Expansion Talk (Split from Domas Thread)

[Capt. Factorial]

I've been running a little thought through my head that Duarte may be "Gerald Wallace Insurance" in the unlikely event that the NBA decides to hold an expansion draft in 2025. It sounds as if the NBA doesn't want to talk expansion until hammering out some media contracts, so that probably means expansion won't happen until 2026 at the earliest but at this point it is probably prudent to always have one contract that is fodder for a potential expansion draft two summers forward. Duarte, who will be an RFA in 2025 (of course, only if we pick up his 4th-year option in October), could be the contract that prevents us from having to expose a core piece. Just a thought.

(Edited to remove quoted material from Domas thread)

 

[SacTownKid]

I've been running a little thought through my head that Duarte may be "Gerald Wallace Insurance" in the unlikely event that the NBA decides to hold an expansion draft in 2025. It sounds as if the NBA doesn't want to talk expansion until hammering out some media contracts, so that probably means expansion won't happen until 2026 at the earliest but at this point it is probably prudent to always have one contract that is fodder for a potential expansion draft two summers forward. Duarte, who will be an RFA in 2025 (of course, only if we pick up his 4th-year option in October), could be the contract that prevents us from having to expose a core piece. Just a thought.

That's actually a very interesting theory. Who knows what the NBA will do, sometimes it seems they run quicker on certain things.

 

[Elektrik]

I've been running a little thought through my head that Duarte may be "Gerald Wallace Insurance" in the unlikely event that the NBA decides to hold an expansion draft in 2025. It sounds as if the NBA doesn't want to talk expansion until hammering out some media contracts, so that probably means expansion won't happen until 2026 at the earliest but at this point it is probably prudent to always have one contract that is fodder for a potential expansion draft two summers forward. Duarte, who will be an RFA in 2025 (of course, only if we pick up his 4th-year option in October), could be the contract that prevents us from having to expose a core piece. Just a thought.

Interesting. I have not heard this. Any idea how many teams would be in this expansion draft…and what cities would be the likely candidates?

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Interesting. I have not heard this. Any idea how many teams would be in this expansion draft…and what cities would be the likely candidates?

The general feeling seems to be that the league wants teams in Seattle and Las Vegas. If there were two teams in an expansion draft it would probably result in all existing teams losing one player.

 

[QWERTYLICIOUS]

Interesting. I have not heard this. Any idea how many teams would be in this expansion draft…and what cities would be the likely candidates?

Just curious: Do you live outside of America?

I only ask because if you're a basketball fan, and you live in America, I would find it hard to believe that you have not heard anything about possible expansion that would yield Seattle and Vegas basketball teams. If you live outside of America, and are an INTERNATIONAL KINGS FAN, your comments/questions would make a lot more sense to me

 

[QWERTYLICIOUS]

The general feeling seems to be that the league wants teams in Seattle and Las Vegas. If there were two teams in an expansion draft it would probably result in all existing teams losing one player.

As long as they don't give both teams similar expansion draft rules that the NHL gave to both Vegas and Seattle, I will be fine with expansion in the NBA. If they go down the same path as the NHL, and skew the draft in both teams' favor, and it yields them immediate success, and a championship (just like Vegas in the NHL), I will be beyond pissed.

And, yes, I am, forever, a salty Sharks fan...

 

[Capt. Factorial]

As long as they don't give both teams similar expansion draft rules that the NHL gave to both Vegas and Seattle, I will be fine with expansion in the NBA. If they go down the same path as the NHL, and skew the draft in both teams' favor, and it yields them immediate success, and a championship (just like Vegas in the NHL), I will be beyond pissed.

The new CBA, although it does not explicitly enumerate any expansion draft rules (leaving it up to the league/player's union to negotiate) does state that it would be held "under substantially the same terms and in substantially the same manner" as the most recent Charlotte expansion draft. The basic terms of that draft were that each existing team could protect a maximum of 8 contracts/RFAs with the caveat that at least one player from each team must be available for selection even if that team does not have 8 contracts/RFAs.

With two teams in an expansion draft, every team would be guaranteed to lose one contract/RFA.

 

[QWERTYLICIOUS]

The new CBA, although it does not explicitly enumerate any expansion draft rules (leaving it up to the league/player's union to negotiate) does state that it would be held "under substantially the same terms and in substantially the same manner" as the most recent Charlotte expansion draft. The basic terms of that draft were that each existing team could protect a maximum of 8 contracts/RFAs with the caveat that at least one player from each team must be available for selection even if that team does not have 8 contracts/RFAs.

