You don't know that, that's an arm chair observstion. If Porter is regarded as the biggest talent in the draft and if he's crushing in his workouts then he may very well be #2 on a lot of teams boards. I get people wanting nothing to do with him. First off he's coming off a major injury and looked pretty bad in the two games he played. Secondly he's a score first guy... Those guys are never fan favorites. It's all about efficiency though with a scorer... Could be Rudy Gay, could be Paul George, or could be KD. No one liked Tatum last year because he was a scorer and now he'd be in everyone's top two.
Mock Draft Kings #2 lists
- Thread starter PurpleHaze
- Start date
Grant was saying that he really believes that the Kings are high on Porter. I don't think he's pulling that out of thin air.
Again, if you want to pump up the value of the #2 pick you leak that you love all the top guys so teams feel they'd have to trade with the Kings to make sure they get their guy.
Instead all we've heard rumored is that the Kings are likely to pass on Doncic and that they really like Porter Jr. I sure hope those are both smokescreens but I'm starting to fear that they aren't.
Again, if you want to pump up the value of the #2 pick you leak that you love all the top guys so teams feel they'd have to trade with the Kings to make sure they get their guy.
Instead all we've heard rumored is that the Kings are likely to pass on Doncic and that they really like Porter Jr. I sure hope those are both smokescreens but I'm starting to fear that they aren't.
IF....some team wants to trade up for pick 2, it would have to be well worth moving down......and I'm not talking moving down to 7 or anything like that but more like 4 at the latest. That still can get you Ayton, Doncic, Bagley or Porter........or if they fancy JJJ or Bamba. But sticking with the top 4 listed, that is a no lose situation. I can't find anyone nationally or anywhere that has Porter at 2. No one. Too much risk or unknown when there are those other 3 on the board.
Time will tell, I've seen so many drafts in all the major sports where there are surprise picks up high. Then after the draft it starts getting out that a lot of teams had the "surprise" player ranked high... Meaning it was only a surprise to fans and media. I won't be surprised if Porter goes 7, also won't be shipped if he goes #2.
Yes, it's all about getting the right guy - we (as fans, at least) just don't exactly know who the right guy is. And we certainly haven't come to a lot of consensus, either!
Bottom line is that strategically, it's in our best interests to be outspokenly in love with about six players in this draft - Ayton, Bagley, Bamba, Doncic, Jackson, Porter. All the guys who could plausibly go at #2 - we gotta love them all. That gives us the most flexibility and the most power in terms of trade leverage. In the end, most likely we figure out who our guy is at #2 and just take him. But maybe we can make some advantageous moves, like say baiting Atlanta out of #3 and #19 only to get our guy at #3 anyway.
I'm just saying, I'm really very zen about where we're sitting and how we're playing it in the media. We got this.
Bottom line is that strategically, it's in our best interests to be outspokenly in love with about six players in this draft - Ayton, Bagley, Bamba, Doncic, Jackson, Porter. All the guys who could plausibly go at #2 - we gotta love them all. That gives us the most flexibility and the most power in terms of trade leverage. In the end, most likely we figure out who our guy is at #2 and just take him. But maybe we can make some advantageous moves, like say baiting Atlanta out of #3 and #19 only to get our guy at #3 anyway.
I'm just saying, I'm really very zen about where we're sitting and how we're playing it in the media. We got this.
Rudy Gobert
Funny that that draft is looked at as one of the worst, but in retrospect hasn't been that bad.
Giannis, Gobert, McCollum, and Oladipo are stars in this league.
Otto Porter, KCP, Steven Adams, Kelly Olynyk, Dennis Schroder, Tony Snell, Tim Hardaway Jr, Andre Roberson, and Allen Crabbe have all carved out good roles for themselves.
There was a lot of talent to be had, just a lot of busts in the lottery.
Funny that that draft is looked at as one of the worst, but in retrospect hasn't been that bad.
Giannis, Gobert, McCollum, and Oladipo are stars in this league.
Otto Porter, KCP, Steven Adams, Kelly Olynyk, Dennis Schroder, Tony Snell, Tim Hardaway Jr, Andre Roberson, and Allen Crabbe have all carved out good roles for themselves.
There was a lot of talent to be had, just a lot of busts in the lottery.
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Gobert & McCollum are not stars but they are quality players. Oladipo is on his way to becoming a star. Giannis is the lone star from the draft for the time being unless Oladipo continues to up his game.
