Ben Simmons

J

Joshoua

All-Star
#1
#1
Hear me out this trade involves Fox who I do love.

So I expect Philadelphia to disappoint again in the playoffs which I didn’t see coming but they don’t look elite. There roster fit will come into question and there fans are already talking trading Ben a building around Embiid which they haven’t considering the roster construction. I wonder if we miss the playoffs if we’d be will to bet on Ben and trad Fox for him, full trade being Fox/Ariza/Dedmon.

I’d do the trade pretty easily considering there only 1 year apart so the age wouldn’t matter. I think Ben is just as good if not a better playmaker/passer than Fox. What Fox is better at would be scoring and shooting but Ben is an all nba defender and can guard 1-4 (hasn’t been selected to the team). I’d put Ben at the 4 position where he belongs although he’d play PG. We’d have elite shooting with Buddy/Bogi and a good shooter in Barnes this also makes Bogi the second playmaker and Buddy the scorer. Bagley would have to tell his dad to shut up while he comes off the bench cause I don’t belive he could play center and with Ben I’d want the shooting in the lineup that Buddy/Bogi/Barnes provide.

so we’d go into next year

Bogi/Joseph
Buddy
Barnes/Bejelica
Ben/Bagley
Holmes/
 
J

jellyfish

Bench
#2
#2
I would prefer a package this year where we send Bagely/Bogi + probably something else not Fox/Hield, while he might never be able to shoot the IQ and defense is excellent, I also think he should be in the 4 position. I would also do a Fox/filler for Ben swap as well. I was thinking of offering Philly Bogi/Bjelly for Richardso/Scott its a big upgrade shooting wise for the 76ers and we get a sweet asset in Jrich who is on a very friendly deal.
 
J

Joshoua

All-Star
#3
#3
jellyfish said:
I would prefer a package this year where we send Bagely/Bogi + probably something else not Fox/Hield, while he might never be able to shoot the IQ and defense is excellent, I also think he should be in the 4 position. I would also do a Fox/filler for Ben swap as well. I was thinking of offering Philly Bogi/Bjelly for Richardso/Scott its a big upgrade shooting wise for the 76ers and we get a sweet asset in Jrich who is on a very friendly deal.
Click to expand...
With Embiid and hoodies or even just Embiid they wouldn’t want Bagley and I think they’d trade Ben in the offseason so Bogi isn’t an option. They probably don’t do the Bogi trade as they have a lot of money tied up and they’d have to resign Bogi.
 
J

Joshoua

All-Star
#4
#4
And if they were dumb enough to trade Emiid to build around Bensay for health concerns and he becomes unhappy there. I would easily offer Fox/Bagley and a 1st
 
S

Sactown ExPat

Starter
#5
#5
All very interesting ideas. The Sixers are clear favorite to trade an elite prospect this offseason. I, too, think it will be Ben. Shooting aside, my big concern with Simmons is his involvement with Klutch. I just don’t trust Lebron to be an honest broker with our front office. Concur on making him a playmaking 4, a la Luka. I actually think Bagley and Ben would work though. Bags has great touch—the shooting will be there, enough, to stretch defenses. Those two could run a lethal pick and pop. But, would Lebron even allow Ben to be traded to the West while Lebron is still playing? Ben almost looks like he was built in a lab in order to guard Lebron.

Another crazy idea to consider, should he decline his mega extension, is Giannis. Anyway...all of this points to why I would not trade Bogi in-season—he’s a perfect complement to any superstar player, and who knows what superstars will be available in the trade market this summer? Worst case scenario is we do a S&T...or outright match and then trade him next season to get below the tax.

Edit to add: a quick internet perusal (unscientific, of course) of perceived value, and I don’t think it would take Fox to get Ben. Buddy and change (1st, etc.) could do it. We can argue the fit, and then we would probably have to trade Bags because I don’t think you can have three rookie max extensions on one team, but Ben’s perceived value is remarkably low.
 
Last edited:
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#6
#6
star players have been traded for less....Kings would not have to give up a Fox or Bagley in order to get this done. They have other assets they can package along with draft picks but you have to be careful in doing that because the Kings can't afford to lose draft picks if the player isn't re-signing.
 
Kings_of_California

Kings_of_California

Starter
#9
#9
What the hell happened to Simmons? He suddenly doesn't look that good anymore. His numbers are down across the board. I've even seen some Sixers fans souring on him over on their board.
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

Hall of Famer
#13
#13
Kings_of_California said:
What the hell happened to Simmons? He suddenly doesn't look that good anymore. His numbers are down across the board. I've even seen some Sixers fans souring on him over on their board.
Click to expand...
I think the longer a guy is around without expanding his game they become easier to scout. It’s like Tyreke Evans regressing just about every season after his rookie season.
 