With two teams in an expansion draft, every team would be guaranteed to lose one contract/RFA.

Well, those are substantially better terms than those set forth by the NHL with their recent, and most likely future, expansion draft rules. So, I will still remain a happy Kings fan. At least a happier Kings fan than I have been a Sharks fan since Vegas became a hockey city...

 

[Elektrik]

Just curious: Do you live outside of America?

I only ask because if you're a basketball fan, and you live in America, I would find it hard to believe that you have not heard anything about possible expansion that would yield Seattle and Vegas basketball teams. If you live outside of America, and are an INTERNATIONAL KINGS FAN, your comments/questions would make a lot more sense to me

Lol, fair question I suppose. Live here in Sac. Have been a Kings fan for 30+ years and a season ticket holder for about 6 years but dropped out of the loop after the product became intolerable. ( I credit the gerbil and the firing of Malone as my motivation to jump ship). Hats off to all the old timers I remember from back in the day for sticking it out. I periodically would lurk to see if there was any good Kings news. There rarely was. Came back last year so call me a bandwagoner if you like. All I know is The Kings are back and so am I baby!

 

[KingsFanSince85]

The general feeling seems to be that the league wants teams in Seattle and Las Vegas. If there were two teams in an expansion draft it would probably result in all existing teams losing one player.

Not to hijack the thread, and perhaps a new thread should be created about this, but regarding expansion — if the NBA did add teams in Seattle and Vegas — that likely would result in one current Western Conference team being shifted East.

I was thinking about this very thing not too long ago. Just curious what others think might happen.

Which team gets shifted to the East? Minnesota, Memphis, or New Orleans??
Furthermore, does the NBA align the 32 teams into 4 divisions of 4 teams as the NFL does? Or do they go 6/5/5 ??

If it’s 4/4 then there is a very good chance we end up with an all Cali division. Or a North-South alignment of Sea-Port-Sac-Gsw and LAC-LAL-PHX-LV.

I was looking at numerous possibilities and there are some intriguing regional alignments.

That said, it would be nice to get all three of Minny, Memphis and New Orleans out of the West. However, I don’t see any way to do that while keeping a balanced number of teams in both conferences. Sending 1 over to the East is likely the best case scenario.

 

[Capt. Factorial]

Not to hijack the thread, and perhaps a new thread should be created about this

Yeah, good idea.

Which team gets shifted to the East? Minnesota, Memphis, or New Orleans??
Furthermore, does the NBA align the 32 teams into 4 divisions of 4 teams as the NFL does? Or do they go 6/5/5 ??

If it’s 4/4 then there is a very good chance we end up with an all Cali division. Or a North-South alignment of Sea-Port-Sac-Gsw and LAC-LAL-PHX-LV.

I think the latter is more likely. Out West, I think the alignments are obvious, but when it gets to the middle of the country things get a bit stickier.

I'd probably go with:

SEA-POR-SAC-GSW (Northwest)
LAL-LAC-LV-PHO (Southwest)
UTA-DEN-OKC-DAL (Mountain)
SAS-HOU-NOP-MEM (Gulf & River)

MIA-ORL-ATL-CHA (Southeast)
MIN-MIL-CHI-IND (West Lakes)
CLE-DET-TOR-WAS (East Lakes)
PHI-NYK-BRK-BOS (Megalopolis)

The trickiest bit here, I think, is to avoid the temptation to keep Texas and the Pelicans together. If you do that, either MIN or MEM gets really orphaned. Minnesota is probably a bad option to get sent to a Mountain conference, but you could swap DAL and MEM without too terribly much imposition on anybody but Memphis. WAS is the other team that seems to get a rough draw here. You could swap WAS and BOS so that Boston gets the rough draw but I don't really see a way out of that situation either.

 

[Rain man]

Yeah, good idea.



I think the latter is more likely. Out West, I think the alignments are obvious, but when it gets to the middle of the country things get a bit stickier.

I'd probably go with:

SEA-POR-SAC-GSW (Northwest)
LAL-LAC-LV-PHO (Southwest)
UTA-DEN-OKC-DAL (Mountain)
SAS-HOU-NOP-MEM (Gulf & River)

MIA-ORL-ATL-CHA (Southeast)
MIN-MIL-CHI-IND (West Lakes)
CLE-DET-TOR-WAS (East Lakes)
PHI-NYK-BRK-BOS (Megalopolis)

The trickiest bit here, I think, is to avoid the temptation to keep Texas and the Pelicans together. If you do that, either MIN or MEM gets really orphaned. Minnesota is probably a bad option to get sent to a Mountain conference, but you could swap DAL and MEM without too terribly much imposition on anybody but Memphis. WAS is the other team that seems to get a rough draw here. You could swap WAS and BOS so that Boston gets the rough draw but I don't really see a way out of that situation either.

