How would you feel if we sign Kuzma
- Thread starter iowamcnabb
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I'm not going to lose sleep over it or anything. If it happens and Kuzma inevitably becomes the most hated player on the team in 2 years we can all commiserate together. (Ideally while watching a championship parade).I like Kuzma on the Kings. I think he and Murray would be a really versatile forward combination.
I’m not worried about shot quality with this team. Kuzma will learn what are good shots within the offense. Also, I think he has unlocked potential as a cutter and can put pressure on the rim. And he boars and can run with D Fox.
And I also think the Kings will mess around with zone coverage more often next year. Kuzma’s length could be an asset.
We shall see…
I’m not worried about shot quality with this team. Kuzma will learn what are good shots within the offense. Also, I think he has unlocked potential as a cutter and can put pressure on the rim. And he boars and can run with D Fox.
And I also think the Kings will mess around with zone coverage more often next year. Kuzma’s length could be an asset.
We shall see…
folks on here sleeping on Kuzma. He's gotten better, sure the efficiency could use some work but he hasn't been playing for any winners so he's given the green light. I think under Brown he will tame him and turn him into a productive player like he did with Wiggins, I'm all for Kuzma if Hart, Williams or Brooks aren't options.
running it back implies that we are bringing everyone back exactly how they were last year. That isn’t the case imo. We drafted Keegan with the 4th pick in the draft and now we are likely asking him to be the 4th option on the team. How many top 5 picks that aren’t busts are the 4th option?
If HB came back it would be as the 5th option instead of the third and I think that’s a pretty substantial difference.
A 48 win team that has one year under their belt with the coach and system, playoff experience, 3 draft picks, maybe Sasha and a 3rd option being groomed for role would have been just fine in my book.
If HB came back it would be as the 5th option instead of the third and I think that’s a pretty substantial difference.
A 48 win team that has one year under their belt with the coach and system, playoff experience, 3 draft picks, maybe Sasha and a 3rd option being groomed for role would have been just fine in my book.
I thought Kuzma improved quite a bit but after looking into his numbers more, I'm going with a hard pass. I don't think he would improve the team at all. His playmaking skills have improved but he's still sporting a 3.7:3 TO ratio. That's not very good at all. I'd rather roll with Barnes if it came down to him or Kuzma.
If we start next season with the same starting 5 as last year it's going to be a long year.
Barnes needs to exit that starting lineup.
He was already bad on defense and now he's a year older so yes what you're saying about experience matters to some extent but timeline also matters and it's just a move that needs to be done.
I don't have a problem with him coming back but it needs to be off the bench.
It's like a no questions asked kind of thing for me.
Barnes needs to exit that starting lineup.
He was already bad on defense and now he's a year older so yes what you're saying about experience matters to some extent but timeline also matters and it's just a move that needs to be done.
I don't have a problem with him coming back but it needs to be off the bench.
It's like a no questions asked kind of thing for me.
Or, and I think this needs to be an option too, just pass and keep some space heading into the season and see what happens at the deadline. By that point the Kings and other teams will know if a big 2 or 3 has formed at the top of the standings as well. If the Suns are for real, the Nuggets come back, and a team like one of the LA teams get something or with the Clipps just get healthy, it's very likely no move this offseason is going to really push the Kings up with them anyway in terms of pure talent. Perhaps keeping Barnes at a reasonable, team friendly price could still allow the sort of flexibility that landed them Barnes for nothing in the first place.
The hardest part about this process, no matter who we sign, is we have to wait a long time to know if it works. When we traded for Sabonis we were all shocked and in some ways upset. After the “embrace game” we knew something special happened and it played out that way the next year. When we drafted Keegan over other “higher ceiling” players we got to see a Summer league mvp 2 weeks after. Free agent signing? We won’t know if this is working until a quarter of the way into the season possibly.
Kuzma is a very good player who reasonably fits one of our open roster spots. I'm not sure about fit for role. He's an all-around player, where Keegan and HB had very structured and defined roles last year.
He has come off as a bit of a jackass some interviews I've heard. Less than Kyrie Irving level, maybe a little less than Demarcus Cousins. Enough to make an impression, not terrible enough to form a grudge against.
Gets a meh from me.
He has come off as a bit of a jackass some interviews I've heard. Less than Kyrie Irving level, maybe a little less than Demarcus Cousins. Enough to make an impression, not terrible enough to form a grudge against.
Gets a meh from me.
For the vet minimum/mid level yeah he's a good signing but not for Harrison Barnes money or more. It's a lateral move at best you get more youth than HB but the IQ on the team dramatically falls. I'd want Grant/Williams ahead of him. Unless it's some trade, I can't see anyone to sign to make the Kings significantly better.
I get the idea this is not the best FA year. Not sure of team improvement with the names i’m hearing and seems the Toronto possibilities are going nowhere.
