The Marvin Bagley thread

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rainmaker

rainmaker

Hall of Famer
#211
#211
sergmatt said:
Grant and Doug were in full propaganda mode today on the radio. Just blatant sellout shilling for the organization with some ridiculous claims and Grant yelling at callers that questioned Vlade or Bagley.

I expect that from a two faced snake like Grant but even Doug has gone into shill mode now, just not as obnoxious about it as Grant.
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Who knows how Marvin will turn out but I remember Grant shouting down callers who questioned the picks of Hawes, JT, Jimmer, Papa G, Donte Greene, WCS, TRob and McLemore. All these guys needed was time, then they'd reach their promise. Now only two are even in the league. Although in Grant's defense, Jimmer was dropping 50+ on Starbury in China.

Funny enough the two players he loved going in on were Boogie and Keven Martin, two of the better Kings over the last 13 seasons.
 
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sergmatt

Bench
#212
#212
rainmaker said:
Who knows how Marvin will turn out but I remember Grant shouting down callers who questioned the picks of Hawes, JT, Jimmer, Papa G, Donte Greene, WCS, TRob and McLemore. All these guys needed was time, then they'd reach their promise. Now only two are even in the league. Although in Grant's defense, Jimmer was dropping 50+ on Starbury in China.

Funny enough the two players he loved going in on were Boogie and Keven Martin, two of the better Kings over the last 13 seasons.
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Thomas Robinson was a great example of how two-faced Grant is. I remember around December and January after a very underwhelming start, callers on Grant's show questioning TROB as the draft choice and how poorly he was playing. Grant did his usual shtick of scream at the caller, call them idiots, defend the front office, and say you've gotta give the rookie 2-3 years before you make a judgement (which may be fair if he himself would actually stick to that).

Fast forward to late February and Thomas Robinson gets traded. Grant couldn't drive the bus over him fast enough. Then Grant was spewing that TROB was a bust and that he can't play. What a good trade it was picking up a veteran Patrick Patterson for him. How smart the front office is (as if they weren't the same ones who drafted Robinson to begin with).

It's despicable behavior. He doesn't allow any of his callers to make negative proclamations on players in advance (gotta protect the organization no matter what) but as soon as that player is gone.......here comes the steam-roller. Should Bagley get traded in the next couple of years the same thing will happen.
 
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sergmatt

Bench
#219
#219
Luka quote "playing against grown ass men since he was 16" is not relevant to whether he should have been drafted higher than Bagley.

Is he not averaging 30/10/9 in the NBA? That's really hard to do, few have ever done it, and it's incredibly unlikely that Marvin Bagley will ever sniff those numbers. Luka is also leading his team to wins in the NBA. Luka may be doing that earlier than the typical 20 year old but the fact he's doing it at all is more of testament to his talent and not where he was playing a few years ago. If it was easy to do somebody else would be doing it.
 
VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#220
#220
sergmatt said:
Luka quote "playing against grown ass men since he was 16" is not relevant to whether he should have been drafted higher than Bagley.

Is he not averaging 30/10/9 in the NBA? That's really hard to do, few have ever done it, and it's incredibly unlikely that Marvin Bagley will ever sniff those numbers. Luka is also leading his team to wins in the NBA. Luka may be doing that earlier than the typical 20 year old but the fact he's doing it at all is more of testament to his talent and not where he was playing a few years ago. If it was easy to do somebody else would be doing it.
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You guys really cannot be that myopic, can you? Pete is giving Luka credit for having a lot more experience playing the freaking game. He's saying Marvin hasn't had anywhere near that experience and to give him time. You cannot even let that go without denial?

This is just silly.
 
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sergmatt

Bench
#221
#221
VF21 said:
You guys really cannot be that myopic, can you? Pete is giving Luka credit for having a lot more experience playing the freaking game. He's saying Marvin hasn't had anywhere near that experience and to give him time. You cannot even let that go without denial?

