Improving the roster (Moved from the Kings/Thunder [Game] thread)

[pdxKingsFan]

And just to add to that I ultimately see HB as the odd man out. But that man has earned some loyalty from the club, even if it ultimately means he is shipped to a club he'd be happy at.

Lyles and Sasha both have opportunity to contribute in different but meaningful ways. Right now I am still feeling if there is a trade out there we move HB, Davion and our 2026 FRP.

 

[The Effort Police]

And just to add to that I ultimately see HB as the odd man out. But that man has earned some loyalty from the club, even if it ultimately means he is shipped to a club he'd be happy at.

Lyles and Sasha both have opportunity to contribute in different but meaningful ways. Right now I am still feeling if there is a trade out there we move HB, Davion and our 2026 FRP.

While I do think that HB is the odd man out, I don't think it would really do anything if Lyles or Sasha get promoted. Upgrading HB is what will make the team take the next step, it has to be for someone that's not either of them.

Deandre Hunter is a not-splashy name that won't cost the farm like OG and Siakam.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

While I do think that HB is the odd man out, I don't think it would really do anything if Lyles or Sasha get promoted. Upgrading HB is what will make the team take the next step, it has to be for someone that's not either of them.

Deandre Hunter is a not-splashy name that won't cost the farm like OG and Siakam.

I mean obviously the most likely trade would be to get a starter that compliments Keegan but Lyles and Sasha both do other things and are capable of contributing in different ways that will be valuable, which is also why they are probably coming off the bench in the roles that they have been assigned and are agreed to even though HB has been mostly ineffective.

HB's role is the 5th man in the starting lineup. On one hand yeah he's starting. On the other hand he's not featured and so consequently he features largely in his missed opportunities. If/when we upgrade this spot we will see everything go back to fingers at Huerter.

 

[Kingster]

And just to add to that I ultimately see HB as the odd man out. But that man has earned some loyalty from the club, even if it ultimately means he is shipped to a club he'd be happy at.

Lyles and Sasha both have opportunity to contribute in different but meaningful ways. Right now I am still feeling if there is a trade out there we move HB, Davion and our 2026 FRP.

I think Heurter could also be in that mix. It seems like Brown hasn't given him many minutes in the 4th quarter this year. Not the greatest vote of confidence in his play.

 

[Kingster]

I've been using the word 'trust' but that's probably not the best word for it. Harrison Barnes and Trey Lyles were both here last season and proved themselves by hitting game winners, making key baskets in overtime, coming up with big stops to finish off wins, etc. It might be hard to see that having joined in this season, but both are good players who have had iconic moments for this franchise. On top of that, for Barnes specifically, this is his 6th year with the team which makes him the second longest tenured King after Fox. Both of these guys have built up a lot of 'equity' with the Coach and with their teammates because of that history and that gives them more leeway to make mistakes and still keep their roles and their minutes consistent.

We have a lot of Kings fans who join the community as fans of specific players and of course all are welcome! I think perhaps because you're focusing more on Vezenkov, it's harder to see the context of why Coach is making the moves he's making. The Kings were a brilliant success last season jumping up from the ranks of the perennial lottery teams into a #3 seed is almost unheard of. But now they're back in year 2 which is the "prove you're for real" year and Coach is being particularly hard on the young players and rookies because he's been in the league long enough to know that, more than anything else, complacency is the enemy of success. He doesn't want anyone feeling good about themselves -- he wants them pushing even harder. It's a tough line to walk as a coach but I think it's the right one for this team and these players judging how Fox, Murray, and Sabonis have all responded to it.

I'll just add that -- having lived through every excruciating year of the Kings non-playoff streak -- all I can tell you is that patience goes a long way as a fan of this team. Nothing comes easy for us. I do personally enjoy the enthusiasm you're bringing to the board though so feel free to keep the same energy. In time all these players will have earned their equity with you too as a fan of the Kings.

Yes, I think there's some truth to that. Maybe both could also be true - Barnes needs the minutes to trade him and Barnes has earned the equity to play him. I do think, however, that Barnes's equity is eroding. It will be interesting to see how this plays out the rest of the year.

 

[pdxKingsFan]

I think Heurter could also be in that mix. It seems like Brown hasn't given him many minutes in the 4th quarter this year. Not the greatest vote of confidence in his play.

Yeah he could be, I think it is less urgent. And while Monte is shrewd and I wouldn't put it past him, there would be some intense backlash this summer at the draft if we have traded him before the pick conveys to Atlanta (unless it netted another all-star level play in return).

 

[Kingster]

Yeah he could be, I think it is less urgent. And while Monte is shrewd and I wouldn't put it past him, there would be some intense backlash this summer at the draft if we have traded him before the pick conveys to Atlanta (unless it netted another all-star level play in return).

He's not giving him away, that's for sure. It would be interesting to hear candid comments from McNair on Heurter, as McNair did make comment earlier in the season about the need for two-way players. Heurter is obviously not a two-way player, so was McNair thinking they needed two-way players to complement Heurter, or was McNair revealing that keeping Heurter wasn't high on his priority list?

