[Game] Kings @ Pelicans, 11/22/2023 5pm Pacific 8pm Eastern

[206Fan]

so who's the next team the Kings face two times in a row? their early season kryptonite apparently, injuries to Fox and Keegan matter a whole lot but just a thought to think about

Injuries don't matter as much as you think. we've already faced a bunch of teams who have missed their key players

• vs. Warriors: Draymond (3rd best player)
• vs. Portland: Simons (best player)
• vs. Spurs: Vassell (best player)
• vs. Pelicans 2x: McCollum & Murphy (3rd & 4th best players)

I know there were other less significant injuries for the those teams like Okoro. There's been a lot of hobbled teams out there. I don't think the Kings can pull the injury card because everyone seems to be injured with a bunch of players who were listed as game time decisions as well.

 

[SacTownKid]

One thing they do have to deal with though is CJ being their point of attack defender as opposed to them just sticking Alvarado or Daniels out there instead

Yeah true. They might be able to control the clock a little more and steal possessions from the other team over the 48 though.

 

[DynaPamm]

Well that sucked
Welcome back Trey Lyles, made shots took some hits
A little too late but not as embarrassing as Mondays night game but still a loss

 

[The_Jamal]

We also haven't been fully healthy pretty much all season. So people saying we aren't "contenders"... well we haven't been healthy at all either.

That 6-game win streak was filled with impressive wins. We're probably a lower end contender (8-10 range) but i think we're certainly around there.

 

[kingsboi]

Contenders don’t take it on the chin back to back against HOU and NO.

teams that play physical and have some size are simply going to give the Kings fits

 

[206Fan]

We’re a playoff team. We aren’t a contending team.

It's hard for me to say that we're top 6 good... I would say we're a play-in team, but not a playoff lock. The teams who have our numbers are also below us in the standings somehow. Seems like another injury-filled year, but it's including the Kings this time

 

[BenchMob]

Well I thought a 3-3 roadie would be successful and it it’s looking that way. I did like the fight we had in the 4th quarter but Zion/BI too much to handle. I am wondering how we can improve this team in trades because we will have problems with teams like the Wolves and Pels.

 

[iowamcnabb]

Who care...he's going to brick anyway just like he done in any pressure games in the past. Trey Lyle should be shooting at one time instead of passing up. Fox was not clutch like he used to in the fourth. The only players on this roster that I'm comfortable of shooting 3s are Keegan or Monk and maybe Fox. Everybody else is just unpredictable. Vezenkov is not automatic like I thought. I thought he couldn't miss in practice? Why does he keeps bricking in real game?

22 points and 4-9 from three and you’ve circled Barnes as the problem. That’s why your rants have no credibility.

 

[kingsboi]

Injuries don't matter as much as you think. we've already faced a bunch of teams who have missed their key players

• vs. Warriors: Draymond (3rd best player)
• vs. Portland: Simons (best player)
• vs. Spurs: Vassell (best player)
• vs. Pelicans 2x: McCollum & Murphy (3rd & 4th best players)

I know there were other less significant injuries for the those teams like Okoro. There's been a lot of hobbled teams out there. I don't think the Kings can pull the injury card because everyone seems to be injured with a bunch of players who were listed as game time decisions as well.

no doubt. my post was mostly pointing to the fact that facing the same team twice in a row is just not going well for the Kings thus far. I don't know how many more times that will happen this season but let's see if that trend breaks next time around

 

[coolhandluke]

One thing they do have to deal with though is CJ being their point of attack defender as opposed to them just sticking Alvarado or Daniels out there instead

CJ could be hunted on defense but he makes up for it on the offensive end. He is a reliable clutch guy at the end of games.

 

[KF8]

We'll still be 3-3 on this road trip after a likely loss against the Wolves this upcoming Friday which isn't too bad. Just wish Barnes, Huerter, and Murray can become more consistent. You never know what you'll get from those 3 from game to game. Too wildly inconsistent.

 

[Kingz19]

Fox had to be ailing with that fourth quarter performance. He was just another guy out there. Only took a few shots. Had some weird low energy, making lazy low percentage passes. Even that shot over Alvarado at the hoop seemed sort of off..I don’t want to say half hearted, but very very flat.

He called for a sub in the third but then didn’t go out. So I don’t know…no team is good enough defensively to make Fox not even try to take over in the fourth. So..something was off.

Domas was aggressive but killed us at the line in the fourth.

HB passed up a wide open corner three for the tie. Stupid and costly decision. Kings end up with a bad shot on that possession.

Monk some dumb turnovers and couldn’t hit his threes.

