Potential Free agent/trade/sign tracker
- Thread starter iowamcnabb
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That’s pretty debatable. Especially if Murray continues to show his ceiling is just a 3&D wing/forward.
Fox (on a 30% max), Sabonis, Grant, DeRozan, Monk, and Carter sum to $183.1 mil. The 2nd apron will be at $228.6 mil. I think Murray’s 2nd contract will be around what Trey Murphy got (and maybe even less with how he’s looking recently). That brings us to $208.1 mil leaving $20.5 mil to fill out the rest of the roster with picks/vet minimums.
Fox (on a 30% max), Sabonis, Grant, DeRozan, Monk, and Carter sum to $183.1 mil. The 2nd apron will be at $228.6 mil. I think Murray’s 2nd contract will be around what Trey Murphy got (and maybe even less with how he’s looking recently). That brings us to $208.1 mil leaving $20.5 mil to fill out the rest of the roster with picks/vet minimums.
Yeah, it could happen and those are the safer assumptions, but if you hit that 2nd apron and you still suck? It's going to be very hard to rebuild because of the trade restrictions. That's where teams might end up suffering. Busting through the 2nd apron isn't the issue, it's getting out of it. There might be situations arise like the Knicks back in the day where you literally just have wait it out for a few years except now you compound that with draft pick punishment, etc. I wouldn't mind a trade for Grant at all in relation to need, but that seems like a last piece kind of trade, not a get us out of trouble one. The more sensible retooling from Monte IMO would have to include someone like Fox or Domas because if this isn't working it's because they didn't work as your two headed monster. Maybe you can deal DeRozan at some point but his value probably doesn't really net anything that's going to set this franchise up unless its on a player with issues of some kind.
Why are we talking about fire Mike Brown mid-season? That accomplishes nothing and brings us right back to being a dysfunctional franchise. Firing him won’t make the players be instantly better under Louks or Christie.
I don’t like parroting info on here because I know people probably get tired of the same long messages I post, but I think half of the blame should fall on Monte for giving Mike Brown such a tough personnel to work with. Blame should also fall on the players like Kevin and Keegan for not executing their parts in our offense.
We don’t have a true PF on this team aside from Lyles who moves like a Center on the perimeter and provides no rim protecting. That puts our interior defense in a bind because our PF ends up being Keegan or DeMar. That’s not enough rim protection nor interior defense next to Sabonis.
This “forcing teams to make 3s” is Brown and Louk’s way of trying to play defense with the personnel that we have, but it’s obviously not working because it’s not being executed as well as they hoped, and teams are making their 3s.
This means we have to change something. If we’re changing our defensive scheme anyways, then I think we should be looking to be active trade partners since we’re shaking things up because it’s clearly not working.
I still can’t believe we drafted Devin Carter and ignored our needs at PF.
I don’t like parroting info on here because I know people probably get tired of the same long messages I post, but I think half of the blame should fall on Monte for giving Mike Brown such a tough personnel to work with. Blame should also fall on the players like Kevin and Keegan for not executing their parts in our offense.
We don’t have a true PF on this team aside from Lyles who moves like a Center on the perimeter and provides no rim protecting. That puts our interior defense in a bind because our PF ends up being Keegan or DeMar. That’s not enough rim protection nor interior defense next to Sabonis.
This “forcing teams to make 3s” is Brown and Louk’s way of trying to play defense with the personnel that we have, but it’s obviously not working because it’s not being executed as well as they hoped, and teams are making their 3s.
This means we have to change something. If we’re changing our defensive scheme anyways, then I think we should be looking to be active trade partners since we’re shaking things up because it’s clearly not working.
I still can’t believe we drafted Devin Carter and ignored our needs at PF.
who do you view as a rim protecting 4? Off the top of my head I can think of JJJ. Aaron Gordon would be. Chet if you consider him a 4 and not a 5. AD mostly plays center. Jon Isaac. Mobley is. Siakam kinda. Scottie Barnes is more theoretical than in practice. Maybe Jabari Smith although he hasn’t been great at that so far. There really aren’t too many prototypical 4s in the league anymore. The 3 and 4 are mostly interchangeable.