 

[pdxKingsFan]

He's not giving him away, that's for sure. It would be interesting to hear candid comments from McNair on Heurter, as McNair did make comment earlier in the season about the need for two-way players. Heurter is obviously not a two-way player, so was McNair thinking they needed two-way players to complement Heurter, or was McNair revealing that keeping Heurter wasn't high on his priority list?

I agree he doesn't match the definition of an ideal two-way player but he's not Buddy Hield out there either. Clearly he's upgradeable but upgrading Barnes spot is a higher priority for this season imho. I worry if Kev is a piece to that upgrade we will lose shooting depth and become more reliant on Monk to be on every night.

 

[Vinny Basketballerino]

I agree he doesn't match the definition of an ideal two-way player but he's not Buddy Hield out there either. Clearly he's upgradeable but upgrading Barnes spot is a higher priority for this season imho. I worry if Kev is a piece to that upgrade we will lose shooting depth and become more reliant on Monk to be on every night.

Is it just me or is there now an abundance of shooting talent in the NBA? Seems like every team we play our announcers are saying "this team has a ton of great shooters on it"....

Kevin was one of the best in the league last year... hopefully he'll start clicking again. Teams are better defending the DHO now though which was what helped him get so many great looks last year...

 

[Jc121]

I’am starting to look at huerter almost like I did Buddy as far as his shooting is either great or goes extinct in a game. But huerter is not the brain dead making dumb play to cost us games type of player.

 

[Fantazija]

While I do think that HB is the odd man out, I don't think it would really do anything if Lyles or Sasha get promoted. Upgrading HB is what will make the team take the next step, it has to be for someone that's not either of them.

Deandre Hunter is a not-splashy name that won't cost the farm like OG and Siakam.

Hunter would be a nice fit

 

[Sac.Kings]

I’am starting to look at huerter almost like I did Buddy as far as his shooting is either great or goes extinct in a game. But huerter is not the brain dead making dumb play to cost us games type of player.

The thing is, with the flexibility of having Monk off the bench, Huerter having a subpar game isn’t a huge deal most of the time. We can cover for that pretty well. What we can’t cover well is Barnes no showing. We don’t really have anyone else his size that can just slot into the role when he’s not playing well. Hasn’t been much of an issue until the playoffs last year and now this season. I’ve seen enough to recognize that he’s in decline and we should sell while the product is still worth something.

 

[The_Jamal]

I think Heurter could also be in that mix. It seems like Brown hasn't given him many minutes in the 4th quarter this year. Not the greatest vote of confidence in his play.

I think his struggles early in the year and in the playoffs just really shortened his leash.

He's done really well on D and rebounding this year, which has helped his value. But yeah, ultimately, he has to be shooting to justify him on the floor over Monk. I think it's just shifted this year where Huerter had to fight for that 5th slot in crunch time.

 

[Tetsujin]

I think his struggles early in the year and in the playoffs just really shortened his leash.

He's done really well on D and rebounding this year, which has helped his value. But yeah, ultimately, he has to be shooting to justify him on the floor over Monk. I think it's just shifted this year where Huerter had to fight for that 5th slot in crunch time.

Yeah. Monk is currently shooting 42% on over six attempts per game along with his elite secondary playmaking skillset that helps take pressure off of Fox in crunch time. For his part, De’Aaron is shooting 38.7% from three on over 8 attempts per game, which is pretty much Dame-level shooting efficiency. In other words, Fox has gotten to the point that he’s able to space the floor by himself which has allowed Mike Brown to eschew Huerter for another forward to go with Keegan.

 

[Caccia]

Yeah. Monk is currently shooting 42% on over six attempts per game along with his elite secondary playmaking skillset that helps take pressure off of Fox in crunch time. For his part, De’Aaron is shooting 38.7% from three on over 8 attempts per game, which is pretty much Dame-level shooting efficiency. In other words, Fox has gotten to the point that he’s able to space the floor by himself which has allowed Mike Brown to eschew Huerter for another forward to go with Keegan.

Whom did you have in mind?

 

[Showtime]

Barnes takes up minutes from other guys who are part of the future and he's so a$$ he shouldn't be on the court. IDC about "featuring" him for trades. That's useless. He's been in the show long enough to where every single GM understands what he can and cannot do at this point. He doesn't need to be featured, and if they can't move him then they need to eat the horrendous deal they gave him this year because it was a stupid move.

 

[hrdboild]

I wonder if what we've seen this season early on -- with both Fox and Sabonis expanding their range behind the 3pt line -- makes people more amenable to adding a defensive-minded PF next to Sabonis? We already have both Lyles and Vezenkov who are floor spacers at the PF/C position. Monk and Ellis are getting most of the guard minutes off the bench and are both capable shooters. All we're really lacking from a matchup standpoint right now is a post-defender/rebounder who can take some pressure off Sabonis and Murray on defense.

 

[iowamcnabb]

Oi vey, these shots fired at Barnes even after having a good game are so corny. Fans seem to forget that most championship level teams are top heavy with 2 or 3 players carrying the load and then role players filling in the gaps. We don’t currently have a big three so it makes our ancillary pieces look worse than they are. Keegan has that opportunity to be that 2nd/3rd guy for us but he hasn’t done it consistently yet.