This is just silly.
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Why'd you bring up his name then if you don't like the responses? And if you had actually read my response you'd see that I wrote Marvin will never sniff those numbers that [REDACTED] is currently averaging. [REDACTED] is currently averaging better numbers than 99% of the league too. It's not just because of all his experience but mostly just because he's incredibly good.
 
VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#222
#222
sergmatt said:
Why'd you bring up his name then if you don't like the responses? And if you had actually read my response you'd see that I wrote Marvin will never sniff those numbers that [REDACTED] is currently averaging. [REDACTED] is currently averaging better numbers than 99% of the league too. It's not just because of all his experience but mostly just because he's incredibly good.
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Whatever. You see what you need to see to keep your rage going. I'm pointing out something a very well respected individual has said in comparing Luka to Bagley. I read your response; I just found no need to further validate it.
 
The Effort Police

The Effort Police

Starter
#224
#224
sergmatt said:
Luka quote "playing against grown ass men since he was 16" is not relevant to whether he should have been drafted higher than Bagley.

Is he not averaging 30/10/9 in the NBA? That's really hard to do, few have ever done it, and it's incredibly unlikely that Marvin Bagley will ever sniff those numbers. Luka is also leading his team to wins in the NBA. Luka may be doing that earlier than the typical 20 year old but the fact he's doing it at all is more of testament to his talent and not where he was playing a few years ago. If it was easy to do somebody else would be doing it.
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Sure, it's relevant.

It's a point in Luka's favor.

Worse is better and better is worse. How does that possibly happen?

Oh wait, it's Vlade. That's how.
 
gunks

gunks

Hall of Famer
#226
#226
Albatros said:
Well it's good news about the foot. I was sure he'd broken something.
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Good news, but the frequency of these injuries is concerning.

I'm glad it's just a few games. Despite his iffy play thus far, I'm still trying to stay optimistic about Bagley's growth and eventual impact.
 
Kings_of_California

Kings_of_California

Starter
#227
#227
Happy that his foot injury isn't serious, but like Gunks said, the frequency of injuries is concerning. Hopefully he's not as fragile as he currently appears.

That said, since the team is looking really bad this year, I want to see Marvin play significant minutes at the expense of vet players.

For instance, I like Bjelica but I know who he is. I want (and the franchise needs) to see Marvin gobble up some more minutes from him and maybe another vet like Ariza.

We're not going anywhere with this current iteration of the team so we need to see what we have in the youngsters. Give Fox and Bagley big time minutes. Bagley either learns to swim or he sinks. We shouldn't be playing the vets more than necessary. This team isn't contending.
 
Albatros

Albatros

Starter
#228
#228
Well if they've given up on playoffs then yes Bagley should be playing heavy minutes.

Not exactly a good idea to have belly riding the bench becoming another disgruntled want away role player though.
 
E

ESP47

All-Star
#231
#231
I just hope Bagley can get out there quickly and stay healthy. Even if you thought he was a wasted pick, you still want to see him out there and you still want to see him improve and become a winning basketball player.
 
ockingsfan

ockingsfan

Starter
#232
#232
VF21 said:
https://twitter.com/statuses/1211098170018521088
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Basically, what irks a lot of Kings fans, is that Vlade passed on a sure-fire, high All-Star caliber wing player from Day 1, for the "potential" and "upside" big man in Bagley.

This is especially irksome in this day and age of wings and guards dominating the NBA, Vlade chose a big man at #2.

Here is the thing about Bagley. Sure he has a ton of potential, and I'm really rooting for him to reach that potential. But, that is going to take a minimum of 3 to 4 years to achieve, especially with all his injuries.

I'm still hoping that Bagley turns into an All-star big, but the NBA is a Guard and Wing player league now and had been for a few years before the Bagley draft. Basically, Vlade missed out on one of the best wing players to come along in a decade, for "Potential".
 