It’s going to be easier to find a rim protecting 5 but then you have to figure that out with Sabonis
It’s going to be easier to find a rim protecting 5 but then you have to figure that out with Sabonis
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Yeah I also don't know about this theoretical rim protecting 4 that people think we need. Yeah it would be great to have one but Mobley, JJJ and Chet don't grow on trees and they certainly aren't available on the trade market for a pair of first round picks plus bench players. Maybe a guy like Boucher is available? I just don't see him moving the needle a ton though. He's not a good outside shooter unless he's playing us.
I just don't think that they're giving up a ton of high percentage 3s because we don't have a rim protecting wing. They need to stop dribble penetration and stop wading into no man's land on defense more than anything. A high percentage 3 is a more efficient shot than challenging Sabonis in the paint and teams are taking advantage of that.
We definitely do need another wing but I don't think Keegan is not playing his part as a 4 adequately on defense. There probably aren't a whole lot of 4s that are defending better than he is.
I think Derrick Jones Jr would have been a nice realistic wing next to Keegan if the Kings were able to get him during the offseason.
I just don't think that they're giving up a ton of high percentage 3s because we don't have a rim protecting wing. They need to stop dribble penetration and stop wading into no man's land on defense more than anything. A high percentage 3 is a more efficient shot than challenging Sabonis in the paint and teams are taking advantage of that.
We definitely do need another wing but I don't think Keegan is not playing his part as a 4 adequately on defense. There probably aren't a whole lot of 4s that are defending better than he is.
I think Derrick Jones Jr would have been a nice realistic wing next to Keegan if the Kings were able to get him during the offseason.
Yes, easily. Keegan's been one of the best 3/4 defenders in basketball, so I'm not really sure what the issue is? As Espy said, of course if you found a unicorn like Mobley/JJJ/Chet, that'd be the perfect fit, but we're never getting that. Otherwise, Keegan is pretty much as good as it gets defensively at the 4 next to Domas.
I suppose how you classify a DFS/Derrick Jones Jr/Cam Johnson type, but that was the other part of my question. What's a "true PF" in today's NBA? Outside of like 3 guys, the position basically is just all big wings now.
I suppose how you classify a DFS/Derrick Jones Jr/Cam Johnson type, but that was the other part of my question. What's a "true PF" in today's NBA? Outside of like 3 guys, the position basically is just all big wings now.
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@Jamal It's way too early in this season to start pulling out evidence from the summer, but you asked me who I would've picked and I gave my list back in July here: https://community.kingsfans.com/threads/devin-carter-to-undergo-shoulder-surgery.98067/post-1816028
If we weren't going to draft TDS, we should've traded for a PF. I can't take credit for this take because EVERYONE in the forum was calling for us to add more length and size
- TDS
- Knecht
- McCain
- George
If we weren't going to draft TDS, we should've traded for a PF. I can't take credit for this take because EVERYONE in the forum was calling for us to add more length and size
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The issue is that I like him better at the 3. I didn't like Harrison Barnes at the 4 either, in terms of a contending lineup.
Had they picked up a starting caliber player in the off season who is a no doubt 4, nobody would think twice about Murray still playing the 3 and would be convinced of his move there from playing 4 in college. We had these discussions for two years.
They picked up DeRozan, so Murray has to start at the 4. That's fine, but I don't believe it's his best spot in a contending lineup
Had they picked up a starting caliber player in the off season who is a no doubt 4, nobody would think twice about Murray still playing the 3 and would be convinced of his move there from playing 4 in college. We had these discussions for two years.
They picked up DeRozan, so Murray has to start at the 4. That's fine, but I don't believe it's his best spot in a contending lineup
I asked this to 206, I'll pose the same question to you.
Who is a "no doubt 4" in 2024 NBA basketball? And which of those guys are actually getable?
-Mobley
-Chet
-Randle
-Zion
-JJJ
Anyone else? And I think you could make a very good argument that 3 of those guys are better at the 5 than the 4.
And if we had to classify positions, I think Keegan plays the 3 more than he does the 4. Because he's taking the toughest perimeter assignments every game. Like vs Minny; his primary assignment was on Ant, not Randle.