With that said, what is the average time people give a draft prospects to pan out? is it 3-4 years? more? Usually you get a good feel for a draft after 3 seasons but that isn't always the case since some players will blossom later in their career and/or with a new team than the one that drafted them.
With that said, what is the average time people give a draft prospects to pan out? is it 3-4 years? more? Usually you get a good feel for a draft after 3 seasons but that isn't always the case since some players will blossom later in their career and/or with a new team than the one that drafted them.
I see people keep saying this but this approach makes a lot of assumptions.
1. Michael Porter Jr does not impress in the workouts
2. Other team wants to move up.
I have hear trade back a spot to Atlanta and get pick 19 from them. Why would the Hawks do that? They all of a sudden know that Kings are targetting someone else so their guy will be there at 3 so why trade up and give another asset when you are right at the start of a rebuild?
Memphis - Why would they do it and what exactly would they have to offer us? So they might want Doncic and think that Atlanta might want him and they want to move up. What do they give up?! Pick 4 and what else? They don't have a 1st round pick next year (going to Boston).
Dallas - Not sure why they would move up when they would be looking for some big men help? They might love Bagley but could consider Jackson Jr. and Bamba as good fits for them? Even if they are after a SF, is the cost of trading up for Doncic really worth the difference between Doncic and Porter Jr in 3 years time?
Orlando - Again, they love length and athleticism. They have Gordon who they are likely to keep. A long Michael Porter Jr fits well at SF. They have a need at PG and C and unless Ayton is there at 2 (in which case we make the pick) they would be comfortable in picking at 6th especially when you consider the cost of moving up from 6 to 2.
Chicago - They have been keen on Porter Jr for a while but would also be interested in a big man. One or the other will be there. Is it really worth the cost of moving up?
My view might be clouded by my opinion that to me Ayton is a clear #1 and then you can take a pick for #2 out of 3-4 players (in no particular order Doncic, Bagley, Porter Jr and Jackcon Jr.)
1. Michael Porter Jr does not impress in the workouts
2. Other team wants to move up.
I have hear trade back a spot to Atlanta and get pick 19 from them. Why would the Hawks do that? They all of a sudden know that Kings are targetting someone else so their guy will be there at 3 so why trade up and give another asset when you are right at the start of a rebuild?
Memphis - Why would they do it and what exactly would they have to offer us? So they might want Doncic and think that Atlanta might want him and they want to move up. What do they give up?! Pick 4 and what else? They don't have a 1st round pick next year (going to Boston).
Dallas - Not sure why they would move up when they would be looking for some big men help? They might love Bagley but could consider Jackson Jr. and Bamba as good fits for them? Even if they are after a SF, is the cost of trading up for Doncic really worth the difference between Doncic and Porter Jr in 3 years time?
Orlando - Again, they love length and athleticism. They have Gordon who they are likely to keep. A long Michael Porter Jr fits well at SF. They have a need at PG and C and unless Ayton is there at 2 (in which case we make the pick) they would be comfortable in picking at 6th especially when you consider the cost of moving up from 6 to 2.
Chicago - They have been keen on Porter Jr for a while but would also be interested in a big man. One or the other will be there. Is it really worth the cost of moving up?
My view might be clouded by my opinion that to me Ayton is a clear #1 and then you can take a pick for #2 out of 3-4 players (in no particular order Doncic, Bagley, Porter Jr and Jackcon Jr.)
It is widely considered that Peaches is a mouth piece for the team so I would be taking what he says here seriously. He is not the only one that has reported this. Jonathan Givony and James Ham have also reported that Kings really like Porter Jr.
The kid has some serious talent and fits the position of need for us. Good scorer, good rebounder, size, athleticims and fits the position of need.
The kid has some serious talent and fits the position of need for us. Good scorer, good rebounder, size, athleticims and fits the position of need.