J

jellyfish

Bench
#15
#15
I wonder if Ben/Fox could play together in a Dave Joeger type uptempo speed, while Ben might never get better offensively, defensively he's a beast and he will always have high IQ (which separates him from Tyreke). Will be interesting to see what Philly does because we got plenty of shooting they need.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#16
#16
Kings_of_California said:
What the hell happened to Simmons? He suddenly doesn't look that good anymore. His numbers are down across the board. I've even seen some Sixers fans souring on him over on their board.
Click to expand...
People are dumb and dont accept Simmons for what he is: An incredibly versatile/effective defensive player that makes tremendous impact with his playmaking, rebounding and transition from the guard slot and is a top 15 player in the league. The Sixers tried really freaking hard to put a core around him that compliments absolutely nothing he does well; a slow grind-it out team that can't shoot. Of course his count stats are down, Tobias Harris, Jrich,Horford,Embiid is a really high USG core around him that all need USG and playmaking possessions to be effective.

I think the fit with us is sneaky good; we have a bunch of pieces that would be ready to help them win now in their title window: Buddy/Bogi/Bjelica, etc, a young exciting prospect in Bagley and all our pick protections back finally. Buddy would be incredible on that team with a bunch of long rangy defenders and would have the space to just launch 10+ times a game while being able to be hidden on defense.

I think they listen to 3 of 4 of Buddy/Bagley/Bjelica/1st for Simmons and spare change. Maybe just send them all 4 pieces and build their bench for them. They become:
Jrich
Buddy
Tobias || Thybulle
Horford || Bjelica
Embiid || Bagley


But for us, it creates a really exciting starting 5:

Fox-Bogi-Simmons-Barnes-Holmes. 5 guys who excel in transition, 2 quality playmakers with a secondary ball-handler, good spacing with Barnes and Bogi, an excellent PnR partner for Simmons in Holmes. 2 elite defenders (Holmes/Simmons) with 1 potentially on the way in Fox. Good age on the core: Simmons (23), Fox (22), Homes (26), Barnes (27), Bogi (27).
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#17
#17
jellyfish said:
I wonder if Ben/Fox could play together in a Dave Joeger type uptempo speed, while Ben might never get better offensively, defensively he's a beast and he will always have high IQ (which separates him from Tyreke). Will be interesting to see what Philly does because we got plenty of shooting they need.
Click to expand...
Don't understand this narrative; he's already damn good offensively. Efficiency has been good the last 2 years (58%) TS, he's one of the best playmakers in the NBA (35.8% AST rate for his career), he's elite at getting to the line (.446 and .429 the past 2 seasons). Impact metrics show him extremely favorable on offense too. No, he can't shoot, the FT% is bad and he probably turns it over too much. But shooting is absolutely the easiest thing to find in the NBA and the Sixers decided to spend $600 million on guys who don't do that.
 
DesertFox

DesertFox

Starter
#18
#18
The model for Simmons' success is Giannis. Simmons and Fox would require 3 lights out shooters on the floor, so moving Buddy and Belly would make it a hard start.
They would ask for Fox/Bagley plus more, and we would hope they can settle for a Bagley/Bogi picks combo. I can't see it happening.
 
S

Sactown ExPat

Starter
#19
#19
DesertFox said:
The model for Simmons' success is Giannis. Simmons and Fox would require 3 lights out shooters on the floor, so moving Buddy and Belly would make it a hard start.
They would ask for Fox/Bagley plus more, and we would hope they can settle for a Bagley/Bogi picks combo. I can't see it happening.
Click to expand...
I don’t think Benny holds that type of value anymore. Keep in mind, the quants won’t touch him because of his 3-pt shooting.
 
S

Sactown ExPat

Starter
#20
#20
The_Jamal said:
People are dumb and dont accept Simmons for what he is: An incredibly versatile/effective defensive player that makes tremendous impact with his playmaking, rebounding and transition from the guard slot and is a top 15 player in the league. The Sixers tried really freaking hard to put a core around him that compliments absolutely nothing he does well; a slow grind-it out team that can't shoot. Of course his count stats are down, Tobias Harris, Jrich,Horford,Embiid is a really high USG core around him that all need USG and playmaking possessions to be effective.

I think the fit with us is sneaky good; we have a bunch of pieces that would be ready to help them win now in their title window: Buddy/Bogi/Bjelica, etc, a young exciting prospect in Bagley and all our pick protections back finally. Buddy would be incredible on that team with a bunch of long rangy defenders and would have the space to just launch 10+ times a game while being able to be hidden on defense.

