[Game] Kings v. Suns - Tuesday, Dec. 12 - 7 PT

VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#1
#1
WCS should be back on the court for this game, which could be interesting depending on the lineup Joerger decides to put out there. I'll tell you one thing - I wouldn't take his job right now for all the money in the world. No matter what he does, somebody is gonna be upset. When you look at our roster, it's really a crap shoot on who to play next to whom and when they should be on the court.

If it was my choice to put a starting five out there, I'd be very tempted to put the usual suspects on the court and then yank them for the bench at the first opportunity since our bench has been our saving grace.

At some point, I would love to see Fox, Mason, Bogs, Hield and WCS out there - knowing full well that's a Don Nelson dream come true. No idea what would happen, but it might be fun to watch.

I remain convinced this is a LEARNING season. I'm also convinced, although I know a number do not agree, that giving Z-Bo minutes now will pay dividends because the rookies need to learn how to finish games, play without giving up, etc. and those are all tools in Randolph's shed. To me, it is much more important for the kids to learn strong fundamentals of that kind than it is to toss them to the wolves. You don't learn by being outmatched IMHO. You learn by crawling before you walk, and walking before you run.

If nothing else this current group of Kings gives arm chair coaches/GMs a lot to talk/argue about. So many different ideas on what the philosophy should be...

Bottom line, we have a team. It's not perfect but it's ours and I think just about everyone can find something from almost every game to be hopeful about that. That's not awful.

I LOVE THIS TEAM!!
 
kingsboi

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#2
#2
winnable game. Booker is out. Not much to worry about from the Suns side of things, which means that Warren will have a career game.
 
eMBarkat10n

eMBarkat10n

Bench
#3
#3
VF21 said:
WCS should be back on the court for this game, which could be interesting depending on the lineup Joerger decides to put out there. I'll tell you one thing - I wouldn't take his job right now for all the money in the world. No matter what he does, somebody is gonna be upset. When you look at our roster, it's really a crap shoot on who to play next to whom and when they should be on the court.

If it was my choice to put a starting five out there, I'd be very tempted to put the usual suspects on the court and then yank them for the bench at the first opportunity since our bench has been our saving grace.

At some point, I would love to see Fox, Mason, Bogs, Hield and WCS out there - knowing full well that's a Don Nelson dream come true. No idea what would happen, but it might be fun to watch.

I remain convinced this is a LEARNING season. I'm also convinced, although I know a number do not agree, that giving Z-Bo minutes now will pay dividends because the rookies need to learn how to finish games, play without giving up, etc. and those are all tools in Randolph's shed. To me, it is much more important for the kids to learn strong fundamentals of that kind than it is to toss them to the wolves. You don't learn by being outmatched IMHO. You learn by crawling before you walk, and walking before you run.

If nothing else this current group of Kings gives arm chair coaches/GMs a lot to talk/argue about. So many different ideas on what the philosophy should be...

Bottom line, we have a team. It's not perfect but it's ours and I think just about everyone can find something from almost every game to be hopeful about that. That's not awful.

I LOVE THIS TEAM!!
Click to expand...
Which is why I am not bashing my head at this, and the other "veteran", signings we pulled off during the offseason. This was always going to be a learning season. Especially since February 19, 2017. Once that day passed, I think most, if not, all Kings fans knew that this year was going to be rough. We were going to be super young. And that we were not going to win a whole lot.

I always love this team. I'll love them a helluva lot more, though, once they play past game number 82 of the regular season.

Be patient, Kings fans, because that part of the ride's about to get rolling shortly. And once it does, you won't have time to think about it. Cuz it's gonna be a THRILLER.
 
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VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#4
#4
eMBarkat10n said:
Which is why I am not bashing my head at this, and the other "veteran", signings we pulled off during the offseason. This was always going to be a learning season. Especially since February 19, 2017. Once that day passed, I think all true Kings fans knew that this year was going to be rough. We were going to be super young. And that we were not going to win a whole lot.

I always love this team. I'll love them a helluva lot more, though, once they play past game number 82 of the regular season.

Be patient, Kings fans, because that part of the ride's about to get rolling shortly. And once it does, you won't have time to think about it. Cuz it's gonna be a THRILLER.
Click to expand...
Okay, just a clarification here... trying to make some kind of distinction between Kings fans and "all true Kings fans" is unfair. I may pretty well disagree with every single take a poster makes, but that doesn't make him (or her) less or more of a fan. If people are posting here, they are - with the occasional exception that does not need to be named at this point - true fans. If they weren't they'd already be sporting Warriors gear. :)
 
eMBarkat10n

eMBarkat10n

Bench
#5
#5
VF21 said:
Okay, just a clarification here... trying to make some kind of distinction between Kings fans and "all true Kings fans" is unfair. I may pretty well disagree with every single take a poster makes, but that doesn't make him (or her) less or more of a fan. If people are posting here, they are - with the occasional exception that does not need to be named at this point - true fans. If they weren't they'd already be sporting Warriors gear. :)
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OK.....I get your point. I don't mean to disrespect any fan on this forum, as everyone on here are, as you said, "true" Kings fans I've gone back and edited my original post.
 
VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#6
#6
eMBarkat10n said:
OK.....I get your point. I don't mean to disrespect any fan on this forum, as everyone on here are, as you said, "true" Kings fans I've gone back and edited my original post.
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I used your post as a basis for clarification because there are a lot of you who weren't here back in the day when there was a really big "TRUE FAN" kerfuffle. Thanks for understanding ... and in case I haven't said already, Welcome to KingsFans. We may be dysfunctional at times, but we're FAMILY! :)
 
sactowndog

sactowndog

All-Star
#7
#7
VF21 said:
I used your post as a basis for clarification because there are a lot of you who weren't here back in the day when there was a really big "TRUE FAN" kerfuffle. Thanks for understanding ... and in case I haven't said already, Welcome to KingsFans. We may be dysfunctional at times, but we're FAMILY! :)
Click to expand...
10 pts for using kerfuffle correctly in a sentence on a sports talk board
 
sactowndog

sactowndog

All-Star
#8
#8
VF21 said:
WCS should be back on the court for this game, which could be interesting depending on the lineup Joerger decides to put out there. I'll tell you one thing - I wouldn't take his job right now for all the money in the world. No matter what he does, somebody is gonna be upset. When you look at our roster, it's really a crap shoot on who to play next to whom and when they should be on the court.

If it was my choice to put a starting five out there, I'd be very tempted to put the usual suspects on the court and then yank them for the bench at the first opportunity since our bench has been our saving grace.

At some point, I would love to see Fox, Mason, Bogs, Hield and WCS out there - knowing full well that's a Don Nelson dream come true. No idea what would happen, but it might be fun to watch.

I remain convinced this is a LEARNING season. I'm also convinced, although I know a number do not agree, that giving Z-Bo minutes now will pay dividends because the rookies need to learn how to finish games, play without giving up, etc. and those are all tools in Randolph's shed. To me, it is much more important for the kids to learn strong fundamentals of that kind than it is to toss them to the wolves. You don't learn by being outmatched IMHO. You learn by crawling before you walk, and walking before you run.

If nothing else this current group of Kings gives arm chair coaches/GMs a lot to talk/argue about. So many different ideas on what the philosophy should be...

Bottom line, we have a team. It's not perfect but it's ours and I think just about everyone can find something from almost every game to be hopeful about that. That's not awful.

I LOVE THIS TEAM!!
Click to expand...
It’s not really so much what we think it should be but having one and executing it.

If your goal is a top 5 pick (stated in the article) we are failing
If the goal is to make the playoff (what we allegedly told Hill) we are failing.

If our goal is to be a perpetual 35 win team forever in the lottery, we seem to have that down :rolleyes:
 
M

mac

All-Star
#9
#9
sactowndog said:
It’s not really so much what we think it should be but having one and executing it.

If your goal is a top 5 pick (stated in the article) we are failing
If the goal is to make the playoff (what we allegedly told Hill) we are failing.

If our goal is to be a perpetual 35 win team forever in the lottery, we seem to have that down :rolleyes:
Click to expand...


At least we're good at something!
 
VF21

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#10
#10
sactowndog said:
It’s not really so much what we think it should be but having one and executing it.

If your goal is a top 5 pick (stated in the article) we are failing
If the goal is to make the playoff (what we allegedly told Hill) we are failing.

If our goal is to be a perpetual 35 win team forever in the lottery, we seem to have that down :rolleyes:
Click to expand...
This is the Suns game thread. I think having the Hill discussion in 2 other threads is adequate. :p
 
sactowndog

sactowndog

All-Star
#11
#11
Well I hope Hill is back and Bogdan can go back to the futures team that passes well.

Hoped for Starters: ZBo, Kosta, Temple, Hill, Fox

2nd group: Willie, Mason, Bogdan, Heild, Jackson/Skal

I want to see
1) the chemistry continue to develop with Willie and Bogdan

2) I want to see the ball in Bogdan and Mason’s hand passing to shooters

3) I want Jackson to get some wide open looks to see if he can make them.

And because Skal and Jackson are still such question marks I want to lose a close game so we have a shot at Bagley :p
 
upinsmoke

upinsmoke

All-Star
#13
#13
sactowndog said:
Well I hope Hill is back and Bogdan can go back to the futures team that passes well.

Hoped for Starters: ZBo, Kosta, Temple, Hill, Fox

2nd group: Willie, Mason, Bogdan, Heild, Jackson/Skal

I want to see
1) the chemistry continue to develop with Willie and Bogdan

2) I want to see the ball in Bogdan and Mason’s hand passing to shooters

3) I want Jackson to get some wide open looks to see if he can make them.