Trey was very good. Ran out of steam on the three ball and missed some good looks at the end but he was the only reason Kings had a chance to win.

Second quarter killed the Kings. Huerter was awful. Duarte couldn’t get into the game and was overmatched anyway. And the bench mostly was terrible except for Trey.

Javale was especially awful tonight. flat out didn’t come to play and should’ve never got back in the game after his dreadful first stint in the game.

Davion hasn’t found redemption with Keon out. It’s going to be an easy decision for Brown to stick with Keon based on these two games.

In fact, he actually looked BAD these last two games rather than a talented player who might not be the right fit like he looked before. Massive moment where he fell asleep on defense and Alvarado hit a big wide open corner three. Not even attempting to contribute offensively anymore.

Sasha missed too many open shots.

We need somebody like Kessler Edwards, except one that can shoot.

 

[Tetsujin]

CJ could be hunted on defense but he makes up for it on the offensive end. He is a reliable clutch guy at the end of games.

But it’s not like the Pelicans really need more offense when both BI and Zion are healthy though. They just sorta need a guy who stays out of their way, hits threes, and plays strong enough defense to not let Zion get hunted on switches every other possession.

 

[reptilexcq2]

Injuries don't matter as much as you think. we've already faced a bunch of teams who have missed their key players

• vs. Warriors: Draymond (3rd best player)
• vs. Portland: Simons (best player)
• vs. Spurs: Vassell (best player)
• vs. Pelicans 2x: McCollum & Murphy (3rd & 4th best players)

I know there were other less significant injuries for the those teams like Okoro. There's been a lot of hobbled teams out there. I don't think the Kings can pull the injury card because everyone seems to be injured with a bunch of players who were listed as game time decisions as well.

Sometimes missing players may result in the teams playing better. For example, Grizzlies missing Morant last year and they were just as good. The team play style is totally different without Morant and they were solid. Who's to say that Pelicans with CJ Mcollum going to be better? The style may shift and may prevent others from dominating the game such as Zion because of it means more touch for CJ or the play style may prevent them from being great. It only take ONE PLAYER to destroy the chemistry. And maybe having him on the floor mean Fox can attack and take advantage of him much better.

 

[The_Jamal]

It's hard for me to say that we're top 6 good... I would say we're a play-in team, but not a playoff lock. The teams who have our numbers are also below us in the standings somehow. Seems like another injury-filled year, but it's including the Kings this time

I mean, you could say that about literally every single team in the West. Teams are going to "have each other's" number all over the place.

I geniunely think this season is all about avoiding massive losing streaks. Whoever stays the most consistent and doesn't let a bad 2 week stretch just wreck the season is going to get the top seeds this year in the playoffs. Everyone is too good.

Honestly, the only true alpha contender I see this season is the Celtics. Maybe the Nuggets with Murray healthy. But I think you could pretty easily group like the next 12 teams in whatever order after that.

 

[206Fan]

our role players are a bigger problem than people think. we do have a deep bench, but we don't have a lot of players who buy into their roles every night.. there's just not a game to game consistency. with the Pelicans, you see guys like Alvardo and Marshall coming in and instantly playing their role. they're getting a lot of consistency from their other starters in Valanciunas and Herb Jones.

with the Kings, sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of SL players running free and trying to make an NBA roster.

 

[Rob-The-Great]

But it’s not like the Pelicans really need more offense when both BI and Zion are healthy though. They just sorta need a guy who stays out of their way, hits threes, and plays strong enough defense to not let Zion get hunted on switches every other possession.

Naw more shooting around a guy like Zion? You can never have too many.

They are a very balanced team. The difference with them is they have 3 people who can take over a game and we have 2 and it’s hard to argue that fox is much more talented than Zion.

Zion-Fox
McMullen better than monk (consistent)
Ingram and this point better than Murray
Val matches up well with Sabonis (Sobonis better tho)

its just a good matchup I could see them being us last year. I can see us dropping without some changes. We have too much shooting and not enough driving physicality

 

[SLAB]

22 points and 4-9 from three and you’ve circled Barnes as the problem. That’s why your rants have no credibility.

Barnes is only usually a problem.

 

[206Fan]

I mean, you could say that about literally every single team in the West. Teams are going to "have each other's" number all over the place.

I geniunely think this season is all about avoiding massive losing streaks. Whoever stays the most consistent and doesn't let a bad 2 week stretch just wreck the season is going to get the top seeds this year in the playoffs. Everyone is too good.

