Welcome Davion Mitchell
- Thread starter Tetsujin
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FWIW this is from the Athletic summary:
Sounds like a pretty good fit to me. Davion as a secondary ball handler, elite defender, and serious three point threat to get those kick-outs from Fox seems pretty fantastic.
With respect to the roster, we functionally have three players now: Fox, Davion, and Haliburton. 23, 22, and 21 years old. All hard working no-nonsense guys. All with complementary skill sets, all good defenders, all good ball handlers. Fox on track to be scoring 25-30 ppg, now surrounded by two great 3-point shooters. The only real concern I can see is with all three being undersized, there could be some issues on defense against larger lineups, but with a properly filled out roster and a good coach I can't think of any reason why it's bad to see what these guys can do together, especially with how many years we have these 3 locked up for.
Sounds like a pretty good fit to me. Davion as a secondary ball handler, elite defender, and serious three point threat to get those kick-outs from Fox seems pretty fantastic.
With respect to the roster, we functionally have three players now: Fox, Davion, and Haliburton. 23, 22, and 21 years old. All hard working no-nonsense guys. All with complementary skill sets, all good defenders, all good ball handlers. Fox on track to be scoring 25-30 ppg, now surrounded by two great 3-point shooters. The only real concern I can see is with all three being undersized, there could be some issues on defense against larger lineups, but with a properly filled out roster and a good coach I can't think of any reason why it's bad to see what these guys can do together, especially with how many years we have these 3 locked up for.
That would be a tremendous gamble. What playoff team in the modern NBA even runs a 3-guard starting lineup? The Blazers? Anybody else? The league is shrinking at 4/5, not at 2/3. It seems like every other team has discovered the value of having multiple wing players that can swing between the 3 and the 4 and sometimes even the 5. Most Kings fans despised the Harrison Barnes acquisition in 2019. Now he's actually one of the Kings' best trade chips because he's a solid wing who can swing between the 3 and the 4 and can hit outside shots at an above-average rate. Three-guard lineups are cute, but I don't think the Kings are getting to the playoffs on the back of that kind of a gimmick.
If Davion doesn’t bust there’s a few outcomes:
1- one of him or Hali becomes a super sixth man long term, creating a successful 3 guard rotation
2- an experimental starting lineup with those 3 somehow succeeds (and here I think the “3 guards” thing is possible because all 3 are great defenders, altho obviously not guaranteed)
3- Hali and Mitchell both play so well that they demand starting spots but it doesn’t work out with them and Fox, resulting in one being traded while their value is peaking
Any three of which are good outcomes.
And this is what happens when you draft for BPA. Yes the fit isn’t obvious. Everyone agrees that we’re bad enough that we need to do best available, and we’ve all got PTSD from the Luka fiasco. So what’s with the heartburn now that we’re looking at the issues that inherently come with drafting the best player available?
1- one of him or Hali becomes a super sixth man long term, creating a successful 3 guard rotation
2- an experimental starting lineup with those 3 somehow succeeds (and here I think the “3 guards” thing is possible because all 3 are great defenders, altho obviously not guaranteed)
3- Hali and Mitchell both play so well that they demand starting spots but it doesn’t work out with them and Fox, resulting in one being traded while their value is peaking
Any three of which are good outcomes.
And this is what happens when you draft for BPA. Yes the fit isn’t obvious. Everyone agrees that we’re bad enough that we need to do best available, and we’ve all got PTSD from the Luka fiasco. So what’s with the heartburn now that we’re looking at the issues that inherently come with drafting the best player available?
Well, this is contingent upon believing that Mitchell was the best player available. I don't necessarily agree. As for your second point above, Fox and Haliburton are not "great defenders." Not yet, anyway. They're not even plus defenders. Mitchell is having to do far too much heavy lifting on that end of the court in any hypothetical three-guard lineup with Fox and Hali.