I've completely moved away from Porter at this point. I've seen nothing personally to warrant calling him a top 10 pick. This is sortof like the Cauley-Stein situation for me. No matter how much other people hype him up, unless I see something myself that convinces me he's a star in the NBA he's not going on my wishlist. If he ends up being the Kings pick he'll immediately go right up there with Spencer Hawes, Quincy Douby, and Jimmer Fredette as picks that made me want to throw up. And if Grant Napear is drooling over this kid now that's even more reason to hate the pick. Anything that comes out of Grant Napear's mouth is the absolute antithesis of intelligent basketball conversation. Bagley is sliding down my draft board too. I don't see anything he can do that Ayton, Jackson, and Bamba can't do better
And actually, the more I look at the board the guy who is being way way overlooked in my mind is Miles Bridges. I kept pushing him further down the list myself because Jaren Jackson had some phenomenal defensive games this year, Bagley put up huge stats as a Freshman, Mikal Bridges shot the ball like Buddy Hield, Mo Bamba looks like he could be a bigtime 3 and D center, and so on but then I come back to the Miles Bridges tape and oh my god is that kid an athlete! He's got some Bonzi Wells to his game and some Caron Butler and some Paul Pierce but with a crazy fast first step and the hops to just elevate over everyone and dunk it and the strength to take contact and still muscle the ball into the basket. If anyone is this year's Donovan Mitchell I think it might be him. Would I pick him at #2? Not over Doncic and Ayton, no. But I could talk myself into picking him at #3.
As of today my list now looks like this: (1) Doncic (2) Ayton (3) Miles Bridges (4) Jackson (5) Bamba (6) Mikal Bridges (7+) Don't care...
And actually, the more I look at the board the guy who is being way way overlooked in my mind is Miles Bridges. I kept pushing him further down the list myself because Jaren Jackson had some phenomenal defensive games this year, Bagley put up huge stats as a Freshman, Mikal Bridges shot the ball like Buddy Hield, Mo Bamba looks like he could be a bigtime 3 and D center, and so on but then I come back to the Miles Bridges tape and oh my god is that kid an athlete! He's got some Bonzi Wells to his game and some Caron Butler and some Paul Pierce but with a crazy fast first step and the hops to just elevate over everyone and dunk it and the strength to take contact and still muscle the ball into the basket. If anyone is this year's Donovan Mitchell I think it might be him. Would I pick him at #2? Not over Doncic and Ayton, no. But I could talk myself into picking him at #3.
As of today my list now looks like this: (1) Doncic (2) Ayton (3) Miles Bridges (4) Jackson (5) Bamba (6) Mikal Bridges (7+) Don't care...
Ham and Grant aren’t really basketball guys and don’t follow prospects at all. Nor is Sacramento a college basketball town. I doubt the casual radio listener knows enough about MPJ to have any opinion on him. If they wanted to drum up conversation they would talk about Bagley, Bamba, Carter, Doncic and JJJ. Not the injured guy who played essentially no college ball and is projected to go #8 or #9. They are both direct conduits of the front office. They are telling us MPJ is our guy at #2.
There is no reason for the team to telegraph their pick. So you have to ask yourself why are they doing it. To test fans reactions to the possibility? To entice teams to offer trades for the 2 spot? As a favor to MPJ's agent? I don't know. But I'm not so sure the he Kings are going to pick MPJ at 2.
Pretty bold post.
Why is Bagley sliding down your draft board? Of the group of big men, I think he has the best post instincts and offensive rebounding skills. He's also the best athlete. On the flip side, he's the worst defender by a large margin. I just worry about his fit in the NBA and whether or not he can lead your team to victory even if he puts up 20 and 10. We've seen that story before.
If the Kings can trade salary for a pick in the low teens, Miles is my man if he's still on the board but I couldn't justify taking him at 3. His lack of improvement from his freshman to sophomore years is concerning. He was basically the exact same player with no improvements other than free throw shooting. I just feel like he's a low ceiling pick at #3 but would have great value at #12 or so. I think he's going to fit into the modern NBA perfectly but most likely just as an average to solid starter.
Why is Bagley sliding down your draft board? Of the group of big men, I think he has the best post instincts and offensive rebounding skills. He's also the best athlete. On the flip side, he's the worst defender by a large margin. I just worry about his fit in the NBA and whether or not he can lead your team to victory even if he puts up 20 and 10. We've seen that story before.
If the Kings can trade salary for a pick in the low teens, Miles is my man if he's still on the board but I couldn't justify taking him at 3. His lack of improvement from his freshman to sophomore years is concerning. He was basically the exact same player with no improvements other than free throw shooting. I just feel like he's a low ceiling pick at #3 but would have great value at #12 or so. I think he's going to fit into the modern NBA perfectly but most likely just as an average to solid starter.