 

[SacTownKid]

Oi vey, these shots fired at Barnes even after having a good game are so corny. Fans seem to forget that most championship level teams are top heavy with 2 or 3 players carrying the load and then role players filling in the gaps. We don’t currently have a big three so it makes our ancillary pieces look worse than they are. Keegan has that opportunity to be that 2nd/3rd guy for us but he hasn’t done it consistently yet.

And there is a serious question as to whether or not it just simply makes more sense to let Keegan continue on his current path of being that 3 and D guy at forward rather than a shot muncher. Finding scoring right now is simply easier than finding those defender/spot shooters. Hence the reason OG has such a high value. "Supposedly".

 

[dude12]

I think if there is a move made by Monte, it will be with Davion and then other pieces if necessary….like Duarte for salary purposes. Would he trade Huerter? He absolutely would but it’s got to be for an equal piece. I don’t see HB being traded as Mike Brown has continually brought up how important he is to the team in his role.

I don’t see the big name deals but do see a Dorian Finney-Smith type guy coming here. That tier of player seems more practical and what we need. A reason why they are kicking the tires on JTA.

 

[macadocious]

Ya the Barnes hate is crazy. He’s a good player.

 

[The_Jamal]

I think HB can still be good, but I don't think he's the same workhorse 82 game/33+ MPG guy we've had the last few years. It's time to move him into the "Iggy" role off the bench where he's around 22-25 MPG, but remains incredibly effective in that role.

 

[ockingsfan]

I think if there is a move made by Monte, it will be with Davion and then other pieces if necessary….like Duarte for salary purposes. Would he trade Huerter? He absolutely would but it’s got to be for an equal piece. I don’t see HB being traded as Mike Brown has continually brought up how important he is to the team in his role.

I don’t see the big name deals but do see a Dorian Finney-Smith type guy coming here. That tier of player seems more practical and what we need. A reason why they are kicking the tires on JTA.

Yup, I don't see a potential "home run swing" type deal happening with all the teams seemingly still in the playoff hunt and those that are not, asking an astronomical price for their stars (i.e. Toronto and Utah).

I can see Monte making more of a peripheral move like you mentioned with Davion and some expiring contracts and 2nd round picks to take on a DFS, Alex Caruso or Bojan Bogdanovic (Detroit) type player to solidify our rotation.

I'm with you, I don't see Monte moving Huerter at this point unless he can get a Jerami Grant or Kyle Kuzma in return.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

I think if there is a move made by Monte, it will be with Davion and then other pieces if necessary….like Duarte for salary purposes. Would he trade Huerter? He absolutely would but it’s got to be for an equal piece. I don’t see HB being traded as Mike Brown has continually brought up how important he is to the team in his role.

I don’t see the big name deals but do see a Dorian Finney-Smith type guy coming here. That tier of player seems more practical and what we need. A reason why they are kicking the tires on JTA.

You can see Finney Smith being traded for....and Barnes staying?

 

[jiimbob]

Yes, for all the reasons already mentioned I don’t see any home run swings happening but we will see.
After watching Keegan go off the other night Id be content to rustle his brother Kris away from Portland and see if the two would work magic here. I don’t see that Portland is doing much with him.

 

[iowamcnabb]

You can see Finney Smith being traded for....and Barnes staying?

They don’t need any more forwards, they need picks. My guess is they are hoping things stall out in Cleveland so they can trade for Mitchell.

 

[GWD]

Yes, for all the reasons already mentioned I don’t see any home run swings happening but we will see.
After watching Keegan go off the other night Id be content to rustle his brother Kris away from Portland and see if the two would work magic here. I don’t see that Portland is doing much with him.

I don't see Kris as a positive on the same team as Keegan. Keegan already seems the introvert, so having his twin brother would likely cause him to isolate many of his interactions to those with his sibling.

As of now, Keegen seems to be integrating with his King's teammates in a profoundly positive fashion. This may partly be due to the fact that this team has mostly positive, kind, supportive, and upbeat personalities. Kris just may be the kind of distraction that would be unintentionally disruptive to the bonds that have, and are, developing. (No knock on Kris intended.)

Note: The above is why siblings are not placed in the same classroom in school.

 

[jiimbob]

I don't see Kris as a positive on the same team as Keegan. Keegan already seems the introvert, so having his twin brother would likely cause him to isolate many of his interactions to those with his sibling.

As of now, Keegen seems to be integrating with his King's teammates in a profoundly positive fashion. This may partly be due to the fact that this team has mostly positive, kind, supportive, and upbeat personalities. Kris just may be the kind of distraction that would be unintentionally disruptive to the bonds that have, and are, developing. (No knock on Kris intended.)

Note: The above is why siblings are not placed in the same classroom in school.

you might be right, Franz and Moritz Wagner seem to be doing well together in Orlando but they may be the exception.
Part of me wants to see Kris get playing time, and who knows, they might elevate each other’s game. I also understood that the Kings traded their first round pick to Dallas not only to move Holmes but that the guy they wanted, possibly Kris, was no longer available.