Sitting on the pick a bit more, I think it can work. Both Fox and Hali need a defensive guard next to them and if he shows he can defend both slots, there's plenty of room for 30+ minute role while getting some time in 3 guard lineups. If his shooting jump his senior year was actually real, guards that can defend both spots while being an elite spacer and offer creation are incredibly rare in the game. And valuable. But you have to trust that jump was real.
Basically it feels like McNair made his job significantly harder than it needed to be. This all of a sudden needs to be an incredibly busy off-season where Buddy Hield, Bagley and now probably Wright or Davis need to be shipped out. Resigning Holmes and signing a MLE wing is unacceptable. He committed his most valuable assets to 3 guards, so he has to have a plan to balance out the rest of the roster if he his plan is to move forward with those 3.
On the surface though, he took the Kings being the worst defensive team in NBA history to heart and directly addressed that need. Mitchell and Neemias both top notch defenders at their positions. Robert Woodard from last year I think can have real defensive upside. Let's see if he has the chops to where these selctions aren't wasted and balances out the roster.
Basically it feels like McNair made his job significantly harder than it needed to be. This all of a sudden needs to be an incredibly busy off-season where Buddy Hield, Bagley and now probably Wright or Davis need to be shipped out. Resigning Holmes and signing a MLE wing is unacceptable. He committed his most valuable assets to 3 guards, so he has to have a plan to balance out the rest of the roster if he his plan is to move forward with those 3.
On the surface though, he took the Kings being the worst defensive team in NBA history to heart and directly addressed that need. Mitchell and Neemias both top notch defenders at their positions. Robert Woodard from last year I think can have real defensive upside. Let's see if he has the chops to where these selctions aren't wasted and balances out the roster.
There's also something to be said if the Kings just say "**** it" and run small permanently. Mitchell takes the best player 1-3, regardless of the size difference and we run the ball down your throat on offense with 3 excellent ball-handlers/playmakers. That would be a very "Morey-disciple" type of move if the plan is to start all 3 from day 1.
I wonder if he lost leverage in holding on to Buddy? Can't seal the deal on a trade AND drafted his replacement. If we don't trade him before the season we are likely to run out the same starting lineup as last year with the exception of Bagley.
Speaking of Bagley, if we bring him off the bench and he is getting 15-20 minutes a game, how will he rebuild value? Do we bring back a guy who basically doesn't want to be here? Another full season with him on the roster only to let him go in restricted free agency.
Maybe we go
Fox Wright Mitchell
Hali Buddy
Barnes Buddy
Bags Metu
Holmes Queta
Speaking of Bagley, if we bring him off the bench and he is getting 15-20 minutes a game, how will he rebuild value? Do we bring back a guy who basically doesn't want to be here? Another full season with him on the roster only to let him go in restricted free agency.
Maybe we go
Fox Wright Mitchell
Hali Buddy
Barnes Buddy
Bags Metu
Holmes Queta
There will continue to be a market for Buddy with playoff teams needing 3 point shooting, and tbh we “won” those trade talks by not getting stuck with Kuzma, and not sending Buddy to the Lakers (who would’ve filled a much bigger need than just throwing Westbrook in the mix and praying it works out). Same with Barnes when Boston came sniffing around. With how young our core guys are it makes more sense to wait a year or two and find the right deal, since we have the luxury to do so.
Bagley I think can be written off at this point - maybe we get a late pick for him or something but if he ends up walking it’s not the end of the world. He’s got talent but with his injury history and attitude he doesn’t have much value. There’s no reason to put too much thought into how exactly his ignominious tenure comes to an end.
Bagley I think can be written off at this point - maybe we get a late pick for him or something but if he ends up walking it’s not the end of the world. He’s got talent but with his injury history and attitude he doesn’t have much value. There’s no reason to put too much thought into how exactly his ignominious tenure comes to an end.
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That said, I am excited to watch him D up and actually give a crap about that end of the floor. After 15 years of the Kings largely ignoring that end of basketball, I suspect he's going to going to be a fan favorite 1 game into the California Classic.