Who is a "no doubt 4" in 2024 NBA basketball? And which of those guys are actually getable?
-Mobley
-Chet
-Randle
-Zion
-JJJ
Anyone else? And I think you could make a very good argument that 3 of those guys are better at the 5 than the 4.
And if we had to classify positions, I think Keegan plays the 3 more than he does the 4. Because he's taking the toughest perimeter assignments every game. Like vs Minny; his primary assignment was on Ant, not Randle.
I don’t really see that being an issue considering DeRozan’s contract comes off the books the following season and I’d imagine he’s either retiring at 38 years old or resigning for much less.
To be more specific, we’d have $198.4 mil tied up in Fox, Sabonis, Grant, Murray, Monk, and Carter and the 2nd apron would be set at $251.5 mil. That’s $53.1 mil in cushion the very next offseason.
To be more specific, we’d have $198.4 mil tied up in Fox, Sabonis, Grant, Murray, Monk, and Carter and the 2nd apron would be set at $251.5 mil. That’s $53.1 mil in cushion the very next offseason.
We still have to see what those dollar amounts are going to be. Remember, as the TV rights come in and the cap rises, so do salaries. There could be a windfall or at least more breathing room, but maybe not. Then there are things like incentives, etc. Bottom line, it's cutting it close and as a GM it would probably be safer to give yourself room in case you do need to reset. I don't think Grant at this juncture is a game changer if this team continues on it's current path which hopefully it doesn't. It just seems like adding on top of adding and hoping the talent increase gets you out of hole. If at the deadline the Kings look to be one Jerami Grant away, then maybe you look at it. I just don't think doing it to save from early season misery is a wise idea. Especially considering the Blazers were pretty dead set on getting a pick in return.
It's funny. The hot takes on rookies always kind of makes me chuckle, even if they to eventually prove out to be true. Kings fans were ready to start picketing over passing on McCain a few weeks ago. Then teams started to pay attention to him. He'll find some sort of baseline like all rookies do and should be an excellent player. Solid player, but he would have been doomed on the Kings. He's like a typical high end Duke PG/SG in a PG's body, and doesn't play a ton of defense. Me thinks he went to the perfect organization considering they were also one that saw value in Seth Curry. What's he bringing to the Kings in this rotation? This is a story we've seen many a time in Sac. Good luck getting PT. Knecht is a solid player and yeah, I was for either Carter or Knecht although I do believe Carter has the defense and guard skills that inherently put him in a higher tier in terms of star potential. More risk, but higher reward. Rule number 1, never assess rookie play during a hot streak and solidify an opinion. Wait and see. It's kind of like this Kings team year 1. You know, the best offensive ever? Yeah, teams figured that out too.
Yeah, on paper Grant and Keegan seem pretty seamless. The thing about Keegan at the four is I think his rebounding jump alone shows how just like in college, as he is playing the 4, more contribution in an all around sense comes from him. And those numbers don't even factor in the amount of tips he gets on both ends.
It's instant gratification. This draft was so weak up top, that the more polished prospects (McCain, Knecht) having early success pops even more than it would in normal years. Not that they haven't been excellent, but the fact they're the "cream" of this draft class so far is pretty telling about everyone else.
You and I are on the same page with Carter and his ceiling. He's a game-changer and if things even break normally for him, is absolutely perfect to slot in next to Fox/Domas/Keegan long-term. Just had to watch Boston last year during their finals run about how their guard pressure was everything for their defense. And I think we got one of those here too.
You and I are on the same page with Carter and his ceiling. He's a game-changer and if things even break normally for him, is absolutely perfect to slot in next to Fox/Domas/Keegan long-term. Just had to watch Boston last year during their finals run about how their guard pressure was everything for their defense. And I think we got one of those here too.
I wonder if we opened a can of worms either the starting of Monk. If he continued to play well and we have any success he is going to expect to continue as starter. That last presser was the most firm he had been on that stance. I too see Carter as the eventual starter due to the defense. I’m not saying Monk will demand a trade but it could be an issue moving forward