And because Skal and Jackson are still such question marks I want to lose a close game so we have a shot at Bagley :p
Click to expand...
 
sactowndog

sactowndog

All-Star
#14
#14
jcwkings said:
I would start

Fox
Bogi
Temple
WCS
ZBo

Bench

Mason
Hill
Buddy
Vince
Skal
Click to expand...
Bogi started last time and all but disappeared.

The games of Fox and ZBo are isolation games while the Games of Bogdan and Willie are movement/passing Games. Putting them together is like oil and water where the water sinks to the bottom and disappears. Now maybe Fox can change but it isn’t likely in a lineup with ZBo.

Lastly you need to get Jackson or Richardson minutes unless you have given up on both...
 
LPKingsFan

LPKingsFan

All-Star
#17
#17
sactowndog said:
Well we shall see. If we win tonight, which I think we might, we will be 6th.
Click to expand...
Indeed. And 538 predicts this will be one of the 17 remaining Kings wins.

There are many games left, and many moves that the Kings and other teams may make. Checking tankathon daily at this point in the season just sounds like unnecessary heartburn to me, but feel free to knock yourself out.
 
Kingster

Kingster

Hall of Famer
#19
#19
I think it was in the Pels game that Joerger played Fox for an entire quarter, and it payed off with good Fox play. Sometimes it works with a short leash; sometimes with a long leash. One of these games I'd like to see a very long leash for Skal. Give him an entire quarter to get tired and get out of the head-trip that he appears to be in.

The Kings are not playing against the Suns in this game. They are playing against themselves. Will the motivated, energetic and focused Kings win against the entropy-laden, scattered and unfocused Kings? Stay tuned.
 
sactowndog

sactowndog

All-Star
#20
#20
LPKingsFan said:
Indeed. And 538 predicts this will be one of the 17 remaining Kings wins.

There are many games left, and many moves that the Kings and other teams may make. Checking tankathon daily at this point in the season just sounds like unnecessary heartburn to me, but feel free to knock yourself out.
Click to expand...
Nah I don’t check at all. Interesting data on 538 however.
 
KingsSelecao

KingsSelecao

Bench
#22
#22
Kings should win this. But, I imagine it will be much closer than it should. Suns have lost 3 straight and will be playing at home tonite. I expect them to come out inspired from the tip. The front court match ups will be interesting.

Chriss, Chandler, and Monroe vs. WCS, Koufas, and Randolph.
 
jcwkings

jcwkings

All-Star
#24
#24
sactowndog said:
Bogi started last time and all but disappeared.

The games of Fox and ZBo are isolation games while the Games of Bogdan and Willie are movement/passing Games. Putting them together is like oil and water where the water sinks to the bottom and disappears. Now maybe Fox can change but it isn’t likely in a lineup with ZBo.

Lastly you need to get Jackson or Richardson minutes unless you have given up on both...
Click to expand...
Fox is not an iso guy. Zbo, yes but Fox would be best utilized running high screen and roll/pop. That is only viable though if he can hit a pullup 20 ft jumper, defenses are giving him that. We're at a catch 20 though because the offense is built around Zbo right now but then again we arent in alot of these games if Zbo isnt putting up big numbers. For now the option is either a more free flow offense with a lot of mistakes and likely more blowouts, or a more simplified offense with our young guys getting close game NBA experience.
 
eMBarkat10n

eMBarkat10n

Bench
#25
#25
I won't be near my computer while watching the game tonight. And I have lost my phone, so I can't even use that bad boy. Therefore, I will not be posting during the game but will chime in with my thoughts later tonight.
 
sactowndog

sactowndog

All-Star
#27
#27
jcwkings said:
Fox is not an iso guy. Zbo, yes but Fox would be best utilized running high screen and roll/pop. That is only viable though if he can hit a pullup 20 ft jumper, defenses are giving him that. We're at a catch 20 though because the offense is built around Zbo right now but then again we arent in alot of these games if Zbo isnt putting up big numbers. For now the option is either a more free flow offense with a lot of mistakes and likely more blowouts, or a more simplified offense with our young guys getting close game NBA experience.
Click to expand...
Hmm. My opinion is most of Fox’s points come from iso drives off the dribble where he either gets to the rim or stops and pops from around the free throw line for a 10-15 foot jumper...

I would agree when he can hit a 20-25 point jumper the pick and roll would be effective but he’s not there yet. Bogie and Frank are currently much more efficient in the pick and roll.
 
ockingsfan

ockingsfan

Starter
#28
#28
The Line up I want to see, would be:

PF: WCS / Skal / Sampson
SF: Bogdan / Jackson / Temple
C: ZBo / KK / Papa
SG: Buddy / Hill / Richardson
PG: Fox / Mason

You get youth at 4 out of the 5 positions.

WCS plays the PF position and keep ZBo in the starting lineup at Center for scoring. Bogdan and Fox provides the ball handling. Buddy and Bogdan will spread the floor.

Maybe coming off the bench will light a fire under George Hill. Mason and Hill will lead the 2nd unit. Skal can play against the other teams 2nd unit, to gain back some confidence. JJ and Richardson needs some PT.
 
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