I think they listen to 3 of 4 of Buddy/Bagley/Bjelica/1st for Simmons and spare change. Maybe just send them all 4 pieces and build their bench for them. They become:
Jrich
Buddy
Tobias || Thybulle
Horford || Bjelica
Embiid || Bagley


But for us, it creates a really exciting starting 5:

Fox-Bogi-Simmons-Barnes-Holmes. 5 guys who excel in transition, 2 quality playmakers with a secondary ball-handler, good spacing with Barnes and Bogi, an excellent PnR partner for Simmons in Holmes. 2 elite defenders (Holmes/Simmons) with 1 potentially on the way in Fox. Good age on the core: Simmons (23), Fox (22), Homes (26), Barnes (27), Bogi (27).
Click to expand...
I really like this—I think it right sizes both clubs. Moreover, we may be able to do just Buddy/filler/1st for Benny because his league value seems to have dropped precipitously. I think they’d probably take that 1st and try to get off of Tobias’ money, as well, but I could be wrong.
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#23
#23
Sactown ExPat said:
I really like this—I think it right sizes both clubs. Moreover, we may be able to do just Buddy/filler/1st for Benny because his league value seems to have dropped precipitously. I think they’d probably take that 1st and try to get off of Tobias’ money, as well, but I could be wrong.
Click to expand...
eh wouldn't go this far, but I dont think he'd require Fox. A 1st +3 of their choice of Buddy/Bogi/Bagley/Bjelica. Thinking about it a little more, they'd probably want Bogi as a 6th man playmaker, something they desperately need. Buddy/Bogi/Bjelica fixes a ton of their current problems and drastically improves their depth.
 
J

jellyfish

Bench
#24
#24
The_Jamal said:
Don't understand this narrative; he's already damn good offensively. Efficiency has been good the last 2 years (58%) TS, he's one of the best playmakers in the NBA (35.8% AST rate for his career), he's elite at getting to the line (.446 and .429 the past 2 seasons). Impact metrics show him extremely favorable on offense too. No, he can't shoot, the FT% is bad and he probably turns it over too much. But shooting is absolutely the easiest thing to find in the NBA and the Sixers decided to spend $600 million on guys who don't do that.
Click to expand...
I never said he was bad on offense I said it didn't matter if he ever gets better cause he brings enough plus all the other little stuff.
 
J

Joshoua

All-Star
#25
#25
The_Jamal said:
eh wouldn't go this far, but I dont think he'd require Fox. A 1st +3 of their choice of Buddy/Bogi/Bagley/Bjelica. Thinking about it a little more, they'd probably want Bogi as a 6th man playmaker, something they desperately need. Buddy/Bogi/Bjelica fixes a ton of their current problems and drastically improves their depth.
Click to expand...
Two of Fox/Bagley/Buddy will be traded along with bjlecia and a couple of first if we trade for Ben. I guarantee that would be Philadelphia’s starting point for a trade
 
T

The_Jamal

Hall of Famer
#26
#26
Joshoua said:
Two of Fox/Bagley/Buddy will be traded along with bjlecia and a couple of first if we trade for Ben. I guarantee that would be Philadelphia’s starting point for a trade
Click to expand...
If that's there starting point, then we walk away. Ben Simmons is awesome, but that's a package you send away for a Giannis/Harden tier player, not the guy below that. What would be the point? We'd be Ben Simmons without any future picks or talent that could grow with him.
 
S

Sactown ExPat

Starter
#27
#27
Joshoua said:
Two of Fox/Bagley/Buddy will be traded along with bjlecia and a couple of first if we trade for Ben. I guarantee that would be Philadelphia’s starting point for a trade
Click to expand...
No, that’s Embiid’s pricetag. Benny would be significantly less. Again, none of the quants will touch him. Only GMs that are former scouts or agents would consider him.
 
J

Joshoua

All-Star
#28
#28
Sactown ExPat said:
No, that’s Embiid’s pricetag. Benny would be significantly less. Again, none of the quants will touch him. Only GMs that are former scouts or agents would consider him.
Click to expand...
The_Jamal said:
If that's there starting point, then we walk away. Ben Simmons is awesome, but that's a package you send away for a Giannis/Harden tier player, not the guy below that. What would be the point? We'd be Ben Simmons without any future picks or talent that could grow with him.
Click to expand...
Ben in the right situation is a top 15 player at the age of 23 and is locked up for 4 more years his package will start there and nothing less. He’s also now an elite defender.
Look at what teams will be offering I believe and Philadelphia will put teams against each other to get the best package:

Portland: CJ/Collins/Simons
Denver: Murray/Harris/picks
GSW: DLo/top 5 pick
Chicago: LaVine/Markkenan
 
You must log in or register to reply here.