Regarding Bagley, I think you pretty much summed it up for me. I appreciate that his size, athleticism, and seemingly endless supply of energy make him a good bet to be a nightly 20/10 guy. But with the league moving away from interior scoring in general, I don't know how valuable that 20/10 is to a team if it doesn't come with some kind of defensive impact as well. I think he's a guy you want if you have a defensive stud at the 5 position already and you're having trouble putting points on the board or you have a standout playmaker who's going to be able to orchestrate beneficial switches and then find Bagley with the ball and a clear path to the basket a dozen times a game. Without that guy I worry that his best-case scenario is a player like Chris Bosh -- he might be an automatic coaches pick for the All-Star game every year on the strength of his counting stats but he's not leading you deep into the playoffs on his own. "Points-per-game" has taken a backseat now to "points-per-possession" which means he's going to have to start shooting a lot more threes to live up to his full potential as a team's leading scorer.
On to the Miles Birdges bit... fortunately we don't have to justify taking anyone at 3 this year but I feel like Miles Bridges has mostly been ignored in the top 5 player conversation and he's one of the few guys that just looks better and better to me as an NBA prospect the more I watch him. The talk about player ceilings more often than not tends to focus on athleticism and size and while Miles is really more of a combo forward at this point with SG/SF measurements, in terms of functional in-game athleticism I think he's more impressive than anybody else including Bagley, Ayton, Jackson, and Porter. The way he gets low to the ground when handling the ball, doesn't waste any movement on his drives (every single step is toward the basket), and just explodes off the ground is very very impressive.
In fact, if you were to mix up the names and put Michael Porter's name on all of Miles Bridges game tapes I would actually start to understand all the Michael Porter hype! Anyone who's on the Porter bandwagon really should do a one-to-one comparison between him and Bridges because I think Bridges comes out on top in every single category except ideal size. The main thing that bothers me with Porter (aside from the back surgery) is that he doesn't look like he can take contact at all. And I don't just mean that he's skinny. He's got an array of juke moves with the ball that he mostly uses to rise up and shoot jumpers. When he does decide to drive it into the lane he doesn't get low to the ground which is going to make it very difficult for him to explode into the basket when he's playing into a defender. More often than not he just shoots over people rather than trying to drive by them and I don't even like the jumper -- he's always using a hesitation dribble to set it up (sometimes on catch and shoots too) and he's got a two-stage shooting motion where he jumps then starts to extend his arms when he's almost at the peak of his jump.
In more ways than one he reminds me of Kevin Martin -- another guy with a skinny frame and a goofy hitch in his jumper who still managed to score the ball like it's what he was born to do. And that's where the whole "high ceiling" claim breaks down for me. You're just not a star in the NBA if you can't play into contact. You can be a second or third option, you can be a spot-up shooter and even a leading scorer on a mediocre team but all the athleticism in the world means nothing if you're reliant on the referees calling touch fouls to get you to the line. The more people talk about Porter having one of the highest ceilings in the draft the more I pore over the tape trying to see it and he just looks worse and worse to me while a guy like Miles Bridges who can play into contact and has already produced like a star at the college level keeps looking better. It seems likely Miles is going to be picked about 6-8 spots later than he should simply because he's a little short and doesn't have a 7' wingspan and that's absolutely insane to me in 2018. I feel like we should know better by now.
On to the Miles Birdges bit... fortunately we don't have to justify taking anyone at 3 this year but I feel like Miles Bridges has mostly been ignored in the top 5 player conversation and he's one of the few guys that just looks better and better to me as an NBA prospect the more I watch him. The talk about player ceilings more often than not tends to focus on athleticism and size and while Miles is really more of a combo forward at this point with SG/SF measurements, in terms of functional in-game athleticism I think he's more impressive than anybody else including Bagley, Ayton, Jackson, and Porter. The way he gets low to the ground when handling the ball, doesn't waste any movement on his drives (every single step is toward the basket), and just explodes off the ground is very very impressive.
In fact, if you were to mix up the names and put Michael Porter's name on all of Miles Bridges game tapes I would actually start to understand all the Michael Porter hype! Anyone who's on the Porter bandwagon really should do a one-to-one comparison between him and Bridges because I think Bridges comes out on top in every single category except ideal size. The main thing that bothers me with Porter (aside from the back surgery) is that he doesn't look like he can take contact at all. And I don't just mean that he's skinny. He's got an array of juke moves with the ball that he mostly uses to rise up and shoot jumpers. When he does decide to drive it into the lane he doesn't get low to the ground which is going to make it very difficult for him to explode into the basket when he's playing into a defender. More often than not he just shoots over people rather than trying to drive by them and I don't even like the jumper -- he's always using a hesitation dribble to set it up (sometimes on catch and shoots too) and he's got a two-stage shooting motion where he jumps then starts to extend his arms when he's almost at the peak of his jump.