Honestly, the only true alpha contender I see this season is the Celtics. Maybe the Nuggets with Murray healthy. But I think you could pretty easily group like the next 12 teams in whatever order after that.

this may be the reason why Monte decides to make changes at the deadline if he believes the duo of Fox-Sabonis can win you a ring right now. this feels like the first time in a while where we don't have any dynasty threats who impede the rest of the league's chances at a ring.

 

[kingdivac]

I mean, you could say that about literally every single team in the West. Teams are going to "have each other's" number all over the place.

I geniunely think this season is all about avoiding massive losing streaks. Whoever stays the most consistent and doesn't let a bad 2 week stretch just wreck the season is going to get the top seeds this year in the playoffs. Everyone is too good.

Honestly, the only true alpha contender I see this season is the Celtics. Maybe the Nuggets with Murray healthy. But I think you could pretty easily group like the next 12 teams in whatever order after that.

T-Wolves

 

[coolhandluke]

But it’s not like the Pelicans really need more offense when both BI and Zion are healthy though. They just sorta need a guy who stays out of their way, hits threes, and plays strong enough defense to not let Zion get hunted on switches every other possession.

Zion is not clutch. BI is inconsistent in the clutch. CJ is the guy that takes the clutch shots. It's good for them that BI is getting better at the end of games.

 

[Rob-The-Great]

West is stacked man. Every game will be a grind. And we are a shooting team means we will have good wining streaks and some losing streaks. We just need to get hot at the right time. Consistency will not happen with this team every game.

mitchlle
McGee
Barnes (not a bad game calm down)
And huerter if we have to
Should be on the trade block for a star player.

who? Well we will have to see

 

[The_Jamal]

our role players are a bigger problem than people think. we do have a deep bench, but we don't have a lot of players who buy into their roles every night.. there's just not a game to game consistency. with the Pelicans, you see guys like Alvardo and Marshall coming in and instantly playing their role. they're getting a lot of consistency from their other starters in Valanciunas and Herb Jones.

with the Kings, sometimes it feels like we have a bunch of SL players running free and trying to make an NBA roster.

Expand on that, because I don't think it's the talent at all. It's two things imo:

1. We've had guys with some real real low floor games. Huerter from the beginning of the season, the last few games as an example. But that might not be entirely fair if he's not 100%. But 2-10 shooting with no Keegan isn't going to get it done. 2-8 from Monk. Just real swingy performances when the rotation guy were so rock solid for most of the year. Speaking of Keegan, his shooting falling off a cliff wasn't in the expected range of outcomes so far this year either.

2. The better argument to me is we have too many duplicate skill-sets. It's not a talent problem, it's how that talent is allocated problem. Huerter/HB/Sasha/Lyles/Duarte all more or less do and bring the same type of value. I think Monk has stand-out value because he's the only Non-Fox guy who you can get to create something out of nothing and is just clearly the best PnR passer on the team. Keegs has added elite/switchable defense on the perimeter and (hopefully) when his shooting stroke returns, along with a few new offensive moves, we'll have an 18 PPG wing with lockdown defense. Seems good.

So to me, I think those 4 are your core spots to build around. And you obviously don't want to flip all your shooting away, but if you could consolidate 2 or 3 of those guys into elite rim protection. Or an elite wing defender. Or an on-ball offensive wing threat. I think Colby/Keon/Kessler all have shown some flashes of doing so, but it's hard to really give them developmental minutes right now when we're trying to compete. And they may just not have enough talent anyway to justify that investment.

Like a perfect low-cost example is if you found a way to bring in Alex Caruso. Awesome impactful player, but I don't think anyone would say he's head and shoulders talent wise above a Huerter or HB. But what he actually does on the court... we don't do at all. And the OG example has been discussed to death, but same type of deal.

 

[fansinceday1]

Man….I’m over Barnes.

 

[The_Jamal]

T-Wolves

Possibly. I'd have them ahead of us, but I don't think they're some lights out no doubt contender. They'd be near the top of that tier 2, but I'd take the Celtics over them.

 

[Tizzy Flip]

I mean, you could say that about literally every single team in the West. Teams are going to "have each other's" number all over the place.

I geniunely think this season is all about avoiding massive losing streaks. Whoever stays the most consistent and doesn't let a bad 2 week stretch just wreck the season is going to get the top seeds this year in the playoffs. Everyone is too good.

Honestly, the only true alpha contender I see this season is the Celtics. Maybe the Nuggets with Murray healthy. But I think you could pretty easily group like the next 12 teams in whatever order after that.

Bucks, 76ers, Suns (esp with Book, Durant, Beal healthy), and Heat all are “alpha” contenders. Nuggets are not a maybe, they are a contender. Dallas is gonna be up there too

 

[KingsFanSince85]

Man….I’m over Barnes.