Everyone watch this video. Forget college, how many dudes in the NBA have tape like this vs someone who is going to be one of the elite superstars in the game?
Everyone watch this video. Forget college, how many dudes in the NBA have tape like this vs someone who is going to be one of the elite superstars in the game?
I don't think Davion is just a good one on one defender. I think he's an excellent help defender, he works his ass off to be a good transition defender and he's constantly making smart reads on and off-ball. And of course I think having a smothering on-ball defender to take the best offensive player is going to take a huge stress off Fox for him to focus on the creation offensively.
I still don't understand why you're bringing this up at all? No one expects Mitchell alone to magically fix the worst defense in NBA history. But replacing our bad defenders with good defenders should help no?
I still don't understand why you're bringing this up at all? No one expects Mitchell alone to magically fix the worst defense in NBA history. But replacing our bad defenders with good defenders should help no?
You said "On the surface though, he took the Kings being the worst defensive team in NBA history to heart and directly addressed that need."
My response was that the team as a whole needs a lot more than Mitchell and Queta to fix its defensive issues, and as long as Fox and co continue being terrible team defenders our poor defense will not have been "addressed".
My response was that the team as a whole needs a lot more than Mitchell and Queta to fix its defensive issues, and as long as Fox and co continue being terrible team defenders our poor defense will not have been "addressed".
Our defense sucks. He drafted two players who profile as good defenders. That's addressing the "defense sucking". Of course this team needs more help on defense. I never said it didn't, that's you trying to play "gotcha!"
You fix a bad defense by infusing it with good defenders and taking the bad defenders off the floor. Mitchell and Delon Wright taking all the CoJo-Buddy minutes from last year is a great place to start.
You fix a bad defense by infusing it with good defenders and taking the bad defenders off the floor. Mitchell and Delon Wright taking all the CoJo-Buddy minutes from last year is a great place to start.
Well firstly, I understood your use of "addressed" to mean that it was taken care of. Fine, difference in understanding, can't blame either of us. Like when you say you've addressed an issue, I take that to mean it's been dealt with rather than you've started to fix the problem.
Nonetheless, I wasn't even rebutting your point per se, but just responding to it or adding on. You're the one who got snarky and sarcastic.
For the record as well, we haven't replaced anybody at this point.
Nonetheless, I wasn't even rebutting your point per se, but just responding to it or adding on. You're the one who got snarky and sarcastic.
For the record as well, we haven't replaced anybody at this point.
My take on the heat on Mitchell's height disadvantage on defense is that this isn't the 90s anymore where everyone will immediately post up a small guy. The game has changed, there's very few players these days whose instinct is a post up play. The game has turned into many running around to get open from the perimeter and shoot a 3. And that's where the Kings are getting burned all day. Our players often get lost where the other teams are switching their players to.
That's why when Halli started snatching balls in the passing lanes Kings actually got some good wins last season. Hence, this is where I think McNair is banking on Mitchell. Add an extra hand to disrupt the passing lanes and the ballhandler and your opponent will drop their offensive efficiency.
Teams don't even give that many minutes to shot blocker these days. The efficient defense now is offense disruption and not just keeping the ball away from the rim.
I do hope Monte's banking on the right kid again.
That's why when Halli started snatching balls in the passing lanes Kings actually got some good wins last season. Hence, this is where I think McNair is banking on Mitchell. Add an extra hand to disrupt the passing lanes and the ballhandler and your opponent will drop their offensive efficiency.
Teams don't even give that many minutes to shot blocker these days. The efficient defense now is offense disruption and not just keeping the ball away from the rim.
I do hope Monte's banking on the right kid again.
It's not just about posting up though. Look at Giannis running through people, KD just shooting over people. The action doesn't need to be back to the basket in the paint for height to matter. Jrue is a fantastic defender but there's only so much he can do when good scorers are just able to shoot over him.