In more ways than one he reminds me of Kevin Martin -- another guy with a skinny frame and a goofy hitch in his jumper who still managed to score the ball like it's what he was born to do. And that's where the whole "high ceiling" claim breaks down for me. You're just not a star in the NBA if you can't play into contact. You can be a second or third option, you can be a spot-up shooter and even a leading scorer on a mediocre team but all the athleticism in the world means nothing if you're reliant on the referees calling touch fouls to get you to the line. The more people talk about Porter having one of the highest ceilings in the draft the more I pore over the tape trying to see it and he just looks worse and worse to me while a guy like Miles Bridges who can play into contact and has already produced like a star at the college level keeps looking better. It seems likely Miles is going to be picked about 6-8 spots later than he should simply because he's a little short and doesn't have a 7' wingspan and that's absolutely insane to me in 2018. I feel like we should know better by now.
I think most of these discussions come down to one thing. We are a couple of players away from being a complete team. We only have one pick. Which piece do you go for first? How do you complete the puzzle? Do you get the pure scorer and find a defensive stud later to cover for him? Do you get the versatile playmaker and then try to find a scorer that he can actually playmaker for?
We don't have an identity as a team yet and who we pick will go a long way in determining what that we be. Picking Porter or Miles takes us in vastly different directions. Or more realistically Porter /Bagley vs Doncic. Who you want in large part has to do with your preferred style of play.
We don't have an identity as a team yet and who we pick will go a long way in determining what that we be. Picking Porter or Miles takes us in vastly different directions. Or more realistically Porter /Bagley vs Doncic. Who you want in large part has to do with your preferred style of play.
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One other observation. Most agree that the league is moving towards guard and wing play. All about the analytics of the 3pt shot.
Most agree that this is a very deep draft. However, the cream of the crop of this deep draft are big men. Most of whom we complain aren't knock down shooters. How can all these big men be so sought after in this 3pt era? Square that circle...
Most agree that this is a very deep draft. However, the cream of the crop of this deep draft are big men. Most of whom we complain aren't knock down shooters. How can all these big men be so sought after in this 3pt era? Square that circle...
I think it's some combination of (A) Old habits die hard and (B) All of them look like they're at least on the way to developing a 3pt shot.
It's a good question though, especially in the context of a season in which Anthony Davis and DeMarcus Cousins on the same team looked good but hardly dominant and the other splashy new pairing in the West of Chris Paul and James Harden had the best record in the league. And both of those big guys are already knockdown shooters at that. What's more, none of the top 4 teams (Golden State, Houston, Boston, Cleveland) featured a dominant big man but all of them had very good guards and wings -- or at least one ultra elite wing in the case of Cleveland and adequate guards. This is probably where all the Michael Porter at #2 speculation comes from and I could understand it if I bought into the idea that he's an elite wing in the making.
I don't think having an elite big guy is a detriment though so much as not having elite guards and wings has become untenable. I like our guards already. We need to upgrade our wings but I still take Ayton after Doncic if that's the way Phoenix chooses to go. I know it's against the grain but the talent is too good for me to pass on and I would hope that we can trade some of our excess bigs for a wing or develop a young player or two or try to get one in free agency by selling them on the idea that Fox/Hield/Bogdanovic/Giles/Ayton looks like a team that's one player away from being very good.
It's a good question though, especially in the context of a season in which Anthony Davis and DeMarcus Cousins on the same team looked good but hardly dominant and the other splashy new pairing in the West of Chris Paul and James Harden had the best record in the league. And both of those big guys are already knockdown shooters at that. What's more, none of the top 4 teams (Golden State, Houston, Boston, Cleveland) featured a dominant big man but all of them had very good guards and wings -- or at least one ultra elite wing in the case of Cleveland and adequate guards. This is probably where all the Michael Porter at #2 speculation comes from and I could understand it if I bought into the idea that he's an elite wing in the making.
I don't think having an elite big guy is a detriment though so much as not having elite guards and wings has become untenable. I like our guards already. We need to upgrade our wings but I still take Ayton after Doncic if that's the way Phoenix chooses to go. I know it's against the grain but the talent is too good for me to pass on and I would hope that we can trade some of our excess bigs for a wing or develop a young player or two or try to get one in free agency by selling them on the idea that Fox/Hield/Bogdanovic/Giles/Ayton looks like a team that's one player away from being very good.
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