Why is Barnes drawing your ire in this game thread? Unlike a few others, the dude actually showed up and produced tonight.

HB was far from the reason the KINGS lost to an inferior team.

The KINGS lost because they gave that crap team too many extra possessions via steals and offensive rebounds, the difference between steals and offensive rebounds was +16 in the Pels favor.

That‘s how a team ends up with 11 more FGA’s and 7 more made FG’s.

Think about this. The KINGS made 1 more free throw and 8 more three’s YET still lost!

That‘s because they allowed WAY too many extra possessions. Pure and simple.

Secondarily, 34% shooting from three is too low to be taking 44 attempts. That hurt too.

Circling back to HB, he was far down the list of reasons why the KINGS lost. Why he receives so much hate escapes me.

I mean, I see a ton of people constantly hating on HB and Davion yet somehow defending Kevin Huerter despite such a long slump dating back to before the all-star break last season. Well, after a stretch of like 5 good games, Huerter has reverted back to his “slump” numbers the past 3 games.

I wonder where the “I’m over Huerter” comments are? Cause HB has been a far better and more consistent player than Huerter during their KINGS tenures.

 

[reptilexcq2]

Due to lack of athleticisms, size and length, the Kings had to play hard or work extra hard to get any advantage. It requires double teaming quickly and stay vigilant in rotation. Basically, it means they have to play a team game to be successful...which is fine because this is a team game after all. But the problem is working extra hard can burn you out...may cause injuries, losing concentration or assignments. Kings have too many undersized players...even Kessler is undersized and short compare with others. Mitchell and Barnes are undersized for their positions. They can get overwhelmed by teams that have size advantage in posting up and rebounding. When do you ever see Barnes make incredible defensive play? A block shot or a defensive stand. Only rarely. The way you can tell if they're a good defensive player is if they strip the ball despite being smaller size. Barnes never strip ball...always run away or backing away from pressure. Mitchell, now he does strip the while backing away...that's a sign of a great defensive player. Unfortunately, he didn't get many calls in his favor even though he play great D. This is why Kings can't stop nobody cuz they had to trade basket. Sabonis had to work extra hard to prevent any interior attack. So what's my point? Time to trade some of these weak seemingly 1-dimensional players and get back guys with length that can actually play great D so guys don't have to work extra hard.

They had to play zone defense because they know they're in trouble one-on-one. They don't have the size to compete. The only players they shall keep are Fox, Sabonis, Keegan and Monk. Everyone is tradeable.

 

[Kingz19]

Why is Barnes drawing your ire in this game thread? Unlike a few others, the dude actually showed up and produced tonight.

HB was far from the reason the KINGS lost to an inferior team.

The KINGS lost because they gave that crap team too many extra possessions via steals and offensive rebounds, the difference between steals and offensive rebounds was +16 in the Pels favor.

That‘s how a team ends up with 11 more FGA’s and 7 more made FG’s.

Think about this. The KINGS made 1 more free throw and 8 more three’s YET still lost!

That‘s because they allowed WAY too many extra possessions. Pure and simple.

Secondarily, 34% shooting from three is too low to be taking 44 attempts. That hurt too.

Circling back to HB, he was far down the list of reasons why the KINGS lost. Why he receives so much hate escapes me.

I mean, I see a ton of people constantly hating on HB and Davion yet somehow defending Kevin Huerter despite such a long slump dating back to before the all-star break last season. Well, after a stretch of like 5 good games, Huerter has reverted back to his “slump” numbers the past 3 games.

I wonder where the “I’m over Huerter” comments are? Cause HB has been a far better and more consistent player than Huerter during their KINGS tenures.

Huerter has a whole thread that has been on page 1 for almost a year dedicated to complaining about him.

 

[KingsFanSince85]

Bucks, 76ers, Suns (esp with Book, Durant, Beal healthy), and Heat all are “alpha” contenders. Nuggets are not a maybe, they are a contender. Dallas is gonna be up there too

Why is Dallas gonna be up there too? Because they sure weren’t last season.

Why is it only teams like the KINGS have to “prove it”? The KINGS did prove it last season, yet are being dismissed by many this season while Dallas, who didn’t prove anything last season, get a pass. Makes no sense.

I’m not buying Dallas, Minnesota, Houston, etc, unti, they are still “proving” it come March and April. They’ve done nothing to make me believe they are any different than last season. I may end up being wrong about one or more of them, but I gotta see it first.

Dallas has a couple big names, but those names are defensive deficient and are far too ball dominant. They may make the playoffs this season if everything goes well, but I don’t see any valid argument for them to be a legit contender to win anything significant.