King Baller

King Baller

All-Star
#233
#233
Luka looks great there is no doubt. Cuban, Nelson and Carlisle went all in on Luka when they used two 1st round picks on him. Also traded away DSJ to acquire KP and took on TH Jr’s contract.

my point is would Luka have developed the same way with the Kings and Joerger having him “earn” his minutes?

Bagley needs time as does Fox. How much time and how high is their ceiling we won’t know until it happens.
 
VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#234
#234
ockingsfan said:
Basically, what irks a lot of Kings fans, is that Vlade passed on a sure-fire, high All-Star caliber wing player from Day 1, for the "potential" and "upside" big man in Bagley.

This is especially irksome in this day and age of wings and guards dominating the NBA, Vlade chose a big man at #2.

Here is the thing about Bagley. Sure he has a ton of potential, and I'm really rooting for him to reach that potential. But, that is going to take a minimum of 3 to 4 years to achieve, especially with all his injuries.

I'm still hoping that Bagley turns into an All-star big, but the NBA is a Guard and Wing player league now and had been for a few years before the Bagley draft. Basically, Vlade missed out on one of the best wing players to come along in a decade, for "Potential".
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Yeah, I get it. I've been hearing it for months to the point where I'm actually developing a dislike for Luka, which isn't fair to him. I wanted us to draft Luka but we didn't. Period. No matter how long it takes for some fans to accept, that's not gonna change. To belabor the point in multiple threads is just redundant. We have a Luka thread. We have a bash Vlade thread. It's NOT Bagley's fault that Vlade chose him.
 
ockingsfan

ockingsfan

Starter
#235
#235
VF21 said:
Yeah, I get it. I've been hearing it for months to the point where I'm actually developing a dislike for Luka, which isn't fair to him. I wanted us to draft Luka but we didn't. Period. No matter how long it takes for some fans to accept, that's not gonna change. To belabor the point in multiple threads is just redundant. We have a Luka thread. We have a bash Vlade thread. It's NOT Bagley's fault that Vlade chose him.
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Sorry, but I was just responding to the Grant-Pete Youngman twitter post that brought up Luka on this thread. You can move this over to the Vlade Bash thread if you like. ;)

However Bagley develops, he will probably always be saddled with being picked ahead of Luka. That's not going to go away, unfortunately for both Bagley and Ayton.

My hope would be that Bagley develops into a Paskal Siakam level of bigman, sooner rather than later. I just wish he could stay healthy enough to stay on the court for more than 3 games in a row.
 
SLAB

SLAB

Hall of Famer
#238
#238
sactowndog said:
Porter looked pretty good tonight. At this point it’s arguable that he is better than Bagley also.
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Eh before the injuries he was right up there with Ayton and Luka so the potential was always there. Can’t risk a #2 pick with those injuries though, so who cares. Denver may have a straight up steal though.
 
Kings_of_California

Kings_of_California

Starter
#239
#239
sactowndog said:
Porter looked pretty good tonight. At this point it’s arguable that he is better than Bagley also.
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Dude... Look, I know everyone is down on Bagley right now, but there's no way I'm going to sit here and say that Porter Jr. is arguably already better than Bagley. He's not even played half a season of NBA basketball yet, and today was his first big game.

Could Porter Jr. be better than Bags? Yea, for sure. He was a top prospect who's stock fell due to injury. But right now I'm not ready to go that far.
 
Section 101

Section 101

All-Star
#240
#240
Kings_of_California said:
Dude... Look, I know everyone is down on Bagley right now, but there's no way I'm going to sit here and say that Porter Jr. is arguably already better than Bagley. He's not even played half a season of NBA basketball yet, and today was his first big game.

Could Porter Jr. be better than Bags? Yea, for sure. He was a top prospect who's stock fell due to injury. But right now I'm not ready to go that far.
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And Bagley is a second year player who's value is dropping because of injury. Which one played tonight?
 
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