I agree that we are almost certainly getting lumped with GSW, Portland, and Seattle. There are only 8 teams in the Pacific footprint, and those 8 teams are going to be grouped together. The LA teams with Vegas and Phoenix makes sense, and then the Nor Cal teams with the PNW teams. That leaves Denver and Utah as the odd teams out, but to lump them with the West Coast teams would banish two West Coast teams to far worse travel.

We should be really happy with that draw, if it comes to pass, and we could expect to be the dominant team in our division for the first few years. If expansion happened in 25-26, as predicted, then this version of the Warriors is almost certainly done, the Blazers are probably (at best) an up and coming rebuilder, and Seattle is an expansion team. We would/should be still committed to a Domas/Fox/Keegan core all in their mid/late 20s.

I'd personally lump the rest of the West as:

UTA-DEN-OKC-MEM
SAS-HOU-DAL-NOP

I know you flipped Memphis and Dallas, but I am guessing the NBA will want to keep the three Texas teams together, and I am not sure there is that much concern about putting Memphis and Utah together. I believe that is still only one time zone difference and the NBA currently has even worse anomalies (Portland and Minnesota). I just don't think the NBA will break up the Texas/NOP thing so that Memphis doesn't have Utah in its division.

I mostly agree with you on the East

BOS-NYK-BRK-PHI
ORL-MIA-ATL-CHA

These both make too much sense. Washington would fit in with either group, but there are 9 Atlantic coast teams, so someone is the odd team out. But Washington is pretty closely located to the other East teams, so it wouldn't be awful. Your East Lake/West Lake idea would work. I would probably go more of a North Central and South Central (swapping IND and DET):

MIN-MIL-DET-CHI
IND-CLE-TOR-WAS

 

[KingsFanSince85]

Yeah, good idea.



I think the latter is more likely. Out West, I think the alignments are obvious, but when it gets to the middle of the country things get a bit stickier.

I'd probably go with:

SEA-POR-SAC-GSW (Northwest)
LAL-LAC-LV-PHO (Southwest)
UTA-DEN-OKC-DAL (Mountain)
SAS-HOU-NOP-MEM (Gulf & River)

MIA-ORL-ATL-CHA (Southeast)
MIN-MIL-CHI-IND (West Lakes)
CLE-DET-TOR-WAS (East Lakes)
PHI-NYK-BRK-BOS (Megalopolis)

The trickiest bit here, I think, is to avoid the temptation to keep Texas and the Pelicans together. If you do that, either MIN or MEM gets really orphaned. Minnesota is probably a bad option to get sent to a Mountain conference, but you could swap DAL and MEM without too terribly much imposition on anybody but Memphis. WAS is the other team that seems to get a rough draw here. You could swap WAS and BOS so that Boston gets the rough draw but I don't really see a way out of that situation either.

You and I are really close with our alignments.

In the East, I think Washington fits better with Toronto, Cleveland, and Detroit from travel/distance perspective (it's shorter). And Boston fits better, clearly, with New York, Brooklyn, and Philly from a regional and rivalry perspective.

So I think you've got that one spot on.

The only difference I see is that I did group all three Texas teams with New Orleans. It just makes too much sense geographically and in terms of travel.

But I get your point re: Memphis. I can see valid arguments for Dallas and Memphis swapping places. There are pros and cons to both.

If the NBA went with a 6/5/5 division split, you could group OKC-MEM-DAL-SA-HOU-NO all together which would create a really tight super region.

Under the 6/5/5 format, you could have the following:

West:
OKC-MEM-DAL-SA-HOU-NO
LAC-LAL-PHX-LV-DEN
PORT-SEA-SAC-GSW-UTAH

East:

MIN-MIL-CHI-IND-DET-CLE
TOR-BOS-NY-BRK-PHI
WAS-CHA-ATL-ORL-MIA

The Wizards are really the only sore thumb fit in the East under this scenario, but they are the furthest South of the group of North West teams and even the most remote distance to them (Miami) is only a 2.5 hour flight.

I assume the NBA would prefer the 4x4 division format and alignment, but you never know. Again, there are pros and cons to both.