I’d like to see Barnes out of the starting rotation and am most intrigued by Cam as his replacement but honestly don’t know enough about him or his injuries.
I’ve got no strong objection to Kuzma though and recon Brown and company will iron out most concerns if that’s the direction we go.
I’d like to see Barnes out of the starting rotation and am most intrigued by Cam as his replacement but honestly don’t know enough about him or his injuries.
I’ve got no strong objection to Kuzma though and recon Brown and company will iron out most concerns if that’s the direction we go.
I wouldn’t feel good about it.
It seems like all the advanced impact stats I look at have him as a pretty negative player. I know Jamal has mentioned some analytics gurus supposedly love him but I’m not really seeing anything that stands out statistically (yet).
Even the other day there was a post that linked this article about him (couldn’t find the original poster who posted it): https://www.audacy.com/espn1320/sports/sacramento-kings/kyle-kuzma-fit-for-a-king.
As an example as I was going through the article, the article mentions how 42.9% of Kuzma’s 3s were wide open in 2020-21 with the Lakers but only 29.3% of his 3s this past year were wide open (suggesting that’s why his 3PT% isn’t very good) but it fails to mention that Kuzma shot 31.7% on his wide open 3s last year.
Now maybe that year was an anomaly, but I just see these articles and it looks like people are trying to manipulate stats to convince themselves that Kuzma is a good fit here. I don’t see it in the stats that I’m lookin at, I don’t see it when watching him live, and I have a hard time thinking that Kuzma fits the mold of the type of player McNair prefers. I mean he’s brought in Halliburton, Mitchell, DiVincenzo, Sabonis, Huerter, Murray, Lyles, C. Jones, etc. Kuzma stands out like a sore thumb when compared to these guys. I’d be surprised if McNair goes the Kuzma route.
It seems like all the advanced impact stats I look at have him as a pretty negative player. I know Jamal has mentioned some analytics gurus supposedly love him but I’m not really seeing anything that stands out statistically (yet).
Even the other day there was a post that linked this article about him (couldn’t find the original poster who posted it): https://www.audacy.com/espn1320/sports/sacramento-kings/kyle-kuzma-fit-for-a-king.
As an example as I was going through the article, the article mentions how 42.9% of Kuzma’s 3s were wide open in 2020-21 with the Lakers but only 29.3% of his 3s this past year were wide open (suggesting that’s why his 3PT% isn’t very good) but it fails to mention that Kuzma shot 31.7% on his wide open 3s last year.
Now maybe that year was an anomaly, but I just see these articles and it looks like people are trying to manipulate stats to convince themselves that Kuzma is a good fit here. I don’t see it in the stats that I’m lookin at, I don’t see it when watching him live, and I have a hard time thinking that Kuzma fits the mold of the type of player McNair prefers. I mean he’s brought in Halliburton, Mitchell, DiVincenzo, Sabonis, Huerter, Murray, Lyles, C. Jones, etc. Kuzma stands out like a sore thumb when compared to these guys. I’d be surprised if McNair goes the Kuzma route.
So I wanted to look at how Kuzma’s stat profile changed when he was on the floor with both Beal & Porzingis (making him a 3rd option) vs. when he was a 1st or 2nd options. These are the per36 stats I found:
1st or 2nd Option (1,449 MIN)
USG% = 0.293
TS% = 0.541
FG% = 0.449
2P% = 0.529
3P% = 0.328
FT% = 0.723
FGA = 19.8
2PA = 11.9
3PA = 7.9
FTA = 4.3
PTS = 23.4
REB = 7.2
OREB = 0.7
DREB = 6.5
AST = 4.0
TO = 3.4
AST:TO = 1.2
STL = 0.6
BLK = 0.4
3rd Option (711 MIN)
USG% = 0.229
TS% = 0.575
FG% = 0.467
2P% = 0.562
3P% = 0.357
FT% = 0.763
FGA = 15.3
2PA = 8.2
3PA = 7.1
FTA = 3.0
PTS = 19.1
REB = 7.8
OREB = 1.2
DREB = 6.6
AST = 3.4
TO = 2.3
AST:TO = 1.5
STL = 0.5
BLK = 0.6
Looking at some On/Off numbers as well, the Wizards had a net rating of +3.6 when Beal, Porzingis, & Kuzma were on the floor (119.4 ORTG and 115.8 DRTG) which would be 5th compared to other team net ratings. We had the best ORTG this year at 118.6 but a 115.8 DRTG would have ranked 22nd. Defense is larger than Kuzma obviously but it's promising to see a very high ORTG with Kuzma as the 3rd option. It suggests that his efficiency concerns may not be dragging an offense down when he's in a secondary role.
