the Knicks look tired? They played the night before as well. Why is fatigue such an issue for the Kings? Aren't young guys supposed to have more stamina and endurance?
It's the difference of being on a 6-game winning streak playing at home with all the Linsanity hype as opposed to a 10-18 team who gets into the biggest city in the world at 3 in the morning that sucks on the road anyway.
 
#30
It's the difference of being on a 6-game winning streak playing at home with all the Linsanity hype as opposed to a 10-18 team who gets into the biggest city in the world at 3 in the morning that sucks on the road anyway.
It goes well beyond last night's game though. The Kings almost always look wiped out on back to backs. i'm really starting to wonder if the strength/conditioning staff aren't doing their jobs correctly.