What's also interesting is the Wizards net rating when Kuzma is either a 1st or 2nd option. The net rating drops to -3.1 (113.3 ORTG and 116.4 DRTG). Makes sense that we see a huge drop in ORTG here considering we all recognize that he's not a #1/#2 option. Also, it's important to note that only 32.8% of his minutes this year came with both Beal and Porzingis on the floor so he was very often forced to be in that #1/#2 role for a large majority of his playing time. Maybe with guys like Monk, Huerter, & Murray, the Kings can afford to keep Kuzma more in a 3rd/4th role keeping those efficiencies higher.
Having said all of this, I still don't like the signing but thought I'd share these splits as I thought it was another data point for us to consider.
1st or 2nd Option (1,449 MIN)
USG% = 0.293
TS% = 0.541
FG% = 0.449
2P% = 0.529
3P% = 0.328
FT% = 0.723
FGA = 19.8
2PA = 11.9
3PA = 7.9
FTA = 4.3
PTS = 23.4
REB = 7.2
OREB = 0.7
DREB = 6.5
AST = 4.0
TO = 3.4
AST:TO = 1.2
STL = 0.6
BLK = 0.4
3rd Option (711 MIN)
USG% = 0.229
TS% = 0.575
FG% = 0.467
2P% = 0.562
3P% = 0.357
FT% = 0.763
FGA = 15.3
2PA = 8.2
3PA = 7.1
FTA = 3.0
PTS = 19.1
REB = 7.8
OREB = 1.2
DREB = 6.6
AST = 3.4
TO = 2.3
AST:TO = 1.5
STL = 0.5
BLK = 0.6
Looking at some On/Off numbers as well, the Wizards had a net rating of +3.6 when Beal, Porzingis, & Kuzma were on the floor (119.4 ORTG and 115.8 DRTG) which would be 5th compared to other team net ratings. We had the best ORTG this year at 118.6 but a 115.8 DRTG would have ranked 22nd. Defense is larger than Kuzma obviously but it's promising to see a very high ORTG with Kuzma as the 3rd option. It suggests that his efficiency concerns may not be dragging an offense down when he's in a secondary role.
What's also interesting is the Wizards net rating when Kuzma is either a 1st or 2nd option. The net rating drops to -3.1 (113.3 ORTG and 116.4 DRTG). Makes sense that we see a huge drop in ORTG here considering we all recognize that he's not a #1/#2 option. Also, it's important to note that only 32.8% of his minutes this year came with both Beal and Porzingis on the floor so he was very often forced to be in that #1/#2 role for a large majority of his playing time. Maybe with guys like Monk, Huerter, & Murray, the Kings can afford to keep Kuzma more in a 3rd/4th role keeping those efficiencies higher.
Having said all of this, I still don't like the signing but thought I'd share these splits as I thought it was another data point for us to consider.
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We haven’t heard a peep yet that the Kings are actually interested in Kuz or anyone else for that matter. I guess it’s not out of the question that Monte cleared the cash to have all options available figuring this was his best chance to add a free agent before the Fox/Domas/monk/Keegan extensions. He doesn’t value late picks as much as us fans do so he figured it was a small price to pay for his signature optionality.
I'd be fine with the overpay if he were the missing piece, but he's not. If you told Keegan to take 6 more shots last year as a rookie, he could replicate Kuzma's production. You can make an argument for Trey Lyles to put up close numbers if you asked him to play 30 min too. If the plus for Kuzma is increased efficiency with less responsibility, that is essentially somewhere between Trey and Keegan level production.
Not a huge fan of Kuzma, although I’m not as harsh on him as some on here. I feel that he would be a redundant piece with Keegan here already and I’m also not seeing the fit at all. Is he an upgrade over Barnes? Probably but the difference isn’t vast by any means and depending on his price tag, we have to be able and willing to walk away. He has strengths, but they don’t really fill enough of our weaknesses.
Kuzma doesn’t move the needle for us nearly enough, but I get the feeling that’s not who Monte is after at all. I think the media folks are hopping on this train because it’s old news and we have no leaks, so they use what they do know. I would say we are far more likely to resign Barnes than sign Kuzma. I also wouldn’t be surprised if Monte swings for the fences with a big trade to get us that extra piece we were missing.
If I had to make a comparison of some kind, it sort of feels like we are in a position similar to a cat when it’s ready to pounce. Only question that remains is what or who are we attacking?
Kuzma doesn’t move the needle for us nearly enough, but I get the feeling that’s not who Monte is after at all. I think the media folks are hopping on this train because it’s old news and we have no leaks, so they use what they do know. I would say we are far more likely to resign Barnes than sign Kuzma. I also wouldn’t be surprised if Monte swings for the fences with a big trade to get us that extra piece we were missing.
If I had to make a comparison of some kind, it sort of feels like we are in a position similar to a cat when it’s ready to pounce. Only question that remains is what or who are we attacking?